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Official JTR speaker thread - Page 175

post #5221 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdome View Post

Omaha GTG this Saturday
I will be hosting a demo of the ported JTR Noesis 212HT speakers at my house on Saturday, November 4, from 10 am to noon. I will have them setup and EQ'd with my Badwater Bass'n infinite baffle sub system. Please let me know by PM if you plan to attend so I can give you my address.

That is very cool DD. I hope everyone has a good time and there are no cases of tinitus. If you have it, the Knowing plane crash scene is a good demo for speakers and subs. The big explosion after the crash has amazing dynamics and the Noesis do it justice. cool.gif

BTW, anyone out here in sunny California (sorry to rub it in tongue.gif) who wants to hear the Noesis should PM me and we can set something up.
post #5222 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

In case you missed it, I added the attenuators and Audyssey back in last night and the results were much better this time. As the graphs show, there really isn't a great deal of difference with Audyssey on or off but I am liking the movie surround sound and low frequencies a little better with Audyssey in play. It give me a few more db at the low end and yet the bass is very controlled. Here are the graphs:
Audyssey off, no attenuation, all speakers level matched @85db (-10mv is reference)

Audyssey 8 position calibration with 15db attenuators on the LCR's. All speakers level matched at 75db with 0mv as reference.

Thanks RMK.

I guess the minimal difference in the FR between Audyssey on and off, is due to the treatment in your room, and the directivity/narrower coverage pattern of the Noesis?
post #5223 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by superaaaaa View Post

Thanks RMK.
I guess the minimal difference in the FR between Audyssey on and off, is due to the treatment in your room, and the directivity/narrower coverage pattern of the Noesis?

Great inference. RMK, do you know if the T12's were that close w/ and w/o audyssey in the same set up?
post #5224 of 18522
The narrower pattern on the Noesis horn should, all things considered and assuming near exact placement minus the toe-in should yield similar response to the coaxial T12 assuming the room treatments are in the same place. It actually should improve on overall response due to their narrower pattern actually (less reflections further out)
post #5225 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by lbrown105 View Post

Great inference. RMK, do you know if the T12's were that close w/ and w/o audyssey in the same set up?

I didn't do non-Audyssey graphs with the T12's. The FR was not as flat with the T12's.
post #5226 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by superaaaaa View Post

Thanks RMK.
I guess the minimal difference in the FR between Audyssey on and off, is due to the treatment in your room, and the directivity/narrower coverage pattern of the Noesis?

Your guess is as good as mine wink.gif. That or maybe there was a 1/2" deviation in the microphone position. That is why I take most peoples "measurements" with a grain of salt. The possibilities for variation are almost infinite.

The Noesis measure flat in free space. How that translates to a room is (as is true with most any speaker) room dependent. My XTZ graphs are reassuring that what I hear is a nice flat frequency response in my room.

Use your ears my friend. They are the best sound measuring instrument you have ... smile.gif
Edited by RMK! - 10/31/12 at 7:22am
post #5227 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Use your ears my friend. The are the best sound measuring instrument you have ... smile.gif

100% agree - at the end, all that matters is how it sounds to the indvidual.

Although, graphs and data are nice just to help understand what's happening in the room.

I've personally never liked equalisation software, although admittedly, I’ve only every used MCACC.

On my last speakers (Klipsch RF82), I found it deadend them too much, and the sound lost most of its excitement. Maybe I wasn’t using it correctly – I understand MCACC requires several steps to implement correctly.

I may give Audyssey a try one day, and see if it’s more to my liking......
post #5228 of 18522
I earlier posted that the demo of the Neosis would be on Saturday, November 4. The 4th is on a Sunday and I have changed it to read Saturday, November 3 from 10 am to noon.
post #5229 of 18522
what does Audyssey do if your spk are very sensitive like triple 12s are? Ive noticed several of you are placing attenuaters if your amps dont have gain controls.When setting the levels of my 12s I have to set it to the lowest setting -12 and its still goes over 75db with test tone,so I just set the rest of my spks a little higher .Everyone that have heard my 12s love them, not as much as me! thanks
post #5230 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by dholmes54 View Post

what does Audyssey do if your spk are very sensitive like triple 12s are? Ive noticed several of you are placing attenuaters if your amps dont have gain controls.When setting the levels of my 12s I have to set it to the lowest setting -12 and its still goes over 75db with test tone,so I just set the rest of my spks a little higher .Everyone that have heard my 12s love them, not as much as me! thanks
If it sounds great to you then dont change a thing. The only negative I noticed was a little harshness on the top end.
The attenuaters may not even make a difference to what you hear at all but since they are inexpensive you may want to give them a try.
It will bring those -12 settings down to where Audyssey can apply its magic.
What amp are you using?
Chris
post #5231 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

