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Official JTR speaker thread - Page 385

post #11521 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by countryWV View Post


The above are my 2 stipulations for watching a movie.

Holy crap... I think you just came up with the best idea EVAR!!! They should make Pacific Rim 2 with hot naked chicks piloting the robots. CHECK..CHECK!!!!
post #11522 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinH View Post

Speaking of gun fight mainly? I need to rewatch soon....it's been a while.

Yes. Also very impressive is the ambience echo after the opening shot. It does a great job echoing around the town and countryside...then all hell breaks loose. biggrin.gif Boss's "blast" is unforgettable. biggrin.gif

The bullets are a bit slow, but I've noticed that occassionally with modern weapons such as handguns when out plinking. Get over 60' or so from the target and there is definately time of flight obvious. I give OR a pass on that.

Back in my A-10 flying days, one of the things we did was long-range strafe (LRS). We would open fire at one mile out (real world strafing is only short 2 second burst of 20-30 rounds or so at 2000 rounds per minute, unlike Hollywood). Time of flight for even the mighty Gau-8 round was quite noticable. When in the range tower (which is near the strafe target) watching this event, there were two distinct sounds. In the distance you would see the hog fire (muzzle smoke), a delay of a second or so, then a LOUD crackling would be heard as the bullets arrived on target. A second later another sound arrived, a throaty BRRRR. The first sound is the sonic booms of all the bullets, and the second sound is that of the Gau-8 firing when it was a mile away. I have seen some youtube video from Afghanistan where hogs are called in for CAS, and you can hear the gun but not the sonic cracks. In that scenario, you don't want to be where you hear the cracks. wink.gif

The wine bottle is just to give you a scale reference.
Edited by Cam Man - 10/16/13 at 8:00am
post #11523 of 18353
Last Man Standing with Bruce Willis has excellent gunfights. Bruce can shoot 100 rounds out of a 15 round clip without reloading. That's why he is a BadAss.biggrin.gif
post #11524 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Yes. Also very impressive is the ambience echo after the opening shot. It does a great job echoing around the town and countryside...then all hell breaks loose. biggrin.gif Boss's "blast" is unforgettable. biggrin.gif

The bullets are a bit slow, but I've noticed that occassionally with modern weapons such as handguns when out plinking. Get over 60' or so from the target and there is definately time of flight obvious. I give OR a pass on that.

Back in my A-10 flying days, one of the things we did was long-range strafe (LRS). We would open fire at one mile out (real world strafing is only short 2 second burst of 20-30 rounds or so at 2000 rounds per minute, unlike Hollywood). Time of flight for even the mighty Gau-8 round was quite noticable. When in the range tower (which is near the strafe target) watching this event, there were two distinct sounds. In the distance you would see the hog fire (muzzle smoke), a delay of a second or so, then a LOUD crackling would be heard as the bullets arrived on target. A second later another sound arrived, a throaty BRRRR. The first sound is the sonic booms of all the bullets, and the second sound is that of the Gau-8 firing when it was a mile away. I have seen some youtube video from Afghanistan where hogs are called in for CAS, and you can hear the gun but not the sonic cracks. In that scenario, you don't want to be where you hear the cracks. wink.gif

The wine bottle is just to give you a scale reference.

A10 is my absolute fav! Tough as nails....hard to bring down.......and who wouldn't love to fire 30mm milk bottle sized rounds out of the nose at ridiculous RPMs lol cool.gif

Can you feel the recoil effects sitting in the cockpit when you let that gun loose?
Edited by KevinH - 10/16/13 at 8:22am
post #11525 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by countryWV View Post


The above are my 2 stipulations for watching a movie. Actually its Either Or.

Ah, putting words into my mouth now? Nice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Yes. Also very impressive is the ambience echo after the opening shot. It does a great job echoing around the town and countryside...then all hell breaks loose. biggrin.gif Boss's "blast" is unforgettable. biggrin.gif

The bullets are a bit slow, but I've noticed that occassionally with modern weapons such as handguns when out plinking. Get over 60' or so from the target and there is definately time of flight obvious. I give OR a pass on that.

