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Official JTR speaker thread - Page 326

post #9751 of 18368
Hey boys! Just got a new rental for a smoking deal! I'll be out 750 a month for rent & utilities! It's a guest house out here in Oregon on a 120 acre horse ranch. Only 6 miles out of the edge of town! (Big time saving for a house down payment. I know, I am younger than most on here smile.gif) Anyway this will be the new living area where I will set up shop. The wall to the left will be the TV and where the Noesis will find a home. I'm thinking the far upper corner for the CapS2. Or I may push for 2 CapS1's for starters and add more later. In thinking about the TV, all the gear, and the 212 Noesis center...I think I am going to build my own custom stand catered around the 212 center channel sitting horizontal. I like my TV up a bit anyway so I may be able to get the center up off the ground quite a bit. I apologize if you find this post bland or dis-interesting, to me it's exciting! Plus with that super low cost it means I can slip more funds (rationally) to the JTR setup!



post #9752 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by ufokillerz View Post

any chance you saw my horn on top 212hts in rosenut/walnut veneer? i'm dying to see how they look like hah, and Jeff probably did not get a chance to take pics.

Beautiful speakers! The custom finishes really look good.
post #9753 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

I have no idea, I just really like the look. smile.gif

Doesn't Jeff have to redo the crossover, etc. if he makes these changes? I would think that it takes a lot of time to get the sound right with the existing setup and moving drivers around would be a step down requiring a ton of rework. Or am I over thinking this?
post #9754 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Horn on top? That should be very nice. I really liked the original Noesis 3TX open baffel design but I think I am the only person that like them. Jeff ssid the pro audio guys didn't like them because of the exposed CD/horn and the damage potential. Not really an issue for home use.

ordered them that way mainly because of living room space and height limitations with my television and all! I was hoping someone has seen them, because i haven't and there are no pictures of them anywhere, hah. Guess i will see them when they arrive tuesday.
post #9755 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by ufokillerz View Post

ordered them that way mainly because of living room space and height limitations with my television and all! I was hoping someone has seen them, because i haven't and there are no pictures of them anywhere, hah. Guess i will see them when they arrive tuesday.

UFO, the only horn on top speakers I saw were the pro 3TX (actualy just cabinents with the std black dura coat stuff). I did see one extra cabinent (Jeff said it was a left over 2010 dont remember which model) with the rosewood and it looked very nice.
post #9756 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

Hey boys! Just got a new rental for a smoking deal! I'll be out 750 a month for rent & utilities! It's a guest house out here in Oregon on a 120 acre horse ranch. Only 6 miles out of the edge of town! (Big time saving for a house down payment. I know, I am younger than most on here smile.gif) Anyway this will be the new living area where I will set up shop. The wall to the left will be the TV and where the Noesis will find a home. I'm thinking the far upper corner for the CapS2. Or I may push for 2 CapS1's for starters and add more later. In thinking about the TV, all the gear, and the 212 Noesis center...I think I am going to build my own custom stand catered around the 212 center channel sitting horizontal. I like my TV up a bit anyway so I may be able to get the center up off the ground quite a bit. I apologize if you find this post bland or dis-interesting, to me it's exciting! Plus with that super low cost it means I can slip more funds (rationally) to the JTR setup!



Not boring at all this is awesome! Send more picture as you start to fill it with speakers too. Hopefull you have good renters insurance for when you inflict subwoofer damage on the structure.biggrin.gif
post #9757 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

Hey boys! Just got a new rental for a smoking deal! I'll be out 750 a month for rent & utilities! It's a guest house out here in Oregon on a 120 acre horse ranch. Only 6 miles out of the edge of town! (Big time saving for a house down payment. I know, I am younger than most on here smile.gif) Anyway this will be the new living area where I will set up shop. The wall to the left will be the TV and where the Noesis will find a home. I'm thinking the far upper corner for the CapS2. Or I may push for 2 CapS1's for starters and add more later. In thinking about the TV, all the gear, and the 212 Noesis center...I think I am going to build my own custom stand catered around the 212 center channel sitting horizontal. I like my TV up a bit anyway so I may be able to get the center up off the ground quite a bit. I apologize if you find this post bland or dis-interesting, to me it's exciting! Plus with that super low cost it means I can slip more funds (rationally) to the JTR setup!










Hey 84,
The room looks large, what are the dimensions? You will need some room treatments,that's easy to accomplish , your setup sounds nice. Congrats!




PeterV
post #9758 of 18368
Really got the bug haven't you?
post #9759 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsoko2 View Post

Really got the bug haven't you?

Yes Bill, need to stay focused! Perhaps another movie night at your place? Will need to bring Katie, my fiancé, so she can understand the awesomeness!
post #9760 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by dragonleepenn View Post

Hey 84,
The room looks large, what are the dimensions? You will need some room treatments,that's easy to accomplish , your setup sounds nice. Congrats!




