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The Official Pioneer 9G North American KRP-500M / KRP-600M Owner's Discussion Pt. II - Page 216

post #6451 of 6727
2/25/12 at 2:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Hell no!

ha ha
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Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #6452 of 6727
2/25/12 at 4:49pm
matching the black level of the 101/500m would be huge,my money says the vt-50 black level will be 3 times higher

Mark
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post #6453 of 6727
2/26/12 at 9:39pm
No....

Quote:
Originally Posted by surap View Post

What do you guys think of Panasonic VT-50? Will it "kill" Kuro 500M/Elite-101 regarding black levels..
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post #6454 of 6727
2/26/12 at 11:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by surap View Post

What do you guys think of Panasonic VT-50? Will it "kill" Kuro 500M/Elite-101 regarding black levels..

I don't think anyone is even trying to do that with plasma right now.
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post #6455 of 6727
2/28/12 at 7:28pm
Hi...

I have a KRP-500m... Love it except for one thing.... I am getting over scan with the when the display's auto size is set to wide. Is this normal?

I like using this feature to help eliminate any burn in from 4:3 content...but I always fins my self switching back to dot by dot for most 1080p content.

I should also mention... this mostly happen while using my Dune media player. The screen size even bounces around when using the menu system of the Dune.

Is there a fix or a way to adjust the auto size settings?

Thanks
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post #6456 of 6727
2/29/12 at 12:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 View Post

Hi...

I have a KRP-500m... Love it except for one thing.... I am getting over scan with the when the display's auto size is set to wide. Is this normal?

I like using this feature to help eliminate any burn in from 4:3 content...but I always fins my self switching back to dot by dot for most 1080p content.

I should also mention... this mostly happen while using my Dune media player. The screen size even bounces around when using the menu system of the Dune.

Is there a fix or a way to adjust the auto size settings?

Thanks

Going to HOME MENU>SCREEN>AUTO SIZE> then WIDE ZOOM or NATURALare your only options for adjusting the "Auto" aspect ratio. If it is bouncing around then it's doing it's job. You cant "fix" that. If it senses bars on the side relatively close to what a 4:3 would produce then it's gonna stretch it, wether its an actual 4:3 signal or your content from your 16:9.
That being said I still suggest not going to dot by dot though. The dot by dot setting even on "16:9" feeds don't quite fill the whole screen most of the time. The media is just pulled over it and it seems most of the time doesn't fit the res specs for this set. I'm no expert but I can see it. With "auto" aspect on a 16:9 feed you lose a tiny bit of the pic. I think this is what you were referring to when you said overscan. I don't want to get uneven wear on the perimeter of my set. So I set it to auto. Like i said, Auto will cut off a tiny smidgion of the content, but it ls negligible. It bothered me too. But I decided I didn't want to risk having a 1/2 inch border of uneven wear in 3-4 years and just live with it. It's really barely anything.
Also yes, wide settings will crop/zoom the content a little. The stretch already makes it look weird. I think it is an attempt to keep the picture looking as good as possible by allowing it to zoom to prevent over distortion....in this case, lateral distortion.
WIDE 1 stretches the picture gradually larger starting from very minimal in the center to significant on the edge.
WIDE 2 will stretch the picture evenly throughout the entire screen.
Hope this helps
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post #6457 of 6727
2/29/12 at 7:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by progrhythmical View Post

Going to HOME MENU>SCREEN>AUTO SIZE> then WIDE ZOOM or NATURALare your only options for adjusting the "Auto" aspect ratio. If it is bouncing around then it's doing it's job. You cant "fix" that. If it senses bars on the side relatively close to what a 4:3 would produce then it's gonna stretch it, wether its an actual 4:3 signal or your content from your 16:9.
That being said I still suggest not going to dot by dot though. The dot by dot setting even on "16:9" feeds don't quite fill the whole screen most of the time. The media is just pulled over it and it seems most of the time doesn't fit the res specs for this set. I'm no expert but I can see it. With "auto" aspect on a 16:9 feed you lose a tiny bit of the pic. I think this is what you were referring to when you said overscan. I don't want to get uneven wear on the perimeter of my set. So I set it to auto. Like i said, Auto will cut off a tiny smidgion of the content, but it ls negligible. It bothered me too. But I decided I didn't want to risk having a 1/2 inch border of uneven wear in 3-4 years and just live with it. It's really barely anything.
Also yes, wide settings will crop/zoom the content a little. The stretch already makes it look weird. I think it is an attempt to keep the picture looking as good as possible by allowing it to zoom to prevent over distortion....in this case, lateral distortion.
WIDE 1 stretches the picture gradually larger starting from very minimal in the center to significant on the edge.
WIDE 2 will stretch the picture evenly throughout the entire screen.
Hope this helps

