Epson Calibration Guide! (1080, 1080UB, 6100, 6500UB, 7500UB) - Page 11

I need some help as i just recieved the eyeone Display LT....Im kind of an amature so forgive the dumb ???s

Ok i did the stereodmans colour gain and offset by adjusting the red and blue so they match using the 90 30 and 40 % grey window.... Now to adjust the gamma thats where i get stuck. after the gain and offset i did the grey scale test from 0 - 100% windows and got the value 40.699 is this high..... or i might be doing something wrong....not sure...

anyway i put the number into the excel spreadsheet and it gave me numbers for the 2.22 gamma sliders in the hcr window what do i look at to adjust the number to the excel sheet... i did it by the Y value near the red gren blue bars.. but i could not get some to the numbers....

So is there a guide that shows exacly what needs to be done and i have read a stereos and smalls guide but a bit un sure.....

i am using a 1080 / tw1000 so anyone htta has done it for these....please help..

thanx...

Denis

If you are using the 100% number in the top of the spreadsheet that is correct. You need to adjust the sliders in the custom gamma (adjust from graph) window starting at the second from the right and start adjusting it (I had to pull it down a lot) to try and match the 90% Y value (I just loaded 40.699 into the spreadsheet and got 32.21 as the target Y value for the 90% window). The sliders will affect more than one window - especially the ones to the right. Do NOT move the 1st or last slider, but adjust the ones between. Start with the 2nd from the right and work left as you change the windows (90%, 80%, etc). I could never get it very precise. You then need to run a 0 - 100% gray scale test again and see what improvement you have made.

I had a terrible time with the upper end of my gamma graph as it was dropping off a cliff. If this is the case, then your contrast is too high. I assume you first set brightness and contrast (Stereomandan suggest that you lower contrast 2 notches from test disk setting as it make the calibration much better) and that HDMI was set to expanded. Also, you should have the probe in the neighborhood of 24" from the screen.

I would suggest you post your HCFR file and spreadsheet so other can look at it. I'm pretty much a rookie, but think I understand the procedure (I have a 6500).

Does your 1080 have Hue, Saturation and Brightness adjustments for RGBCYM? I've read that early versions of this model didn't have Brightness, which complicates calibrating the colors.

Hope this helps.

no my 1080 like beer does not have the brightness in the rgbcym..

so in the basic tes tpattern for contrast how many bars should i see from 234 as i lower the contrast i can get all the bars to show up to the end but i think that is too much....

also when adjust say the 90% window and have hc runing on continous rrading where do i look for the input Y so i can set it to say 32.21 or do i drop the 2nd last slider and then do a re grey test to see what 90% it comes to..... as from what i just read from you knd thats what i gather....

um 24" is this inches.... sorry from Australia so we use more cm mm and so forth i have the probe to the highes ftl i could get which is approx 4 inches from the screen on a tripod angle a bit up.. lower a little from the screen
thanx KND....

when i do the saturation for the RGBCYM since i dont have the brightness bars how should i go about setting this what numbers do i follow...
once i get this then ill be about right... then ill post up my settings...
whe i did the gain... i had to raise the r almost to top.. this sound right...
thanx

thanx

For contrast I beleive I would set it so the bars 235 and above were flashing and then move 2 more settings. I think that had the bars up to about 240 flashing (I'm not at home and can't check my setup). You can try it with just 235 and above flashing but I found I couldn't get the gamma line flat at the higher values.

Yes, you are doing the gamma correctly, set HCFR for continuous reading and then read the cd/m^2 value from the left side (there are several readings there cd/m^2, ftL, T, etc). You don't want the "Y" value, but rather the cd/m^2, as that is what the spreadsheet calculates. Also, your 40.699 is in these units. You use the 2nd to last slider to adjust the continuous value shown until you get it close to the 32.21 (cd/m^2). You then put up an 80% window, see what the reading is and use the 2nd and 3rd from the right to adjust the value down to what the spreadsheet calculates. It was never very precise for me. I would do this down to 20% window, rerun the gray scale test, look at the gamma and see if it has improved. I would then just go into gamma adjustment and move the sliders based upon the improvement from the orginal and rerun the gray scale test. I only used the calculated results for my first pass, as I found it to be quicker to just adjust the sliders based upon the previous gamma curves. I also found that I had to pull all sliders down below the line, and some quite low.

