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Samsung PN**B450 Picture Settings - Page 47

post #1381 of 1471
The Upcoming Sinusoidal Settings:

Greetings Colleagues,

I just ordered a double conversion ups. After receipt and connection to my theater system, I will redo the calibrations to see if there is any noticeable difference or improvement, and then report back.

Vincentfam
post #1382 of 1471
The Upcoming Sinusoidal Settings: Preliminary.

Greetings Colleagues:

The double conversion ups (uninterrupted power supply) has arrived and, based on observations alone, the picture quality appears to have improved, with the standard mode having what appears to be a definite improvement. The picture appears to be smoother.

I wouldn't classify the improvements as substantial, but would describe them as "definite", meaning there appears to be some improvement that is noticeable - especially with the standard mode.

There may have been some improvement to my picture quality due to tv's proximity to furnace (15 feet), two refrigerators, three other tvs, two microwaves, laundry machines, neighborhood electrical grid, appliances, etc., that may have introduced electrical noise.

I have yet to perform calibrations with the ups. It was kind of heavy (40 pounds) and I had to place it in two different places for best positioning to plug in the various home theater components. I will perform calibrations by this upcoming Saturday.

On average, this ups is not cheap and may not be worth the costs unless your personal preference is for improving picture quality no matter how small. Also, your home electrical environment may have a decent power supply where a double conversion ups may not add any benefit to picture quality.

Nonetheless, I am not disappointed in getting the ups. There are other benefits from this device. Perhaps, after more calibrations, I will be able to give you more details on changes in settings, if any.

Vincentfam
post #1383 of 1471
The Colormunki - Sinusoidal Settings with Double Conversion UPS:

Greetings Colleagues. Herein are the Colormunki - Sinusoidal Settings, using a double conversion ups power source. The picture quality appears to have improved with some noticeable changes to the movie modes and significant but not substantial changes for the standard modes. Sound quality appears to be better - at least my wife is telling me to turn down the tv a little more.

Calibration tweaks made some changes to rgb offsets and gains, but no changes to contrast, brightness, color, tint, and sharpness settings. Gamma levels were near levels measured without the UPS.

If I had to do it all over again, I would still buy the double conversion ups. But note for some it may not produce the same or better results, depending on your electrical circuitry. Also, there is noise from the ups' fan which does not bother me at all.

Standard HDMI
D93 Color Temperature
screen fit
Using AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion Pure Sine Wave UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 9
contrast 87
brightness 46
sharpness 0
color 49
tint 53/47
black tone off
Gamma -1
auto color space
offsets Red 11 Green 22 Blue 32
Gain Red 50 Green 26 Blue 33
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie HDMI
See revised and brighter settings in # 1385 below
D65 Color Temperature
screen fit
Using AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion Pure Sine Wave UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 88
brightness 47
sharpness 4
color 49
tint 52/48
black tone off
Gamma +1
auto color space
offsets Red 31 Green 29 Blue 37
Gain Red 44 Green 18 Blue 32
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Standard Component
D93 Color Temperature
screen fit
Using AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion Pure Sine Wave UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 86
brightness 46
sharpness 0
color 49
tint 53/47
black tone off
Gamma -1
auto color space
offsets Red 23 Green 29 Blue 39
Gain Red 45 Green 23 Blue 29
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Movie Component
See revised and brighter settings in # 1385 below
D65 Color Temperature
screen fit
Using AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion Pure Sine Wave UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 10
contrast 91
brightness 47
sharpness 2
color 49
tint 53/47
black tone off
Gamma +1
auto color space
offsets Red 35 Green 33 Blue 46
Gain Red 43 Green 18 Blue 25
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

The Vincentfam
Edited by vincentfam - 1/26/13 at 12:47pm
post #1384 of 1471
Thanks Vincent,

Sorry it look so long for me to check but you bought the same UPS (yes, it is big!) that I have!

I make the adjustments just now. I'll let you know after a night worth of viewing if there is any noticeable difference.