That's funny. I advocate using dot by dot for as many inputs as possible.
Less processing is better IMO. It may not be idea for all sources but if you watch mostly HD content the exceptions will be minimal.
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post #6458 of 6727
2/29/12 at 9:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by progrhythmical View Post

... That being said I still suggest not going to dot by dot though. The dot by dot setting even on "16:9" feeds don't quite fill the whole screen most of the time. ...

Not sure why you're recommending not going dot by dot. I keep my 600M on dot by dot for all inputs and using the Spears and Munsil test/calibration disk it perfectly displays the 1080 input from all sources (assuming the sources are correctly set) with no under or over scan. If it's fed a 480 signal it displays it 4x3 with black bars on either side which I prefer so that no distortion of the image occurs. I keep the AUTO SIZE option to OFF.
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post #6459 of 6727
2/29/12 at 10:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 View Post

...I have a KRP-500m... Love it except for one thing.... I am getting over scan with the when the display's auto size is set to wide. Is this normal?...

I guess it might have been better if I'd answered this original post rather than one members response to it.

Yes it seems "normal", at least from my testing. Using my Oppo 93 and the Spears and Munsil calibration disk on my 600M if I leave the AUTO SIZE to anything but OFF I get over scan and lose a noticeable amount of pixels on each side of the screen, at least for 1080 input. That's why I leave AUTO SIZE in my 600M to OFF.

My Oppo is set to output 1080p with 1080p/24 set on AUTO. The Oppo uses HDMI to my Denon 4311 and then HDMI to my 600M. My Denon is set to pass through the signal untouched, except for the screen OSD.
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post #6460 of 6727
2/29/12 at 3:19pm
i may be mistaken, but i think you increase the chances of IR if you use dot-by-dot(disables orbiter mode). D-nice posted this in a different thread here a few days ago...
i myself cant see a difference with using dot-by-dot or using auto with orbiter on with real video content.
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post #6461 of 6727
2/29/12 at 3:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1forsnow View Post

i may be mistaken, but i think you increase the chances of IR if you use dot-by-dot(disables orbiter mode). D-nice posted this in a different thread here a few days ago...
i myself cant see a difference with using dot-by-dot or using auto with orbiter on with real video content.

I've had my 600M for almost three years now and have used dot by dot the entire time. I've never noticed any IR on my display even tho I have always used 4x3 with pillar bars when viewing 480 input. Now if you're using your display to play video games which you play for hours at a time with the same HUD or border on it you MIGHT be worried about IR. But I've seen posts from folks who do this on their 500 or 600's and report no problems.

Granted if you somehow have obtained a NEW 500 or 600 (remember this thread is only for these displays) you might be a little careful for the first 200-300 hours or so but who these days has a new one?

As to not seeing a difference with real video content that may be true for you but I'm a little obsessive about my 600M (as I'll bet many here are ) and want to see every pixel from whatever video source I happen to be viewing. As I recall I was losing over 20 pixels per side which is not acceptable to me.
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post #6462 of 6727
2/29/12 at 4:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1forsnow View Post

i may be mistaken, but i think you increase the chances of IR if you use dot-by-dot(disables orbiter mode). D-nice posted this in a different thread here a few days ago...
i myself cant see a difference with using dot-by-dot or using auto with orbiter on with real video content.

What D-Nice wrote:

D-Nice on 2/20/2012 in the "The Official Pioneer 9G Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread":

I prefer mode 1 unless the display is used exclusively for > 1.77 content at which point I recommend mode 2.

It 100% prevents IR when it comes to tickers, logos, etc. Nothing will help excessive 4:3 and/or > 1.77 content.

Unless you watch nothing but content with an aspect ratio greater than 1.77:1, D-Nice recommends Mode 1 for the orbiter which in dot by dot mode means the Orbiter is OFF.

