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Input lag wars!, post your input lag results of your LCD display here for reference - Page 117

post #3481 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjetski71 View Post

Waveboy the Panasonic X3 plasma has an off resolution and pixel shape which doesn't lend itself particularly well to anything except movies and TV watching. It has a 4:3 resolution: 1024x768, but with rectangular shaped pixels to achieve a widescreen 16:9 format. It will accept higher resolutions at it's input but everything is downscaled to 1024x768. Since you seem to be a little more discriminating in what you want, i don't think you'll have much fun with that

And by the way, weren't the Panasonic LCD's tested to have the lowest input lag for 2011/2012 ? It's their E3 and U3 models i'm referring to. I would definitely research them and verify first but i think it's between 1 to 1-1/2 frames of lag if i'm not mistaken. And as usual, always purchase from a decent merchant with a good return/exchange policy, unfortunately there's always the chance you'll need to take advantage of it.

This will be a temporary set until I get a 55" 3D 1080p HDTV before the Wii U launches in Nov. For now, I basically got rid of my PS3(hardly gamed on it, used it mostly has a Bluray/dvd/music player...But instead i replaced it with a Sony 3D Bluray Player....What can i say i hate the idea of using a video game console as a Movie player XP ) and XBOX 360 which i sold a long time ago. Sooo, I game on the Wii as far as 'modern' consoles go. Ahem, total Nintendo nut right here! hehe. So obviously a fixed 720p display isn't going to make a difference considering wii games are 480p(640x480. Plus i use compoent cables) and I'm fine with 1024x768(Downscaling 1080p via HDMI into it for Bluray) sitting at a viewing distance at about 9 feet should be fine.

However, I wouldn't bother with any fixed 720p display if the Wii were HD, i'd obviously go for a 1080p set considering 1080p can resolve every single pixel for a 720p title. But again in the wii's case none of that matters. I'm torn between the X3's superior 'plasma motion' which i find is 'ideal' for film and i'm guessing 'better' black levels. Yet the LED has amazing brightness, a wider color gamut(I'm guessing) a cleaner/crisper/clearer(I'm sounding like a broken record here.lol) for gaming and beautiful bright whites. It's quite the massive difference, but that comes at a price with it's weak motion handeling...

IF high end LED's had the motion handeling of a plasma(at least..OR make it a CRT + No dithering than I'd be in complete heaven! XD) than I wouldn't be so mixed, iffy and unsatisfyed with the technology.

Movies - PLASMA all the way, no question again due to the superior motion
Gaming - it's a toss up....both have their pro's and cons. BUT, for those super colorful, bright and vibrant titles I'd say LED all the way. Plasma's also have inherent video noise, duller whites, and just aren't as bright.

Super OLED looks to solve this LED/LCD motion issue, but we wont be seeing affordable sets for a while...eek! Anyways, And I don't want to bother with LCD due to having issues with the UV back lighting. i don't want to get into it due to a certain temporary health issue, but i can't have any of that in my place. LED however is mercury free and the like, so it's easily more ideal which can be said about Panasonic plasma's as well.
post #3482 of 4189
Well, I've done enough research online and i can't get any proper NTSC input lag results for either the Panasonic X3 Plasma or the LG LV3500 LED. So I'm just going get both at BestBuy, try them out for myself, pick one that i'm happy with and return the other.

Also, wouldn't the LG LK450 be incredibly simular to the LV3500, the only difference being the back light, aka LED vs LCD? They're both 60hz and they are both the lowest end LG LED/LCD available. You'd think they would be practically the same different back light aside.
post #3483 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

i don't want to get into it due to a certain temporary health issue, but i can't have any of that in my place. LED however is mercury free and the like, so it's easily more ideal which can be said about Panasonic plasma's as well.

I will respect it if you don't want to answer, but is your concern that the mercury within the CCFL bulbs will leak over time or that you might accidentally knock the tv over and then be exposed to the mercury that would potentially escape if a bulb were broken.

