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Sharp XS1, the forgotten LCD, what is the final verdict? - Page 2

post #31 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PanamaMike View Post

I guess Sharp has done a poor job of keeping themselves in the limelight, regarding direct to customer LCD sales. Who knows, maybe they'll just go to selling LCDs straight to manufacturers rather than having their own line.

Mike

I think that must be it. Looking at SONY whose TV division is continually in a state of crisis and Pioneer throwing in the towel while the Korean giants Samsung and LG are dominating the retail space I guess it does not take a genius to figure out with those miniscule profit margins the real money is in being a parts supplier.

I certainly hope for SONY that whatever comes out of Sharp's 10th generation plant is up to snuff. I guess that is SONY and the Japanese manufacturer's last stand against the Koreans.
post #32 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

I think that must be it. Looking at SONY whose TV division is continually in a state of crisis and Pioneer throwing in the towel while the Korean giants Samsung and LG are dominating the retail space I guess it does not take a genius to figure out with those miniscule profit margins the real money is in being a parts supplier.

I certainly hope for SONY that whatever comes out of Sharp's 10th generation plant is up to snuff. I guess that is SONY and the Japanese manufacturer's last stand against the Koreans.

Like Asian manufacturers (and of course popular demand) killed off German TV production nearly completely (only one manufacturer. Loewe, remaining - in the high price segment) it's completely feasible that the Japanese will experience the same.

bye
Benny
post #33 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny42 View Post

Like Asian manufacturers (and of course popular demand) killed off German TV production nearly completely (only one manufacturer. Loewe, remaining - in the high price segment) it's completely feasible that the Japanese will experience the same.

bye
Benny

I've been thinking the same. The situation now with Samsung/LG reminds of Japan's situation in the 70's where they were on the rise, first flooding the market with cheap alternatives then slowly gaining respect through innovation and new thinking all the while the western brands suffered until they mostly went extinct.

Looking at Japan now I find it hard to believe they can't compete with these newcomers, certainly in knowhow the Koreans have nothing on the Japanese, it just seems like the old giants like SONY have grown sluggish and lethargic with time. Nowhere is to be seen that zest and soul with which they conquered the world back in the 70-80's.
post #34 of 116
Pls keep us posted how's your tv .
post #35 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecgz88 View Post

Pls keep us posted how's your tv .

Sadly it is still in mid shipment, I am as eager as anyone for it to arrive, but it might take a week or two given the distance it has to travel by what I must assume is truck. Even then if it is damaged or not 'factory sealed' as advertised it is going right back with the shippers. Lets not count the chickens before they've hatched, but I am crossing my fingers and if all goes well will give it the once over with my critical eyes and post my impressions.

Mainly noting its black level performance which is what makes or breaks any display for me personally. If the Pioneer Kuro Experience DB rip I am downloading is done by then that will be my test disc if not I am going to pick up Gladiator on Blu-ray and throw in a good dark transfer as well, perhaps Batman Begins. Then, of course, video games, my favourite pastime, I'll throw on a few of my PS3 favourites to see how the set handles them.
post #36 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

Sadly it is still in mid shipment, I am as eager as anyone for it to arrive, but it might take a week or two given the distance it has to travel by what I must assume is truck. Even then if it is damaged or not 'factory sealed' as advertised it is going right back with the shippers. Lets not count the chickens before they've hatched, but I am crossing my fingers and if all goes well will give it the once over with my critical eyes and post my impressions.

Mainly noting its black level performance which is what makes or breaks any display for me personally. If the Pioneer Kuro Experience DB rip I am downloading is done by then that will be my test disc if not I am going to pick up Gladiator on Blu-ray and throw in a good dark transfer as well, perhaps Batman Begins. Then, of course, video games, my favourite pastime, I'll throw on a few of my PS3 favourites to see how the set handles them.

Did u buy 50 inch or 60 inch?
post #37 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoro View Post

Did u buy 50 inch or 60 inch?

The 52" was the only size I was able to find for sale anywhere, so I went with that one. Thought I would have loved to have gone with the 65", even at a few grand more.
post #38 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

The 52" was the only size I was able to find for sale anywhere, so I went with that one. Thought I would have loved to have gone with the 65", even at a few grand more.

tv looks like a piece of art worthy for a museum! how is pq, will determine it is actual worth though!
post #39 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

I've seen the 8000's and outside the aestetics I was not that impressed by them. In particular was the glossy screen that gives the picture glare as well as undesireable PC look which makes anything below good HD look terrible.