In over 5,000 hours (Orbiter OFF / Dot by Dot mode) of mixed viewing I don't see any signs of burn-in when I display a pure white screen. During that time we've watched a lot of logos, sports, some 4x3 movies, and a lot of wide movies. We've also watched a lot of 1.77:1 movies and HDTV,

Based on D-Nice's recommendation, I'm going to change to Orbiter Mode 1 and leave my display in dot by dot mode. When I watch something risky, I'll switch Size from dot by dot to Full mode which will engage the Orbiter.
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post #6463 of 6727
2/29/12 at 10:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by icetbc View Post

i've had my 600m for almost three years now and have used dot by dot the entire time. I've never noticed any ir on my display even tho i have always used 4x3 with pillar bars when viewing 480 input. Now if you're using your display to play video games which you play for hours at a time with the same hud or border on it you might be worried about ir. But i've seen posts from folks who do this on their 500 or 600's and report no problems.

Granted if you somehow have obtained a new 500 or 600 (remember this thread is only for these displays) you might be a little careful for the first 200-300 hours or so but who these days has a new one? :d

as to not seeing a difference with real video content that may be true for you but i'm a little obsessive about my 600m (as i'll bet many here are ) and want to see every pixel from whatever video source i happen to be viewing. As i recall i was losing over 20 pixels per side which is not acceptable to me.

+1000000000000000
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post #6464 of 6727
2/29/12 at 10:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

What D-Nice wrote:

D-Nice on 2/20/2012 in the "The Official Pioneer 9G Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread":

I prefer mode 1 unless the display is used exclusively for > 1.77 content at which point I recommend mode 2.

It 100% prevents IR when it comes to tickers, logos, etc. Nothing will help excessive 4:3 and/or > 1.77 content.

Unless you watch nothing but content with an aspect ratio greater than 1.77:1, D-Nice recommends Mode 1 for the orbiter which in dot by dot mode means the Orbiter is OFF.

In over 5,000 hours (Orbiter OFF / Dot by Dot mode) of mixed viewing I don't see any signs of burn-in when I display a pure white screen. During that time we've watched a lot of logos, sports, some 4x3 movies, and a lot of wide movies. We've also watched a lot of 1.77:1 movies and HDTV,

Based on D-Nice's recommendation, I'm going to change to Orbiter Mode 1 and leave my display in dot by dot mode. When I watch something risky, I'll switch Size from dot by dot to Full mode which will engage the Orbiter.

htwaits - Hey Neighbor, UMR owes you a beer! I signed up for his May tour to get my 600M finally calibrated because of your signature. Cheers!
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post #6465 of 6727
3/1/12 at 12:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

htwaits - Hey Neighbor, UMR owes you a beer! I signed up for his May tour to get my 600M finally calibrated because of your signature. Cheers!

You're not the first!

I hope you're having him work on your audio too.

Enjoy
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post #6466 of 6727
3/1/12 at 5:17am
Using Dot for Dot is the only reference quality setting in my opinion. Anything else will not give you the best image results.

Scaling and "distorting" the image in any way is not going to provide the best image quality.

I use Dot or Dot and it is locked in to ISF Mode ... and I have never seen burn-in. I do not watch 4x3 materials but I do watch some 16x9 with teh majority of what I watch being blu-ray ... which has the bars on top and bottom.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 View Post

Hi...

I have a KRP-500m... Love it except for one thing.... I am getting over scan with the when the display's auto size is set to wide. Is this normal?

I like using this feature to help eliminate any burn in from 4:3 content...but I always fins my self switching back to dot by dot for most 1080p content.

I should also mention... this mostly happen while using my Dune media player. The screen size even bounces around when using the menu system of the Dune.

Is there a fix or a way to adjust the auto size settings?

Thanks
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post #6467 of 6727
3/1/12 at 5:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

What D-Nice wrote:

D-Nice on 2/20/2012 in the "The Official Pioneer 9G Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread":

I prefer mode 1 unless the display is used exclusively for > 1.77 content at which point I recommend mode 2.

It 100% prevents IR when it comes to tickers, logos, etc. Nothing will help excessive 4:3 and/or > 1.77 content.

Unless you watch nothing but content with an aspect ratio greater than 1.77:1, D-Nice recommends Mode 1 for the orbiter which in dot by dot mode means the Orbiter is OFF.

In over 5,000 hours (Orbiter OFF / Dot by Dot mode) of mixed viewing I don't see any signs of burn-in when I display a pure white screen. During that time we've watched a lot of logos, sports, some 4x3 movies, and a lot of wide movies. We've also watched a lot of 1.77:1 movies and HDTV,

Based on D-Nice's recommendation, I'm going to change to Orbiter Mode 1 and leave my display in dot by dot mode. When I watch something risky, I'll switch Size from dot by dot to Full mode which will engage the Orbiter.

htwaits,

I have a 500M calibrated by D-Nice, it has approx 4400 hours of use (power count 2259) over the past 2 years (= 6 hours per day ).

