2009 Mitsubishi Owners Thread (C9/737/837) - Page 3

My 60737 colors seem to shake on certain hd tv shows. Anyone else having these issues yet? I have not really messed with any of the color settings other than the brightness and contrast. Other than some jumping colors blue-ray and ps3 games look beautiful although I can't say I will ever watch a standard def. Channel again ........ Post your settings when you all start to adjust them

So, various people seem to be insistent on what Smooth120hz *isn't*. Can anyone tell me what it *is*, and whether it makes an improvement (and how it does it and how much) compared to Mits DLP that don't have it? They claim anti-judder improvements of some form from it.

the mack ext warranty is from tapeworkstexas. they have sold alot of them to avsers over the years. also check with Roman O at buybestplamsa.com or Chris at Cleveland plasma.
http://tapeworkstexas.com/mack_warranty_combo.html

Strange that Frye's doesn't include bulb replacement anymore. My warranty i have with them for my 52 dlp included it. I'll call mitsubishi and see what their ext warranty costs. I'm trying to decide on which size right now. Hope the one i pick doesn't have any issues. what i saw in the store looked nice though i coudn't see the bars much on the feed they're playing. i think i'll force them to hook up a blu ray player to it I'll miss the crystal clear screen that mine has right now. the glimmer/sparkly screen coating will take a bit of getting used to. i watched my friend's sammy dlp 62 last night and noticed his has the light bleed issue. the bars go bright a bit when the scene has alot of light in it. i stuck my tv on craigslist. we'll see what happens.
Hope you guys are happy with the dlps. can't beat the price.

I have had my tv now for a week(65737), the bleeding on mine is only on the top and in very bright scenes you see a reflection, but it is not bad. Before the Mitu, I was using my 50 inch vizio plasma from my bedroom after my jvc broke and I think the mitu has a better picture quality. I noticed a really big difference going from component to dvi/hdmi on my cable hd box, the dvi to hdmi looks much better and cleans up the picture. Also I connected a belkin pure a/v surge protector with fliters and it made a difference also. On some hd cable shows like local news in full HD to people look like they pop out of the screen. Honestly I never expected the picture to be so good, was trying to go big and save a little money. Right now I am thinking it doesn't even need a pro calibration. Amazing how light the tv is, I may need to put a few pieces of tape under it so if I bump the tv it doesn't move on the stand it is on. My neighbor has a samsung 6 series 62 inch plasma and was over $4k, he was also surprised how good this tv looked and said if they looked this good in the store he would have bought one, but when he seen them side by side the mitu looked crappy. Other than the remote, this tv is great and for the money(average price is 999 for 60, 1499 for 65 and 1999 for 73) you can't beat it. I used the avia dvd to get some things right, but I had already set it up by eye and looked pretty close already. Thinking about a warranty tech extended warranty now(includes I bulb replacement), wasn't going to pay around 500 at BB for one. BTW new bulbs from Mitubishi site are $99 now.

I also had another question for previous owners of these type sets, I have my center channel speaker under the tv on the stand, can the speaker on rumbling scenes cause any picture issues with the dlp? I haven't seen any issues yet, just wondering from the vibration.

Can an owner post the options available in the Advanced Calibration mode on these TVs? I haven't seen one in person yet and am curious what Mitsubishi finally decided to put into the user menus that they have refused to for so long.

Apparently I have the wrong light in here to get a decent picture of that black and white menu right now.

Anyway, Advanced Picture Settings (WD-60737):

(left column)

Picture Mode: --
H position:31
V Position:31
Deepfield Imager: Off
Super Resolution: Off
Sharpedge: Off
Video Noise: Off
Brightness: 31
Contrast: 50
Color: 31
Tint: 31
Sharpness: 31
Gamma : 2.4
Red High: 1023

(right column)

Green High: 1023
Blue High: 1023
Red Low: 0
Green Low: 0
Blue Low: 0
Blue Only: Off
Red Adjust: 15, 0, 0
Green Adjust: 0, 15, 0
Blue Adjust: 0, 0, 15
Magenta Adjust: 15, 0, 15
Cyan Adjust: 0, 15, 15
Yellow Adjust: 15, 15, 0

RESET Picture Mode

That's what mine says (aside from the left/right column indicators, which I included to help you visualize the screen), tho I don't know that those settings are actually in effect or what, since the regular Picture menu shows some different settings for some of these same items.

