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*OFFICIAL* Denon AVR 1910/790 Owner's Thread - Page 51

post #1501 of 9205
8/10/09 at 9:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimlad2000 View Post

Hi everyone just bought then 1910 but am having a little difficulty

I have my xbox 360 connected up via component to my 1910 then AVR to Panasonic PH9 via component, sound is via optical.

I know the screen should blank out when I press the menu button then I should get the white on black OSD but for some reason I dont any ideas?

I'm not really worried about the OSD but it would make the inital setup that bit easier when calibrating rather then using the front panel

Se Page 9 of your Manual. My XBox360 is connected via Components to the AVR but the output is through a single HDMI cable. I get the OSD with no problem.

The Manual says that to get OSD with component connection you must connect the video terminals

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post #1502 of 9205
8/10/09 at 11:00am
Thread Starter 
yes, it looks like a side effect of Denon dropping component upconversion on the 1910 model is that the OSD will not show over component as well. At least that's how I'm reading it... They REALLY want you to use an HDMI cable to your TV! For a non-HDMI display looks like you need to connect a standard (yellow) composite cable for OSD.
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post #1503 of 9205
8/10/09 at 11:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

yes, it looks like a side effect of Denon dropping component upconversion on the 1910 model is that the OSD will not show over component as well. At least that's how I'm reading it... They REALLY want you to use an HDMI cable to your TV! For a non-HDMI display looks like you need to connect a standard (yellow) composite cable for OSD.

glad I have the 1909, then. That would have been a deal breaker for me.
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post #1504 of 9205
8/10/09 at 11:06am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by matbl View Post

Can you be more specific what you mean by 24p conversion?
As far as I know it's like this:
Passing through 1080p/24 from source to tv? Yes.
Converting other framerates/resulotions/signal formats to 1080p/24 over HDMI? No. But I don't think the 2310 can do that either.
Converting other resulotions/signal formats to 1080p/50 or 1080p/60 over HDMI? Yes.

all correct expect that the ABT-2010 Denons (890/2310 and up) can indeed convert to 1080p/24.

the 1910/790 can convert to 1080p/60 but not 24. I would ASSUME that 1080p/24 signals would simply pass through (and not be converted to 60fps) but somebody should really test that with a Blu-Ray player.
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post #1505 of 9205
8/10/09 at 11:09am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by yfzcentral View Post

Wondering if you guys can help me out..

BD Player: Samsung 1590 (same as 1600) set to Audiophile
Receiver: Denon 1910

So I'm playing Chris Botti live in Boston and John Mayer, where the light is. I can get the TrueHD light to come on, but only in SOME of the chapters.

The first few chapters of Chris Botti (when on TrueHD multi ch) are silent...if I go to LPCM, then I get sound. If I skip a few chapters, then TrueHD works.

Is this a setup problem?

Thanks!

Considering the TrueHD is working, the Denon is set up correctly and you would have to assume the problem is with the source itself (or the player's handling of the source). There really isn't anything to do on the Denon besides set Input Mode = "Auto" and, since it does work when it gets the right signal, it's obviously not a settings problem on the Denon.

I assume you have also tried other Blu-Rays and they work fine with HD audio? That would be the obvious first troubleshooting step to confirm it's that specific disc that is giving you the problems.

You may want to query in the owner's thread for your BDP. It's possible those chapters have secondary audio tracks or something (I don't know what the "Audiophile" feature does) and that confounds the bitstreaming.
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post #1506 of 9205
8/10/09 at 11:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

all correct expect that the ABT-2010 Denons (890/2310 and up) can indeed convert to 1080p/24.

the 1910/790 can convert to 1080p/60 but not 24. I would ASSUME that 1080p/24 signals would simply pass through (and not be converted to 60fps) but somebody should really test that with a Blu-Ray player.

I just received a 790 a week ago, and I can confirm that blu-ray 1080p/24 does pass through intact.
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post #1507 of 9205
8/10/09 at 12:03pm
Thread Starter 
what is the "i/p scaler" setting when you checked this? Obviously the 1080p/24 will pass through if the scaler is not on; I am curious if the Denon converts 1080p/24 to 1080p/60 if the scaler is set to "analog and HDMI" and resolution is set to 1080p (and/or "auto").
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post #1508 of 9205
8/10/09 at 12:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill5150 View Post

I have Infinity TSS 1100 speakers system w/subwoofer in a 5.1 configuration. I normally listen in Denon's 5 channel stereo mode on the AVR 3200.Thank you!

