Panasonic 11G/12G/13G black levels have seemingly doubled overnight? - Page 104

Originally Posted by Fr. John

Well crap, I just found this thread. I have 2 42" 85u's in the house and one 54" G10. Now I have to go and check them.

I also have to bite my tongue for all the recommendations I've made to friends and family over the last 2 years!

Here I've been bragging up Pannys and Plasma and I have to shut up now. I am not happy.

Originally Posted by donnymac51

This is an excerpt from the g10 review from hdtvmagazine.com.

"The TV really shows its strength in darker scenes. There is plenty of contrast to make out even the most subtle shadows. Blacks are very deep. Panasonic calls their technology "Infinite Black". From what we could find out about it is that the TV shuts off power to the pixel to achieve "Infinite Black". Whatever they call it it works. "

Seems like it only works until your blacks turn grey.

Originally Posted by sakke

Today I measured my old sony 32v4500 (year 2008 european model) which I sold to a friend. When I turned the tv on I couldn´t believe how good the blacks looked. Both sets meausured pretty much same in black screen (sony 0.015 fL panasonic 0.016 fL) when brightness was adjusted to 34 fL. When there was content on screen sony destroyed panasonic. Ansi contrast in sony was 2266:1 (0.015 fL black, 34 fL white) while panasonic only managed 1080:1 (0.030 fL black, 32.4 fL white). Measurements were taken in dark room.

I still can´t believe how grey panasonic looks on dark scenes compared to sony. I have one question to Orta, is your and mine meausurements comparable if I measure my black level with the same peak brightness as you (140 cd/m2) ?

Originally Posted by donnymac51

How did you go from .016ftl to .030ftl on the panasonic?

Originally Posted by Rpresner

So I wanted to see what other sets were measuring since I already told people I can reach .007 on my v10. Like I said before I had a bunch of friends with in the area I live in with 12g panasonics. I was able to send my friend to 8 of there houses in the last week. Not one tv(hours of use between 100-2000 hours) measured more than .010 running in custom mode.. Some were calibrated some were not. The tvs were s,v,g and 1 z model. This still leads me to believe there is an issue but is completely isolated to such a small number of sets. I believe Dnice stating it affects all models, just not all sets. My opinion is that certain break in methods or maybe power supply or something the user does to affect this. Not one person that was tested did any break in procedures. If you read the article on cnet it states that the levels will rise over time but not double like some people have PROVED and most that speculate and refuse to you prove. Its really baffles me why some people say "why should I use a meter when my eyes let me see the problem".. well sorry to say the eyes can play serious tricks on you..thats been proved.. so what needs to happen is everyone that has a problem, post on a new thread just meter readings on certain tv modes with content. Not just a blank screen with no input. EVERYONE should no there is a glow on a black screen. My tv reads .007 and has a glow in a all dark room...

Originally Posted by Rpresner

So I wanted to see what other sets were measuring since I already told people I can reach .007 on my v10. Like I said before I had a bunch of friends with in the area I live in with 12g panasonics. I was able to send my friend to 8 of there houses in the last week. Not one tv(hours of use between 100-2000 hours) measured more than .010 running in custom mode.. Some were calibrated some were not. The tvs were s,v,g and 1 z model. This still leads me to believe there is an issue but is completely isolated to such a small number of sets. I believe Dnice stating it affects all models, just not all sets. My opinion is that certain break in methods or maybe power supply or something the user does to affect this. Not one person that was tested did any break in procedures. If you read the article on cnet it states that the levels will rise over time but not double like some people have PROVED and most that speculate and refuse to you prove. Its really baffles me why some people say "why should I use a meter when my eyes let me see the problem".. well sorry to say the eyes can play serious tricks on you..thats been proved.. so what needs to happen is everyone that has a problem, post on a new thread just meter readings on certain tv modes with content. Not just a blank screen with no input. EVERYONE should no there is a glow on a black screen. My tv reads .007 and has a glow in a all dark room...

Originally Posted by mmoh00

Most s1 measurements i've seen in the s1 thread are near 0.014 ftL.

What meter was used and what size were your friends' tv's?

Originally Posted by Rick46

Lets see, you have these Plasmas and have been happy with them and now you have discovered this thread and now your going to be unhappy. My suggestion is forget this thread and go back to being happy.

My G15 looks great!

Originally Posted by jefflackey

Were you the person talking about being in telephone conferences with Panny engineers who were trying to figure out the problem, etc?

Whatever happened to those teleconferences and follow-up?

Originally Posted by Rpresner

I can find out the exact name of the meter. I just texted my friend. I dont have a clue on this stuff to be dead honest(meter speaking). his statement was this" I went over to there houses and checked on this(its basically most people I grew up with, hence all having the same type of tv's being recommended to each other), and i really did not get a reading higher than .010".. He told me who he went to and I know what tvs they have. Ill check what the s1 had, but I know that only one of my friends has a s1 and its a 50 or 54 inch... ill edit this post when he texts me back.

Originally Posted by donnymac51

Gotcha.. you did the checkerboard test. I also did that and came up with 1214 ansi and 2115 on/off CR. I missed the word ANSI in your post..sorry. Mine was done about a month ago so maybe I should check again.

Originally Posted by batpig

This is the truth...

That is why I caution people who are happy with their gear to never, ever look at AVSforum!!

Originally Posted by Gov

The "infinate black level" appearently does not work on all the displays, even though it is supposed to. I tried it a few weeks ago on my V10, and it never kicked in. I am going to try it again tonight.
BTW, I do not have the rising black levels.

Originally Posted by Orta

I calibrated it about a week ago and the timer just over 300 hours. It measured 0.008fL. I need to see if I can get Infinite Black to work on it, never tried.

Originally Posted by sakke

I know this is stupid question but could someone explain me why samsung 40b6000 is rated worse than panasonic 42g10 regarding black level and contrast.

To me it seems Samsung contrast is 3184:1 and black 0.0326 cd/m2 while panasonic is 906:1 and black 0.11 cd/m2.

Originally Posted by mmoh00

OK, let us know.

The reason I asked is because the accuracy of black level reading is VERY dependent on the meter used. IIRC, the cheap Spyder2 and the expensive i1pro are both garbage when it comes to the black level measurement while the i1LT seems to be pretty good. 0.014 ftL readings of s1 were mostly (if not all) done with i1LT.

Originally Posted by donnymac51

That should be .011 for the panny

Originally Posted by nesterpr

Hello there, I was reading all the posts in this thread, I have a TC-P54S1, i got it for $1,050 ( a good bargain) here in Sears of SJ Puerto Rico. I got 300+ hours and counting. I got 0.011 on black levels using Chroma 5 light meter, just checking black levels weekly!