The viewing mix is 30% kids / teens cable programming (with logos), 10% Wii, 30% adult cable programming (with logos & banners and 30% BD & HDDVD movies (with bars).

Permanently Mode1, Dot x Dot, ISF auto for cable programming & Wii, ISF Night for movies.

Not one iota of IR nor burn in

Leave the panel on Mode1, forget about it and sleep well

Gman
(I hope I just didn't jinx myself.......)
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post #6468 of 6727
3/1/12 at 7:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

You're not the first!

I hope you're having him work on your audio too.

Enjoy

I am. He's doing a basic cal and making me break out my bfd.
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post #6469 of 6727
3/1/12 at 4:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

I am. He's doing a basic cal and making me break out my bfd.

I thought the difference that UMR made in my audio was more exciting than the video.
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post #6470 of 6727
3/1/12 at 8:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

I thought the difference that UMR made in my audio was more exciting than the video.

We were pretty impressed with what he did with the video too
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post #6471 of 6727
3/2/12 at 1:00pm
Well like I said, im not an expert lol. I just tend to lean to the cautious side. Most of the things I obsesses on end up not mattering haha. Hey, but all my things are NICE even after years and years I do watch things in dot by dot. I just get nervous when I see some DTV feeds that don't fill the very edges on dot by dot. I'm talking a 1/4 - 1/2 inch on both sides here. I suppose I can turn the orbiter to mode 2. I don't know. For some reason once I see it not fill on the edges it distracts me. So my suggestion is influenced by what I enjoy....and my anxiety haha. It's all about what creates the most enjoyable experience for the individual, right? That's where various opinions create perspective.
Also keep in mind that when you have the orbiter on in dot by dot you never see all of the pixels at the same time either.....since we are getting technical lol.
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post #6472 of 6727
3/2/12 at 1:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceTBC View Post



As to not seeing a difference with real video content that may be true for you but I'm a little obsessive about my 600M (as I'll bet many here are ) and want to see every pixel from whatever video source I happen to be viewing. As I recall I was losing over 20 pixels per side which is not acceptable to me.

Well it looks like most of us obsess about different things for our own reasons/objectives
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post #6473 of 6727
3/24/12 at 4:04pm
I have a 500 and I do see the red tint in the black but I'm also having an issue with red sparkles on white screen. I have been told it could be the white board or the voltage needs to be re-adjusted on the white board or the panel is going bad? Had the 500 for almost 3 yrs. About 10K hrs. on the panel. Any ideas??? BTW no warranty.
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post #6474 of 6727
3/24/12 at 4:19pm
I should also add that once I turn the display on it takes about 5 secs. for the black level to actually go to black....Help!
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post #6475 of 6727
3/24/12 at 4:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by visualgeek View Post

I should also add that once I turn the display on it takes about 5 secs. for the black level to actually go to black....Help!

There's nothing wrong with that.
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post #6476 of 6727
3/24/12 at 7:52pm
I don't know how some of you are using dot by dot. It leaves too much unused space either to the left or right. The picture is never even. Which i don't get why the kuro does this. I always use full. PQ is the same, you just get a litte overscan.
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post #6477 of 6727
3/24/12 at 7:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

I don't know how some of you are using dot by dot.

You're doing something wrong.
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post #6478 of 6727
3/24/12 at 8:03pm
Not doing anything wrong. Its always been that way. I think thats why D-Nice recommends full.
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post #6479 of 6727
3/24/12 at 8:57pm
I use dot-by-dot but noth of mine are hooked to DVDO Edge VP's.

I think it may be something to do with the source.

- Rich
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post #6480 of 6727
3/25/12 at 9:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

I don't know how some of you are using dot by dot. It leaves too much unused space either to the left or right. The picture is never even. Which i don't get why the kuro does this. I always use full. PQ is the same, you just get a litte overscan.

Not sure why this is happening to you but it must be peculiar to your equipment and settings. Output from my Oppo 93 player through my Denon 4311 AVR to my KRP-600 (using dot by dot) gives me a full picture with no over or under scan. I have verified this using the Spears and Munsil image cropping pattern which shows a perfect 1920x1080 image with no lost or added pixels.
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AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › The Official Pioneer 9G North American KRP-500M / KRP-600M Owner's Discussion Pt. II