Back in my A-10 flying days, one of the things we did was long-range strafe (LRS). We would open fire at one mile out (real world strafing is only short 2 second burst of 20-30 rounds or so at 2000 rounds per minute, unlike Hollywood). Time of flight for even the mighty Gau-8 round was quite noticable. When in the range tower (which is near the strafe target) watching this event, there were two distinct sounds. In the distance you would see the hog fire (muzzle smoke), a delay of a second or so, then a LOUD crackling would be heard as the bullets arrived on target. A second later another sound arrived, a throaty BRRRR. The first sound is the sonic booms of all the bullets, and the second sound is that of the Gau-8 firing when it was a mile away. I have seen some youtube video from Afghanistan where hogs are called in for CAS, and you can hear the gun but not the sonic cracks. In that scenario, you don't want to be where you hear the cracks. wink.gif

The wine bottle is just to give you a scale reference.

Has the gau-8 improved on the original "hog" where the longer "movie style" firing would stall the plain due to the sheer force of that many rounds escaping the turret? It was my understanding that 2 second bursts are still basically required to maintain speed and obviously consistency in the flight line. Very cool regardless. I have always liked the thunderbolt.
post #11526 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

I am not interested in slo mo like the matrix. I m only interested in very loud bangs that shoots right thru your bones like a real gun.

It isn't slow motion like matrix (or Wanted, BTW I like that movie). It is a Winchester 73 fired from 30 paces and the bullet hitting the watering trough a second + later. Really kind of funny when you watch it. smile.gif

The rifle/pistol shots sound great and the echo's are perfect. The DB shotgun blast is a classic at reference or above ... cool.gif
That scene is where Mark Seaton let his Catalyst 12's and quad Submersives off the chain (at least +5 ref) at a demo I attended. I almost wrote him a check on the spot ... biggrin.gif
post #11527 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Dang, I was wanting to avoid the purchase of PR, but sounds to me like you guys are liking the quality of the movie enough that it could be worth it. I usually can care less of the story-line if the presentation is 5 star worthy.

Without a doubt PR is worth picking up just to show of your system. I bought it yesterday afternoon and watching with my wife and kids lastnight, my 5 years son couldn't stop laughing because the subs were shacking the house.

I have all of my speakers calibrated to 83dB at my main LP and both the subs are the same, honestly we couldn't watch the movie with my master volume past -15. Maybe if I was by myself I could watch at -10, but probably not for the whole movie.
post #11528 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Ah, putting words into my mouth now? Nice
Has the gau-8 improved on the original "hog" where the longer "movie style" firing would stall the plain due to the sheer force of that many rounds escaping the turret? It was my understanding that 2 second bursts are still basically required to maintain speed and obviously consistency in the flight line. Very cool regardless. I have always liked the thunderbolt.

biggrin.gif No, that's all urban legend...despite the hog being rather slow by modern standards. The short bursts are because that's about the limit of what can be held accurately on a target and long bursts wear the gun barrels out too fast. Unlike Hollywood, bulltets should never be "wallked" to the target. Walking only puts a round or two on the actual target. The rest are wasted. A couple of rounds won't result in a kill on armor; it takes a few. So, the skiils that have to be learned are to get a steady aim on the target, slowing the aiming cross so that when on the target and the trigger pulled, very slight forward pressure on the stick holds the rounds on target for the two seconds. A good strafe pass results not in bullets walking through a target, but all hell breaking loose on and right around the target for two seconds.

Of course the skill I didn't mention was the flying skill necessary to get to that open fire point with only three seconds on final (straight and level). Three seconds is all that we can expect to give the bad guys with 7.62 (or whatever) to figure out the solution to hitting us. So, CAS fighters in a low-threat environment (small arms only) will generally work as a mutual support 2-ship from a one-mile diameter "wheel" pattern at about 6000' (above small arms range), or possibly lower. The two aircraft remain across the wheel from each other, each visually covering each other's six for SAM (SA-7) launches. There they wil be talking to the groung FAC (forward air controller) with the troops that need the support to get the pilots' eyes on target and friendly location. Once the details are worked out, they take turns rolling in and engaging the target.

The roll-in is a decending turn that culminates with the three seconds max in level flight to aim and open fire on target. An aggressive pull up (4 Gs in 2 seconds) and turn is initiated at ceasefire to evade small arms fire...and climb back up into the wheel. During that time, the wingman is covering the attacking partner from the safety (a relative term) of the wheel altitude. They basically then take turns until they have neutralized the target, run out of ammo, or reach bingo fuel. Sorry, a little off topic. redface.gif
post #11529 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

It isn't slow motion like matrix (or Wanted, BTW I like that movie). It is a Winchester 73 fired from 30 paces and the bullet hitting the watering trough a second + later. Really kind of funny when you watch it. smile.gif