What got me though was the red gain is at max! I'm wondering if you may at the hairy edge and you can achieve the same thing my taking some of the gains down and adjusting the offsets. There not much more (none) headroom now in the red.
post #1385 of 1471
Revised Sinusoidal Movie Settings:

Bookworm370,

I agree that the red gain for the standard mode is max'ed out at 50. This is the setting necessary to get to the D93 target point on the color gamut and to level out the gamma level. If I needed to increase the red gain, I would just lower the green gain and hope that gamma would remain level. For your convenience, I have attached the gamma graph for these settings:

Sinusoidal Gamma Curve.png 6k .png file

Also for your convenience, I have revised the sinusoidal movie settings, with some changes highlighted. The ones posted yesterday just seemed too dark. Also attached below are the gamma graph (which looks pretty flat) and the rgb graph.

Movie HDMI
screen fit
Using AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion Pure Sine Wave UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 88
brightness 45
sharpness 4
color 49
tint 52/48
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 35 Green 29 Blue 39
Gain Red 44 Green 18 Blue 33
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie Component
screen fit
Using AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion Pure Sine Wave UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 10
contrast 91
brightness 45
sharpness 2
color 49
tint 53/47
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 35 Green 31 Blue 39
Gain Red 42 Green 18 Blue 32
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Sinusoidal Gamma Curve Revised Movie.png 6k .png file Sinusoidal RGB Graph.png 7k .png file

Once again,

The Vincentfam
post #1386 of 1471
The Tweaked Brighter Colormunki Sinusoidal Settings (Double Conversion UPS):

Greetings Colleagues,

An unexpected but pleasant result of using a double conversion ups was a darker picture. I compared the samsung's picture to another nearby television and noticed the darker picture. I actually had to raise the gamma setting to brighten the picture for all modes, and the brightness settings had to be lowered per technique in using the DVE calibration disc. Even some color and tint settings changed a little. Sharpness settings remained the same. I think the picture quality is better.

See following link for DIY calibration techniques for plasma tvs: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1430821/some-diy-techniques-in-calibrating-plasma-hdtv

The Sharpness Dilemma: You may have noticed that the sharpness settings below have changed after this post was edited. Sharpness calibration is not that easy and many calibrators' suggestions may vary. One suggestion indicated that sharpness can be best set by using thick or thin lines in a sharpness pattern, depending on your tv. The 1080p sharpness pattern on the DVE disk has thinner lines and may lead to a sharper picture after calibration. I have also posted the sharpness settings below after using the DVE 1080p sharpness pattern. The original sharpness settings used the DVE 720p sharpness pattern.

For DIY Calibrators: Peak White for Standard Modes is approximately 45 ftL and for Movie Modes is approximately 35 ftL.

Tweaked: 3/14/2013
Also changed set top box input from native to 1080i. See: http://www.hometheater.com/content/1080p-vs-720p-displays for information regarding scaling effects from interactions between various devices.


Movie Modes Tweaked 3/24/2013 due to increase in contrast to decrease tinting

Herein are the settings:


Standard HDMI
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 9
contrast 87
brightness 45
sharpness 0 (1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern)
color 48
tint 52/48
black tone off
Gamma 0
auto color space
offsets Red 15 Green 22 Blue 31
Gain Red 50 Green 26 Blue 35
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie HDMI --- Tweaked 03/28/2013
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 90
brightness 45
sharpness 3 (4 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern)
color 49
tint 51/49
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 34 Green 32 Blue 49
Gain Red 43 Green 18 Blue 33
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Standard Component
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 86
brightness 45
sharpness 0 (1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern)
color 48
tint 51/49
black tone off
Gamma 0
auto color space
offsets Red 20 Green 27 Blue 39
Gain Red 45 Green 23 Blue 30
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Movie Component
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 10
contrast 92
brightness 45
sharpness 2 (4 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern)
color 48
tint 52/48
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 40 Green 24 Blue 47
Gain Red 41 Green 18 Blue 33
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Your colleague in picture quality,

Vincentfam
Edited by vincentfam - 3/28/13 at 7:34pm
post #1387 of 1471
Sharpness Settings Adjusted with DVE 1080p Pattern:

Greetings Colleagues,

I hope that you noticed the recent changes in sharpness settings in post #s 1365 and 1386 using the DVE 1080p sharpness pattern instead of the 720p pattern. The 1080p pattern has thinner lines that allow adjustments for a sharper picture. Artifacts appear at a higher sharpness setting than using the 720p pattern.

