Marantz UD9004 Universal player with Blu-ray - Page 4

Originally Posted by edorr

Yes. When you cross over the CBIII at 40Hz you get response way above 40Hz because of the "slope" of the filter. With the Marantz you need to cross over above 40Hz to get a more smooth bass response.

You can easily compare by hooking up the Marantz digitally to the CBIII and analog to the six shooter. Then you play a CD with L/R bass crossed over to LFE channel and turn off all your channels except the sub. You can now switch between the digital input into CBIII and the analog into SS. I find you will get substantially higher frequencies coming out of the CBIII even at 40Hz Xover setting than the Marantz at 80Hz setting.

Originally Posted by tyree91

My assumption here is Steve is using 6 dB Butterworth with the CB, and the Marantz is 12 or 24 dB.

Originally Posted by moonhawk

Thinking of upgrading my Denon 5910 to one of these things. Have any of you owners compared this Marantz to the 5910, or the DVD A1?

I'm mainly interested in audio quality, I assume the picture will be outstanding. Also I'll be running analog audio only, as I am using a Parasound Halo P7 analog mch preamp.

TYIA

PS Steve--glad to hear you're not Doug. I'd hate it if he was using my name...

Originally Posted by moonhawk

Thanks--that's good news. I guess it will fit if I go that route.

My other contender is the new Ayre universal player. That would be my dream player, but it not only costs much more, I would also have to buy a different pre-pro to accomodate the HDMI audio for multichannel movies or music. Not that I care so much about the mch music, but it's a must for movies.

Thanks again!

Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky

Stll been burnin' the 9004 in a lot!

Today, don't laught, I watched the blu ray of "Stargate: Continum".

The picture has never ever been better. Could it be even better than my Oppo BDP-83? Could HD video over HDMI be better on the 9004 thanks to the power supply, etc of the 9004? It just might be!

I can for sure say the picture between "Casino Royale" yesterday and "Stargate: Continuum" today is as good as it has ever been. As for better, someday on a weekend I'll set up the Oppo and AB them both. But I am very very video happy!

I have definitely heard the multichannel SACD getting better. The bass has cleared up with burnin' in and now is outstanding. I played a James Taylor SACD in multichannel that I know very well and yea, hands down beats my old Compli on multichannel SACD.

Tonight I also played "Blood Seat & Tears 3" stereo SACD, for which I have balanced interconnects into the Theta Six Shooter. WOW! Stereo SACD has never sounded like this in my system before!

I am getting very, very impressed.

Originally Posted by moonhawk

Thanks--that's good news. I guess it will fit if I go that route.

My other contender is the new Ayre universal player. That would be my dream player, but it not only costs much more, I would also have to buy a different pre-pro to accomodate the HDMI audio for multichannel movies or music. Not that I care so much about the mch music, but it's a must for movies.

Thanks again!

Originally Posted by edorr

Same expience - the audio really opens up with more hours on the player. Just curious - are you using a multi channel or stereo disc for burn in? Not sure how the electronics really flow, but in theory if you burn in with 2 channel disc you are bypassing at least part of the multi channel circuitry. By the same token, if you burn in using source direct on sacd, you are bypassing the DSP circuitry. So - at least in theory - you should burn in using a multi channel source with source direct off (when you listen to SACD, you obviously need to switch back to source direct on).

Originally Posted by edorr

Read back my dialogue with Charles on the Ayre univeral forum. I had a debate going on (before buying the ud9004) about what would sound best on MC audio - ud9004 + Six Shooter, or Oppo 83 + CBIII with HDMI (I was still naively assuming Theta would deliver at this point). His view was the analog route would beat the HDMI setup. If you bought the Ayre instead of the Oppo things would get better because of the separate audio clock, but because of lacking ARC it would still be a very suboptimal implementtion of high rez MC audio. All this for the price of 10K fir the Ayre and another 10K+ for a very good HDMI capable SSP. The Marantz route would be cheaper and very likely sonically superior on MC. For 2 channel the Ayre promises to be beat the Marantz, but like steve I will be using the PS Audio PWD for this. In conclusion, if you spend 80% of your time listening to stereo CD and MC audio and video is secondary get the Ayre, a top notch 2 channel preamp with HT bypass and a half decent SSP (Integra comes to mind).

If BR and MC audio is important to you get the Marantz. Only problem is what MC analog preamp to get. No one in his right mind would buy a MC analog preamp at full price these days, but used Audio Research and Swtichman are rarely seen. You could also consider an SSP with good analog bypass (not sure which one to get). You could shop around for a six shooter and bare bones CBIII as a controller. This combo can be had for <3K i suspect.

Originally Posted by moonhawk

Thanks edorr.

I remember your discussion with Charles well, as I only found that thread recentlly, and just finished it a couple of days ago.

I have the mch analog covered, as I currently have a Denon 5910, running into a Parasound Halo P7. I also have a Nuforce AVP17 fed by my Dish DVR, and then running through the P7 in HT bypass mode. Little clumsy, but it works.

So, the Marantz would pretty much be plug and play for me, with no other upgrades necessary for now. Plus I found a killer deal on a new unit with full warranty, so I'll probably go that route.