You may be stepping down the Denon line but your speakers are well matched to this AVR and there have been some major advances over the past 10 years, especially Audyssey MultEQ with DynEQ. I expect you'll find it brings out the best in those little satellites with the sophisticated EQ and time correction filters and will better envelope you in a surround field. So my guess is you'll actally hear improvements in AQ with the 1910.
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post #1509 of 9205
8/10/09 at 12:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

what is the "i/p scaler" setting when you checked this? Obviously the 1080p/24 will pass through if the scaler is not on; I am curious if the Denon converts 1080p/24 to 1080p/60 if the scaler is set to "analog and HDMI" and resolution is set to 1080p (and/or "auto").

I left the scaler off for blu-ray. I'll have to try the other path and let you know.
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post #1510 of 9205
8/10/09 at 1:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill5150 View Post

I'm potentially in the market for a new receiver, and like many of you on this board, have contemplated the Pioneer 1019, Onkyo 607 and the Denon 1910 (and am leaning toward the Denon).

My question is this.. I have an old Denon AVR 3200 receiver that is still working great. Back in the day, the 3200 retailed for $1200. Although the technology is 8-10 years old, how do you think the 3200 would compare to the 1910. I don't want to "downgrade" by buying a newer model.

While all the newer inputs and HDMI would be nice on the 1910, I'm getting by with the web of wires behind my TV and my Harmony remote making it simple.

My big issue is will the sound be better with the 1910.

Thank you.

For raw output power the 3200 wins, which the 1910 can't match . What you hear from the 1910 will be the magic of audyssey at work and yes you will hear magic. Audyssey will sound like nothing you ever heard before in your home for sure. The only reason for me would be the sound of audyssey. Try one out and hear for yourself . But than what to do with the 3200, that hurts
Get a bigger and better Denon, this way its a total upgrade with no mixed feelings, its a win-win and you will sleep better knowing you made the right choice
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post #1511 of 9205
8/10/09 at 1:08pm
An interesting article on the ABT chip used in the 790/1910:

http://www.reuters.com/article/press...09+PRN20090625
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post #1512 of 9205
8/10/09 at 1:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

yes, it looks like a side effect of Denon dropping component upconversion on the 1910 model is that the OSD will not show over component as well. At least that's how I'm reading it... They REALLY want you to use an HDMI cable to your TV! For a non-HDMI display looks like you need to connect a standard (yellow) composite cable for OSD.

I will try with a composite cable tomorrow when i pick one up, then hopefully once properly setup I will be able to really give my Canton's a work out (after i have mounted then on the wall)

I currently have Xbox 360 Component to Panel as Im not sure the 1910 does a better job of upscaling to my Panels 720p native res.

Sky + RGB scart best way to connect I think.

Another quick Q Batpig would it be worth me changing my current component connection from amp to Panel to HDMI when i get a blue ray player?
and would I be able to output that signal via component and if so would i lose any PQ?

many thanks
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post #1513 of 9205
8/10/09 at 2:09pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Another quick Q Batpig would it be worth me changing my current component connection from amp to Panel to HDMI when i get a blue ray player?

If your display accepts HDMI input, I think you should do it NOW and not wait for the BDP. You will be able to use the AVR for video scaling / switching and you will be able to see the OSD menus as well. This AVR will only scale via the HDMI output so you are missing out on that feature.

When you do get the BDP, definitely use HDMI for that component (from player to amp) as you will get the lossless audio tracks.
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post #1514 of 9205
8/10/09 at 2:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

what is the "i/p scaler" setting when you checked this? Obviously the 1080p/24 will pass through if the scaler is not on; I am curious if the Denon converts 1080p/24 to 1080p/60 if the scaler is set to "analog and HDMI" and resolution is set to 1080p (and/or "auto").

