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Actiontec MI424WR - a cheap MoCA bridge for all! - Page 34

post #991 of 1198
Thread Starter 
Read my post a few up:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1145636/actiontec-mi424wr-a-cheap-moca-bridge-for-all/960#post_22214986

xnappo
post #992 of 1198
I have a question about MoCA. I'm planning to get the Ceton Q, along with a Ceton Echo, when they come out. I'd like to set it up with MoCA, as my house isn't wired for Cat5, and the power pretty much hasn't been changed at all since the 40s (though for that matter, I'm not sure the coax has either). I'd like to have the Q connected to the home network, which is WiFi. I've made a diagram of how I think it would work:

Black is coax, gold is Cat5, and blue is WiFi.

The MoCA adapter by the Q would be this or similar, as it has coax pass-through so I can plug it in to the tuner. The other MoCA adapter(s) could be the MI424WR, as I need only Ethernet (in fact only a single port of it, I think), no pass-through coax.

I'd like to know if this setup would work and connect to my home network (or what I should change to make it work), what I could streamline (especially in the regard of the Modem/Router/MoCA adapter setup- could I maybe ditch the modem altogether, as I have only the router, no phones, currently hooked up to it? I'm confused) and a very basic setup guide (I assume it would be similar to the one in the OP). The WiFi router is the Netgear WDNA3700.

Also, what's the difference between a MoCA adapter and a cable modem I could get from Comcast? The only two I notice are coax pass-through on MoCA adapters(which may be present on some modems) and phone jacks on modems.
Edited by ImThat1Guy - 8/18/12 at 2:51pm
post #993 of 1198
Need some help with slow speeds at one end of the MOCA bridge. Here is my setup:

Cable from Comcast ---> splits to lines A and B:
Line A) connects directly to actiontec router (rev F) which only connects to my xbox via cat cable

Line B) runs to my office and splits to lines C and D:
Line C) Connects to comcast modem (this then connects to my Dlink router)
Line D) connects to actiontec router (rev D) (this then connects to my Dlink router)

So I have Comcast for my ISP and my download speed is about 30Mbs and upload is about 5Mbps when I test them on my desktop that is connected to my Dlink router via cat cable.

Now when I run a speed test on my xbox connected to one my actiontec routers (rev F) I only get 2.5Mbps download and 1.5Mbps upload.

Any thoughts as to why the download and upload speed is so slow? Is it likely due to the signal quality reaching the rev F router or possibly something in the actiontec configuration settings? I figure altogether I only have two splitters in the system and no single coax line is longer than 80 feet or so.

Thanks
post #994 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkellogg556 View Post

Need some help with slow speeds at one end of the MOCA bridge. Here is my setup:
Cable from Comcast ---> splits to lines A and B:
Line A) connects directly to actiontec router (rev F) which only connects to my xbox via cat cable
Line B) runs to my office and splits to lines C and D:
Line C) Connects to comcast modem (this then connects to my Dlink router)
Line D) connects to actiontec router (rev D) (this then connects to my Dlink router)
So I have Comcast for my ISP and my download speed is about 30Mbs and upload is about 5Mbps when I test them on my desktop that is connected to my Dlink router via cat cable.
Now when I run a speed test on my xbox connected to one my actiontec routers (rev F) I only get 2.5Mbps download and 1.5Mbps upload.
Any thoughts as to why the download and upload speed is so slow? Is it likely due to the signal quality reaching the rev F router or possibly something in the actiontec configuration settings? I figure altogether I only have two splitters in the system and no single coax line is longer than 80 feet or so.
Thanks

Try using a diplexer to split line B, with line C connected to the low band output jack and line D connected to the high band "Satellite" jack.

That will almost double the signal strength at the rev D Actiontec on the part of the band it needs to see, which is the part over 1Ghz. If you use a normal splitter, you give half of that to the comcast modem, which will pay no attention to it, because it only wants the part below 1Ghz.

The diplexer will also give the comcast modem almost twice as much of the part of the band it wants, since the normal splitter will give half of the low band to the actiontec, which has no use for it.