It's nice to see they FINALLY put these settings in the user menu. My guess is that between the user and service menu now, you should be able to get these pretty darn close to spec. They have always done a good job with gamma and grayscale, but have lacked the ability to do many adjustments needed to get the primary and secondaries correct. Hopefully, I'll get a stab at one of the new models soon. :-)

Deepfield Imager: Off
Super Resolution: Off
Sharpedge: Off
Video Noise: Off

of these settings, which of these should be turned on? oh and thanks for that informational post on the settings. it is nice to see a more detailed menu system in the tv's.

Indeed. Looking at the values, one might not be tempted to enter the SM at all.

some info on the extended warranty thru Mistubishi. I called them this morning and they said the pricing for the new models isn't out yet. it covers a bulb and all the stuff they cover during the first year coverage. I imagine it isn't too much for how much it costs.

No kidding! I was just looking at the owners manual for our WD-62725, the first-gen Mits DLP (still in service with us in another room). It weighs 165lbs! Our new WD-60737 weighs 65lbs! You only need two people to carry it because of the size, not the weight!

Only for the keystone correction.

For my WD-73737
After menu 2-4-5-7, in the service menu I hit 0 to get to the keystone correction.

The option wasn't listed like it was on the 73736 I had, so I hit manual geometry set..or something to the sort, and then I hit enter.

When I exited the Service menu, the television was able to pass the 1:1 pixel test for 1920X1080p...it was failing it before hand, just as the WD-73736 had before turning off keystone correction.

Does anyone know if this is the proper way to set this??? I do notice a slight geometry issue in the top left corner now...only noticable in letterbox that the line curves slightly up towards to far left top.


I think the settings I have now look superb. Aside from the slight geometry thing and the bleeding into the black bars...I think the picture is better than the Samsung HL67A750 and the Mitsubishi WD-73736 I had this month in the same room.

I currently have a 2.5 year old Sammy HLS-6188 that I love. I use it 40% for Blu-Ray/HD-DVD movies, 40% for XBox 360/PS3 games, and 20% for HDTV via FIOS. SD PQ isn't a concern. I sit 8-10' away directly in front of TV in a room that can be made completely dark at anytime during the day. I'm leaning towards the Mitsubishi 73"/82" (once available), but first I have a question.

For those who own/purchasing DLPs, I'd like a bit of clarification on something I've been led to believe by HDTV reviewers. Is it a given that you sacrifice picture quality in favor of screen size when comparing DLPs to plasmas? I initially assumed that the price difference had to do with plasmas being "sexy" (thinner, wall mountable, and "plasma" just sounds cool) rather than having superior PQ.

Thx, 61

Which 73" plasma do you want us to compare it against?

Seriously, if PQ is your be-all and end-all, then plasma is probably the way to go. Some of us really like BIG screens and excellent price/performance --and these new Mits offer both. If price is no object, you're in the wrong place.

But really the best thing to do is just go to a store and look for yourself and see how much the difference feels like to you, remembering that size is an element of PQ as well. . .

is that 2-4-5-7 the access code to the service menu after you press the menu button? and is the bars tolerable on the 73"?

Thanks for your response. I didn't intend to pose the question from the standpoint PQ was my end all or I don't value price/performance (I have a 61" dlp), so I'll try to explain myself better. If I have a plasma and a DLP that's the same size, say 60", is it a given that the plasma will have better PQ? I asked the question due to comparisons of the different HDTV technologies on sites such as CNET which routinely rated the DLPs lower than plasmas & lcds when it came to PQ. Also, DLPs cost significantly less. I was curious as to why this was the case.

