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Another subwoofer GTG, Southern style - Page 5

post #121 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

I was hoping we could get a couple commercially made subs. I have never heard on outlaw sub so if you want to bring it I will shoot you a PM with the info. And I am also up for anyone who wants to bring a camera along. I would like to get lots of pictures and video if possible. A laptop probably wouldn't hurt but I think ricci is bringing his along and I have my pc in the room where we will do most of the listening.

If I can get some one to help me load up my ED A7S-450 I guess I could bring it also. I don't mean one of you guys. I know you wanted to limit the subs, so let me know.
post #122 of 781
Thread Starter 
Why is that? Is it because he mentioned no HPF in there? I believe that we will be using a filter for driver protection purposes. Or were you wanting the full assault of eq?
post #123 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

Why is that? Is it because he mentioned no HPF in there? I believe that we will be using a filter for driver protection purposes. Or were you wanting the full assault of eq?

I do not need EQ to get down low since I use a ported design. I am just not going to test a ported sub with out a HP filter. A HP filter is a separate piece of equipment if you use a pro amp and not something built into a sub as part of the design. Now I do not think that you guys were planning on going that route, but I did want to let you know that I would not test my sub under those conditions.
post #124 of 781
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjg100 View Post

I do not need EQ to get down low since I use a ported design. I am just not going to test a ported sub with out a HP filter. A HP filter is a separate piece of equipment if you use a pro amp and not something built into a sub as part of the design. Now I do not think that you guys were planning on going that route, but I did want to let you know that I would not test my sub under those conditions.

I understand that. Ricci is bringing his Rane and it's got a HPF if you change your mind. Personally I'm not going to try to play WOTW at reference level with my sub and no HPF. It's hard to bottom my sub from the voice coil to back plate, but I would imagine the spider would hit the plate and damage it if it hit hard enough.

I think the main remarks from Bosso was that the we wouldn't have to do a full eq for each sub if they're all located in the same place. Maybe fix a room null if there is one and then leave the sub to play the rest.
post #125 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

I understand that. Ricci is bringing his Rane and it's got a HPF if you change your mind. Personally I'm not going to try to play WOTW at reference level with my sub and no HPF. It's hard to bottom my sub from the voice coil to back plate, but I would imagine the spider would hit the plate and damage it if it hit hard enough.

I think the main remarks from Bosso was that the we wouldn't have to do a full eq for each sub if they're all located in the same place. Maybe fix a room null if there is one and then leave the sub to play the rest.

You miss understood. I plan on being there and bringing my Shiva. I just would not be willing to test my ported sub without a HPF. My post was just to let you guys know how I felt if you took Bossobass's suggestion of not using a HPF for testing. I have also offered to bring my ED A7S-450 with 1,300 watt amp since you said you wanted to hear some commercial subs. Just let me know.
post #126 of 781
Bosso was mainly referring to my comments about EQing the subs individually. We will skip this and do a general EQ, if it is needed, to correct for the general room response effects. For instance if there was a bad peak at 50hz that could be padded down a bit. We won't go trying to boost nulls either, or getting anal about getting a super flat response, only cutting peaks if there are a few that need addressed. My comments only pertained to sealed subs only as far as boosting is concerned.

Nobody is going to be subjecting any sub to anything that it's owner is not comfortable with. I plan on doing the listening eval's at a set, moderate level that even the smallest sub there can handle. I would like to push some of the bigger subs as well to see how they do at higher levels and have some fun too, but we'll have to figure that out. Obviously if you listen to the material at higher volumes with some of the subs it will affect things.

There will be a HPF on the ported subs. I wouldn't run one without it personally. I don't think Bosso suggested that necessarily. He doesn't hate ported designs THAT bad.

mjg100, Brandon,
What are your subs tuned to? Do you have an EQ unit to boost the low end on the A7S-450 mjg100, or do you run it dry?
post #127 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci View Post

Bosso was mainly referring to my comments about EQing the subs individually. We will skip this and do a general EQ, if it is needed, to correct for the general room response effects. For instance if there was a bad peak at 50hz that could be padded down a bit. We won't go trying to boost nulls either, or getting anal about getting a super flat response, only cutting peaks if there are a few that need addressed. My comments only pertained to sealed subs only as far as boosting is concerned.