A diplexer looks exactly the same as a normal splitter except one of its outputs - the one you connect to the Actiontec - will be labeled "Sat." You can get them for $10 or less, since they're used for satellite TV installations.
post #995 of 1198
I searched the thread, but did not find the exact answer (sorry if I missed it).

I have 2 actionteks that I use as bridges in my house. My main modem/router is also an actiontek. I use the main one for wireless. I would like to switch-on the wireless on one of the bridged Actionteks to serve as a WAP on the first floor. I enabled wireless, turned DHCP off, set the SSID and WPA2 the same as the main Actiontek. My laptop can connect to the WAP, but it says 'no internet access". I must have missed a step. Any thoughts?
post #996 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post

Try using a diplexer to split line B, with line C connected to the low band output jack and line D connected to the high band "Satellite" jack.
That will almost double the signal strength at the rev D Actiontec on the part of the band it needs to see, which is the part over 1Ghz. If you use a normal splitter, you give half of that to the comcast modem, which will pay no attention to it, because it only wants the part below 1Ghz.
The diplexer will also give the comcast modem almost twice as much of the part of the band it wants, since the normal splitter will give half of the low band to the actiontec, which has no use for it.
A diplexer looks exactly the same as a normal splitter except one of its outputs - the one you connect to the Actiontec - will be labeled "Sat." You can get them for $10 or less, since they're used for satellite TV installations.

I changed out the splitter to a diplexer as you recommended and unfortunately there is no difference in the speed. This really makes me wonder if there is some other setting in the config that I may have to change to improve the throughput.
post #997 of 1198
Been running MoCa for almost 3 years now with no problems thanks to this thread. Since Wednesday, none of my Media Center Extenders (Xbox 360 and Linksys DMA2200) have been able to connect to my Windows 7 Media Center PC. Also, on the Xbox 360s, in the Video Library, I'm unable to see the PCs (Windows 7 Media Center, Windows Home Server) off of the main Actiontec MI424WR Router / MoCa Adapter.

The Xbox 360s are on the network, can connect to Xbox Live, etc. When plugging a laptop into the MI424WRs, it's able to get out on the Internet and even Remote Desktop into the Windows Media Center PC. So, MoCa is still working for all traffic except for accessing media shares (Video Library, etc.) and connecting to Windows Media Center.

To isolate the issue, I took the Actiontec MI424WR and Linksys DMA2200 from the bedroom, brought them upstairs and plugged the MI424WR to the main MI424WR via Cat-5e. The DMA2200 was able to connect to the Media Center PC.

Specifically, Windows Media Share and Windows Media Center traffic appears to be blocked via Coax connections from the Actiontec MI424WR Routers / MoCa Adapters throughout the house to the main Actiontec MI424WR Router / MoCa Adapter.

Nothing has changed with my setup, so I'm drawing a huge blank on what the issue would be.

My cable, internet, etc. provider is Verizon FIOS.

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Edited by Stockton - 9/7/12 at 6:33pm
post #998 of 1198
Ok. Comcast came out the other day and I don't know what happened but I no longer have any MoCa connection. My box is the old Motorola cable box that has ethernet. I was getting a slow-flashing light which meant I wasn't getting the 'best' connection/speed but at least it was working. I don't know what he did but now it's not working. The diplexer is still connected etc. I even swapped out the diplexer for a new one and nothing. I know my box is not the actiontech but I'm hoping my box is similar enough so that someone might have an answer/suggestion.
ps - the Box is the NIM100.
post #999 of 1198
The strongest probability is that one or more low-pass filters were put in the line somewhere between (or at) the jacks your MoCA boxes are connected to. These are usually little cylindrical devices with cable jacks on either end. If that was done, the simplest solution is to find and remove them. Since they have female connections on both ends, you have two choices:

(1) if you're lucky, one of the cables will be long enough to connect directly to where the cable on the other end of the filter connects to;

if not

(2) you'll have to get an in-line coupler (or "gender changer"), which is just a pair of female cable jacks mounted end-to-end to connect the two cables that were connected to the filter to each other directly instead.

