The "Official" Pioneer VSX-1019AH Owner's Thread - Page 97

I was wondering if my 1019 could push the polk monitor 70's ok? I know it should be fine in stereo mode but what bout in home theatre? Doesn't only push like 30w per chanel in surround mode? Thanks in advanced! And I have the cs2 for center.

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You are correct. The output of the 1019 is 120 watts only while driving a single channel. It decreases significantly while driving more channels. I'n not aware of the specifications of those speakers, but I'm sure the 1019 will be able to drive them efficiently.

Regarding the power output, it is said that the 1019 is enough to drive most home theater setups.

So my 705 is producing the output the 1019 will (and possibly more), yet I'm not satisifed so outboard amps are the ONLY option?

Most movies have to be watched around -10 to -8 to even be REMOTELY loud in my personal opinion, not much headroom left... audyssey sets the fronts -2db and the center -6db

does any internally amped current receiver provide more power than my 705 then?

Very nice setup. Your speakers are very efficient, sensitivity rated at 90db. the fronts and surrounds are large speakers with freq. range of 40 Hz - 40KHz, the center starts at 80Hz.

The 1019 should have no problem with your setup, could you give the room size where this will be used? The 1019 may be stressed if the room you're trying to fill is large enough. The 1018's amp section is better than the 1019's, and with the full 7.1 pre-outs, you can expand to an external amplifier is power is an issue.

Again, that becomes necessary if the room larger. Otherwise, the 1019 is just fine.

There's plenty of integrated AVR's that do, so no, an external amp is not your only option. It is probably the most cost effective if you are satisfied with your current AVR. If you want to upgrade to get other features than just power, then by all means, the following within the Pioneer line will give you more power without using external amps:

More power:
sc-09TX - 140 W x 10 channels - $7000 sugg. retail
SC-27 - 140 W x 7 - $2200
SC-25 - 140 W x 7 - $1800

Similar power:
vsx-23 - 110 W x 7 - $1000
vsx-21 - 110 W x 7 - $800

Now all of these can be found discounted, so YMMV, but typically, more power means more expense. The above are per channel over the whole human listening frequency range of 20Hz - 20KHz, all channels driven with 0.9 % distortion. I'm sure you can find equivalent AVR's in the Denon, Integra and other lines as well.

Is there absolutely no way to use an external amp with 1019 to boost the sound generally and the center channel in particular?

I know I've asked you this like a million times but pls indulge me this last time I promise no more after this Sigh...I just love my movie dialogue real loud...

Without pre-outs to carry the audio signals to an amplifier, it's not possible for the 1019. Things to investigate would be upgrading your speakers to more efficient speakers, but again that can carry you only so far.

If you promise.

There is no practical way to use an external amp with a 1019. (Technically there is a way, but it isn't a good one, so you can safely ignore it.)

As for boosting the sound, that is what the volume control is for. Don't worry about headroom, that is built in. For example, if you are running at -10, you could double your loudness before reaching 0. Most Pioneer AVRs go to something like +12, meaning you could double the output again. At -10, in a typical speaker/room you are probably using less than one watt.

You can make the center channel louder than the others by increasing it in the channel level setup (in the "Manual SP Setup" menu).

I do promise

So you're saying there's enough headroom to safely have the volume at +10 to watch a 2-3 hour movie? I thought -0 was supposed to be the point of no return

I left my speakers set to large and 80Hz, moved it to SW -PLUS and it kicked and is working fine now.

Should I lower my speakers to small or change the Hz? when I moved the Hz to 100 and higher the sound didn't seem as full IMO.

Thanks again for the help zervinb and your input klhill.

I've been using a 1019 for about a month, very nice upgrade from my ten year old Pioneer AVR.

Until today I had been using the 1019 with my also ten year old JBL "home cinema" speakers (very much an entry-level 5.1 speaker system). Today I replaced the front left and right surround speakers with Axiom M3ti's (hand-me downs from my son). The plan is to eventually replace the back surrounds and center channel too. Then the subwoofer.

After connecting the M3ti's I re-ran MCACC. It set the M3ti's to large. I had read here before about just changing them to small, but when I did it grayed-out the subwoofer -- so for now I've let them set to large. Why did changing them to small gray-out the subwoofer? Should I change anything?