So, with a 1080p/24 source, I enabled the ip scaler and tried different HDMI resolutions: auto, 1080p, 1080i, 720p. In all four cases, the video to the set remained 1080p/24. One hypothesis is that the i/p scaler knows the difference between upscaling and downscaling, and it only does upscaling.
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post #1515 of 9205
8/10/09 at 2:36pm
Thread Starter 
that's good to know, looks like the scaler simply leaves 1080p/24 untouched regardless of the setting. just pass it on through buddy! Thank you for testing that.

this is not the case for the 2310/890 and up. because of the more powerful vp chip it can process 1080p/24.... but it's a double-edged sword as this leads to an issue with a multi-purpose device like the PS3, where some of the content (movies) you want scaled to 1080p/24 and other (games) you want left untouched at 1080p/60. If you set the scaler to 1080p/60, it will change 1080p/24 Blu-Ray content to 1080p/60.... but if you set it to 1080p/24 it will change PS3 games to 1080p/24. Apparently none of the settings will work for "don't touch 1080p content! but still scale lower rez stuff up to 1080p".
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post #1516 of 9205
8/10/09 at 2:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

It's possible those chapters have secondary audio tracks or something (I don't know what the "Audiophile" feature does) and that confounds the bitstreaming.

Looking at his 1590 Owner's Manual, in the Audiophile (bitstream) setting, the secondary audio tracks are apparently not played at all which is most likely the cause of his missing audio.
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post #1517 of 9205
8/10/09 at 4:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post


I am curious though as to what exactly you mean by "changing the HDMI 2 Input settings"? According to the Owner's Manual, the factory default settings for the HDP source should be that Input Assign (HDMI) is set to HDMI 2 and everything else is set to NONE. What were your settings after the microprocessor reset that you changed back NONE?

I don't remember what else was on the settings but I know that when I went in there I had to change the settings on hdmi2 to none on the other two rows.

It all is really weird!
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post #1518 of 9205
8/10/09 at 4:32pm
OK, I have read through most of this thread, and haven't seen this rather obscure question I would like answered:

I have some "party" dvds like TV Lightbox that have interesting videos I like to put on in the background at parties. Usually I will hook up my ipod or play XM over my DirecTV HD DVR for music (so the TV isn't a big black hole on the wall). With the Blu-Ray player and DirecTV DVR being fed to the Denon via HDMI, and then HDMI to my Panasonic plasma, will I be able to do this? I tried on a friend's Yamaha receiver and it wouldn't work because it would run audio+video of whatever source the receiver was set to (so if I set it to AUX for the ipod, it would blank the TV screen; if I set it to DVD, it would mute the ipod aux).

I assume it is an HDMI thing (like the receiver is asking "why would you want sound from one source and video from another? That doesn't make sense."). Will the Denon be the same way? Any way around it? I'm still going to get the Denon, just hoping there is a workaround.

Thanks!
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post #1519 of 9205
8/10/09 at 4:59pm
Thread Starter 
this is actually one of the first few questions in my FAQ (#4 or 5):
http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html

you CAN mix audio + video sources with the "Video Select" feature but it's not possible with any HDMI inputs.
Quote:


I assume it is an HDMI thing (like the receiver is asking "why would you want sound from one source and video from another? That doesn't make sense.").

You are correct that it's an HDMI thing, but not because it doesn't "make sense" but because of the rigid copyright schemes the place on the HDMI format.

There are a few options for workarounds, here's a couple:

1. split the RCA audio signal from the ipod / XM and run it into the analog (Red/white) RCA inputs that correspond to one of your other sources. For example, if the BDP is assigned to the "DVD" name, split the RCA input from the ipod and run it to the "DVD" analog inputs. Then, use the "input mode" button to choose "analog" for audio.