PeterV

It will be nice. I am thinking some 244 panels on the wall next to where the right front will be. I will have to check and see if I can put some on the ceiling.
post #9761 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by lbrown105 View Post

Not boring at all this is awesome! Send more picture as you start to fill it with speakers too. Hopefull you have good renters insurance for when you inflict subwoofer damage on the structure.biggrin.gif

Yes 50k renters! smile.gif
post #9762 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by lbrown105 View Post

UFO, the only horn on top speakers I saw were the pro 3TX (actualy just cabinents with the std black dura coat stuff). I did see one extra cabinent (Jeff said it was a left over 2010 dont remember which model) with the rosewood and it looked very nice.

I was seriously considering a wood finish for my 212HT's but have decided to stick with black. Besides, i don't want to add any delays. Now I have to get rid of 5 awesome AE Speakers drivers that I was going to use for my DIY build. I was actually looking forward to that build, but time and SQ doubts led me to just get a few Noesis'.

So anyone that is looking for some 10' and 15" TD AE drivers with the Apollo option on the VC, shoot me a PM
post #9763 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Many here would maintain that the Denon alone would be adequate for the Noesis.

I use separates and my amp (W4S) has no gain control and i have the Noesis at -12db on my processor. I put some 15 db attenuators on the LCR XLR's and got down to +3 db on the processor but did not hear a difference so I removed the attenuators so that I had less connectors in the signal chain.

RMK, would you mind sharing where and which attenuators you bought. I have a Sunfire 7401 that does not have any gain adjustment. I suspect I will have an issue with gain in my room with the Noesis and want to order some attenuators to have on hand for the calibration.

Edit: Found these and ordered http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=266-244
Edited by Gooddoc - 9/7/13 at 8:50pm
post #9764 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooddoc View Post

RMK, would you mind sharing where and which attenuators you bought. I have a Sunfire 7401 that does not have any gain adjustment. I suspect I will have an issue with gain in my room with the Noesis and want to order some attenuators to have on hand for the calibration.

Edit: Found these and ordered http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=266-244

I used these XLR Attenuators.
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=240-414&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=pla
Since you're using the RCA connects on your Sunfire you may not need attenuation but those look fine if you need them.
post #9765 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

Hey boys! Just got a new rental for a smoking deal! I'll be out 750 a month for rent & utilities! It's a guest house out here in Oregon on a 120 acre horse ranch. Only 6 miles out of the edge of town! (Big time saving for a house down payment. I know, I am younger than most on here smile.gif) Anyway this will be the new living area where I will set up shop. The wall to the left will be the TV and where the Noesis will find a home. I'm thinking the far upper corner for the CapS2. Or I may push for 2 CapS1's for starters and add more later. In thinking about the TV, all the gear, and the 212 Noesis center...I think I am going to build my own custom stand catered around the 212 center channel sitting horizontal. I like my TV up a bit anyway so I may be able to get the center up off the ground quite a bit. I apologize if you find this post bland or dis-interesting, to me it's exciting! Plus with that super low cost it means I can slip more funds (rationally) to the JTR setup!



Arg that's less than half what rent cost me for a small 2 bdrm apartment. I need to move where you guys live!
post #9766 of 18368
Hey so, pro 3tx vs 212? Are they the same, just different driver orientation?
post #9767 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

Yes Bill, need to stay focused! Perhaps another movie night at your place? Will need to bring Katie, my fiancé, so she can understand the awesomeness!

Just let me know when.

Bill
post #9768 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by DotJun View Post

Hey so, pro 3tx vs 212? Are they the same, just different driver orientation?

3tx uses 2x 10" woofers while the noesis uses 2x 12" woofers.
post #9769 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by ufokillerz View Post

3tx uses 2x 10" woofers while the noesis uses 2x 12" woofers.

Yep, those 10's, the cabinet and a different XO makes it a very different speaker but I bet they sound very much alike. smile.gif
post #9770 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

I used these XLR Attenuators.
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=240-414&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=pla
Since you're using the RCA connects on your Sunfire you may not need attenuation but those look fine if you need them.

Ah, you're using XLR's. My current speakers are around 98 dB sensitivity and I'm trimming them 8-9 dB, so there is a good chance it could be greater than 12 dB. And I might be adding a second row and pushing the front row a bit closer as well. In that case I'm pretty certain I'll need them.
post #9771 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Many here would maintain that the Denon alone would be adequate for the Noesis.

I use separates and my amp (W4S) has no gain control and i have the Noesis at -12db on my processor. I put some 15 db attenuators on the LCR XLR's and got down to +3 db on the processor but did not hear a difference so I removed the attenuators so that I had less connectors in the signal chain.