I have the crossover set to 80. I know the M3ti's go from 60 to 22 kHz, I have no idea what the old JBL speakers do. Should I change it from 80? Experiment to see what sounds best? The JBL "home cinema" speakers are small cubes, about 3" square.

It is... for your ears!

Assuming an MCACC calibrated AVR with typical room/speaker conditions, 0 should approximate standard reference level, 85dB. That's uncomfortably loud for extended listening in a home environment. Most people listen in the 65-75dB range.

+10 safely? Possibly, but probably not. That extra 10dB brings you within range of threatening hearing damage over the course of a movie. Also, while going over the 0 mark for an extended period of time might not harm the amp or speakers with many rock music albums (with their compressed dynamic range), it's risking amplifier clipping with movies, where peaks can be up to 20dB above average levels. That's what the headroom is for. Most AVR's have a little headroom for peaks above their published specs, but it's like gambling on having two more gallons of gas when the fuel gauge reads E.

If you intend to listen to movies at +10, I would recommend two things: A 400 watt amp and ear plugs.

Room size : 13' X 15'

Well, if you're wild and crazy, you could do the following...

• Hook up your center-channel speaker to the 1019 in the usual fashion.
• Tap the +/- leads from the speaker and run those into the line-in on a 2nd amplifier. Actually, you'll want series resistors and de-coupling capacitors in the (+) and (-) paths, otherwise you'll short the (-) terminal to GND, which is bad.
• Hook up a speaker to the 2nd amplifier. This becomes your 2nd center-channel speaker. Crank its volume as you see fit.

MCACC will set most speakers that reach below 60Hz to Large. Small is best in most circumstances. If you set the fronts to Large, you'll be missing a lot of bass that they cannot reproduce. If they are set to Small, the "lost" bass will be redirected to the subwoofer. On the other hand, the JBL "sub" may not be a lot more capable than your Axioms, so you probably should experiment and decide as you listen for yourself. ("Subs" in many HTIB systems are just woofers, and often do not dig any deeper than typical full range speakers.)

Your JBL "home cinema" speakers probably don't go down below 150Hz, so you might want to experiment with various crossover points.

A high crossover (above ~100Hz) heightens the possibility of localization of the bass, plus you don't want to handicap your fronts for the benefit of the rears. I'd try 80Hz and 100Hz, maybe even 150Hz, and see how it sounds. Many systems have "holes" in the surround bass field, and the owners don't notice, so I wouldn't worry about a crossover that is "too low" for the JBLs. However, if you decide your Axioms are better "Large", raise the crossover to at least 150Hz. Large speakers are not affected by the crossover setting.

Oh, and your sub setting is grayed out when your speakers are set to Small because it is locked into the On position. The AVR will not support a combination of Small speakers with No sub.

Yep, that's what I was referring to when I said there was a way. They even sell Speaker Level To Line Converters for those who don't want to build their own circuit. But just because something can be done doesn't make it a good idea.

Alright, so just from reading recent posts I should set my speakers to small.

Keep the crossover at 80 and try changing the speakers to SMALL. When you're keeping the speakers LARGE, they are being sent bass which they may or may not be able to handle. If they can't, the low frequencies will simply be filtered out and not be output from the speakers. Setting them to SMALL sends all those low frequencies to the Sub which is better at handling lower frequencies.

Try the 2 combinations and see which one works out better for you.

blacklion, seriously... You should not hear anything at excessively loud volumes. How loud do you want the dialogue to be? Do you want the characters shouting in your ears, when all they're doing in the movie is whispering?

The excessively loud volumes are going to put a lot of strain on your receiver (since you don't have an external amp), your speakers (tweeters could blow because of clipping) and most importantly, your ears, God's gift to you. Permanent hearing damage can occur to those who hear excessively loud volumes for a stretch of time. I'm sure, hearing your grandchildren play (when you're old) would be more important in the long run than hearing movie dialogues at excessive volumes right now.

This is just my honest opinion. I am no one to judge you. Please don't take this the wrong way.

I have a question of my own for the experts. I've ordered the VSX-919, and it should be arriving by mid-February (relative from US is bringing it down).

