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Antimode 8033 - Page 6

post #151 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by danieljoseph View Post

Hi

I have a Denon 4810 which my sub is connected to (M&K 125MkII) and before I purchased and ran anitmode, Audyssey has correctly detected distance as 2.0m to my listening position. But after I purchased and ran antimode and then Audyssey set up, the distance has increased to 3.6m

Is this normal or have I done something wrong?

Thanks

its normal because of the delay that the anti-mode creates when added in the chain. by setting the distance further away from your ears it compensates for the delay.

also, holy crap you sit 6 feet away from your sub?
post #152 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by danieljoseph View Post

Hi

I have a Denon 4810 which my sub is connected to (M&K 125MkII) and before I purchased and ran anitmode, Audyssey has correctly detected distance as 2.0m to my listening position. But after I purchased and ran antimode and then Audyssey set up, the distance has increased to 3.6m

Is this normal or have I done something wrong?

Thanks

Below is from the 8033 manual which explains what you are finding after running Audyssey.

If the A/V receiver supports speaker distances, you can add 90 cm to the subwoofer distance relative to other speakers to compensate for the internal processing delay. This is not absolutely necessary since the delay is small enough that the human auditory system can generally not detect it.

You can also use your A/V receiver's automatic functions to determine the correct distance and level settings. In that case the processing latency of AntiMode is automatically taken into account by the A/V receiver.


Bill
post #153 of 554
The 8033 adds delay for which Audyssey is compensating.
post #154 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_Stuewe View Post

also, holy crap you sit 6 feet away from your sub?

LOL..how far should one sit from their sub??
post #155 of 554
Can I use one antimode with 2 subs.
post #156 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsil View Post

Can I use one antimode with 2 subs.

YES, I use one Anti Mode with 4 subs.
post #157 of 554
I guess you are using a y- adapter on antimode then to all subs.
post #158 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsil View Post

I guess you are using a y- adapter on antimode then to all subs.

Yes.
post #159 of 554
Ok, I finally connected an 8033 to my dual Epik Sentinels. It did a good job; however, it might have only been a 10-15% improvement over my BFD PEQ. I only had 1 cut and boost with my BFD.

REW of room with no sub calibration:



REW with my BFD:



Unfortunately I don't have REW running and have not been able to get a graph of the Antimode's results. I also don't have any waterfalls.
post #160 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_Stuewe View Post

its normal because of the delay that the anti-mode creates when added in the chain. by setting the distance further away from your ears it compensates for the delay.

I didnt understand. If Antimode is adding delay shouldnt the distance be reduced by Audyssey?
post #161 of 554
Mupi, the 8033 (or any external processing device) will "add delay". That means the signal will take longer to go from the receiver to the subs. The longer time the signal takes to get to the sub is similar to the subs being further away from the unit(LP). This is why Audyssey adds more distance.
post #162 of 554
Thanks. It makes sense now.
post #163 of 554
For those using the Antimode for multiple subs, did you level match or gain match your subs?? I have tried level matching my dual Epiks subs thus far, but am not too impressed. I didn't know if anyone has compared the 2 different methods. I decided on level matching because my subs will not reach their limits with their current gain..
post #164 of 554
I am actually considering selling my Anti-Mode. I find myself not using it as everytime I do, I lose some strong notes in the regions my subs really pound.

I've tried it with three different subs and I ended up disconnecting it each time (tried with SVS PC12-NSD *single and dual, my Klipsch Sono and another sub/MBM that I built years ago). I can tell it definitely flattened the curve just by bringing the sound they really pound down to the output of what the really low stuff plays at. I guess I don't mind non-flat curve, but will take bass where I get it. My subs aren't to the level of some here, but I don't think they're slackers either.

I will be picking up an external sound card very soon to see what the curve looks like on a graph before I decide to go without any sub EQ.
post #165 of 554
Running REW will teach you a lot about your room curve.....and you. You will visually get to see the type of bass (probably peaked) that you like. I know im my quest for subs and calibration I realized I like bass response with a peak around 38z. My ears got used to it. I have a great thread outlining my journey with this.
post #166 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by deepstang View Post

Running REW will teach you a lot about your room curve.....and you. You will visually get to see the type of bass (probably peaked) that you like. I know im my quest for subs and calibration I realized I like bass response with a peak around 38z. My ears got used to it. I have a great thread outlining my journey with this.