Also, some of the component settings changed in post # 1386. I bought a belken 4' component cable for $11, regularly $58. Couldn't pass up this deal. I think this cable was on sale because of the short length of the cable.

I am using the new sharpness settings and the picture quality looks great.

Vincentfam
post #1388 of 1471
The Colormunki Sinusoidal (Double Conversion UPS) Settings, Using Native Color Space:

Greetings colleagues:

It's been awhile, but I have tweaked the settings once again, using native color space setting instead of auto. Only impact appears to be color and tint settings. Also, the contrast settings were adjusted for movie modes due to tinting at the higher settings on AVS Forum contrast pattern.

Warning: Colors are a little more saturated, making the standard mode settings look great.


Standard HDMI
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 9
contrast 87
brightness 45
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 50
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 15 Green 22 Blue 31
Gain Red 50 Green 26 Blue 35
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie HDMI
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 87
brightness 46
sharpness 3 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 51
tint 50/50
black tone off
Gamma +2
native color space
offsets Red 49 Green 36 Blue 41
Gain Red 41 Green 18 Blue 33
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Standard Component
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 86
brightness 45
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 50
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 20 Green 27 Blue 39
Gain Red 45 Green 23 Blue 30
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie Component
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 10
contrast 88
brightness 46
sharpness 3 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 51
tint 49/51
black tone off
Gamma +2
native color space
offsets Red 30 Green 24 Blue 39
Gain Red 40 Green 15 Blue 30
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Your colleague in quality hdtv,

Vincentfam
Edited by vincentfam - 4/14/13 at 7:23pm
post #1389 of 1471
The Recommended Colormunki Sinusoidal (Double Conversion UPS) Settings:

Greetings colleagues:

These are the recommended settings with Native Color Space for Standard Mode settings and Auto Color Space for Movie Mode settings. Native color space appears to be too saturated for the movie modes.


Standard HDMI
D93 Gamut Target - changed to approximately 8500K color temperature due to minor clipping
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 9
contrast 87
brightness 45
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 50
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 15 Green 22 Blue 31
Gain Red 50 Green 26 Blue 35
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie HDMI
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 87
brightness 46
sharpness 3 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 49
tint 51/49
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 49 Green 36 Blue 44
Gain Red 41 Green 18 Blue 33
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Standard Component

D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 86
brightness 45
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 50
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 20 Green 27 Blue 39
Gain Red 45 Green 23 Blue 30
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie Component
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 10
contrast 88
brightness 46
sharpness 3 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 48
tint 52/48
black tone off
Gamma +2
Auto color space
offsets Red 30 Green 24 Blue 39
Gain Red 40 Green 15 Blue 30
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Your colleague in quality hdtv,

Vincentfam
Edited by vincentfam - 5/18/13 at 7:18am
post #1390 of 1471
The Revised Recommended Colormunki Sinusoidal (Double Conversion UPS) Settings:

Greetings colleagues:

These are the revised recommended settings with Native Color Space for Standard Mode settings and Auto Color Space for Movie Mode settings. Native color space appears to be too saturated for the movie modes.

Contrast settings were lowered for standard modes to decrease eye strain, and cell light reduced for movie mode for component input to level out gamma curve. White balance settings were adjusted accordingly.

April 27, 2013 Update: Tinting discovered on movie modes using ramp patterns from DVE and AVS Forum disks. Lower contrast settings to reduce tinting. White balance settings were also adjusted.

Standard HDMI
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 83
brightness 46
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 50
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 12 Green 22 Blue 30
Gain Red 49 Green 26 Blue 32
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie HDMI
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 85
brightness 46
sharpness 3 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 48
tint 51/49
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 41 Green 36 Blue 44
Gain Red 44 Green 18 Blue 30
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Standard Component
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 80
brightness 46
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 51
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 17 Green 27 Blue 33
Gain Red 48 Green 23 Blue 30
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie Component
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 86
brightness 46
sharpness 3 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 49
tint 51/49
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 38 Green 24 Blue 38
Gain Red 40 Green 17 Blue 28
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

Your colleague in quality hdtv,

Vincentfam
Edited by vincentfam - 4/27/13 at 12:46pm
post #1391 of 1471
Keeps getting better!