Again, if you're lucky, they're attached to the jack on the way to your equipment. If not, they could be behind the wall plates or even in a junction box outside your house.

When I was setting up MoCa to connect my second-floor apartment to my basement theater, I had to work with a junction box mounted to the wall outside my living room window - fortunately I could reach it without leaning too far out the window for comfort!

Good luck!
Edited by Philnick - 9/8/12 at 11:23am
post #1000 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post

The strongest probability is that one or more low-pass filters were put in the line somewhere between (or at) the jacks your MoCA boxes are connected to. These are usually little cylindrical devices with cable jacks on either end. If that was done, the simplest solution is to find and remove them. Since they have female connections on both ends, you have two choices:
(1) if you're lucky, one of the cables will be long enough to connect directly to where the cable on the other end of the filter connects to;
if not
(2) you'll have to get an in-line coupler (or "gender changer"), which is just a pair of female cable jacks mounted end-to-end to connect the two cables that were connected to the filter to each other directly instead.
Again, if you're lucky, they're attached to the jack on the way to your equipment. If not, they could be behind the wall plates or even in a junction box outside your house.
When I was setting up MoCa to connect my second-floor apartment to my basement theater, I had to work with a junction box mounted to the wall outside my living room window - fortunately I could reach it without leaning too far out the window for comfort!
Good luck!
If he did I can't see them/find them. I wasn't here when he was. My better half was home and said all he did upstairs (where the main line is) was test the cable for it's strength/output. But later they were at our telephone pole up in the crane doing 'stuff'. So if they put one on way up there, I'm SOL I guess. frown.gif
post #1001 of 1198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

If he did I can't see them/find them. I wasn't here when he was. My better half was home and said all he did upstairs (where the main line is) was test the cable for it's strength/output. But later they were at our telephone pole up in the crane doing 'stuff'. So if they put one on way up there, I'm SOL I guess. frown.gif

Anything they were doing outside should not impact MoCA since it is before any splitters in your house. If you disconnect the POE cable connection does it start working again?

xnappo
post #1002 of 1198
There's nothing added, etc to the main area where the main line comes into the house. I did find one of those adapters but on the line in the bedroom (which is what they were here for to begin with - on-demand rarely working). If POE is point of entry and means where the line meets the house then no - in that box is a big ol mess of wires and adapters. Nothing has changed there either. The line that goes to the docsis router (main line) I did unplug from the diplexer when I swapped it out to try a different one (actually tried 2 of them).
post #1003 of 1198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

There's nothing added, etc to the main area where the main line comes into the house. I did find one of those adapters but on the line in the bedroom (which is what they were here for to begin with - on-demand rarely working). If POE is point of entry and means where the line meets the house then no - in that box is a big ol mess of wires and adapters. Nothing has changed there either. The line that goes to the docsis router (main line) I did unplug from the diplexer when I swapped it out to try a different one (actually tried 2 of them).

Yes that is what I mean by POE, but I meant if you disconnect the line from the cable co does MoCA work?

Regarding your On Demand problem, the cable co usually does stupid stuff to try to fix it. My guess is this amp will fix it:
http://www.amazon.com/Motorola-Signal-Booster-1-Port-Amplifier/dp/B003T2RY7I/ref=cm_cr-mr-title

Put that at the POE. Note that this particular amp amps both the signal from the cable viands TO the cable co ie the On Demand requests.
xnappo
post #1004 of 1198
I'll have to test that since I would always power off the NIM100 when I was working w/the cable ilnes. They unplugged a splitter I connected (in the bedroom) and put the pass-thru filter on which I took off and put on a better splitter tonight (On Demand working right now). Many months ago when they were here and re-did the main box attached to the side of the house they added a powered amp to the system.
post #1005 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by xnappo View Post

Yes that is what I mean by POE, but I meant if you disconnect the line from the cable co does MoCA work?