No judgement here. Just curious.
post #3484 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viche View Post

I will respect it if you don't want to answer, but is your concern that the mercury within the CCFL bulbs will leak over time or that you might accidentally knock the tv over and then be exposed to the mercury that would potentially escape if a bulb were broken.

No judgement here. Just curious.

I'm not too worried about it breaking, because the chances of that happening is extremely rare. That aside, i actually may be suffering from mercury poisining due to my recent test results being extremely high(major tuna over load as a source of protein may of been the cause during a 1-3 year period) or a possible auto immune disease since I've been experiencing all of the symptoms and many of my blood work and symptoms have matched up.

UV lights not only contain mercury but they're known to have a negative effect on human health all together and they don't have to be broken. UV lighting can trigger auto immune diseases and make it worse all together. It sounds crazy, but just to be safe in the time being i dont want any exposure so I'm switching my current LCD Computer monitor to an LED, and my current LCD(which i replaced with a temporary CRT SDTV) to an LED or Panasonic plasma(Lead & Mercury free). Better safe than sorry. The same deal goes for those horrible CFL energy saver light bulbs which also contain mercury.
post #3485 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

I'm not too worried about it breaking, because the chances of that happening is extremely rare. That aside, i actually may be suffering from mercury poisining due to my recent test results being extremely high(major tuna over load as a source of protein may of been the cause during a 1-3 year period) or a possible auto immune disease since I've been experiencing all of the symptoms and many of my blood work and symptoms have matched up.

UV lights not only contain mercury but they're known to have a negative effect on human health all together and they don't have to be broken. UV lighting can trigger auto immune diseases and make it worse all together. It sounds crazy, but just to be safe in the time being i dont want any exposure so I'm switching my current LCD Computer monitor to an LED, and my current LCD(which i replaced with a temporary CRT SDTV) to an LED or Panasonic plasma(Lead & Mercury free). Better safe than sorry. The same deal goes for those horrible CFL energy saver light bulbs which also contain mercury.

Thanks
post #3486 of 4189
So I've been using a Panasonic TC-P50G25 as my gaming, movie, cable TV in the computer room but..

When you get into a long long games with friends CODMW3 for more than 5~7hr game sessions it can take a toll on a Plasma. IE I get IR and afterwards I just leave the screen on cycling HD images to get rid of it. HOWEVER I don't wanna artificially balloon my freaking hours on the screen.

So I switched to my PC monitor an ASUS VH242H Black 23.6" 5ms for my gaming needs...but the bug to buy something new hit me and I purchased a Sony Playstation 3D TV. $299.99 at Best Buy atm is a great price for a 24" '240hz' LED LCD TV, size is just fine, the buttons on the back is okay since I use it as a PC monitor, playing games in 3D is fun...but its overly to glossy. It reflects everything where it masks things on screen. IE I could have a target on screen but I CANT SEE them because the target is masked by the reflection in the room.

So has anyone tested the Panasonic VIERA TC-L32C3 32-Inch 720p LCD HDTV? The 32inch size is perfect as a PC Monitor for me, speakers are a nice touch if I don't wanna use a headset when playing a game, being able to do double duty as a TV later on its life is a plus also.

Or I can go the cheaper way and pick up a "EVO Monitor" the ASUS vh236h
post #3487 of 4189
Any lag results out there on 2012 model LEDs?
post #3488 of 4189
Anyone know the input lag on the Samsung UN46D6000?

I ran it on my pc and it is very fast in game mode not so much without game mode. Very quick twitch like moves. I know samsung I hear gets the worst ratings but I couldn't tell. Sorry about the video quality my camera is horrible it doesn't do the tv justice but it shows movements. The shots were instant I had no other game to demonstrate on so this is it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGvX3jrtquI
post #3489 of 4189
I want to change my 24" TN BenQ monitor to some 32-37" HDTV. But I need extremely low input lag, for playing CS and Dota. Also it wolud be great to have 3D support on it (also available to use with nvidia 3D vision kit), but it's not "NEED" option. Can someone recommend something without 3D and with 3D support?
post #3490 of 4189
Well this is my first post here, hello everybody.