Nobody is going to be subjecting any sub to anything that it's owner is not comfortable with. I plan on doing the listening eval's at a set, moderate level that even the smallest sub there can handle. I would like to push some of the bigger subs as well to see how they do at higher levels and have some fun too, but we'll have to figure that out. Obviously if you listen to the material at higher volumes with some of the subs it will affect things.

There will be a HPF on the ported subs. I wouldn't run one without it personally. I don't think Bosso suggested that necessarily. He doesn't hate ported designs THAT bad.

mjg100, Brandon,
What are your subs tuned to? Do you have an EQ unit to boost the low end on the A7S-450 mjg100, or do you run it dry?

I only use Audyssey with the A7S-450. The HPF was the only thing I had a problem with in Bossobass's post and that is why I highlighted it in my first response. To be on the safe side I would like an 18Hz HP used on the Shiva-X.
post #128 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjg100 View Post

I only use Audyssey with the A7S-450. The HPF was the only thing I had a problem with in Bossobass's post and that is why I highlighted it in my first response. To be on the safe side I would like an 18Hz HP used on the Shiva-X.

Is 18hz the tune on your Shiva and it's 6.5ft right? We'll use REW at a very low volume setting to help set the Rane's HPF up right for it.
post #129 of 781
Thread Starter 
My sub is tuned to 15 hz. Keeps that low end pseudo LLT going.
post #130 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci View Post

Is 18hz the tune on your Shiva and it's 6.5ft right? We'll use REW at a very low volume setting to help set the Rane's HPF up right for it.

Thanks. My room is getting closer to getting complete (for awhile) I received my NHT 116 drivers and switched them out with the NHT 075 drivers that I had in my MBM's/bass bins. Now I have three MBM's/bass bins under my three front speakers, Shiva-X in back right corner and 2.0 CF dual 10" (NHT 075 drivers) in back left corner. I am waiting to order one more driver and amp for a surround sound sub and that will do me for a while. I need to re-calibrate everything again. I am going to try and find time to do that this week end. Here are a couple of pics:
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post #131 of 781
Thread Starter 
What's your impression of the dual 10's?
post #132 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

What's your impression of the dual 10's?

I have not had more than a few minutes of listening and that was with all five subs going and not calibrated. It is going to take some time to calibrate all of this. I did download some tones for calibrating, 40 to 80Hz and full range. I was going to put on some music and listen to the subs, kicking different subs in and out to hear the differences but the upstairs HT room is right off of our bedroom and my wife went to bed right after dinner. She said she had a very hectic day today. I thought that it would be in my best interest to just fire up the downstair projector and watch a ball game. Did you watch my Toppers play any of their games? We lost in the second round to Gonzaga. Gonzaga made a last second shot to win.
post #133 of 781
Thread Starter 
5 subs? What else do you have?


The only basketball I watched was the mtsu women lose by one point to mi state. They had a 6'9 girl on their team.
post #134 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

5 subs? What else do you have?


The only basketball I watched was the mtsu women lose by one point to mi state. They had a 6'9 girl on their team.

I added three 1 CF sealed subs to my front three speakers. I am using them from 40Hz to 150Hz. (DIY)
One 6.5 CF ported Shiva-X for 50Hz and down. (DIY)
One 2.0 CF sealed 30Hz to 80Hz. (DIY)

I have an old NHT SW2Pi that I am going to place in the back of the room and tie into my surround speakers. Then I will be running AVR with all speakers set to large and LFE + mains. I am currently running LFE + Mains.
post #135 of 781
Thread Starter 
That's a nice setup. Now all you need is enough subsonic subwoofers to put one on each channel. Get the room really shaking! My wife would kill me if I said I was getting more subwoofers.
post #136 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

That's a nice setup. Now all you need is enough subsonic subwoofers to put one on each channel. Get the room really shaking! My wife would kill me if I said I was getting more subwoofers.

