*OFFICIAL* Denon AVR 2310CI / 890 Owner's Thread - Page 68

If anyone cares, the red lines on the display are NOT there when HDMI control is turned off.

** NOTES ***

The below post was put together about 1 1/2 years ago to discuss the 1st three firmware updates for the XX10/X90 models and is now being updated to note that the 3rd update released in 2/2010 also resolves the audio dropouts noted in the XX10/X90 models while viewing the Star Wars: The Complete Saga BD series recently released 9/16/2011. Although it pertains to the XX10/X90 models if you are experiencing this issue with your particular model, there is an update for your model available in one of three ways depending on the Denon model you have: (1) Networking models received an update last summer and should not be experiencing any issues as long as your firmware is up to date (2) non-networking models w/o RS-232 jacks, via a repair facility as an "in-warranty" repair (regardless of the age of your unit even if beyond the 2 year warranty period), as well as non-networking models w/RS-232 jacks that don't wish to install the update themselves or (3) non-networking models w/RS-232 jack (2309CI, 2808CI/988, 2809CI/ 989) directly emailed to you by first reviewing the entire post below for information that might pertain to your model, and if you still want the update and have a USA model, PM me with your model # and non-gmail email address. Note this update is cumulative and will include any prior updates previously released for your model.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Denon AVR 890, 1910/790 and 1610/590 owners must either deliver or ship (at your own expense) your AVR to a Denon authorized repair center (see paragraph further down for more info) to have the firmware installed as your AVRs have no RS-232 jack.***********

Jeff Talmadge (aka DenonJeff, Denon Director of Product Development) confirmed that firmware updates are available for the 2010 models having the Samsung/LG Blu-Ray Player bitstreaming and HDMI-CEC issues. He has provided me with the update for the 2310 and indicated it is for the USA/CA 2310CI only. See Note 2 below on how to obtain firmware for non-USA/CA models. To obtain this update, please PM me with your email address excluding yahoo, gmail, and gmail based (commonly .edu) addresses. If all you have is an "excluded" email address, then please go to hotmail.com and create a new one.

-------------------------
1st Update: Firmware Update Ver 0079 (released Oct 2009) corrects the following:
a. Samsung/LG Blu-Ray players (e.g Samsung BD-P3600, LG BD-390, etc.), Sony BDP-N460, Oppo BDP-80 and possibly some other models - although the HD Audio "blue light" lights up, there is no audio when the BDP is set to bitstream, rather only when it is set to PCM (keep in mind though that as long as you don't have to see the "blue light", the PCM audio quality is the same as the bitstream audio)
b. HDMI-CEC bugs [even with HDMI-CEC (Samsung - Anynet+, Panasonic - Viera Link, Sharp - Aquos Link, Sony - BRAVIA Sync) turned OFF on the TV (which often solves this problem), an HDMI source audio and video will not both pass to the TV when the AVR is in Standby]
c. Multi-zone audio - slight audio delay when same source selected in both zones
d. Speaker "popping" noise when changing inputs - only noted by a couple posters

Once Ver 79 is installed the Main Ver = 00.69 and Sub Ver = 00.30. Any Main Ver # lower than that number will have the above listed issues. If you just recently purchased your 2310, please use the procedure below to check the Main Ver # as you may not have to install the update if it's already been installed by Denon.

-----------------------

2nd Update: Firmware Update Ver 0082 (released Jan 2010) corrects the following:
a. All issues corrected in Firmware Update 0079 above
b. Loss of audio using HDMI-DVI adapter/cable to some older DVI TVs

Once Ver 82 is installed the Main Ver = 00.69 and Sub Ver = 00.31, the only difference being the Sub Ver changes from 30 to 31.