Yes, 24 inches. I first started calibrating at about 9", but found that by pulling the probe back it was much easier to get more consistent readings. Smallpooldad has written on this and quite a lot on gamma. Have you checked out his checklist? Link is in the first post.

Yes, my tripod is set very similar to yours, below midpoint of the screen and angled up some (this is dependent upon how high you have your projector mounted, and how high your screen is), as you want the face of the probe to be perpendicular to the light path from the projector.

Ok i did the gains and i did the offset. the gamma got to 2.22 and contrast is 985:1
did the tweak so the 10% is at 2.15 gamma so i got that pretty good...

the only things that i cant match to the readings is the saturation as i think this is due to brightness setting in the rgbmcy settings... i did it to the best i could get it and now testing out from what i can tell its better than beer settings but i gather that as diff setup screen lighting and so forth...

do i do the contrast test again and brightness or leave it as is....

thanx for your help KND

its looking good...

some pointers on the rgbmcy since i dont have the brightness settings

or the way i did it is the closest i can get..

thanx All..

Denis

The gain may be correct. Did you set the tint and saturation settings that Stereomandan suggests (-4, and -10 respectively)? If not that may be the reason for such a high gain setting (I beleive the saturation at -10, lowers the gains and offsets amounts on gray scale).

Opus007 has a similar projector to your in regards to no brightness control for RGBCYM. Start reading from post #200. Stereomandan (the real expert) offers some suggestions a few posts down, and Opus007 posted some of his files so you can see what is possible.

Hope this helps.

Hi...coming in with an entry at Page 11 of this thread...I am hoping that all the experts here will respond ...and please do be patient...because I will come across as an amateur.

I spent the last 2 evenings calibrating my EPSFON 6500 (TW4000 in Australia). I use a Display 2 and ColorHCFR software...
I also used Kal (Curtpalme) calibration for Dummies as my starting point...

To cut a long story short..I set my GAmma at 2.2 all other settings to default..using "Normal" mode to work with...
a) I had excellent results with my Gray Scale calibration...almost all (except 10 IRE) having a dE of less than 3!!
b) Began to calibrate my Primaries and Secondaries..
- Using the AVD 100% saturation windows, I began the process of tweaking the "brightness", Hue and Saturation...(x,y & Y)...but keeping Y constant based on the %ages suggested in the document (Kals)

PROBLEM : No matter what I do, I cant seem to get a reaction from the Meter when I tweak Hue AND Saturation for each of the RGBYCM !!! They all just remain fairly static.

Now, I know the meter is fine, because I used it to calibrate my greyscales....somehow, nothing that I do affects the x,y readings...tweaking the Hue and Saturation!!

My CIE Diagram, with HD 709 Standard triangle..shows me a completely warped TRIANGLE for my "calibration" (if that is the word!!)...and my dE are all above 20!!

Can anybody help throw some light as to what I may have missed...because I have no doubt that my inexperience with this is the cause of my messing things up...

(but I am having fun!!!)

Thanks

KND i got the hang of it using stereo and small mostly smalls

i got the gamma as close as i could get it using the spread sheet, i did the rgbycm and got the number perfect with 100% window... yes it is a bit duller but then i went after everything the brightness a bit and contrast... to make it a bit brighter. does anyone know what tips for us 1080 owners have for the rgbmcy without bright control...

thanx to everyone as its starting to come together once my head got wrapped around it....

did u end up trning the iris back on.. after or u think its not needed....

I'm not sure I know what you mean by "normal" setting. Is this the HDMI setting? If so, I have had better results with Expanded and set the brightness and contrast from this.
My suggestion is to use the dummie guide for gray scale and gamma, but to use Post #1 of this thread to set colors. The 75% saturation windows give better overall color than using the 100% saturation windows. You will end up getting good correlation for the 25%, 50%, and 75% points for all 6 colors. The 100% points will be outside the triangle, but I have read (and experienced) that movies or HDTV rarely have 100% saturation of any color in their content.

You really should study Post #1 and try this technique.

Ok...here is what I did last night...I copied and pasted the dialog between Stereomandan and Dukster...(because Dukster had the same issues as me!!)..
This together with Stereomandans Excel Spreadsheet....helped me with my calibration last night...

Stayed up late in the night doing this...and I think I have (at least I think) good results...because I was comparing my results to Duksters' (using Duksters .chc files as my reference)...

Would Streomandan be kind enough to have a look at my .chc files an comment...please ? Though I am not sure how to attach my .chc files!!