The advice to go see for myself is spot on and what I plan to do. However, I just wanted leverage the experience of the forum if there was a clear-cut answer to this.

Thx 61

Well, I haven't seen the LaserVue in person yet, so that's a bit of a wildcard. But other than that, yes, I think a quality plasma will beat a quality DLP for PQ every time at the exact same screen size. . . usually (absent "clearance sale of discontinued model plasma" pricing) at a significant price premium to go with it.

And I think there are clearly some scenarios where DLP's should be ruled out. If you have much of a need for significantly off center (say, people lying on the floor trying to watch the TV from a few feet away; or at relatively severe side angles) viewing positions for some of the people who will be watching it regularly. Or rooms with a lot of direct sunlight during times you'd want to be watching and no effective way to cut that down (say a skylight putting sun on your TV position when you want to be watching the news).

Not necessarily, IMO. I've seen some rotten low-end plasmas, and many of the cheap LCDs have subpar black levels and even the better ones can be nearly unwatchable because of all the gimmicky image processing. I saw the 737 the other day in the local BB Magnolia and fiddled with it for a while. The blacks aren't bad and at least the picture looks natural. While plasmas have gotten quite good in recent years, there is still that shimmer and ever so slight unsteadiness of image you get from a pixel display. Never owned a plasma but I suppose you get used to it. I'll say this as far as plasmas go, the (discontinued) Pio. Kuro is head and shoulders above the competition from Panasonic and Samsung so if you have $$ in the bank and want to go plasma, get one now while they're still available. Pioneer has a 60" panel and Panasonic is scheduled to release a 65" soon. Pricey, pricey though.

I'd like to see what the 837 Diamond offers above the base models, but none in my town to see. Waiting for more reviews & especially interested in what the calibrators think.

I semi agree with you. I would still say at this point that DLP is still the best bang for the buck for 60" or larger displays. All of the recent Mitsi's I have calibrated that are based on the DC4 DLP chip have very good blacks. They have even gotten better about primary and secondary color accuracty by putting values in the SM so that you can actually adjust those now.

As far as plasmas go, I have do disagree. Today's plasmas (IMO) have the most realistic pic when calibrated properly than do DLP or LCD. I own one and have calibrated quite a few, so I feel comfortable giving my opinion on this. As far as the whole Pioneer/Panny/Sammy thing goes, yes, the Pioneer might have the deepest blacks (for now), but other factors need to be involved as well. Primary and secondary accuracy have been reported as not being as accurate.

Also, even blacks are soon not going to be the trumpet for Pio. Have you seen the new Sammy 8 series Plasma? Even in BB, it was easy to tell the blacks are VERY black on this set. I can't wait to calibrate one.

For price/performance, Mitsi still has it in the bag for a while longer. 2k for an 83" tv is a tuff pill to swallow for plasma and LCD.

If you do get one, I highly recommend a calibration. You will be amazed at how well these sets will perform when properly calibrated. (And I'm not just saying that as a calibrator, I also own an older 62" Mitsi DLP as well.)

I've noticed something the last two nights that makes me curious. I currently still have Deepfield Imager, the sharpness/noise setting, and the Smooth120hz on, so I don't know if one or more of those is contributing.

Last night I saw it on the salt portions of George Clooney's salt 'n pepper hair on CNNHD when he and Bono were having a chat. Tonight I saw it in the salt portion of Bill Guerin of the Pittsburgh Penguins salt 'n pepper beard when he was being interviewed after the game on Versus HD. In both cases it was clear that there were strong TV lights coming from the side on both men. As they turned their head in one direction, suddenly every single one of their "salt" hairs would suddenly flash pure white at once, and then as they kept turning their head the salt portions would flash back to something more like you'd expect.