-----------------------

3rd Update: Firmware Update Ver 0033 (released Feb 2010) corrects the following:

** Forum member Flaken2000 was able to get the update from another Denon Rep and successfully loaded and installed it without issue. This update is different in that you will be installing a <.bin> file rather than simply running the .exe file so there will be three files being sent with the Installation Help file being the .pdf file which you'll want to open first. Also note that this new update procedure starts with "resetting the microprocessor" so be sure to jot down all your current settings beforehand so you can more quickly return to them after running AUTO SETUP. **

** A couple of members (out of roughly 300+ at this point) have had issues with the update freezing on them before successfully completing and another couple couldn't get it to update at all which required them sending their AVR to a repair facility for installation of the firmware. Please note that these updates are NOT officially supported and Denon CSR will not be able to provide assistance. If you cannot successfully install the update using the various troubleshooting suggestions provided in the .pdf help file, then your only recourse is to send the AVR to an authorized repair facility that is able to install updates to the 2310. **

a. All issues from the previous updates listed above.
b. Crackling noise on surround back speakers during playback of DTS HD-MA 6.1 disc.
c. No audio heard from sub when MultEQ is engaged.
d. No audio when HDMI source initially selected unless another surround mode (eg. STEREO, 5-CH STEREO, etc.) is selected and then the original surround mode (eg. STD) is selected again.
e. When pressing the MUTE button, the "MUTE" text on the display will not go away when using the Volume UP/DOWN buttons
f. No HD audio heard when using Samsung BD-C6900
g. Audio dropouts from DTS-HD MA 6.1 audio track (Star Wars: The Complete Saga)

Once Ver 33 is installed the Main Ver = 00.69 and Sub Ver = 00.34, the only difference being the Sub Ver changes from 31 to 34.

--------------------
To install a firmware update, you'll need a Microsoft OS (XP, Vista, 7) laptop and either a USB-to-Serial (DB9) or serial-to-serial (DB9) cable which can be purchased at most computer stores for roughly $10-$15. Forum sponsor sells them for about $10 here. (Note: for more info on how to use the cable including obtaining a driver if none is provided read my 2808 update post here). With the latest firmware, I will forward three files, one of which will be <.pdf> setup file that will explain how to install the update from your laptop by connecting the cable to the USB/serial port on the laptop to the RS-232 jack on the 2310. The update will take about 15 min to install.

Problems with installing the update can generally be resolved by one of the following:

a. Try a different COM port that also gets a COM CHECK OK.
b. Use the "Countermeasure" procedure listed in paragraph 2.6 of the .pdf Update Manual.
c. Obtain the correct driver for the cable you are using. If not on your computer, then google for it on the internet. One owner reported that even though he was able to get a COM CHECK OK, the update would not start until he got the correct driver for the serial cable he was using.
d. Use a different serial cable.
e. Use a different laptop.


What is my firmware version?
In order to check both your firmware Main Ver # and Sub Ver #, using the buttons on the front panel display (not the remote) first turn the AVR ON (green light around power ring), then using the small power button, power it OFF (ie. not in Standby). Next, while pressing both the [DIMMER] button and [STATUS] button on the front panel (just below the front panel display) simultaneously, power ON the AVR using the small power button. After the unit powers on release the buttons. Then, each time the STATUS button is pressed, it will cycle through the various firmware version numbers including the Main Ver # and Sub Ver# as well as the serial number.

If your 2310/890 Main Ver = 00.69 and Sub Ver = 00.34 or higher, your unit already has the latest update installed.

************************************************************ *******
For 1910/790 and 1610/590 Owners: You can check your Main Ver # using the same procedure above as well. See Note #1 below for how to get the firmware update.

Once the 1st firmware update is installed the Main Ver = 00.89 and Sub Ver = 00.24. Any Main Ver # lower than that number will have the above listed issues. If you just recently purchased your AVR, please use the procedure listed above to check the Main Ver # as you may not have to have the updates installed if it's already been installed by Denon. It's been confirmed that units beginning with serial number "001" (and likely "912") will have this update installed.

Once the 2nd firmware update is installed the Main Ver = 00.89 and Sub Ver = 00.26, the only difference being the Sub Ver changes from 24 to 26.