Ok - I'm not sure I understand what you're asking: the main cable line from the pole comes to the side of our house into a box and then there's two or three ginormous/industrial splitters in that box that split the cable 'everywhere' but the main line out from the box goes upstairs (via outside the house and drilled through a wall to get access into the room). That line comes in and I attached the diplexer since that line connects to our router. If I unplug that cable then I get no signal for the cable or moca.
post #1006 of 1198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

Ok - I'm not sure I understand what you're asking: the main cable line from the pole comes to the side of our house into a box and then there's two or three ginormous/industrial splitters in that box that split the cable 'everywhere' but the main line out from the box goes upstairs (via outside the house and drilled through a wall to get access into the room). That line comes in and I attached the diplexer since that line connects to our router. If I unplug that cable then I get no signal for the cable or moca.

Hmm - having trouble visualizing this. There should be absolutely no reliance on the signal from your cable company and your MoCA working. I am talking about disconnecting the line that comes from the pole to the 'industrial' splitters.

Can you take a picture of the industrial splitters and label when they go?

xnappo
post #1007 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by xnappo View Post

Hmm - having trouble visualizing this. There should be absolutely no reliance on the signal from your cable company and your MoCA working. I am talking about disconnecting the line that comes from the pole to the 'industrial' splitters.
Can you take a picture of the industrial splitters and label when they go?
xnappo
I'm at work right now so I can't however I could tonight but the box is 'barely' closed with zip ties. Doesn't the MoCA need the cable line (otherwise how can it transmit anything without the line powering it)?
post #1008 of 1198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

I'm at work right now so I can't however I could tonight but the box is 'barely' closed with zip ties. Doesn't the MoCA need the cable line (otherwise how can it transmit anything without the line powering it)?

No power comes from the cable line - it is just the cable modem and TV signals. If you can, you might also try testing the NIMs with just a single piece of coax between the two just to make sure THAT works.

xnappo
post #1009 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by xnappo View Post

No power comes from the cable line - it is just the cable modem and TV signals. If you can, you might also try testing the NIMs with just a single piece of coax between the two just to make sure THAT works.
xnappo
So would the coax go from the sat input on one to the sat on the other or would i use the cable-out on the main one? do i need anything else connected to them to test them out (ethernet etc)?
post #1010 of 1198
This sounds a lot like the situation we dealt with a few pages back in this thread here.

If that photo resembles what you have, the solution is one last outboard split.

Get a cheap two-way splitter and a short cable. The goal is to use the outboard splitter to connect the cables that go to the two MoCa locations - which you'll probably have to identify by disconnecting cables from the master splitter one at a time so you can see which location is disabled each time.

Once you've identified the cables that run to the two MoCa locations, attach them to the outputs of the two-way splitter and attach its input to one of the big box's outputs - preferably from one of the outputs with the least loss.

That should restore your MoCA network.

-Phil
post #1011 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

So would the coax go from the sat input on one to the sat on the other or would i use the cable-out on the main one? do i need anything else connected to them to test them out (ethernet etc)?

The sat jack is what you connect to the local MoCA box. The jack adjacent to it on the same side of the diplexer goes to your cable tv equipment (set-top box, cable modem, cable telephone, etc.).

The jack on the opposite side all by itself is what gets connected to the wall jack or the cable to the other location.

That jack carries the combination of what the other two jacks carry sorted-out between them.

-Phli
post #1012 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post

This sounds a lot like the situation we dealt with a few pages back in this thread here.
If that photo resembles what you have, the solution is one last outboard split.
Get a cheap two-way splitter and a short cable. The goal is to use the outboard splitter to connect the cables that go to the two MoCa locations - which you'll probably have to identify by disconnecting cables from the master splitter one at a time so you can see which location is disabled each time.
Once you've identified the cables that run to the two MoCa locations, attach them to the outputs of the two-way splitter and attach its input to one of the big box's outputs - preferably from one of the outputs with the least loss.
That should restore your MoCA network.
-Phil
I actually have been reading this thread for a while and did read that link/prior posts when it was posted and I re-read it again.
I'll have to take some pics of my box since I don't have as 'clean' a set up as that person does in my cable box. It's a real cluster 'f'.

