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Epson Calibration Guide! (1080, 1080UB, 6100, 6500UB, 7500UB) - Page 24

post #691 of 730
Did you try calibration to 75% saturation that is very well covered in this thread? Calibration to 100% saturation will not work - I tried it several times and was very frustrated and almost gave up until I found this thread. I’m away for the weekend but will share my setting next week. Please note they may not work for you as my screen is 0.8 Gray screen.

BTW – is there a thread that covers calibration and calibration results for 3010? I could not find it.
post #692 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by dzieju1 View Post

Did you try calibration to 75% saturation that is very well covered in this thread? Calibration to 100% saturation will not work - I tried it several times and was very frustrated and almost gave up until I found this thread. I’m away for the weekend but will share my setting next week. Please note they may not work for you as my screen is 0.8 Gray screen.
BTW – is there a thread that covers calibration and calibration results for 3010? I could not find it.

Actually thats a good point. I only tried 100% and gave up ! May be I should try it again !

Unfortunately there is no calibration thread or official owner's thread. There is an unofficial owner's thread that gets some posts once in a while but no talk about calibration...may be because users are mesmerized with out of box performance of 3010 smile.gif

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1366241/my-epson-3010-projector-just-arrived
post #693 of 730
Yes, I have seen that thread and read at least 80% of that as I was researching the PJ. I could not decide between this one and HD-33 and Acer H9500. Still not sure if I made the right decision…..smile.gif
post #694 of 730
falafala,

Attached are my settings - sory for the picture quality. It was taken with the phone.


photo1.JPG 1548k .JPG file

photo (2).JPG 1490k .JPG file

photo3.JPG 1639k .JPG file

photo.JPG 1441k .JPG file
post #695 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by dzieju1 View Post

Hi All,
My first post but I have been following this forum for months. I have read each and every post in this thread. Thank you all very much for all the hard work you put in it and shared with others. You made calibration possible for some one like me.
Please see attached my calibration of my first front projector Epson 3010. Please let me know what you think. To me it looks really good but I’m not as experienced as you are.
The question I have is: I do not really see that much improvement in the picture after the calibration – I mean there is some improvement but I think I expected to be blown away after reading some of the posts in this thread.
Is there anything I can still improve in the calibration? I’m projecting from 11.5’ on 120” 0.8 Gray home made screen in light controlled room.
Thanks
Epson 3010 Gama 2.22.zip 382k .zip file
Custom Gama 2.22.zip 6k .zip file

For some reason I couldn't open the HCFR file, but the spreadsheet looks like you've got the technique down. The only other adjustment that you may want to do is to make sure you have your black level set correctly.

I think that some of the earlier projectors that this guide was used on didn't have particularly good "out of the box" pictures, so this may be the reason for so much enthusiasm. I know my 6500 was quite a bit improved following this guide, but my 5010 out of the box was pretty good.
post #696 of 730
Quote:
For some reason I couldn't open the HCFR file, but the spreadsheet looks like you've got the technique down. The only other adjustment that you may want to do is to make sure you have your black level set correctly.

HCFR file was created with the new FORK HCFR 3.0.4.0
post #697 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by dzieju1 View Post

falafala,
Attached are my settings - sory for the picture quality. It was taken with the phone.
photo1.JPG 1548k .JPG file
photo (2).JPG 1490k .JPG file
photo3.JPG 1639k .JPG file
photo.JPG 1441k .JPG file

Thanks a lot ! I will try these over the weekend. Do you by any chance have "before" and "after" pictures ?
post #698 of 730
Does anyone calibrate with 'Living Room' mode?

I understand the instructions here said to calibrate in 'Natural' mode.

But Natural mode for my Epson 8100 on a gray screen is way too dark (~6ftL).