The rifle/pistol shots sound great and the echo's are perfect. The DB shotgun blast is a classic at reference or above ... cool.gif
That scene is where Mark Seaton let his Catalyst 12's and quad Submersives off the chain (at least +5 ref) at a demo I attended. I almost wrote him a check on the spot ... biggrin.gif

Great!!! That's what I like to hear.. 'above reference'... haha
post #11530 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Why don't you check it out for yourself. A little pricy but it is a collectable.
http://www.amazon.com/Open-Range-Blu-Ray-Kevin-Costner/dp/B002JE52NU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1381932425&sr=8-1&keywords=open+range+bluray

The gunshots sound great but they are the slowest bullets ever captured on film. Watch it to see what I mean ... wink.gif

The Blu-Ray or DVD version? Or, do they both have the same sound effect?
post #11531 of 18353
Cam Man, yea we got off topic, but it is still great info thanks!!!

On another note, with all this talk about Open Range, I looked it up. I feel stupid. This whole time I have been thinking it was a Disney animated film. Free range or something silly like that.
post #11532 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinH View Post

A10 is my absolute fav! Tough as nails....hard to bring down.......and who wouldn't love to fire 30mm milk bottle sized rounds out of the nose at ridiculous RPMs lol cool.gif

Can you feel the recoil effects sitting in the cockpit when you let that gun loose?

Kind of. It's quite loud in the cockpit and you can't miss the vibration...which is part dishcarge and part gun mechanism. The gun gas blows back over the nose a bit and you can certainly smell it.

Shifting subjects....

After my Atmos field trip to those great Harkins theaters, I had to put Oblivion chapter 2 on for five minutes for a "reassurance listen." It was fabulous! Ahhhh I don't know why I fret after such events rolleyes.gif.

Speaking of Oblivion, how is it on your JTR systems?
post #11533 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

The Blu-Ray or DVD version? Or, do they both have the same sound effect?
i have both and the Audio is essentially the same. The Bluray looks a little better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Cam Man, yea we got off topic, but it is still great info thanks!!!

On another note, with all this talk about Open Range, I looked it up. I feel stupid. This whole time I have been thinking it was a Disney animated film. Free range or something silly like that.

Umm, that would be chickens ... tongue.gif

You don't have the Scuba Steve Blu-ray Demo Disk eek.gif Beast, I'm dissapointed in you man. wink.gif
post #11534 of 18353
No, I do have it. I have always just scooted right past that scene there too smile.gif I only pop that disc in for a couple scenes in the LFE section usually on my demos as I sprinkle in some music tracks, AoF, and stuff not on the disc to show 3d capability. TBQH I have not run through the entire disc ever I don't think.
post #11535 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Kind of. It's quite loud in the cockpit and you can't miss the vibration...which is part dishcarge and part gun mechanism. The gun gas blows back over the nose a bit and you can certainly smell it.

Shifting subjects....

After my Atmos field trip to those great Harkins theaters, I had to put Oblivion chapter 2 on for five minutes for a "reassurance listen." It was fabulous! Ahhhh I don't know why I fret after such events rolleyes.gif.

Speaking of Oblivion, how is it on your JTR systems?

One of the best audio/video experiences ever. 5 star soundtrack and incredible images. cool.gifcool.gif
post #11536 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

No, I do have it. I have always just scooted right past that scene there too smile.gif I only pop that disc in for a couple scenes in the LFE section usually on my demos as I sprinkle in some music tracks, AoF, and stuff not on the disc to show 3d capability. TBQH I have not run through the entire disc ever I don't think.

That's understandable, after about 15 minutes of full-on audio assault I weaken. Good selectionss and fun in snippets. Free Range (chicken tongue.gif) is a classic.

The Rango demo is fun too.
post #11537 of 18353
Anyone watched The Croods. I thought the 'bass' was pretty good in most scenes too. The 'thuds' etc, just so great to watch a movie with great sound effects...
post #11538 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

Anyone watched The Croods. I thought the 'bass' was pretty good in most scenes too. The 'thuds' etc, just so great to watch a movie with great sound effects...

Saw it with the kids but I streamed it (no blu ray) so I am sure I wasn't getting the optimum AV experience.. I thought the bass was pretty decent and the story was actually good for an animated film.
post #11539 of 18353
OK, so I am not completely crazy. Here was my hangup:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_on_the_Range_(2004_film)
post #11540 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

OK, so I am not completely crazy. Here was my hangup:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_on_the_Range_(2004_film)

Oh, the gunshots in that one aren't nearly as good ... tongue.gif
post #11541 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post

Saw it with the kids but I streamed it (no blu ray) so I am sure I wasn't getting the optimum AV experience.. I thought the bass was pretty decent and the story was actually good for an animated film.