That is exactly why I want to run REW before making my decision. If anything, I may just need something that I can make manual input to for sound. I've tried the 35hz lift and it sounds more like what I want, but the lift may be a bit more than I need as it really limits how loud I can turn them up as with my experience, with my setup, is a little more boost than I'd like.

I've almost had my Anti-Mode for a year, but it's been disconnected most of it.
post #167 of 554
I understand. I have been through several subs in the last couple of years trying to satisfy my hunger for clean deep bass. I have learned a lot. I have been using my anti-mode for a few weeks now, and don't really think it added much. I don't blame the anti-mode, but my room and possibly the subs. From the reviews it seems that there is no doubt the anti-mode gets the job done. On the same note, it is not fair to expect her to work miracles
post #168 of 554
Just added an Anti-mode to my system (picked it up for a great price at the Montreal audio show on Saturday--didn't have time to install it until this morning). I ran REW about a month ago (once I figured out how to use its basic features, at least) and got a curve with a large, wide hump (+ 6-8 dB from target of 75 dB) between 28-40 hz, a narrow dip centred at 47 hz (down about 7 dB from target of 75 dB) and another hump at 63-75 hz (not quite as high as the first one, but nearly + 4-5 dB along that curve). I had an R-DES plugged into the system and using it I was able to improve my bass (so I know EQ works in my room--though I used the R-DES before discovering REW, so it was a painfully long task) but it introduced a distorting rumble that was masked by loud passages in movies but clearly evident with quiet passages and with most music.

I haven't re-run REW (I've already used more of my morning for non-work related HT tweaking than I probably should), though I will. However, a quick listening test using my DVD-A of Hotel California reveals a much better, less boomy (one-note) bass (easily revealed with the bypass feature on the Anti-mode). So it's doing something--and something right.
post #169 of 554
Anyone have any opinons on using the "multiple position" function of the Anti-mode??
post #170 of 554
@ovation...

good deal! i figured you were gonna like it...

yea, it sounds like it's doing it's job...
post #171 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

@ovation...

good deal! i figured you were gonna like it...

yea, it sounds like it's doing it's job...

It's not a radical change (the humps were not "peaky"--looked more like the top of a valentine's heart rather than taller, narrower peaks) and I doubt casual listeners would notice much difference (unless I pointed it out to them) but it does provide cleaner low bass--kick drums in Hotel California, electric bass in Fleetwood Mac's The Chain and Gold Dust Woman, standup bass on Diana Krall's The Girl in the Other Room (whole disc)--first two discs DVD-A and last one SACD: all in MCH mode.

Looking forward to doing some A/Bing with movies later this week. I think Inception should provide a good test.
post #172 of 554
Did a quick A/B this morning with the Balrog scene in LOTR on BD. The effect was noticeable but somewhat subtle (again, casual listeners might not notice, or indeed prefer w/o EQ as the deep bass "shakes the seat" a bit more owing to the hump in the 28-40hz range in my room). With EQ, the stomping footsteps of the Balrog are "cleaner" and some bass sounds are more clearly present (not masked by the hump). While I've had no desire to up my sub volume after EQ for music, I might be tempted to adjust the sub trim "on the fly" for movies or perhaps engage one of the lift modes on the 8033. However, I will give myself some time to listen with the EQ without the lift or increasing the sub levels to acclimate to the flatter bass response.

While it's early days yet, I suspect at least some of the following are true:
  • In a room with already decent (no sharp peaks or multiple deep nulls) bass, the improvement might appear disappointing on first listen to casual listeners (though not to me, even though I had a decent response already).
  • The improvement in bass response is probably more evident in music than in movies with LOTR-like deep bass, again to casual listeners.
  • The market that would most benefit from the 8033 (or built in auto-EQ for subs in various receivers/pre-pros) is the one least likely to appreciate its effects UNLESS the room is quite bad.

No regrets so far (wasn't expecting anything "magical") but beware of those making extravagant claims (which the designer, on-hand at the audio show, to his credit, did not make in his presentation).
post #173 of 554
Just ran through Peter Gabriel's Up (MCH SACD) and ELP's Brain Salad Surgery (MCH DVD-A). Works like a charm with the really low frequency stuff on each disc--for example, a cleaner sound on Still You Turn Me On and Lucky Man (w/o 8033, the bass on each track is deep, but "sloppy").