Living Room mode gives me about 17ftL on the same gray screen.
post #699 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Does anyone calibrate with 'Living Room' mode?
I understand the instructions here said to calibrate in 'Natural' mode.
But Natural mode for my Epson 8100 on a gray screen is way too dark (~6ftL).
Living Room mode gives me about 17ftL on the same gray screen.

You could, you are just going to have to sacrifice on overall total accuracy. Up to you to decide if the extra brightness is worth it, which IMO is...
post #700 of 730
But if you calibrate it, wouldn't the accuracy be a moot?
post #701 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

But if you calibrate it, wouldn't the accuracy be a moot?

It depends on whether there is enough adjustment range in the controls to calibrate the brighter setting. For example, many years ago I tried to calibrate my old Panasonic AE3000 in 'normal' mode which doesn't use an internal filter unlike the more accurate (but darker) 'colour 1' mode. I as unable to calibrate the brighter mode fully and in doing so brought the brightness right down to a similar amount to the 'accurate' mode. In order to do this I had to apply much more adjustment which in itself might be more prone to create side effects, so there is no free lunch. wink.gif
post #702 of 730
hmm...I see
post #703 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Does anyone calibrate with 'Living Room' mode?
I understand the instructions here said to calibrate in 'Natural' mode.
But Natural mode for my Epson 8100 on a gray screen is way too dark (~6ftL).
Living Room mode gives me about 17ftL on the same gray screen.

When I owned my 6500ub I calibrated in natural mode but wanted more light. I then calibrated in living room but decided to calibrate in dynamic as it is very similar to living room but with slightly more output.

I now exclusively use dynamic mode on my 5010. I posted my calibration results and where you lose accuracy is between 75% saturation and 100% saturation. My understanding is that much of normal viewing is in the 0% to 75% saturation range so the higher end inaccuracy is not usually seen.

Anyway I much perfer the additional lumens and I can't see any difference in picture quality. Also with the add'l lumens the shadow detail looks more pronounced to me but it may be my older eyes.

Green is the most inaccurate of the colors but watching golf tournaments for example still look great.
post #704 of 730
Thanks KND.

That's very good to know.

Maybe I should try calibrating it in Natural mode. I do prefer the gray screen, but want a brighter image.

Where's you calibration results?
post #705 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Thanks KND.
That's very good to know.
Maybe I should try calibrating it in Natural mode. I do prefer the gray screen, but want a brighter image.
Where's you calibration results?

Posts 683 and 684 pg 23 (one page back).
post #706 of 730
Knd

I have a 3010 and I somehow got the impression that in Dynamic mode it should be similar to 5010. If this is true, should I expect to see improvemnets in PQ with your settings? May be I should try before asking smile.gif

anyway other question is I have been itching to use Dynamic mode but refrained from it as I was concerned it my reduce lamp life....is this true? Other fear I have is if i get used to Dynamic from day one (as opposed to Natural or Cenema I am using now) I may be disappointed with lumen loss as the lamp ages and I wont have another setting to increase the lumens. Do you agree with my concern?

last point is will I extend the lamp life in running the fan in High Altitude mode so it keeps the bulb cooler?
post #707 of 730
Hey guys, I need some help. I got stuck at color gamut calibration.

Epson 8100 (Living Room mode)
HCFR version 3.0.4.0
i1D3

I went through grayscale and gamma.

Then I started color gamut, adjusted RED just fine (got it to 378% and 24%/24%).

I then moved on to GREEN, this is where I got stuck. I maxed out saturation but couldn't get green to 133%, the highest is 129%.

Am I doing something very wrong?

Here are some graphs of the grayscale measurement. 30%-100% looks decent.

Can you provide some insight/feedback as to why GREEN is giving me the problem?