Once the 3rd firmware update is installed the Main Ver = 00.89 and Sub Ver = 00.27, the only difference being the Sub Ver changes from 26 to 27.


If your 1910/790 or 1610/590 Main Ver = 00.89 and Sub Ver = 00.27 or higher, your unit already has the latest update installed.


HDMI LPCM issue
Another issue that was just recently identified (and therefore not resolved by the Ver 79 update) for these (4) models only is the inability for Dyn Eq and Dyn Vol to work correctly with HDMI LPCM audio (ie BDP is doing the decoding) even though the Dyn Eq and Dyn Vol lights are lit. Those models with serial numbers beginning with "9" would likely have this issue. The Jan 2010 firmware update will resolve this issue and will also include fixes for the bitstream issues as well. It has been reported though that units with a serial number beginning with "003" (mfr'd March '10) will likely have the first two updates installed. The serial number is located on the back of the AVR as well as on the box itself. Your best bet is to ask for the most recent model the vendor has received from Denon, ideally with a serial number beginning with "003, 004, 005, etc.".

If the "LPCM" update (which includes the "bitstream" firmware update as well) has been installed, the Main Ver # = 00.89, Sub Ver# = 00.26. (Note: The only difference between this update and the former update will the Sub Ver# (00.26 vice 00.24)


************************************************************ ***

Do I really need to get this update?

If you are not experiencing any problems noted above (that aren't resolved by Resetting the Microprocessor) other than the fact that your AVR will not play the bitstreamed HD audio (or it's very weak) AND you don't mind not seeing the "blue" HD Audio light (like all of us PS3 fat owners), then no, you don't need to have this update installed. Simply have the Blu-Ray player do the decoding (set to PCM) and you'll still hear the same original HD audio stream you would hear if you bitstreamed it to the AVR (there is no difference in sound either way).

************************************************************ *******

Notes:
(1) These updates, although developed and tested by Denon, are being provided as a convenience only and are not supported by their customer service help desk. They are also provided to Denon Authorized Repair centers that are able to do firmware installations.

(2) If you aren't experiencing any of the problems noted in this post, there's no reason to install the update, however, there should be no harm in installing it to ensure you have the latest firmware either.

(3) If you have an 890, 1910/790, or 1610/590 and want the update installed, you must either ship or deliver (if local) the AVR (at your expense) to either the NJ factory repair center or to an Authorized Repair Center near you that is capable of firmware installation and has the most current firmware. If shipping to other than the NJ repair center, call them in advance to ensure they have the proper "jig" to install the update as not all repair centers are equipped to make the installation. Although it might cost a little more in shipping, folks shipping to the factory repair facility in NJ (PanurgyOEM) have had < 2 week turn around times from the day they shipped it to the day it was returned, while others have had their AVRs out for 3-4 weeks due to their local repair facility not having the correct "jig" to accomplish the firmware update. For quicker turn around time, if you have an issue that you see listed in my post above (an no other issue), then place a note inside your AVR box indicating you just want the firmware updated to the latest version, otherwise the repair center will spend time trying to troubleshoot your AVR. Recently a member shipped his 1910 to the factory repair center indicating only the problem. The tech's troubleshooted his unit and sent it back as they couldn't replicate his issue, however, they also did NOT update the firmware which required him to send it back again for the update, which WILL in fact resolve his problem. The tech that worked on his AVR apparently wasn't aware there were firmware updates for the 1910.

(4) For non-USA/CA models check with your country/Region Denon Help desk for the latest information on how to obtain the latest update. The European (EU) model update can be downloaded from this site.

(5) Issues not resolved with this update:
(a) A known issue with the LG BD390 is that the GUI will not overlay when playing a BD/DVD, rather just the menu over black background will appear
(b) The 2310 GUI/volume overlay may not display on a cable box 720p source channel when connected to the 2310 via HDMI (component works without issue).