RMK,
I am not totally sure I understood the discussion about attenuators... as I see it, the JTRs are so sensitive that audyssey has to set the trim way way too much and that somehow interferes with it's workings so a trim of signal strength is needed. So, I am assuming that that is with external amps... what if you just used the receiver to power your speakers... do you still need attenuators? If so, what sort do you suggest I use?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dholmes54 View Post

what does Audyssey do if your spk are very sensitive like triple 12s are? Ive noticed several of you are placing attenuaters if your amps dont have gain controls.When setting the levels of my 12s I have to set it to the lowest setting -12 and its still goes over 75db with test tone,so I just set the rest of my spks a little higher .Everyone that have heard my 12s love them, not as much as me! thanks

If you read say the last 5 pages or so of this thread you will see the benefits of applying attenuators in your signal chain.
post #5232 of 18522
thanks ill do a little reading,my amp is ATI 3007 300 watts x7 & a 2 channel Behringer pro amp for height spks.Do they make for xlr connection? never mind I found them at Partsexpress wonder how many db to attenuate?
Edited by dholmes54 - 10/31/12 at 4:14pm
post #5233 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by dholmes54 View Post

thanks ill do a little reading,my amp is ATI 3007 300 watts x7 & a 2 channel Behringer pro amp for height spks.Do they make for xlr connection? never mind I found them at Partsexpress wonder how many db to attenuate?

The 10db will do the job. smile.gif
post #5234 of 18522
Did you guys get the Harrison Labs 12db attenuator?
post #5235 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Did you guys get the Harrison Labs 12db attenuator?

That's an RCA attenuator. I needed XLR and got the Hosa 15db. The 10db would have been fine.
post #5236 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Did you guys get the Harrison Labs 12db attenuator?

Yes.

post #5237 of 18522
Thanks!
post #5238 of 18522
You know you made a good purchase decision when every time you use the product you find new things to like. The Noesis just keep getting better as I slowly work my way through familiar music and movie soundtracks. These speakers are the most balanced and detailed I have heard in my room. Regardless if it's listening to HD audio recordings from AIX, old R&R CD's or action/dialog based movies they deliver sound quality that is as good as any loudspeaker I have heard.

It's to bad that these can't be put into a more aesthetic package because it really is a hybrid speaker capable of audiophile SQ and pro-audio SPL. Prior to the Noesis, the Seaton Catalysts12's were the only speaker I had heard that did both things so well. I'm sure there are other speakers in this performance category but at the price of the Noesis, I can't imagine you could do better. smile.gifcool.gif
post #5239 of 18522
I added Front Wides to my setup last night and it did make a difference. I had a set of older T8's and all my surrounds are T8's. A nutty thing is that MCACC in the initial setup says that all the T8's are "out of phase" when I know they are not. I always ignore it and continue on with the speaker setup.
post #5240 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsoko2 View Post

I added Front Wides to my setup last night and it did make a difference. I had a set of older T8's and all my surrounds are T8's. A nutty thing is that MCACC in the initial setup says that all the T8's are "out of phase" when I know they are not. I always ignore it and continue on with the speaker setup.
Sometimes it does that when the speaker wires are touching each other or just the opposite binding post.
Sometimes it does it when everything is hooked up correctly. Ignore it and continue works too.
Chris
post #5241 of 18522
Hey guys, quick question. I am hoping to get a pair of slanted single 8's for front heights. My understanding is that they should be directed at the "sweet spot". It seems to me that with the slanted 8's, you wouldn't have to tilt the speakers like you would with normal speakers, but that you could rotate them about 30 degrees and have them focused on the sweet spot. Does that sound right? Thanks.
post #5242 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Hey guys, quick question. I am hoping to get a pair of slanted single 8's for front heights. My understanding is that they should be directed at the "sweet spot". It seems to me that with the slanted 8's, you wouldn't have to tilt the speakers like you would with normal speakers, but that you could rotate them about 30 degrees and have them focused on the sweet spot. Does that sound right? Thanks.
You are right. That is why they are the perferct speaker design for both rear surrounds and front height.
Some mount them on the wall and some use ceiling mounts. That 30 degree angle makes it easy to aim.
Chris
post #5243 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Hey guys, quick question. I am hoping to get a pair of slanted single 8's for front heights. My understanding is that they should be directed at the "sweet spot". It seems to me that with the slanted 8's, you wouldn't have to tilt the speakers like you would with normal speakers, but that you could rotate them about 30 degrees and have them focused on the sweet spot. Does that sound right? Thanks.

It depends upon the distance to the LP and mounting height. In my case the distance (approx 11') and the front bevel angle of the S8 is perfect to hit slightly above ear height of the front row. My heights are ceiling mounted (9' ceilings) attached by a swivel bracket. The bottom of the speaker is right at 8' off of the floor.
post #5244 of 18522
Thanks, guys. RMK!, I hadn't thought about ceiling mounting the slanted 8's, but that's a great idea. Just out of curiosity, how long was the wait time for you guys from order to shipment for the single 8's? thanks again.