I'm confused though: the line to upstairs is different from the line going to the first floor (from the cable box). So right now at my box two lines are coming out of the box to go to both places: by splitting one line to connect these two won't I reduce the bandwith going to both locations?
post #1013 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post

The sat jack is what you connect to the local MoCA box. The jack adjacent to it on the same side of the diplexer goes to your cable tv equipment (set-top box, cable modem, cable telephone, etc.).
The jack on the opposite side all by itself is what gets connected to the wall jack or the cable to the other location.
That jack carries the combination of what the other two jacks carry sorted-out between them.
-Phli

What i meant was the NIM100's have a cable 'in' and cable 'out' on them - the cable 'out' is not used since i'm just connecting the coax to the 'in' so to test would i connect the coax to the cable 'in's on both boxes?
post #1014 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by xnappo View Post

Err - I forgot - the NIM100s have a built-in diplexer! You don't need to use one at all. The Actiontecs only have a input, hence the need for the diplexer.
xnappo
Wait a minute - I've read in other forums/places I do need a diplexer? If I don't need a diplexer are you saying I can just connect a 'cable in' to it via a normal splitter and then connect it to my router via ethernet and that should work? Or do I use the cable 'out' and not use a splitter?
post #1015 of 1198
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

Wait a minute - I've read in other forums/places I do need a diplexer? If I don't need a diplexer are you saying I can just connect a 'cable in' to it via a normal splitter and then connect it to my router via ethernet and that should work? Or do I use the cable 'out' and not use a splitter?

Well I deleted the post because I wasn't sure(you were fast!). I was thinking of the NetGear box.

Where did you read you need one for a NIM?

xnappo
post #1016 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

Wait a minute - I've read in other forums/places I do need a diplexer? If I don't need a diplexer are you saying I can just connect a 'cable in' to it via a normal splitter and then connect it to my router via ethernet and that should work? Or do I use the cable 'out' and not use a splitter?

Using the internal diplexer in your NIM means its input would be connected directly to the wall jack and its output would be connected to the other coax devices. No conventional splitter would be needed on the way into the NIM - only to divide up its output among the other coax devices.
post #1017 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

[. . .} So right now at my box two lines are coming out of the box to go to both places: by splitting one line to connect these two won't I reduce the bandwith going to both locations?

You'd be reducing the signal strength, not the bandwidth - that's why I suggested using the output from the master splitter marked as having the least loss - if they are so marked.
post #1018 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philnick View Post

Using the internal diplexer in your NIM means its input would be connected directly to the wall jack and its output would be connected to the other coax devices. No conventional splitter would be needed on the way into the NIM - only to divide up its output among the other coax devices.

Ok - so only if I directly connected the NIM's would it work.
I used the Diplexer so the SAT output goes to the NIM and the Cable output on the diplexer goes to my comcast/xfinity gateway/router.
Would it 'work'/be better if I directly connected the line into the NIM (not use a diplexer) and use the 'cable out' on the NIM to my gateway/router?
post #1019 of 1198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wryker View Post

Ok - so only if I directly connected the NIM's would it work.
I used the Diplexer so the SAT output goes to the NIM and the Cable output on the diplexer goes to my comcast/xfinity gateway/router.
Would it 'work'/be better if I directly connected the line into the NIM (not use a diplexer) and use the 'cable out' on the NIM to my gateway/router?

Either of those approaches would work, but the MoCA signal strength would be greater if you omitted the external diplexers.

As far as the other equipment goes it would be about the same either way.
post #1020 of 1198
Well I took off the diplexer at my main area (upstairs) and connected the main cable in directly into the NIM and then connected the cable out from the NIM to the gateway and no cable signal so that is a 'no-go'. The two NIMs are too far away to directly connect. I think I'm going to go the route of a ethernet adapter powerline kit.
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