(6) If bitstreamed HD audio is still desired (w/o the update), one workaround that works for some is to cycle the AVR OFF/ON while the Blu-Ray is playing.

(7) If your 2310 or 890 serial number begins with "001" (mfr'd Jan 2010), "912" (mfr'd Dec 2009), or "911" (mfr'd Nov 2009) and ends in a number higher than "16237" (2310) or "01007" (890) then you shouldn't require the Jan 2010 firmware update.

(8) Oppo-83 Owners: If you are having difficulty with the AVR decoding the bitstreamed HD audio, try the following procedure:

Restart the Easy Setup Wizard on the Oppo. Press "Setup", select "Device Setup", then select "Reset Factory Default". Go through the steps until you reach step 5. It will give you two options for the Audio Setting: Compatible or Advanced. Select "Advanced". And that should solve the issue of the Denon not decoding the source audio properly.

after reading about issues with denon and decoding/hdmi handshakes, onkyos and audio dropouts, and my personal failures with marantzs, what is up with the 2009 receivers? economy causing cost cutting on testing or qc? seems most models are having major glitches...

More like a combination of poor QC and technical issues with HDMI HDCP. Putting out 10 new models each year certainly doesn't help and is taking it's toll.

So my 2310 appears to be dead. When powering up I heard a thump and now the denon will not power up. Bummer. Hopefully Denon will replace it or 6ave.com as it is only 2 months old.

Certainly worth calling 6Ave, although as you're out of the 30 day window they'll most likely refer you to Denon. Give Denon Help desk a call and they should take care of you.

I kind of like the way Audyssey set the calibration for all the speaker levels when watching tv or movies, but for games I feel it's a bit off since they seem to be more liberal with how they use the 5 speakers. Is it possible to save your settings/tweaks for different inputs like you can for the video adjust? For instance, I have the brightness up a few notches for directv, but 0 for dvd and it remembers those settings per input. I'd like to set levels for the surrounds on xbox360 different from that of dvd.

i have the WII connected to the 2310 with composite cable, and the receiver through hdmi to the panasonic 46pz85, but the upscaled image have a black borders, there is no overscan or similar settings in 2310?

So, I've upgraded my STB from the Moto 6200 to a Moto DCX3400 DVR (my only choice with TWC). To recap briefly, the 6200 didn't have HDMI, so was connected via component to the 2310, then HDMI out to my display. But I was getting lots of flashing with the scaler on with 480i SD sources. Turning if off fixed that, but, of course, couldn't take advantage of the ABT chip in the 2310. My Samsung display does a very good job with scaling, but, ya know...

So now with the DCX3400, I can take advantage of an all-HDMI connection, but there's a new wrinkle. The DVR can ouput native resolutions. However, with the scaler on, after the 2310 is turned off and back on again, the output from the DCX reverts to 720p for everything. Apparently this is a known issue discussed over at the TWC (Los Angeles) thread, where others see a reversion to 1080i instead. Workaround is to turn the AVR on last in the startup sequence and first in the turn off one (at least for those with Yamaha AVRs). Doesn't seem to work for me (besides, I'm running everything with a Harmony One and there doesn't seem to be a way to delay the start of the AVR initially). The only solution, so far, is to, again, turn the scaler off in the 2310 .

So, bottom line, has anyone else had any experiences like this and is there some trick with the 2310 to get around this? I'd also be interested in any insights about why this happens. I'm guessing it has to do with how & where the DVR is getting its info about what resolutions the display can handle or is preferred, but it's still fairly muddled in my mind.

Hi Bruce,

Let's assume you have your STB assigned to SAT/CBL button. Set up everything to your liking, then on the remote press and hold the SAT/CBL button for more than 2 seconds or till the text "Memory" apprears on the 2310's display. All should be well,...but if not just wait till batpig chimes in!

Have you tried using a component cable from the DCX box to the 2310? Turning sources on in a particular order sometimes works to solve HDMI related issues even with the Denon AVRs. I'm not familiar with the Harmony remotes; however, if you want a delay, you should be able to add a step to turn on a non-existant device in order to get the delay.