Hey RMK!, question for you.. are you saying that you calibrated everything with your processor maxed out at -12dB for your LCR? I just received my JTR shipment and have a feeling I'm going to max it out as well (really, really small room). The problem is that I will be using bare wire to connect the speakers to my Pio AVR and can't use those attenuators to bring down the signal some. The only thing I can really do is to add an external amp with gain control or an amp without gain control and put the attenuators on the RCA cables that would connect to the AVR's pre-outs. I just thought it was bad to have the speakers at whatever the max was on your AVR/Processor. I guess my question is this: If my AVR sets all/some of the speakers at -12dB (which I believe is the max on my AVR) should I do what I just said to get the levels into the "safe" range? I was also thinking I could just raise all of the trim levels the same amount in the AVR into that "safe" range and just have my "reference" at a different -dB. Example: I bump all speaker trim levels up 5dB, now my new "reference" is -5dB instead of 0dB.. 0dB currently being reference on my AVR. I know I quoted you RMK!, but anyone else with a thought or idea would be greatly appreciated. By the way, nothing is hooked up right now, so I don't know for sure if this will be the case but I'm guessing I'll have this problem due to the fact that the MLP is less than ~7ft from the LCR and about 4.5ft from the surrounds!
post #9772 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiniHT View Post

Hey RMK!, question for you.. are you saying that you calibrated everything with your processor maxed out at -12dB for your LCR? I just received my JTR shipment and have a feeling I'm going to max it out as well (really, really small room). The problem is that I will be using bare wire to connect the speakers to my Pio AVR and can't use those attenuators to bring down the signal some. The only thing I can really do is to add an external amp with gain control or an amp without gain control and put the attenuators on the RCA cables that would connect to the AVR's pre-outs. I just thought it was bad to have the speakers at whatever the max was on your AVR/Processor. I guess my question is this: If my AVR sets all/some of the speakers at -12dB (which I believe is the max on my AVR) should I do what I just said to get the levels into the "safe" range? I was also thinking I could just raise all of the trim levels the same amount in the AVR into that "safe" range and just have my "reference" at a different -dB. Example: I bump all speaker trim levels up 5dB, now my new "reference" is -5dB instead of 0dB.. 0dB currently being reference on my AVR. I know I quoted you RMK!, but anyone else with a thought or idea would be greatly appreciated. By the way, nothing is hooked up right now, so I don't know for sure if this will be the case but I'm guessing I'll have this problem due to the fact that the MLP is less than ~7ft from the LCR and about 4.5ft from the surrounds!

You basically have it all correct except for a couple of points.

First, the part about having the speakers at the max trim of the AVR doesn't matter if it is the correct trim level. That's only bad if the AVR was really trying to set the trim at -14, but was prevented by the AVR's limits from doing so.

Second, you can correct the reference level as you stated, but you have to know how many dB's you're off reference level trim to know the Master Volume correction to be at reference. For example - and assuming you're using a recent iteration of Audyssey that calibrates to reference - if the room correction sets the trim at -12 dB but the actual trim should be -14 dB, then when raising the trims by 5 dB the new reference level would be -3dB, not -5 dB. The only way to figure out how far off the trims are is to use a calibrated mic and measure the dB level at the listening position after a calibration and see how far off from 75 dB you actually are.
Edited by Gooddoc - 9/8/13 at 4:28pm
post #9773 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiniHT View Post

Hey RMK!, question for you.. are you saying that you calibrated everything with your processor maxed out at -12dB for your LCR? I just received my JTR shipment and have a feeling I'm going to max it out as well (really, really small room). The problem is that I will be using bare wire to connect the speakers to my Pio AVR and can't use those attenuators to bring down the signal some. The only thing I can really do is to add an external amp with gain control or an amp without gain control and put the attenuators on the RCA cables that would connect to the AVR's pre-outs. I just thought it was bad to have the speakers at whatever the max was on your AVR/Processor. I guess my question is this: If my AVR sets all/some of the speakers at -12dB (which I believe is the max on my AVR) should I do what I just said to get the levels into the "safe" range? I was also thinking I could just raise all of the trim levels the same amount in the AVR into that "safe" range and just have my "reference" at a different -dB. Example: I bump all speaker trim levels up 5dB, now my new "reference" is -5dB instead of 0dB.. 0dB currently being reference on my AVR. I know I quoted you RMK!, but anyone else with a thought or idea would be greatly appreciated. By the way, nothing is hooked up right now, so I don't know for sure if this will be the case but I'm guessing I'll have this problem due to the fact that the MLP is less than ~7ft from the LCR and about 4.5ft from the surrounds!