Thanks













post #708 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Hey guys, I need some help. I got stuck at color gamut calibration.
Epson 8100 (Living Room mode)
HCFR version 3.0.4.0
i1D3
I went through grayscale and gamma.
Then I started color gamut, adjusted RED just fine (got it to 378% and 24%/24%).
I then moved on to GREEN, this is where I got stuck. I maxed out saturation but couldn't get green to 133%, the highest is 129%.
Am I doing something very wrong?
Here are some graphs of the grayscale measurement. 30%-100% looks decent.
Can you provide some insight/feedback as to why GREEN is giving me the problem?
Thanks
At least 3 factors (other than those that you mentioned above) are potentially affecting your color gamut performance & measurement:

(1) your screen (some screen materials tends to shrink the gamut triangle more than the others)
(2) your viewing environment (e.g. ambient light, color of walls / ceiling / floor, and their reflectivity, etc.)
(3) your meter (measured by spectro, or spectro-profiled colorimeter, or just the bare colorimeter, etc.)
post #709 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by dominickwok View Post

At least 3 factors (other than those that you mentioned above) are potentially affecting your color gamut performance & measurement:
(1) your screen (some screen materials tends to shrink the gamut triangle more than the others)
(2) your viewing environment (e.g. ambient light, color of walls / ceiling / floor, and their reflectivity, etc.)
(3) your meter (measured by spectro, or spectro-profiled colorimeter, or just the bare colorimeter, etc.)




Can you elaborate?

1 - I have a doubled layer spandex screen (white with silver backing)
2 - dedicated room. light controlled. walls and celing are dark gold and dark brown
3 - i1D3 colorimeter
post #710 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by falafala View Post

Knd
I have a 3010 and I somehow got the impression that in Dynamic mode it should be similar to 5010. If this is true, should I expect to see improvemnets in PQ with your settings? May be I should try before asking smile.gif
anyway other question is I have been itching to use Dynamic mode but refrained from it as I was concerned it my reduce lamp life....is this true? Other fear I have is if i get used to Dynamic from day one (as opposed to Natural or Cenema I am using now) I may be disappointed with lumen loss as the lamp ages and I wont have another setting to increase the lumens. Do you agree with my concern?
last point is will I extend the lamp life in running the fan in High Altitude mode so it keeps the bulb cooler?

I don't really know about the 3010, as I've never owned one.

Dynamic should have no effect on lamp life.

My approach is to use Eco mode, Dynamic until the lumen output gets low (I'm guessing well over 1000 hours) and switch to high lamp. I don't know if the 3010 has the same bulb as the 5010, but they went to a 230 watt bulb and mine has plenty of output for my 118" diagonal screen. So if you are projecting on a smaller screen then you may want to stick with Natural (or Cinema) until that gets dimmer and then switch to Dynamic until that get dimmer and then high lamp Dynamic until the end of life of your bulb.

I find I like the brighter image as I can see shadow details better on darker scenes, although it might be my older eyes (I'm 58).

I don't know about the High Altitude mode. I read on this forum that some folks are using that but don't know whether it works or not.

Hope this helps.
post #711 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Hey guys, I need some help. I got stuck at color gamut calibration.
Epson 8100 (Living Room mode)
HCFR version 3.0.4.0
i1D3
I went through grayscale and gamma.
Then I started color gamut, adjusted RED just fine (got it to 378% and 24%/24%).
I then moved on to GREEN, this is where I got stuck. I maxed out saturation but couldn't get green to 133%, the highest is 129%.
Am I doing something very wrong?
Here are some graphs of the grayscale measurement. 30%-100% looks decent.
Can you provide some insight/feedback as to why GREEN is giving me the problem?
Thanks
[

If you go back far enough in this guide, you'll see that the Epson's have issues with green in Living Room and Dynamic mode. I believe that the reason they don't with the other modes is the projector slides a filter into the light path to correct for this. This filter is also the reason that the lumen output drops so for Cinema and Natural modes. There is nothing you can do to fix the green in Living Room or Dynamic.