I'd also suggest updating your 2310 with the latest firmware per my post #2013.

No, it's on the HCP port (another fun HDMI issue is that not every port cooperates sending the signals - HDCP errors ). If I understand what you're saying, I'm not sure that would matter since the problem is with the DCX, it seems, not the 2310 remembering settings (unless I'm missing something, which is, of course, a HUGE possibility...)


Haven't tried component; I suspect the issue would go away (as it does if I simply do a direct HDMI connect to my display). Trouble with the Harmony is that the turn on signals, from what I've read at the Logitech forum, are done in parallel, so no delay can be inserted easily (tech support could probably do something, but it would be a billed call, not interested in that..). There's a trick, I believe, about adding a non-existent AVR in the initial startup, then add the 2310 later on in the activity sequence (maybe that's what you're saying). Seems kinda messy to me; I'd have to experiment. Might just turn on the display separately and set it to be an "always on" device for Harmony, so it won't bother with power toggling it. Or not...

And, just to clear up, after more fooling with this, it doesn't have anything to do with whether the 2310 scaler is on or off. The issue simply persists as long as the display is not turned on before the 2310 (the DCX is always on, btw).


You really think this is related? Not that I don't believe you, it's just that firmware updates always make me a little squeamish initially (irrational fear of frying...sorry... ).

The picture adjustments for the ABT chip in the 2310 are listed on p. 52 in your Owner's Manual. Other than that, you can also change the overscan setting on the Panny from HD Size 2 to 1 (or something similar).

He's referring to using a Quick Select button, and as you say, most likely it's a DCX / 2310 connectivity issue.


Yes, this is what I am saying. Adding the non-existant AVR adds a few seconds of delay (at least it does on my Denon programmable remote). Not really messy as that's what programmable remotes are designed to do ... program the steps you need to accomplish the task.



One of the issues this fix resolves are HDMI-CEC issues. I can't say whether it would solve your problem or not. If you can't come up with a work around that is acceptable to you, install the update.

yes, the panny have the overscan feature, but is very annoying, i have to manually enable when using the wii and turn off with all other device

A programmable remote (eg. Harmony) would make that job much easier as you could program all the steps into one button (turning on the Wii, turning on the Denon, turning on the Panny, changing the overscan on the Panny, etc.).

This is of course just a wild guess on myside, but maybe worth trying. First off, I don't know what resolution your Denon is set to, let's assume it's at 720p. You won't notice it on the TV, coz in that case the TV will set the resolution to 1080p as the last participant in the chain. (Picture is full size on the TV screen, isn't it?)

Now, the STB will find what display modes your Denon will support and adjust its own settings accordingly. The Denon and the STB has to make a HDCP handshake anytime you change input modes or turn off your avr.

Even if you change resolution on the Denon, but you don't save it for that specific input, it will always go back to default settings (720p in this case of my example) everytime you turn off the avr or change input modes.

Me also in the dark for this case, though haven't had the problem of your's yet, but gonna check it out on myside as well. Loookin' forward...

Feri -
I think you're confusing the resolution going IN to the Denon (which can be a single resolution or multiple resolutions depending on how the cable box is set) with the resolution going OUT to the TV. The Resolution setting in the Denon is what goes OUT to the TV which is why that setting is normally left at AUTO as the Denon only has to figure out the highest resolution the HDTV can display (in the Ops case, 1080p).

Let me know if you discover anything. Right now, I'm seeing that, contrary to what I was led to believe by others, even manually turning on the TV first, waiting until it displays a "no signal" message, then turning on the Denon the DCX still reverts to 720p. So, for now, I'm connecting the HDMI to the display directly, as my patience is wearing a little thin.