Thanks
post #1392 of 1471
The Revised One For The Road Standard Colormunki Sinusoidal (Double Conversion UPS) Settings:

Greetings colleagues:

These are the final revised settings with Native Color Space for Standard Mode settings only, using DVE patterns to avoid tinting on high contrast levels.

The approximate peak white for each input iss around 46 ftL, which should be okay in a moderately lit or brightly lit viewing environment.

If your eyes start to get fatigued or tired, use the standard settings with a lower contrast setting.

Standard HDMI
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 86
brightness 45
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 50
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 11 Green 22 Blue 33
Gain Red 49 Green 26 Blue 32
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Standard Component
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 88
brightness 45
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
color 51
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 19 Green 27 Blue 40
Gain Red 49 Green 25 Blue 31
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Your colleague once again in quality hdtv,

Vincentfam
post #1393 of 1471
Is This A 1080P TV?

Greetings Colleagues,

I was experimenting with the input signal from the cable box and my cable provider upgraded its set top boxes to deliver 1080P signal. When I changed the cable company input to 1080P, the tv's information box (see by pressing "info" on the remote) indicated a 1080 (as opposed to a 1080i) signal for the hdmi input. I looked in the service manual and it indicated a 1080P setting in the service menu. I think that there is a slight improvement in picture quality.

A while back I changed the model number in the service menu from B450 to B560. I do not know if this made the 1080P input available for our model.

Please note that inputting a 1080P signal will not work with component inputs.

Your colleague in picture quality.

Vincentfam
post #1394 of 1471
Hi vincentfam how come you don't use the black tone control anymore? Is it because it crushes blacks or messes gamma? I'm asking because my set is pretty dim(Sam e450),and need too run high brightness setting.
post #1395 of 1471
Hi Vic12345,

After reviewing my previous calibrations, I believe that a colleague in the display calibration forum recommended against using the black tone setting because using this control would decrease details in dark scenes, and it does something weird to the lower part of the gamma curve (see graphs in postings 1263 to 1268). Also, my brightness settings use the 2% DVE method which provides a good black level (actually losing the lower 2% of the image which fellow members described as garbage) making the use of the black tone control unnecessary.

As for my last posting in this thread, this is a 720p tv that can accept a 1080p signal.

Until next time,

Vincentfam
post #1396 of 1471
smile.gif Ok thanks.Some people have there brightness setting about where the dithering stops ,but on mine(sam e450) it's quite a lot higher than that so the tv is not so dark.Part of reason is because my contrast is set lower than most peoples to avoid white clipping.Also gamma 0 works best on mine.
post #1397 of 1471
Vic12345,

You may be setting the contrast too low. Some members in the display calibration forum stated that they max out the contrast setting to its highest setting (without tinting). What they suggested, and what I do, is to use a ramp pattern from a calibration disk (the free AVS Forum 709 disk downloadable in the calibration forum has ramp patterns). Set contrast to its maximum setting and you should see some red or blue tinting on the ramps. Lower the contrast setting until the tinting disappears. Now your contrast control is set to its optimal setting. Next, readjust your brightness level. The AVS Forum disk has a brightness pattern. Adjust the brightness until bar 17 is the lowest one flashing. I use bar 21 as the lowest as this is the same as using the 2% DVE method. Recheck contrast setting with the ramp pattern. If that slightly changes, then recheck brightness level, etc.

Good luck,

Vincentfam
post #1398 of 1471
If you search my latest posts I describe how I calibrate and turning up contrast problem.Dont want to clutter up this thread.Thanks
post #1399 of 1471
Device Interactions Impacting Picture Quality (?):

Greetings Colleagues,

This is probably my last stretch of issues regarding picture quality (I have said that before). This issue involves the number of devices connected to the hdtv that may impact picture quality. In the past for another hdtv, I discovered that a connected vcr affected the operation (on/off) of the hdtv. After disconnecting the vcr, the on/off problem went away.

For my pn50b450, I have about five devices (wii, bose, blu ray, etc.) connected to it. I have disconnected all of the devices with the exception of the set top box to see if this affects the tv's picture quality.

I will report back later on my observations.

Vincentfam
post #1400 of 1471
That's to be expected. It's EMI from the cable of the other devices. Most people don't connect directly to the monitor but go through an AVR HDMI receiver with HDMI switching. This is the reason that newer television sets are coming with less and less HDMI inputs. The direction is that the monitor (I have to say monitor because does anyone believe the speakers being built into these things make them a real TV) may have one or two HDMI inputs or outputs (possible back-channel from the current use of TOS Link (Fiber) audio backwards. The less cables run parallel to each other to your monitor the less EMI interference. This is why a lot of them have toroid coils on them to cut the EMI.