BTW, RMK!, I was just going over your HT room thread for about the 100th time. I hate it because I'm always jealous when I look at those pictures. Great setup!
Edited by hogues - 11/1/12 at 9:52am
post #5245 of 18522
Sounds like things improved for you RMK - Thats awesome....
Sounds like the new BMS compression drivers are getting the nod for cleaner less abrasiveness in the upper regions from your descriptions...


Do we have pics of the grills at all.... product page states magnetic grills... cloth ?!?!?

I'm contemplating moving to some more dynamic speakers for my great room..... replacing the Paradigm Sig S8's...
Its hard for me to switch to something less aesthetic but.... I guess we'll see...

I was really trying to wait it out for Seaton to come up with his narrow / floor standing Cat's but it just doesn't seem to be on the top of his list.....

This is important to me, along with the need for higher SPL's

I will have to make the 45 min drive out to check out Jeff's place and see his Noesis stuff... He was just by my house a couple weeks ago to check out my rig and my Subs...
Nice to meet him finally....


Oh I missed the info on the early buyers sale.... Link or info..!?!?!?
post #5246 of 18522
45 minute drive? Good god man what are you waiting for? Borrow a pair and try them out.

I dumped a full Signature system for the JTR 's and haven't regretted it. Everybody's needs and expectations are different though so only you can decide what's best for your setup.You got nothing to lose and actually stand to make bit of coin on the sale of the 'digms with their ever increaceing list prices.
post #5247 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

Sounds like things improved for you RMK - Thats awesome....
Sounds like the new BMS compression drivers are getting the nod for cleaner less abrasiveness in the upper regions from your descriptions...
Do we have pics of the grills at all.... product page states magnetic grills... cloth ?!?!?
I'm contemplating moving to some more dynamic speakers for my great room..... replacing the Paradigm Sig S8's...
Its hard for me to switch to something less aesthetic but.... I guess we'll see...
I was really trying to wait it out for Seaton to come up with his narrow / floor standing Cat's but it just doesn't seem to be on the top of his list.....
This is important to me, along with the need for higher SPL's
I will have to make the 45 min drive out to check out Jeff's place and see his Noesis stuff... He was just by my house a couple weeks ago to check out my rig and my Subs...
Nice to meet him finally....
Oh I missed the info on the early buyers sale.... Link or info..!?!?!?
I would love to hear what you think about The Noesis. While it is a completely different design and concept than the Salk M7, I
would like to see what you think about the clarity of this new JTR offering. They would compliment those Dual opposed LMS5400 very well.
The grill looks exactly the same as the Subm HP and I am sure you can get any finish you like.
Glad to see you have an interest in this speaker since you have that big open room to fill with sound.
Looking forward to your opinions and thoughs.
Chris
post #5248 of 18522
Quote:
Originally Posted by countryWV View Post

I would love to hear what you think about The Noesis. While it is a completely different design and concept than the Salk M7, I
would like to see what you think about the clarity of this new JTR offering. They would compliment those Dual opposed LMS5400 very well.
The grill looks exactly the same as the Subm HP and I am sure you can get any finish you like.
Glad to see you have an interest in this speaker since you have that big open room to fill with sound.
Looking forward to your opinions and thoughs.
Chris

Thanks Chris.....

never saw anyone post about your visit....

I'm not expecting nor needing them to be as delicate as the M7's but I can appreciate RMK's unique viewpoint for comparisons...

As you know my room is setup to be really clean with aesthetics in mind, so I'm going to have to figure this out... it sure would be nice if these were a tower design....
Otherwise I'd have to build something to put them on.... I'm hoping for a nice veneer, but I haven't seen anything mentioned about that, much less could I find the initial release post.

Still wondering about the intro price..?!?!?
post #5249 of 18522
Go to JTRspeakers website and click on the forum below the facebook link. There is some info on pricing and some pictures of past custom veneers.
He also offers matching stands custom to your prefered height. I have 18" stands for my T12's and they make them look like one piece towers.
I got to a point where I cant stand piano black anymore so that flat black textured finish is a refreshing change for me. The Noesis's box
is the same overall size as the T12's but with a square middle for the horn. I am sure Jeff will cut you a great deal as your posts and reviews on
here carry some weight. As of this moment you still have the best subwoofers I have ever seen. IMO The Noesis 212 is a perfect match for them.
Chris
When I say "have seen" I am referring to your pictures and I bought my D-sonic amp based upon your past reviews.
Edited by countryWV - 11/1/12 at 12:03pm
post #5250 of 18522
Ahhhh Thank you Chris...

Still trying to put the screen names with the people that showed up with Jeff that Sunday night... I know it was Jeff & dlbeck, but was unclear on who the third guy was..

I was at the forum, didn't see the finishes thread before.... found it..
Do you have a pic of your stands by chance../?!?! LINKY??

Glad the D-Sonic is working out for you, I still have mine up and running as well as the Wyred4Sound, which would ultimately power up the Noesis if I went with them.
And the Dual Opposed LMS's are still doing their thing in my great room....

I got an email out to Jeff..... I'm sure I'll get more answers soon, as well as an audition.
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