As for you suggestion about resolution in the Denon, when I had scaling enabled, output was set either to Auto or 1080p. Didn't matter -- problem persisted whether it was one of those or if scaling was totally off for that input. Once everything was shut off, turning back on the DCX would revert to 720p (there are different resolution lights on its display so you can see what it's outputting). Once everything is up and running, I can change the DCX's output and things are cool, whether the Denon is scaling or I set it to passthrough. Once turned off, why the DCX is deciding that the Denon won't accept anything other than 720p during their handshake, I don't know. It doesn't have that problem handshaking directly with the display.

Are you noticing any real difference in PQ between the direct connect to the HDTV at 1080i vs. letting the 2310 upscale to 1080p? Other than that, there's no lose in audio quality when connecting a coax (or yellow video composite) or toslink/optical cable to the 2310.

Although I did notice the DCX is able to pass DD+ which AFAIK will sound better over HDMI rather than being converted to and passed as a DD 5.1 stream, however, until HD channels are broadcast in other than DD 5.1, using coax/optical is not an issue.

^^^No, can't say I do. I kinda think 480p run through the Denon to 1080p looks slightly better than having the TV do it, but perhaps that's just in my head (not sure offhand what chip my Samsung LED DLP is using -- my old Samsung DLP had Faroudja). And I know the audio part of it is pretty much moot considering what is being broadcast. Mainly I want things to work the way they're supposed to. Just my OCD.

Something curious, though, about the audio. After I connected the DCX to the Denon via coax, I got sound, but noticed that there was no indication on the Denon's display of input channels, just 5.1 DDII output . Dug into the settings and found that audio was set to EXT. IN instead of digital. So switching to digital fixed that. But since I have nothing connected via EXT. IN, how was I getting sound with that setting?

As a new member, I must say that Batpig should be receiving a commission from Denon as I wouldn't have given the Denons a second look because of various issues, if not for his FAQ's, setup guides and online help.

I'm considering the 2310 or 890 but have a depth limitation in my stereo stand. The support for my LCD goes straight up the back of the unit right where the power cord plugs into these receivers. The rest is open. I don't need the outlets below the power connection. The only right angle cords I can seem to find are 3 prong like in this image. Will a 3 prong shroud cable like this work with these receivers?

And could someone please tell me the depth of the receiver from the maximum part of the curve on the faceplate to the back edge of the case.

Thanks for the help.

Hi Bruce,

I did try to reconstruct your setup on my system, but to no avail.

Firstly, here's my setup:

1. STB: Philips HD DVR model 8111
2. AVR: Denon 2310
3. TV: Samsung LE40A656

Whatever I changed on the Denon as regards video resolution the STB ignored it after shut off and turning on again. Then shut off everything and turned them all on again, the resolution on the STB remained rock steady regardless of 1080i or 720p or auto.

?????????????,

Hi jd, thanks for the clarification. I do stand corrected.

No worries. Simply trying to understand your suggestion.

I and having my first problem with the 2310. Don't know whether its the AVR fault or mine. Up till now, when I was watching cable and turned the AVR off (from the remote), the Sony TV would continue to show the cable channel and the sound would switch to the TV. All well and good, since sometimes I watch with only the TV sound on and don't want to turn on the AVR, especially late at night.

Now, if I am watching and switch off the 2310, I get a message saying the sound is switching to the TX, but then the picture and sound on my TV flash on and off. Actually, it's like a half second good picture and sound, a quarter second of snow, then a black screen. This cycle repeats every few seconds. It's the same if I just turn on the TV without the 2310 on.
What went wrong? Why isn't the 2310 properly and passing through the signal on the HDMI cable to my TV anymore? Shouldn't it automatically do this in the standby power mode?

Make sure HDMI Control is still set to ON and that the correct source is selected. Turn off the HDMI-CEC in the TV if possible. Are you sure no setting or configuration changes have occurred since this started happening?

I did turn off the HDMI-CEC in the Sony TV. Still doesn't pass through the audio and video when the 2310 is in standby, except for the intermittent flashes. Any other settings that could affect this? I hate to reset the microprocessor and go through Audessey setup, etc again. But if nothing else works, I will.