I bought the Panasonic Viera 32"E30 one week ago, and I didn´t know anything about the "input lag"...I just read some post here, because I noticed that my TV was suffering from this when I read some reviews, especially when I read the "Digital Versus" one.

I play with Xbox360 and Wii consoles. I didn´t felt any lag with the Wii, but I did with the Xbox. I´m also very sensible to lag.

I play drums from many years ago, and produce music, and I have a similar problem at recording in real time: the ****ing latency. But this is a small problem compare to the input lag, because it has a solution when producing, it´s easy to remove latency, but you can´t with TV´s.

When I was noticed that LED´s and LCD´s are presenting latencies over 20ms or more, I was very surprised. 20 ms is too much in music, but also in videogames...It´s 20 ms, and this is one of the lowest input lags that you can find with the latest Tv´s.

We´re all very sensible with timing, even if we don´t feel it. But this is a big problem of time, and it make some games half enjoyable, for sure!! I can feel it, and if you can´t feel it being conscient, you´re feeling unconscient, and it will afect to your way of playing, creating a vice, that will be difficult to remove the day that the TV´s become as faster as the old CRT´s. Your mind will be calculating the moves on your controlls just to compensate this latency, this ****ing ****** called "input lag".

Our minds are using to compensate this lags, and then will be difficult being able to the 0-5ms latency.

At this moment, I would strongly recomend to any harcord player to play always at the same latency, and then his mind will be used to it, and will be a better player.

And I wouldn´t never accept an input lag higher than 5-8 ms. It´s that because I´m actually looking for a monitor for playing videogames instead the new TV´s.
post #3491 of 4189
Hey everyone this link below shows you why input lag is a big deal. While they are touch screens the same thing still applies to gaming on a TV. In an idea world you'd want a 1:1 response and this shows you how various ms times perform.

http://techcrunch.com/2012/03/09/mic...8TechCrunch%29
post #3492 of 4189
So just use HDMI or DVI already. What is the point for using dinosaur equipment? Maybe I am just a late implementer and I only have used HDMI or DVI. I have only been using a DIGITAL HDTV for about 14 months. In fact I just built a computer and with a Intel 2500K CPU and it doesnt seem to have lag from the Intel 3000 HD Graphics via HDMI.

It is a good possibility that if you have a weak processor or a low-end video card that the lag is possibly due to the user not wanting to spend the money for a fast computer. Some people are stubborn and want to buy into the idea of lowest common denominator their pocketbook can buy. The problem is a cheap man's computer is just cheap and slow.
post #3493 of 4189
Wow still no input lag test on the PLAYSTATION 3D DISPLAY anyone? Tia
post #3494 of 4189
I'm an utter noob when it comes to this stuff so please bare with me.

I'd like to purchase a 32 inch HDTV for general use but also for pc gaming which range of tv's would be good for this my budget is around £400.

...I found this tv

"Samsung LN32C530" (new poster)

it has a 6ms response time... what about this?

whats the main stuff i'm looking for, can any of you kindly suggest some?
post #3495 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niko85 View Post

I'm an utter noob when it comes to this stuff so please bare with me.

"Samsung LN32C530" (new poster)

it has a 6ms response time... what about this?

whats the main stuff i'm looking for, can any of you kindly suggest some?

Welcome....I'm going to wager most of us are from the US and Canada, so we're going to have a problem with Model Numbers being different across the pond, if the model is available at all.

Having said that, you're going to have to do some legwork.....find a few models of TV that you "like" in your pricerange and then do web searches on their input lag. Input Lag isn't on factory specs, unfortunately, and it varies from Model to Model.

You said you were looking for a 32" set correct? And 400 quid is....well that's a lot for a 32" set here in the States...that's almost 700 dollars US I think (just a guess), which puts you firmly in the higher-end 32" sets. Are sets that pricy in the UK due to VAT and such?
post #3496 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadRusch View Post

Welcome....I'm going to wager most of us are from the US and Canada, so we're going to have a problem with Model Numbers being different across the pond, if the model is available at all.

Having said that, you're going to have to do some legwork.....find a few models of TV that you "like" in your pricerange and then do web searches on their input lag. Input Lag isn't on factory specs, unfortunately, and it varies from Model to Model.