On my 69B490 I have a grand total of 4 cables running to it:
Power
HDMI
Fiber
Coax Cable for watching cable TV (normal CATV) if the Sat dish goes down.

That's it, Power cable has the toroid coil on it. Coax is Quad shield and the HDMI is the highest end Media Bridge available. The cable runs by itself to the TV. The only point where all 4 meet is for about 1 foot behind the acrylic post to hide them.

All my other devices:
Dish Hopper
Sony BluRay
Apple TV
Google TV
Wii
DVR

All plug into my Denon 3313ci AVR and the Denon does the HDMI switching to the TV. So the TV always see the same HDMI specs (the Denon) at all times. So you're settings are very very good.
But there are also PQ setting in the 3313ci that can also be tweaked like Brightness, Contrast, Up Conversion, about 8 more that I had to balance with your settings as well. You're settings are the base point and I use them unchanged, then change the Denon video HDMI settings to get the best PQ that I can see.


Quote:
Originally Posted by vincentfam View Post

Device Interactions Impacting Picture Quality (?):

Greetings Colleagues,

This is probably my last stretch of issues regarding picture quality (I have said that before). This issue involves the number of devices connected to the hdtv that may impact picture quality. In the past for another hdtv, I discovered that a connected vcr affected the operation (on/off) of the hdtv. After disconnecting the vcr, the on/off problem went away.

For my pn50b450, I have about five devices (wii, bose, blu ray, etc.) connected to it. I have disconnected all of the devices with the exception of the set top box to see if this affects the tv's picture quality.

I will report back later on my observations.

Vincentfam
post #1401 of 1471
Oh and Vincefam,

Remember, adjusting for the best PQ is like Golf. It's a game that can be played but never be won.
post #1402 of 1471
The Observations Re Device Interactions Impacting Picture Quality (?):

Greetings Bookworm370 & Colleagues:

Trying to track down good settings for this hdtv is all the more reason I do not play golf. It is never ending.

As for my observations, I unhook all unused devices, with the exception of the speaker connections with the Bose, and recalibrated the hdmi settings. The Standard mode changed a little, while there were significant changes to the movie mode. Using the ramp patterns, red tinting showed up for contrast settings in the 80s and all but disappeared with a setting of 90 for the movie mode. Consequently, I also had to readjust the brightness level. There were also changes to white balance settings, but no changes to color and tint settings.

We are almost getting there near a perfect picture.

May 18, 2013 Update: Standard Mode white balance settings adjusted to reduce color temperature from D93 to 8500K due to color clipping at 30% ire; Movie mode also adjust as blue gain was too low, probably due to apl impact.

Standard HDMI
Sole TV Input
D93 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

standard mode
color tone cool
cell light 8
contrast 86
brightness 45
sharpness 1 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
(sharpness 2 none and 1 technique)
color 50
tint 48/52
black tone off
Gamma 0
native color space
offsets Red 12 Green 22 Blue 33
Gain Red 48 Green 26 Blue 31
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement


Movie HDMI
Sole TV Input
D65 Gamut Target
screen fit
AVS Forum Small APL Windows
Double Conversion UPS

Movie mode
color tone warm2
cell light 9
contrast 90
brightness 45
sharpness 3 using DVE 1080p Sharpness Pattern
(sharpness 4 none and 1 technique)
color 48
tint 51/49
black tone off
Gamma +2
auto color space
offsets Red 38 Green 36 Blue 49
Gain Red 42 Green 18 Blue 34
screen fit
HDMI Black Level greyed out or low
All other enhancements off, including edge enhancement

For those wanting updated settings without the UPS, and for component settings, just let me know.

Vincentfam
Edited by vincentfam - 5/19/13 at 1:23pm
post #1403 of 1471
The Double Conversion Pure Sine UPS - Murphy's Law:

Greetings Colleagues,

My double conversion ups developed a bus fault, which is not a good thing. The ups cannot be used and must be replaced or repaired. However, the manufacturer has a two/three year warranty. I will keep you updated.