Yeah, I never liked streaming... I watched the Bluray and it was awesome. I thought it was one of the few animated movies that comes out like a factory today that was pretty good fun... I especially noticed the sound effects with my Noesis.

BTW: I recently watched the Evil Dead (redo), and it sort of scared me... mainly because of the 'sound effects'... i never liked horror before and now I might have to check out more since I have the Noesis...
post #11542 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Oh, the gunshots in that one aren't nearly as good ... tongue.gif

RMK, have you watched the Gun Shots Battle on Book of Eli, when he was walking away with the bible and the bad guys started shooting at him?? That is my favorite demo scene and it never fails to impress anyone...
post #11543 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

RMK, have you watched the Gun Shots Battle on Book of Eli, when he was walking away with the bible and the bad guys started shooting at him?? That is my favorite demo scene and it never fails to impress anyone...

Yes, I have the film and I believe that is the demo scene on the Scuba Steve Demo Bluray.

There are lots of good gunshot scenes. One of the best that no one talks about was in that Costner movie Mr. Brooks. Only rented it but remember the gunshots as very realistic.
post #11544 of 18353
Anyone else still demo the intro to Toy Story 2? Fun for the kids and the adults. Kind of an oldy now that I think about it.
post #11545 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Sorry, a little off topic. redface.gif

I enjoyed your experiences. I flew Marine A6 Intruders in Nam. No guns but lots of bombs. I don't think I'd have wanted to be close enough to hear them though.... wink.gif
post #11546 of 18353
"Nice - thanks again John for another great post."

no problem. I made one correction (speakers in a field have no reflections off walls of course) and the spell check seems to has changed 'haas' effect into 'has' effect.

"So, I'm guessing that acoustic panels on reflection points on the wall and ceiling can help with reflections but not completely eliminate them?"

acoustic panels and dealing with all those "first reflections" is a much bigger problem when working with an omnidirectional radiator than a controlled directivity speaker. most of the cues with respect to imaging are in the 1khz region and up. again, not sure why, it just is. those frequencies are largely controlled by the horn, so acoustic panels don't help much with them. you'll notice that both linkwitz and cowan employ controlled directivity speakers but otherwise have no room treatments. they aren't really necessary.

...

cookgeek, here is a stylized picture of a jtr speaker in horizontal mode. a listener off axis will have a different distance to each woofer. when that distance is 1/2 of a wavelength, the frequency will be completely cancelled out. the closer the woofers can be put together and the lower the crossover point where only the center unit is emitting sound, the less problematic it will be. for the noesis, the cancellation point would be quite far off axis, so unless you were sitting way off to the side and close to the screen, it should be ok, more or less, to run them sideways. the d'appolito arrangement was actually specifically designed for this purpose by the way as a way of putting the off axis cancellation point right on the walls in order minimize reflected energy. turned vertically, it helps minimize ceiling/floor bounce.


Edited by LTD02 - 10/16/13 at 3:43pm
post #11547 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by K1LL3M View Post

Thank you!! That explains why I have been lurking this thread for so long despite not being a JTR owner.

I am though about to become a fully fledged Seaton member (waiting on their arrival) that appears to maintain very similar commonsense; albeit with a power twist wink.gif

The Seaton club(thread) is a lot quieter than this one too

Think its the same reason I like to lurk on here too. Im a SHO-10 owner but wish to own JTR speakers and subs in the future once I have the $$$. ( I have Caps and Neosis 212HTs in my dreams). Real great group of fellas around here and I love the conversations.
post #11548 of 18353
Battle of L.A. is one you guys should try out. On my system at reference, it's beyond insane. One part that always makes me smile is when they are on the city bus and just before he goes to blow up the gas station, he fights one of the alien drones..... good lord it is amazing!!!

Also, good to know open range IS out on blu-ray, even if it is a import.
post #11549 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

Anyone watched The Croods. I thought the 'bass' was pretty good in most scenes too. The 'thuds' etc, just so great to watch a movie with great sound effects...

I agree. I seen it in the theaters and then had to buy it once it was out. Great movie and a great soundtrack too.
post #11550 of 18353
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianick View Post

Anyone else still demo the intro to Toy Story 2? Fun for the kids and the adults. Kind of an oldy now that I think about it.

I do it all the time!! Its a blast and absolutley ground rattling bass to boot. I love Pixar.
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