Also did a really good job with the third installment of the Pirates of the Caribbean series last night.

I'll probably A/B a few more things but even w/o running REW, I know there is an improvement (not just an impression).

If anyone is running without any sub EQ and is not contemplating a new receiver with such a feature, I recommend the 8033--real improvement (again, not magical--I don't want to exaggerate its effect--but notable) AND incredibly easy to use. Tweakers will likely be bored with this device (for them, the BFD is available and less expensive in money, if not time) but for anyone who wants better sound from their sub in 10 mins (at most) and doesn't want to break the bank--this is a great option. And, for me, it guarantees my non-HDMI DVD-A player will have an EQ'd sub output (no matter what receiver I upgrade to)--a major plus in my book.
post #174 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

I would definitely want to use the resistors to sum the two outputs because there is no guarantee that those outputs are buffered (few are). If they are not, using a Y-cable without the resistors will shunt the L and R channels to each other and the main output will be mono only.

I found a place that sells affordable (about 1/3 the price of others I found) Y cables with attenuation in place. They are Arcade Electronics. Wanted to mention this for those not handy enough to make their own or don't want to spend $80 for one from other sources.

http://www.arcade-electronics.com/detail.aspx?ID=23214

Part number is 35-525B-MZ.
post #175 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by hhawk View Post

I found a place that sells affordable (about 1/3 the price of others I found) Y cables with attenuation in place. They are Arcade Electronics. Wanted to mention this for those not handy enough to make their own or don't want to spend $80 for one from other sources.

http://www.arcade-electronics.com/detail.aspx?ID=23214

Part number is 35-525B-MZ.



Part # shows CAD 35-525-MZ and I ordered 4 of them.
post #176 of 554
I note the DSPAntimode cable has 3 male ends. The Arcade buffered Y cable has 1 male and 2 female ends. Not a drop in replacement.
post #177 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by hhawk View Post

I found a place that sells affordable (about 1/3 the price of others I found) Y cables with attenuation in place. They are Arcade Electronics. Wanted to mention this for those not handy enough to make their own or don't want to spend $80 for one from other sources.

http://www.arcade-electronics.com/detail.aspx?ID=23214

Part number is 35-525B-MZ.

DO NOT USE THIS as a Y splitter WITH THE ANTI MODE! I tried one and it cuts the output to the subs by a third. And the female ends are stuffed with glue inside at the solder joint and doesn't allow the male center pin to seat all the way so it is a loose connection. I would say that this is a quality control issue.

Bill
post #178 of 554
Here is a great deal on the 8033c and the 8033S for the Holiday weekend.

http://creativesound.ca/details.php?model=ANTIMODE8033C

http://creativesound.ca/details.php?model=ANTIMODE8033S

Bill
post #179 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Here is a great deal on the 8033c and the 8033S for the Holiday weekend.

http://creativesound.ca/details.php?model=ANTIMODE8033C

http://creativesound.ca/details.php?model=ANTIMODE8033S

Bill

Wow, that's cheap. Any reason for me to get the 8033S vs the 8033C? I've got an Epik Empire, Marantz AV7005, Oppo BDP-93, Emotiva XPA-5, and MB Quart speakers.
post #180 of 554
Quote:
Originally Posted by globalgreg View Post

Wow, that's cheap. Any reason for me to get the 8033S vs the 8033C? I've got an Epik Empire, Marantz AV7005, Oppo BDP-93, Emotiva XPA-5, and MB Quart speakers.

I'm not positive but I thought the difference was the 8033S can be used for a stereo system and a HT system. The S also has a soft power up and down so there are no loud thumps as with the C. If I was buying one now I would go for the 8033S for the upgraded features.

Below is from the product sheet of the 8033S:

-Simultaneous connection of stereo system and home theater possible
(with stereo to mono or speaker level adapter)
-Smooth power on and off with fade-in


http://verkkokauppa.planeetta.net/ep...cts/8033S-0001

http://www.dspeaker.com/en/products/...ode-8033.shtml

Bill
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