You said you were looking for a 32" set correct? And 400 quid is....well that's a lot for a 32" set here in the States...that's almost 700 dollars US I think (just a guess), which puts you firmly in the higher-end 32" sets. Are sets that pricy in the UK due to VAT and such?

Thanks for the welcome, okay so I did some digging around and got some details. plasma would probably be best? panasonic or samsung range, has very low response time, as for input lag..i'll probably have to dig deeper to find which paticular model is good, pretty good motion clarity and rich blacks, as for burn in..well..i am a bit worried about that..

EDIT* there are so many random forum posts on the web discussing facts and figures, but they're all discussions, is there maybe a some sort of intro guide for noobs regarding all this stuff?
post #3497 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niko85 View Post

EDIT* there are so many random forum posts on the web discussing facts and figures, but they're all discussions, is there maybe a some sort of intro guide for noobs regarding all this stuff?

Don't exactly know for sure...look at the top of the forums for sticky posts?

PLASMA: Best blacks, usually universally low input lag, possibility for image retention (different from burn-in) exists, possibility that your black level will fade towards grey over time exists in some panasonic models I believe.....use a lot of power, throw off heat, usually have glossy glass meaning a reflective finish, can be aproblem for some folks.

LED LCD: uses less power than a match, wafer thin, can get them with super thin bezels which to me looks better. Problem is finding one with low input lag is DIFFICULT. Color tracking on some LED sets can be problematic, some sets really favor blue/green push, may or may not be an issue for you. edge-lit sets can have flashlighting or hot spotting in the corners, rear lit sets can be expensive.

LCD: Same as LED, thicker, more options for sets with good input lag numbers but look a little clunky next to the thinner plasmas and the super thin LED sets. These are the "CRT" sets of our age....they're out there...but I think their time is limited, nobody wants the thicker CCFL lighting any more......

Good Luck!
post #3498 of 4189
there are the 32" and 37" panasonic leds that have 16ms lag times. I cant recall the model (E30 series maybe?), but look into the forums and you will find it.

you can search this thread too for info
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1377652&page=9
post #3499 of 4189
Does the LG LK520 1080p 120hz LCD deliver the same low input Lag performance as the 60hz 'LK450' when you turn the 120hz/auto motion plus feature off? Pretty annoying that LG only went up to 47" with the LK450, as i want a 50-56" set.

The LK520 comes in 52" and that's the perfect size I'd say.
post #3500 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

Does the LG LK520 1080p 120hz LCD deliver the same low input Lag performance as the 60hz 'LK450' when you turn the 120hz/auto motion plus feature off? Pretty annoying that LG only went up to 47" with the LK450, as i want a 50-56" set.

The LK520 comes in 52" and that's the perfect size I'd say.

Perhaps you have forgotten, or look at too much other info, the LK520 120HZ would have about +30ms or more of input lag over the LK450. It is inherent because of double the 60HZ refresh rate. You've asked this several times in the xxLK450 thread. Look at Posts #869 and 870 in the xxLK450 thread._


And where do you see that a 52" LK520 is available? There is a 55LK520.
post #3501 of 4189
What about the 2012 Panasonic VIERA TC-L37E5 37-Inch LCD tv? I see Amazon has them now and was wandering if any one is considering it.
post #3502 of 4189
I don't know how the 2012 models have changed, but I just bought a 2011 Panny L37E3, and so far it's awesome for gaming. I haven't measured the lag yet (plan to though) but even Wii pointer controls feel near-instant.
post #3503 of 4189
PANASONIC Viera TX-L32E30B Full HD 32" LED TV

what about this set?

for pc gaming
post #3504 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phase700B View Post

Perhaps you have forgotten, or look at too much other info, the LK520 120HZ would have about +30ms or more of input lag over the LK450. It is inherent because of double the 60HZ refresh rate. You've asked this several times in the xxLK450 thread. Look at Posts #869 and 870 in the xxLK450 thread._


And where do you see that a 52" LK520 is available? There is a 55LK520.