I am just about to that point since my room is 5.1. I am going to try a single sub for the back channels since I have a spare NHT SW2Pi not being used.

I did some calibrating today and listened to a few movie scenes. Huge difference with the Shiva taking care of the low (50Hz and down) stuff, the high output sealed dual 10" taking care of the 30 to 80Hz zone and the NHT 116's kicking the 40 to 150Hz zone. Lots of head room now. I calibrated so that zero on the AVR is 75db and when I played Transformers I was hitting 109db peaks when the AVR was set to -5 and the sound was clear and clean, no strain. I have 20 more clicks on the AVR, but it already had my ears at the ringing point so I did not go higher. Before when playing Kung Fu Panda you felt the deep bass stuff and some of the blow impact, but now you feel the thud when the spears hit the ground and hit the face of the cliff in the Tia Lung escape scene. When the arrows rain down on Tia Lung it will make you jump. When Po trains with his master you can feel the bamboo staff hitting him.

Before you felt some sound pressure from the helicopter rotors in Transformers, but now there is a lot of sound pressure build up in the room. When the big guns fire in Transformers you can feel the concussion from the guns. I had thought about getting some bass shakers, but no need now.
post #137 of 781
I might not be able to be there as early as I wanted to. I coach my sons soccer team and we have a game at 10:15 AM on the 18th. Since schedules have not been sent out yet I am trying to get that game changed to 9:00 AM. That way I can leave right after the game. Should take me about 1.5 hours to get there.
post #138 of 781
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjg100 View Post

I might not be able to be there as early as I wanted to. I coach my sons soccer team and we have a game at 10:15 AM on the 18th. Since schedules have not been sent out yet I am trying to get that game changed to 9:00 AM. That way I can leave right after the game. Should take me about 1.5 hours to get there.

We will likely be evaluating late so whenever you can get here would be fine.
post #139 of 781
brandon, even though there are lots of comments about how you could do things different or better, there are lots of us out here that are very excited and grateful that you are hosting this event! i just thought some props were due.
post #140 of 781
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

brandon, even though there are lots of comments about how you could do things different or better, there are lots of us out here that are very excited and grateful that you are hosting this event! i just thought some props were due.

Thanks man. Truth is, like I've said previously, I'm in it for knowledge as much as the next guy. From reading in here I've realized that I'm a beginner in the DIY world and have a good grasp on general subwoofer knowledge, but I'm looking to forward that with more research and hands on experience through the meet. Really the only thing I am bringing to the table is a mediocre DIY sub by the broad standards, a decent sized room, and a very centralized location in the south. I'm just starting to wish I would've scheduled the meet sooner. I'm happy with the date though. More time for good planning.

BTW LTD02, are you going to try to make the trip? It's only about a 9.5 hour drive. I've driven your way before and it doesn't seem like it took that long.
post #141 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

BTW LTD02, are you going to try to make the trip? It's only about a 9.5 hour drive. I've driven your way before and it doesn't seem like it took that long.

can't make it this time, but i will be following along online. your comment about being in it for the knowledge is spot on. everybody loves shootouts, "this one vs. that one", etc. but in the process, we all learn alot.

its really cool to see folks (props to ricci et al) step up to help make this event a success.
post #142 of 781
Well I have scuba checkoffs that weekend, but all this talk about subwoofers have made me all giddy and want to push them off . I'm about 3.5 hours away and think I am going to try to make it. Do we have a timeframe that things are going to get started/end? Just curious since it is a drive and wondering if I need to head up the night before or what since I have a friend that lives by Brentwood.