I am interested in these Audessey settings also. Audessey sets my mains at -12 and center at -11 (all 228 speakers). My Seaton sub is at -10. It sounds great to me but just wondering what the attenuators bring to the table. Btw, I use a XPA-5.
post #9774 of 18368
And also, I know many will balk at this suggestion, but it's a cheap fix if a calibrated mic is not available. It's not the route I would take, but it will work.

http://www.fullcompass.com/product/415890.html
post #9775 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by rangers View Post

It sounds great to me but just wondering what the attenuators bring to the table.

Nothing if -12 is the correct trim level.
post #9776 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiniHT View Post

Hey RMK!, question for you.. are you saying that you calibrated everything with your processor maxed out at -12dB for your LCR? I just received my JTR shipment and have a feeling I'm going to max it out as well (really, really small room). The problem is that I will be using bare wire to connect the speakers to my Pio AVR and can't use those attenuators to bring down the signal some. The only thing I can really do is to add an external amp with gain control or an amp without gain control and put the attenuators on the RCA cables that would connect to the AVR's pre-outs. I just thought it was bad to have the speakers at whatever the max was on your AVR/Processor. I guess my question is this: If my AVR sets all/some of the speakers at -12dB (which I believe is the max on my AVR) should I do what I just said to get the levels into the "safe" range? I was also thinking I could just raise all of the trim levels the same amount in the AVR into that "safe" range and just have my "reference" at a different -dB. Example: I bump all speaker trim levels up 5dB, now my new "reference" is -5dB instead of 0dB.. 0dB currently being reference on my AVR. I know I quoted you RMK!, but anyone else with a thought or idea would be greatly appreciated. By the way, nothing is hooked up right now, so I don't know for sure if this will be the case but I'm guessing I'll have this problem due to the fact that the MLP is less than ~7ft from the LCR and about 4.5ft from the surrounds!
From the Audyssey thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1/51750#post_21782993
Quote:
e)6. What do I do if my trim levels are at the limits of their adjustment ('maxed out')?

During the calibration, Audyssey sets each speaker's volume level so that all your speakers are playing at the same level, relative to each other, after the calibration is complete. These settings are called the 'trim levels' and you can see how Audyssey has set them by going into your AVR or Prepro's menus.

The range that Audyssey works within depends on the make of your unit: for Onkyo it is -12dB to +12dB for the satellites and -15dB to +12dB for the subwoofer; for Denon and Marantz the range is -12dB to +12dB for the satellites and the subwoofer. For other brands, check with your user manual. After calibration, all your speakers should show a trim setting within these ranges.

It is important that no trim level is 'hitting the stops' or maxed out. The reason for this is that if you do hit the stops, you have no way of knowing if Audyssey would have gone even further if it had been able to. So if, for example, your sub is set to -15dB, then there is the possibility that it could have been set to -17dB if Audyssey had allowed it.
post #9777 of 18368
Drove 686 miles roundtrip on Thursday to pickup 3 2010 T12s I purchased from a fellow forum member. I am in the middle of relocating all of my equipment so I haven't calibrated them yet, but WOW what an upgrade from my Def Tech BP2000s LR & CLR3000 center biggrin.gif. I have only listened to music thus far (Grant Green, Pink Floyd, Cowboy Junkies & Tommy Emmanuel) and only calibrated by ear but it is a huge upgrade in sound clarity and dynamic range. Still looking for some slanted 8's for surrounds and heights (currently using def tech ProCinema1000s) and then I will be set for at least 6 months rolleyes.gif.
post #9778 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by HTPCat View Post

Drove 686 miles roundtrip on Thursday to pickup 3 2010 T12s I purchased from a fellow forum member. I am in the middle of relocating all of my equipment so I haven't calibrated them yet, but WOW what an upgrade from my Def Tech BP2000s LR & CLR3000 center biggrin.gif. I have only listened to music thus far (Grant Green, Pink Floyd, Cowboy Junkies & Tommy Emmanuel) and only calibrated by ear but it is a huge upgrade in sound clarity and dynamic range. Still looking for some slanted 8's for surrounds and heights (currently using def tech ProCinema1000s) and then I will be set for at least 6 months rolleyes.gif.

Congrats! I'll be making a 1000 mile round trip for my 212HT's....not really looking forward to the ride, but I sure am looking forward to the new speakers.
Edited by Gooddoc - 9/8/13 at 4:13pm
post #9779 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooddoc View Post

Congrats! I'll be making a 1000 mile round trip for my 212HT's....not really looking forward to the ride, but I sure am looking forward the the new speakers.

1000 miles? Why do you have to drive that far to get your speakers?
post #9780 of 18368
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

1000 miles? Why do you have to drive that far to get your speakers?

Check your PM
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