If the lk520 is really 30ms worse (isn't this an eterenity in lag times?), what is an average MS time for the LK450?
post #3505 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00firebird View Post

If the lk520 is really 30ms worse (isn't this an eterenity in lag times?), what is an average MS time for the LK450?

The average input lag time of the LK450s is around 16-32ms (32ms is probably the average) so the additional input lag from the LK520 would be substantial.
post #3506 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phase700B View Post

Perhaps you have forgotten, or look at too much other info, the LK520 120HZ would have about +30ms or more of input lag over the LK450. It is inherent because of double the 60HZ refresh rate. You've asked this several times in the xxLK450 thread. Look at Posts #869 and 870 in the xxLK450 thread._


And where do you see that a 52" LK520 is available? There is a 55LK520.

Well consider the LK520 out of the question and evey other 120hz & 240hz set if that's the case. What a total bummer, considering the LK450 only goes up to 47".

Since I'm unsatisfyed(LCD's having weak motion handeling, usually weaker black levels, while plasma's cannot match the brightness and pure whites of an LCD/LED concering my gaming needs only) with both LCD & Plasma for gaming depending on the gaming genre, as i love both technologies for different reasons as I've mentioned before. So to solve my problem. Just get both! Which I've already done. Plasma for movies and certain video games, and LCD again for certain video games only. I've got the space anyways and the extra cash. I just want to upgrade from 42" to 55/56" a tiny bit before the launch of the Wii U which will be in NOV.

But, like i've said before a 56" LCD is what I'm intersted in getting down the line, 56" plasma aside(I'd probably get the ST30). Problem is, is that these 3D LCD's usually have more of that shnazzy processing which results in more input lag. While the bottom of the barrel LCD's don't even have 3D, but usually offer less lag. It's got to be 16ms for me that's that.

Should be interesting to see how these 2012 sets test in the lag department. It's too bad somebody can't creat some sort of device that gets rid of lag all together....I'd spend up to $500 on something like that knowing me. ;P
And yes, i ment the 55" LK520 my bad!
post #3507 of 4189
is LED worse than LCD CCFL? Saw a UN46EH6000 (240hz) that looked miles ahead of the D550/LK450 lines but I'm sure theres a downside. In general, are they better or worse? Someone needs to test this new model they look wonderful.
post #3508 of 4189
First post here, and like many others never really thought of "input lag" from a TV but after cruising around on here I see thats its a BIG problem for gamers especially anyone who plays FPS games.

Ive been playing ps3 console on a 42" Philips LCD "42pfl3603d/27" for a couple years now and just decided I wanted a bigger display, I opted for a 55" Sony Bravia "KDL55bx520" bigggggggggg mistake..... input lag was so bad I couldnt even fly a jet or heli in BF3..... I tried turning off all processing and still is horrible....so I put tv in my living room.... has anyone found a great lcd/led screen in the 50-55" range with minimal lag?
post #3509 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by jloutz View Post

What about the 2012 Panasonic VIERA TC-L37E5 37-Inch LCD tv? I see Amazon has them now and was wandering if any one is considering it.

I'v 2011 Model 37E30E(European model)

InputLAG w/Game Mode;10ms and w/Standard Mode;35ms

those values against "TN" base panel as well!!

If you test against CRT base which means inputLAG more!
such as 15/20ms w/Game Mode ON

all in all Pany LCDs(32/37) are OK for Gaming and one off the fast
TVs ever
post #3510 of 4189
Quote:
Originally Posted by albani View Post

I'v 2011 Model 37E30E(European model)

InputLAG w/Game Mode;10ms and w/Standard Mode;35ms

those values against "TN" base panel as well!!

If you test against CRT base which means inputLAG more!
such as 15/20ms w/Game Mode ON

all in all Pany LCDs(32/37) are OK for Gaming and one off the fast
TVs ever

Just clarifying what your saying. If you test the display against a CRT it shows roughly 15-20ms lag?

That would be consistent with what I have seen before the only downside to the PANNY is that they definetly do not do 4:4:4 Chroma subsampling so they don't make a good monitor.
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