I'm in the market for a new sub and am really looking forward to hearing some DIY options and commercial subs as my audio knowledge is weak to say the least as my calibrating skills know how to start MCACC.

I know you were wanting to bring commercial subs and all I have is a Bic H-100, but if I am able to come I would be willing to bring it. I know it won't touch any of the subs there as it is in a far lower price range, but let me know and then we can have some comparisons of that.
post #143 of 781
Thread Starter 
I would imagine we'll get started around 10. We'll go till we get finished or we're all too tired to listen anymore I guess. No real time limit.

I can put your Bic on the list and it may give you a heads up comparison between yours and the others. One thing I wish I could have done when looking around is to listen to a bunch of subs one right after the other.

Having the subs like we're going to have will be a good wide base of subs. We'll have a commercial sub or two, some more budget friendly DIY stuff like mine and the shiva, and the upper end with the LMS and some others. It will really give a good idea of what you get for the money.

Personally, I think just about any aftermarket sub is better than none. I grit my teeth when I go to into places like Walmart and hear someone commenting on how good a $150 HTIB sounds.
post #144 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

can't make it this time, but i will be following along online. your comment about being in it for the knowledge is spot on. everybody loves shootouts, "this one vs. that one", etc. but in the process, we all learn alot.

its really cool to see folks (props to ricci et al) step up to help make this event a success.

I do it for the love of the game. Actually I do it so I can keep learning and have fun. Plus it's cool to hear a bunch of equipment I never have before.
post #145 of 781
That would be great to be able to compare subs against others. I've bought practically all of my AV equipment based on this forum alone. There really aren't any stores anywhere close to me who carry any decent kind of equipment. I did audition quite a few speakers before I bought my Ascend Sierras for the LCR, but bought those blindly on reviews and I'm glad I did. I went to Nashville and Murray to listen to speakers there.

This whole DIY route seems really interesting. I'm definately going to be picking people's brain. After reading all the rave things about the LMS and the AV15 c 2x PR I can't wait to hear them. I'm not much of a handy man, but I have a friend who makes cabinets for a living and has a CNC machine so I should be able to get him to make me a box pretty easily/cheaply if I need one.
post #146 of 781
Thread Starter 
Guys, ricci has helped plan this thing behind the scenes more than anyone knows. If it weren't for him this meet would not be nearly what it is going to be. More than anyone he deserves some huge applause!

Vili, if your friend has a cnc machine he could make you an insane enclosure. By him gifts to entice use of that machine!
post #147 of 781
I will do that brandon! I have to first get the $$ to be able to afford such a build since I just spent nearly $800 on the Pio SC05.

From the WI shootout everyone loved the LMS. I contacted Ricci offline and has been a big help regarding equipment I would need to build the sub. I'm just curious the physical size of the completed sub as my living room is also my ht room and size is a consideration.
post #148 of 781
Thread Starter 
You will see when you get to my place my sub is large. Its four feet long. I made mine after the llt model. Sealed gets you a smaller box but you need a really good driver to get those low notes.

You will get a crash course in diy.
post #149 of 781
Excellent. Although 4 foot is too big for my area unfortunately, I'll start reading the DIY option route more so I can already have a basic understanding. I like some of the Mael-X builds and they seem about as big as I would be able to fit...hopefully someone will be able to bring one of those as well.
post #150 of 781
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci View Post

I do it for the love of the game. Actually I do it so I can keep learning and have fun. Plus it's cool to hear a bunch of equipment I never have before.

I am looking forward to hearing some of these other subs. No place around here to listen to any good subs. I do not know very many people that have HT's. My brother has an HT, but no sub. He does have some fantastic mains, Meridian DSP-6000's (total of 8-8" drivers). The only other places that I get to hear HT systems is when I go to parade of homes and none of those offered any real performance. Most of them feature little tiny open back in-wall speakers and a small sub. They show off these little boutique HT's in these new homes like they are the greatest thing and none of them have much performance.
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