2. Run a component video cable from the BDP to the Denon and assign that component video input to an unused name (e.g. "VCR" or something else that you aren't currently using). That extra "name" will just serve as your "dummy source" for video when you want the party DVD image on the screen. Then, just use the "Video Select" feature to mix the video with whatever audio you want.
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post #1520 of 9205
8/10/09 at 5:02pm
could someone please tell me, with the 1910 if the volume control will show up on the tv screen. If so what connection makes it work ,Thanks
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post #1521 of 9205
8/10/09 at 5:04pm
Thread Starter 
please do read the thread and check my FAQ, this has been answered many times

the short answer is NO
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post #1522 of 9205
8/10/09 at 5:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexicon RX7 View Post

could someone please tell me, with the 1910 if the volume control will show up on the tv screen. If so what connection makes it work ,Thanks

Page 9 of the Manual. You have to connect S-Video or the Video Terminals. Menus are then superimposed on the picture being played. You can then position the Volume Indicator at the Top or Bottom.

Its a damn complicated Manual.
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post #1523 of 9205
8/11/09 at 12:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexicon RX7 View Post

could someone please tell me, with the 1910 if the volume control will show up on the tv screen. If so what connection makes it work ,Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by insync44 View Post

Page 9 of the Manual. You have to connect S-Video or the Video Terminals. Menus are then superimposed on the picture being played. You can then position the Volume Indicator at the Top or Bottom.

Although the S-Video or composite cable connection is a work around to display the volume, you have to upgrade to the Denon 2310 to display the volume over HDMI which is certainly a much cleaner and generally the preferred method.
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post #1524 of 9205
8/11/09 at 4:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

that's good to know, looks like the scaler simply leaves 1080p/24 untouched regardless of the setting. just pass it on through buddy! Thank you for testing that.

(This includes some guessing from me)
I think it actually "passes-on" all types of 1080p video from hdmi in to hdmi out without touching it at all regardless of framerate.
I have borrowed a device (popcorn hour) that doesn't support hdcp. I set it to output 1080p/60 and it was forwarded by the 1910 without hdcp. I then set the popcorn hour to output 576p and the 1910 scaled it to 1080p and added hdcp to the output!
The settings of the 1910 was the same all the time (i/p scaler set to analog/HDMI and 1080p for both analog and HDMI).
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post #1525 of 9205
8/11/09 at 10:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by matbl View Post

I think it actually "passes-on" all types of 1080p video from hdmi in to hdmi out without touching it at all regardless of framerate.

True, as outlined in the FAQ of batpig's "Denon-to-English Dictionary:"

Quote:



Q: Do Denon AVR's screw up HDMI video at all?

A: Denon seems to get HDMI implementation correct: HDMI Video will pass through untouched, including 1080p/60 and 1080p/24.
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post #1526 of 9205
8/11/09 at 10:56am
Thread Starter 
That is generally true but I may have to alter the FAQ a bit on that topic, as the new models have HDMI>HDMI video processing and the 890/2310 and up (with ABT-2010 chip) can actually convert 1080p/24 > 1080p/60 and vice versa... so the situation is a little more complicated now.

On the 1910/790, it looks like it can't process 1080p at all so it still goes through untouched (as it should).
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post #1527 of 9205
8/11/09 at 11:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

That is generally true but I may have to alter the FAQ a bit on that topic, as the new models have HDMI>HDMI video processing and the 890/2310 and up (with ABT-2010 chip) can actually convert 1080p/24 > 1080p/60 and vice versa... so the situation is a little more complicated now.

On the 1910/790, it looks like it can't process 1080p at all so it still goes through untouched (as it should).

Okay, cool. Also, you may have missed it when I mentioned it before, but the first link on the first post in this thread is incorrect:

Quote:
FOR GENERAL FAQ AND DENON SETUP HELP, PLEASE VISIT:
http:/batpigworld.com/

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post #1528 of 9205
8/11/09 at 11:17am
Thread Starter 
thanks, fixed it. stupid double-backslash....
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post #1529 of 9205
8/11/09 at 11:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by insync44 View Post

An interesting article on the ABT chip used in the 790/1910:

http://www.reuters.com/article/press...09+PRN20090625

That's a press release, not an 'article'...

Anyways...I've been working far too much lately, and haven't had time to keep up with the thread - did Logitech update the Harmony software for this receiver yet?
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post #1530 of 9205
8/11/09 at 11:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

thanks, fixed it. stupid double-backslash....

Of course, I just quoted the bad link, so I've perpetuated it for eternity...
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AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Receivers, Amps, and Processors › *OFFICIAL* Denon AVR 1910/790 Owner's Thread