I calibrate in Dynamic mode and I just get the 75% saturation for green as close as I can get it. On the 5010 it gets pretty close, but 100% saturation will be off (yellowish if I recall correctly). In real viewing I don't think the 100% green saturation shows up much because I can't notice it, and I've watched a lot of golf, football and soccer in this mode and the greens always look about right, even green uniforms.
post #712 of 730
Thanks KND.

That's good to know.

It's strange that I couldn't get my GREEN calibrate properly, but on the greyscale measurements graphs, it looks spot on.

Looks like I also need to bring my red down a bit.

Also, any tips to get gamma closer? Espcially 10%, 20%, and 50%?
post #713 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Thanks KND.
That's good to know.
It's strange that I couldn't get my GREEN calibrate properly, but on the greyscale measurements graphs, it looks spot on.
Looks like I also need to bring my red down a bit.
Also, any tips to get gamma closer? Espcially 10%, 20%, and 50%?

Gamma can take a lot of time. One hint that I've learned over time is that the sliders affect different IRE's depending on which slider you move and also how much you move them. For example the 2nd from the left slider primarily affects 10 IRE and small movements of the sliders make quite large changes. The 3rd from the left primarily affects 20 IRE, but when you get over to the 2nd from the end on the right side, this slider seems to affect about 60 - 90 IRE and takes more movement to create much change.

So to improve 10 and 20 I would try moving the 2nd slider from the left up one click and the 3rd from the left up 2 clicks. I would pull down the 3 slider from the right 2 clicks for 50 IRE. You may want to try making all 3 changes and then rerun you gray scale (gamma) or make one move at a time and rerun your gray scale for each change. I also save the settings every time I have an improvement, so if I accidentally move something the wrong way I can just revert back to the last saved settings and start again.

Hope this helps.
post #714 of 730
Thanks, I noticed that too.

The second slider from the right impacts the 60-90% values.

So moving the slider up lower the gamma values? It has a inverse effect?

What about my RED? Lower brightness a little to bring it down?
post #715 of 730
No matter what I do, I just couldn't get green close.

What do I do? Just ignore it and move on?
post #716 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Thanks, I noticed that too.
The second slider from the right impacts the 60-90% values.
So moving the slider up lower the gamma values? It has a inverse effect?
What about my RED? Lower brightness a little to bring it down?

Yes, moving the slider up lowers the gamma value and pulling it down raises the value (bigger number).

Your question about brightness only is used when trying to get the color red to spec. Since your graphs above don't have any information on saturation, hue or brightness I am assuming you mean the red of your gray scale. So brightness doesn't have any affect on gray scale only gains and offsets do. Your red is a little high at 30 IRE and 80 IRE, the two points that are typically used. Offsets are used for 30, and gains are used for 80, so reduce red at these two locations and that should improve your measurements, but to be honest they're pretty good as shown. One thing I have read is that a dE below 4 is generally not visible to the human eye.

Hope this helps.
Edited by Knd - 12/13/12 at 4:18am
post #717 of 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

No matter what I do, I just couldn't get green close.
What do I do? Just ignore it and move on?

That's what I would do. Finish the calibration and then start watching things to see what your impressions are. To me, gray scale and gamma are more noticeable than "perfect" colors.
Edited by Knd - 12/13/12 at 4:19am
post #718 of 730
just got a 8700ub. will test the method here after mount it to ceiling.
any settings (8700UB) can be share for reference?
post #719 of 730
Greetings!

First post here.

This thread has been a huge education tool for me. That being said I lack a meter for proper calibration. I own a Epson 6100 and would appreciate anyone to share their calibration settings with me. Im looking for a place to start. thanks!
post #720 of 730
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ez3c View Post

Greetings!

First post here.

This thread has been a huge education tool for me. That being said I lack a meter for proper calibration. I own a Epson 6100 and would appreciate anyone to share their calibration settings with me. Im looking for a place to start. thanks!

Glad to help. Sorry I don't have any reference calibrations for a 6100.

I would be interested to know how the latest Epson's behave with the current CMS system.

Dan
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