Vincentfam
post #1404 of 1471
I'm unaware of why you are using a UPS for these budget TVs.

Utility frequency is +/-0.5Hz typically and the first thing the TV does is rectify it to unsmoothed 160VDC (pulsing at double line frequency.) It then boosts it and stores this in the main capacitors (PFC stage.) The 400V or so out of the PFC stage has minimal ripple on it, typically only around 10Vp-p, which the main step-down transformer filters out by varying duty cycle appropriately. The transformer produces the voltages which are used to drive the plasma panel, Vs (205V) and Va (55V) slightly varying with each plasma panel. The 13 or 15V, which also goes to the panel drivers, is used for the audio circuit as well. The ripple at this point is so low, you will not see it on the panel.

Basically, as long as your input frequency is not unstable and the line voltage is sufficient, you will notice no degradation in picture quality whatsoever. If you see any, it is probably a placebo effect. I've fiddled around with a plasma on a variac, which lets you adjust line voltage. Even over the range of 90V AC to 265V AC, the panel did not change in measured or perceptible intensity. Below 90V AC, the panel dimmed and became somewhat pink tinted, and a couple of seconds later, the TV shut down with a panel fault detection, it worked once the input voltage was high enough.
post #1405 of 1471
tom669,

Thanks for your comments. Using this ups on this hdtv is just an experimental adventure to see if there will be any changes to picture quality. Using this particular ups impacted the brightness level and I also had to adjust the white balance settings, with some noticeable improvements in PQ which may be partly or wholely suggestive. At the least, members and visitors to this forum will see my humble attempts in having an ups with some indications on its advantages and disadvantages. To translate: I just had some money in my pocket and was dying to see if using the ups would improve PQ.

However, let me ask you a question, perhaps not for a budget tv, do you believe that a double conversion pure sine ups would be beneficial to any tv, particularly including high level hdtvs?

Vincentfam
post #1406 of 1471
If you are seeing an increase in brightness, it is simply a visual illusion or the placebo effect. A-B comparisons with black level or brightness are very, very hard to do, which is why you must use a meter. The rails in the TV are well regulate, and input voltage should have no effect on the brightness. So, I do not think any UPS, double conversion, pure sine, whatever, will make any impact on the TV.
post #1407 of 1471
Re: UPS and Murphy's Law:

I detected a change in brightness level and white balance settings with the colormunki display meter, objectively speaking.

By the way, the manufacturer just contacted me with instructions to have the ups repaired. The device is under a 2 year warranty, with the 3rd year being for parts only.

Vincentfam
post #1408 of 1471
Maybe Samsung cheaped out more on this power supply than I remember. Good luck getting the UPS repaired.
post #1409 of 1471
UPS Operation:

Bookworm370,

How do you operate your ups? Do you leave it on continuously? Has it broken down at all? I just returned my ups to the manufacturer for repair (under warranty) and just wanted to know, after getting my ups back, how you use your ups in case I am doing something wrong.

Vincentfam
post #1410 of 1471
Quote:
Originally Posted by vincentfam View Post

UPS Operation:

Bookworm370,

How do you operate your ups? Do you leave it on continuously? Has it broken down at all? I just returned my ups to the manufacturer for repair (under warranty) and just wanted to know, after getting my ups back, how you use your ups in case I am doing something wrong.

Vincentfam

Funny you should ask this question now. I've had it for about 4 years now without any issues other than replacing the batteries 2 years ago. Just yesterday we had a thunderstorm that took out power. Even though the generator kicked in under 30 seconds the UPS made a buzzing sound and the TV would not come on and no display at all on the panel. No resets or button pushing has been able to get it back.

I had a spare CyberPower CP1000 that I put in but honestly the Opti-UPS is as heavy as a concrete block! I'm going to order one of these (I have another powering the rest of the AVR equipment such as the Denon 3313ci. So far no issues at all with any of my CyperpPower UPS's. But the humming, buzzing, and total lack of screen tells me it may be fried.

http://www.amazon.com/CyberPower-CP1500PFCLCD-Sinewave-Compatible-Mini-Tower/dp/B00429N19W

At 900 watts it should be plenty to power the PN69B490. The 600 watt unit I have in there now has only the TV plugged into it and seems to be working fine. I think the TV draws ~450 watts.
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