Dan ?

Cheers
Kris

het stero / dan

i used the 100% sat method for the rgbmcy is this ok or is it better to do the 75% method.....

1 ? when i did custom gamma and put the Y 100% which was 45.506 or so....when i started to do the gamma adjust in the graph i matched all the numbers as close as possible to the 2.22 of the spread sheet....at the 100% brightness of 45.506 or so...
no when i did the grey scale again i got gamma at 2.26/7 and the total 100% is not the same as the one i first used... is this a prob.... should i get the gamma at 2.22 (i did the 2.15 for 10%). what are your thoughts on this.. as i do not have the 1080ub only the 1080 without brightness controls. So any help on this would be great...

i did at the end redo the brightness and contrast to the disc to get the bars right.... was it ok to do this as it brightened up my picture as it was dull at the end of the calibration not too bad but a touch dull.

Thanx All

Sorry..didnt reply to your post...
And, it should have read "Natural" not "normal"...Duh !!!

Did read this post, and many others and read through them several times..I think I went better last night...at least I could maneuver the controls to fix the Primaries and Secondaries...

Dan has kindly consented to having a look at my files...thanks Dan.

Dan...first THANK YOU very much...you must receive many such requests for your time...so I am grateful.

I was waiting with bated breath for your response, not having the guts to look at my picture (and that sounds really crazy, but it is true) till you gave me the "approval"....

The bulb has less than 100 hours on it, which is why that brightness level...but I noticed that I started out at around 35 cd/m2 and as the Projector warmed up...it slowly climbed to that level...

And that is why, I decided to move to LOW lamp brightness ...all the while I was using HIGH !!

Will post again tonight after looking at the results of my calibration..I have a fairly bright room, so I need the dark to make a good evaluation...

But I will post again ...with my own evaluation...

Thanks Dan...you are a star!!

I calibrated using LOW lamp!! ...I am going to give HIGH Lamp a miss..for the moment...

I did start out with HIGH settings but decided to go LOW - that decision was based on Dkster's impressions with his calibrating...

Yes..

One more question, Dan...

Having a look at my Gamma Slider...the points are all over the place (visibly)...though the readings are all according to your suggestions for a value of 2.22

Is that ok?

Also get a few bright patches on dark faces...which shouldnt be...not sure what to tweak...looking at my settings...any thoughts ?

Cheers
KW

I had that same problem. The second slider from the left that you adjust was much higher than the rest when I calibrated it to 2.22 according to the spread sheet. I believe I had it calibrated to around +6 when every other slider was between -6 and -15! With it set to +6 faces looked horrible, especially in dark scenes. It made them cartoonish like a cheap lcd flat panel. I paused it on a scene where it was obvious and lowered that slider from +6 to about -5. That fixed the problem.

I don't know why I had a problem with only that slider. Maybe the formula in the spread sheet is wrong or maybe I missed something. I tried it many times and no matter what that slider should be set to around +6 according to the spread sheet. I gave up and set it to -5 where is looked best with actual content.

Thanks Martin for that input...I will give it a shot this evening...not sure where my second slider is at the moment...but you have understood my problem straight away...(looks like a cheap LCD ..LOL...exactly!!)...

Are your sliders points all over the place ? Or is that ok? or should that slider meant to have a smooth curve (when you have an imaginary line joining the dots?)?

Cheers
KW

I don't believe it needs to be a perfect curve but I think it should be fairly smooth. I knew when the second slider was +6 and the rest were below -5 that it wouldn't look right. It didn't.

I am not sure if the problem is the sensor getting a poor reading at such low light level or if there is a problem with the spreadsheet itself. I didn't have a problem with the first slider you adjust do I don't know why there is only a problem with the second one.

My gamma slider is all up and down...and there is nothing smooth about it!!

I will try again this evening..because obviously there is a problem...

What I wanted to know is where the problem lay...with my Greyscales or Gamma or Primary and Secondaries?

I think you helped me with that, Martin...many thanks..
KW

Thanks Dan. Yes that is with the iris off. Keep in mind when I say second slider I mean the second from the left that we adjust. Which is actually the third from the left since we don't touch the first one. I don't know why mine is so far off only on that slider. If the first slider we adjust was off as well I would assume I had something set wrong. I don't think I have the brightness set to high but I will try the blank screen test the next time I use the projector.

Looking into purchasing a 7500UB. What kind of lumens are you guys seeing *after* calibration?

thanks