Best Receiver for music? Video less important

Originally Posted by dhensley

Hi Everyone,

I am trying to find the best receiver for my needs, which are probably different than most of you. I am more interested in getting the best sounding music than I having amazing, wall shattering sound for my blu-ray movies. Dont get wrong, I would like to have a nice surround sound, but I am more interested in the quality of the sound for listening to music...this is my priority. I want to be able to hear/feel the kick drum like it is in the same room as me (not just feel a heavy but cheap boom from the bass). I also want to be able to clearly hear a singer's voice(s) and identify all the various instruments.

Most of my music, dvd and blu-ray watching will come through my HTPC. I have a number of high quality audio/video outputs and will purchase any new audio card needed to support my listening needs (for music or video).

I was considering getting the Marantz SR6003 or Onkyo TX-SR806. I almost pulled the trigger last Friday and decided to wait. When I decided to go ahead an buy the Marantz a day later I see that both receivers have now jumped up price by ~$300...this is almost full price. I would like to stay under $700 and I am considering the TX-SR606 at this point, or maybe the TX-SR607. I really need some advice though.

What would you suggest in this scenario?

I have posted a similar message on another board and have heard I should sway away from Onkyo due to my interest in music, but I still need help finding an optimal receiver.

Thanks

I am more interested in getting the best sounding music

Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman

I would think a solid kick drum would be helped by a decent powered sub.

Originally Posted by penngray

lots of discussion on this over the past couple of years. Most discussion has been in threads talking about Midbass solutions.

First,
Solid kick drum has nothing to do with receivers and all to do with speakers and SPL.

Secondly, its actually the low end of the main speakers that is more important here....the 60Hz to 120Hz region is where most people fail to improve their systems and that is where the "kick in the chest" feelings happens.

So if the OP wants "solid kick drum" he needs to make sure he has main speakers that do that FR justice and he needs the power to driver his speakers to the SPL levels needed for the greatest impact.

The OP has lots of choices since he only wants Music he can look several years back for quality Receivers saving himself a great deal of money and putting it into a serious power amp!!!

Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman

Can't say I agree 100%, but my comments are based on my memory. I will try to do some testing to see if my results agree with my memory or not.

I would still like to "hear" all the details in the music at lower levels. That is something I worry about as I have heard nice systems at friends houses and they sound great at very high volume but A LOT of sound disappears at lower levels.

Originally Posted by dhensley

Thanks for the feedback so far.

One thing I forgot to mention, and I want to make sure comes across is that I would like to be able to hear the music well at different sound levels. I would like to be able to pump the system up once in while to really get into it and feel it, but I would also like to be able to have some soft music playing in the background while I work on my computer. I would still like to "hear" all the details in the music at lower levels. That is something I worry about as I have heard nice systems at friends houses and they sound great at very high volume but A LOT of sound disappears at lower levels.

Any specific help on this issue?

Thanks

Originally Posted by bigbare

Can't say as if I agree you need EQ nessacarily. I am not saying I totally disagree either as I haven't personally used any. However with the right speakers and processor you can certainly have detailed music at all volumes. Just one experience I had that shocked me a bit... I was waiting for my local dealer to finish up with a customer and was walking around the store a bit. I noticed some music playing in the "listening" room, mostly what shocked me was how low the volume was yet how clear the sound was. The room is not what some would call a listening room, basically it is just a room with demo speakers on the wall, some different amps, and the processor and transports etc. They use Mac gear with no EQ or tone controls. I could not figure out what speakers were on, I had to actually walk around with my ears right next to each speaker to figure it out! This happened on several occasions with different speakers, mind you they were all 1500 and up speakers. So you can achieve your goal without the EQ it just takes the right gear. I know that takes you above you pricing so I would say get good speakers that can grow with the rest of the system, then buy a receiver that fits your needs (I recommend Marantz) and has pre outs so you can add an amp down the road, then move into a pre/pro with good 2ch performance. You may not get exactly what you are looking for right away so be patient and buy wisely. Happy listening!!

Originally Posted by bigbare

Not sure what you mean you can't trust anyone. Eveytime I've gone to demo anything I can always see where the interconnects go so what can they hide? They also give me control over the processor, again hard to hide something. Of course you will not get exact results that is why most offer in home as well. Sorry but that comment is unnecessary and can put peole off, especially those who don't have money to just throw around. It can give them a good peace of mind before they buy.

Originally Posted by penngray

Thats cool, my comments are based on my own tests with mains and ending up building my own mains. There are lots of threads out there to read on it and we have had lots of DIY discussions on mid-bass lacking. The DIY crowd are the ones with the best sub systems out there but still we lack that kick in the chest feeling. The problem is that the mains seldom keep up with the subs, you can not have wimpy mains if you want that kick in the chest.

Read what Dr. Geddes says about all that stuff too. Heck, Dr. Geddes Summas are probably what the OP needs....best dynamic CD speakers out there!!

Originally Posted by bigbare

Nice thing about them is you can mout them pretty much right on the ceiling if you had to and wouldn't have an issue.

Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman

I set my levels automatically through YPAO. I made a few tweaks. Speakers are set to small, probably via speaker size skip. YPAO suggest a 60hz xover, which I used.

Main Speakers are ACI Sapphire 25th Anniv. ed. Are they full range? Probably not by many people's definition. But they do put out bass.

In Pure Direct mode, on the NIN track closer, bass is much better with the sub on. It's tricky to say that that the sub is not introducing higher levels of bass. But it's clear on the Closer kick drums ( which could be electronic, or electronically augmented,) bass is improved, IMO. Pure Direct sounds weak in comparison.

So in my experience, I would say a powered sub is important. Rock and roll songs always sound better to me when Pure Direct is not engaged.

Songs with a lot of synth bass practically demand a sub, unless your speakers are excellent performers.

Originally Posted by bigbare

Yes their job is to sell a procuct, that does not mean they all lie in order to do it. One should certainly educate themselves before venturing out to visit these salemen so as not to get caught off gaurd. You can only educate yourself in science and such matters for so long until you need to venture forth and put some faith into your learnings. Hence the sales people and their demo gear. It is very easy for one to get caught up in the hype people create on forums and advertisements so it is very important to be abel to go hear/see for oneself what they think of the hype. Science will take you so far then no matter how hard one may try there is always personal thought and feelings, especially when it comes to music. So again one needs to be able to go and do it for themsleves. I will not disagree that many slaes people are frauds who are there just to sell, but I have come across a few that are there to make you happy as they know a happy customer comes back. Just like there are people who will tell lies on these forums that you need to wade through. Happy listening!!

Originally Posted by Russdawg

Buy a used Arcam AVR 300 from Audiogon. 7-800 dollars...

Very few if any AVR receivers work better with music than an Arcam, just google and read up.

I am more interested in the quality of the sound for listening to music...this is my priority. I want to be able to hear/feel the kick drum like it is in the same room as me (not just feel a heavy but cheap boom from the bass).

I would like to keep my speaker budget under $1000 and I need to keep them as small and unobtrusive as possible. Additionally, any "rear" speakers are not going to be able to be behind me, they will have to be next to my head.... Ideally, I would not have large speakers next to my TV. I think something the size of bose speakers are smaller than what I a shooting for, but I would also like to keep them smaller than regular bookshelf speakers if it is possible to do so while getting nice/clear sound.