Is that Deepfield Imager trying to deal with a lot of different contrast in a small area (individual hairs of different color) in the presence of a strong stationary light source?

You're right about that, which is why I'm choking at the thought of dropping big dollars on a large plasma panel, especially given the rate display tech is improving, which in my case means I'll probably want the latest-greatest in a couple of years. I have a light-controlled HT room and no real need for a wall-hanger. Plus I want 60" inches or better, and the price jump from a 50" plasma to a 60 or 65" is usually huge.

Your comments on the Kuro are interesting, but I believe they would not be well received by the Kuro "enthusiasts" in the plasma forum.

Thanks for all your replies.

This is where I'm at too JohnFR. Do I drop big $ on a plasma knowing that in 2 years it'll be dated and I'll get the itch again for the latest and greatest.

Question: what factor does having a light-controlled HT room play in your decision? I can make my HT room completely dark anytime (my preferred viewing experience).

If someone has their set professionally calibrated and posts the settings here will it also work on another set of the same model number, or are they too unique to do that?

Also, if you get a calibration blu-ray and adjust the set for a perfect picture with that how will that impact the satellite receiver? That input won't be calibrated --- does that mean you can only properly calibrate your blu-ray input?


Thanks
DoP

All TVs are unique and need their own calibration. Even LCD tvs that don't have bulbs or phosphors like DLP and plasma are individually different. That's just a result of the manufacturing process. That's why the companies don't do the calibration in house themselves. Too many differences between each tv.

That being said, if you have a calibration blu-ray, that is definitely a good place to start if you don't want to do a professional calibration right away. As far as the satellite input, if you have the HDNET channel, they do a test pattern every saturday morning and you can use that with the RBG gel that comes with the test disk to do that input. It won't be perfect, but it's a good way to calibrate the satellite input. Once you go through the calibration blu-ray, you'll see how the HDNET test pattern will be useful for you.

Do you recommend using different inputs on the TV for Blu Ray and cable/satellite signals? If so, that means if you are running hdmi's from your components through an AVR the AVR will need two hdmi outputs, correct? If you only have one hdmi output on your AVR, do you calibrate for blu-ray (I assume passing through a 1080p signal) or do you calibrate for the 1080i signal?

I saw a post somewhere else from a guy that claimed to have been one of those who worked on designing this set, and he said that just turning it to Natural/Low temp from Brilliant/High temp (which is what they all seem to ship at) would "get you in the ballpark at least". Definitely did help. Tho I've also ordered my first blu-ray calibration disk (DVE) to have a go with that.

I dont think my prior question was stated properly.. I have all my components routed through an HDMI switching receiver. Therefore just 1 HDMI input from the receiver to the TV. So what's the better method to calibrate? Use blu-ray or the Hdnet test pattern? If I calibrate to one how will that impact the other? Is the Eye One LT sensor any good?

DoP

I've been comparing alot of the settings and I like it best with sharpedge on and deepfiedl imager on. The sharpedge removes the slighty blurry look on text and makes it clear. Deepfield imager doesn't make as much of a difference, but it makes the blacks look better. This is using comcast hd dvi to hdmi direct to the tv. So far the best settings I have came up with are:
Natural
low
contrast 50
brightness 30
color 29
tint 31
sharpness 27
video noise med
deepfield on
sharpedge on

Guess it also depends on each tv and how much use it has had. Over the week I have had it, I have had to change some setting slightly.

This is the way I have my HT hooked up as well. I decided to calibrate to the PS3 (bluray) as I wanted that to be top quality. Also, since I am able to use my calibration disc with it, it makes more sense for me to use that for a full calibration. Once I was complete I put up the HDNET pattern and it was quite close, so I was satisfied with the results.

If your TV receiver is very far off from the blu-ray, you might have to come up with a compromise. What I would do is first calibrate to the blu-ray source, and then check the results with the HDNET test pattern and see how it looks.