But either way, I've recently discovered ADA products and am seriously considering either the ADA suite 7.1 HD at about 5.5K, or the Reference MachIV when they release the balanced version, about 7.5K.

http://www.ada.net/products/ht/suite...e19776d526ccff

http://www.ada.net/products/ht/cinem...sody_mach4.php

The most info I can find about these products comes from this thread on AVForums, our sister site in the UK. (Though the ADA is built right here in the good old USA)

http://www.avforums.com/forums/audio...te-7-1-hd.html

Check it out: seems like an incredible bit of gear. I'm still reading the thread, but it's about the same length as the DX-5 thread, with much participation by the British distributors and techs. It doesn't have the ARC to my knowledge but does some sort of reclocking. A couple of the participants in the thread heard it once and immediately sold their Arcam AVR888s.

Ther is an Ayre dealer in Santa Fe I'm going to check out. I may know someone at that location, but I'm leaning towards the Marantz, just because it requires no immediate further upgrades.

Thanks again.

Originally Posted by moonhawk

Well guys, I just went ahead and ordered a UD9004 from American Theater off of an audiogon ad. Brand new, warranty, good price. Should be here in a couple of weeks.

The big advantage for now is it will fit right in where I have my Denon 5910, and hopefully give a big improvement in music as well as movies. 'Bout time I got Bluray.

I'll put off any further decisions for a little while.

Thanks to all for your input. I'll report back when it arrives.

Originally Posted by moonhawk

I may just use the smaller ADA with the HDMI output of the Marantz and the optical output of my Dish DVR for all mch audio then get a higher end pre amp for the balanced 2ch output of the marantz, hopefully one with HT Bypass.

Got other things to deal with for now, so those decisions can wait.

Originally Posted by edorr

If you go 2 channel analog and multi channel HDMI the Ayre would indeed have been your ideal player (theoretically anyway), but the Marantz should be a close 2nd at 40% of the (street) price.

The only drawback is that the Marantz will downsample MC SACD to 44/16, so if you have a big collection of MC SACD your target "HDMI for MC audio over ADA" configuration is suboptimal. If MC SACD is not a factor for you, your ADA + 2 channel analog preamp sounds pretty ideal. If MC SACD is a factor I would seriously consider picking up a used Six Shooter and bare bones CBIII instead, and here is why:
- This will give you a true MC channel analog preamp, which will be better on MC SACD, and unlock the full value of your Marantz
- Your cost will be around 3K, less than just the 2 channel analog preamp that is sonically equivalent to the Six Shooter (according to the resident Six Shooter experts on this forum - I cannot confirm based on personal experience)
- You can use your CBIII for Satelite reciever over S/PDIF

Incidentally, this is precisely what Steve and I are doing. Only thing is we are stuck with pricy Xtreme cards which we don't really need, but which you don't ever have to buy.

Only drawback is if one of your Theta components ever fails - given the current state of Theta you are SOL.

Anyway, you got yourself a nice upgrade with the Marantz out of the box, and with the Parasound as preamp there is no rush to do anything but enjoy the music short term.

Originally Posted by edorr

I am extremely happy with my Marantz sonically but have a question about a glitch I am experiencing. On SACD my first player sometimes gave intermittent sound. I was clearly a defect and I send it back and got a replacement. The 2nd player was working fine for 2 months and than had the same problem. I switched off "source direct" and the problem went away. When I switched back to "source direct on" the problem had disappeared. Now in my third month of ownership it happened to me once again. Thankfully, the fix is extremely easy, but still this is a technical issue that Marantz can hopefully resolve in firmware. When my first player acted up I called Marantz they said they never heard of the problem. Any other Marantz owners that have experienced the same problem?

Originally Posted by moonhawk

When My UD9004 arrives, will I be able to use my subwoofer with the 2ch analog (balanced) outputs, without converting the signal to digital?

My fronts are less than full range.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by moonhawk

When My UD9004 arrives, will I be able to use my subwoofer with the 2ch analog (balanced) outputs, without converting the signal to digital?

My fronts are less than full range.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by edorr

This is how I understand it works. The crossover works in the digital domain, but since you are playing the disc on the Marantz bass management happens in the DSP of the Marantz before anything gets converted to analog. The DSP works with a PCM signal so for CD you are not losing anything and there no additional conversions.

For 2 channel SACD the Marantz needs to convert DSD to PCM before you can use the DSP and hence your sub. I would expect this all happens in the digital domain before anything gets converted to analog, so what you lose here is the DSD to PCM conversion (which is substantial in my experience), but there is no additional A/D/A conversion.

I personally would typically prefer 2 channel SACD without the crossover, and CD with the crossover.

I believe all outputs are active all the time, so you should be able to combine the 2 channel balanced outs with RCA out for the LFE channel. Although Steve and I both use the PWD, the Marantz is a very competent 2 channel player, especially balanced.

Originally Posted by moonhawk

Just checked the P7 manual, and there is an option to use the subwoofer with any of the stereo in/outs--including balanced. The two channels are summed, and then routed through a low-pass crossover to the sub channel. I thought that was the case, but nice to confirm it. There is also a high pass for the mains, and the sub trim level can be set individually for stereo and multichannel sources.

I'll be able to compare that to crossing over in the marantz, hopefully soon!