I usually "switch off" my components while not using them. As in, I don't leave them on standby. I get them on Standby and then power them off, which is almost as good as unplugging them from the socket.

By doing this, will my settings/MCACC adjustments be lost? Do I need to set them all over again from the defaults when I start up the receiver again? If so, then it would be best to leave the receiver in Standby, wouldn't it? Any other pros/cons of turning it off completely?

NOTE: I shall NOT be using Kuro Link to pass through HDMI inputs to the television during standby, so that is not an issue.

Many thanks hernan, VTTOM, zervinb and Macfan! This is why I love AVS. I'll get the converter.

@ Macfan - ok, why do you think a speaker level to line level converter is not a good idea? Even if I buy one from amazon? Danger of shorting the wires and blowing the amp and receiver? Or poor sound resulting from lag between the 2 center speakers? I googled speaker/line level converters and they appear to be in pretty general use.


PS Thank you very much for your concern for my ears/hearing, Macfan and ZervinB

Page 64 and 65 of the 1019/919 manual should help you. Go into the Audio Parameter menu by pressing Receiver, then Audio Parameter. Scroll down to "DIALOG E." and then turn it on.

RE trying to find the Tone BAss Treble settings

Actually, it seems it only shows up in stereo on my system and I always use extended stereo. No wonder I couldn't find it. Haven't tried with the Dolby settings though.

Yes you are right. I hadn't noticed that before. In the footnotes on page 66, point b. says that the TONE setting can only be accessed in STEREO, Auto Surround (STEREO) or ALC (STEREO).

They add some noise and distortion, the opposite of what a traditionalist like me would want. But, hey, it's not my setup. Moreover, I'm not at all convinced additional amplification is the answer. Perhaps what you need is a better center channel speaker.

In any case, I would recommend you experiment with the dialog enhancement and increasing center channel levels before proceeding. You might also experiment with boosting the center channel 2kHz and/or 4kHz settings. That would accentuate consonants which might help make voices sound clearer and closer.

If you really listen as loud as you seem to be implying, you may have already experienced some hearing loss. Boosting these ranges (and maybe the 8kHz setting as well) might help if that's true, as these are the frequencies generally affected first.

I have a question of my own for the experts. I've ordered the VSX-919, and it should be arriving by mid-February (relative from US is bringing it down).

I usually "switch off" my components while not using them. As in, I don't leave them on standby. I get them on Standby and then power them off, which is almost as good as unplugging them from the socket.

By doing this, will my settings/MCACC adjustments be lost? Do I need to set them all over again from the defaults when I start up the receiver again? If so, then it would be best to leave the receiver in Standby, wouldn't it? Any other pros/cons of turning it off completely?

NOTE: I shall NOT be using Kuro Link to pass through HDMI inputs to the television during standby, so that is not an issue.

Macfan, and the others...any idea??

MCACC settings are retained in nonvolatile memory. They won't be lost when power is removed, at least not over a reasonable time span. I've had mine disconnected for a couple of weeks without any loss.

There is a school of thought that some devices longevity is adversely affected by not leaving them in standby. I suspect this may be an urban legend, but it might be worth a call/email to Pioneer CS to hear what they have to say about it.

Thanks for the reply Macfan. I'll send Pioneer an email later when I get my receiver. Eagerly awaiting it. HT shall be set up by the end of February. Have you any experience with KEF speakers? I was planning on purchasing KEF KHT-2005.3 speaker package with the KUBE-2 subwoofer. Have to go in for Satellites/Sub setup since I don't have the floor space for towers, nor appropriate shelves for Bookshelf speakers. Don't want to suspend bookshelves on the wall, because the speakers will have to be suspended on a narrow wooden pillar (according to my home setup).

Hence going the Satellite way. Could you take a look at the specifications of the KHT-2005.3 and the KUBE-2 and tell me if they are appropriate to be paired with the 919, and if the 919 will have any problem driving them.

Thanks a lot, in advance.

EDIT: I'm still a NOOB when it comes to appropriate pairing of speakers with receivers (or vice-versa)

Should be fine - it's not too large a room.

Speakers are very personal, but for years KEF's have enjoyed an excellent reputation, and their KHT-2005.3 set is well regarded in its class. On paper it is an excellent match with the 919.