I have a pretty neat middle-high end sound system with a Denon receiver and big tower Polk speakers, all the sound of my movies and games come through those so the television speaker was never an issue for me. Depending on how I like the look I might even not hook up the TV speakers at all.

There is one thing about the XS1, it seems it comes with no stand what so ever. Though since I was going to wall mount it anyway it does not matter much. The thing is the XS1's own specific wall mount which Sharp strongly recommends can only be had through authorized dealers and costs 480 CAD.

For now I've ordered a cheap (< 20$) low profile wall mount from monoprice. I hope it'll do the job, I don't want to spend 1/5th of the cost of the tv on what essentially is just a piece of metal. I find it funny that for the original 12000USD asking price Sharp did not have the decency to throw something like that in the box. But I guess a profit margin above 1000% is too good to pass up by anyone.

Actually I find that the 8000 does a great job upscaling standard TV. But of course there are channels where the quality is just too low, compressed or garbled to produce decent picture. The overall PQ is stunning IMO out of the box. Doubt that the XS1 will look better with standard TV.

About the sound - I have a high-end home theater myself, in fact I have a 5308 Denon and great speakers. I just find it annoying when I cannot use the TV speakers - sometimes I just want to flip channels but the 8000 sound is so bad I'm forced to turn the sound system on. I never thought that would be an issue for me, but it is (which is why the XS1 sound solution looks so appealing). Also, not having local dimming is not an issue for me for the same reason - having the home theater I usually use the projector when watching in the dark, otherwise the screen uniformity would bother me more.

About wall mount - I use Peerless. It's convinient because I can turn and tilt the TV any which way I like (particularly useful for plugging cables). On that mount the TV is not exactly flush against the wall, but I'd rather have the flexibility than the flush mount look.

Like everyone else said - post impressions once you get the XS1
post #40 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by st_o_p View Post

Actually I find that the 8000 does a great job upscaling standard TV. But of course there are channels where the quality is just too low, compressed or garbled to produce decent picture. The overall PQ is stunning IMO out of the box. Doubt that the XS1 will look better with standard TV.

About the sound - I have a high-end home theater myself, in fact I have a 5308 Denon and great speakers. I just find it annoying when I cannot use the TV speakers - sometimes I just want to flip channels but the 8000 sound is so bad I'm forced to turn the sound system on. I never thought that would be an issue for me, but it is (which is why the XS1 sound solution looks so appealing). Also, not having local dimming is not an issue for me for the same reason - having the home theater I usually use the projector when watching in the dark, otherwise the screen uniformity would bother me more.

About wall mount - I use Peerless. It's convinient because I can turn and tilt the TV any which way I like (particularly useful for plugging cables). On that mount the TV is not exactly flush against the wall, but I'd rather have the flexibility than the flush mount look.

Like everyone else said - post impressions once you get the XS1

The PC look of glossy screens has nothing to do with upscaling, I am sure the Samsung does a fine job, it is a different thing, its like when you watch video on a laptop, it just looks different than it should on a TV.

Anyway, I don't watch television, ever, its not even hooked up actually. The delivery date I've been informed is 8th of September, so there is going to be a long wait. Now to sit back and twiddle my thumb...
post #41 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

The delivery date I've been informed is 8th of September, so there is going to be a long wait. Now to sit back and twiddle my thumb...

Instead of playing with your appendages you could use the waiting time to get yourself some more demo movies!
Be sure to get the Sharp True Colors demo they made for the XS1.
Personally, I think the "2008 Taipei 101 Fireworks" (HDClub) is much more stunning, though.

These demo videos run very nicely from the PS3 - just put them on an USB stick to transfer them.

bye
Benny
post #42 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny42 View Post

Instead of playing with your appendages you could use the waiting time to get yourself some more demo movies!
Be sure to get the Sharp True Colors demo they made for the XS1.
Personally, I think the "2008 Taipei 101 Fireworks" (HDClub) is much more stunning, though.

These demo videos run very nicely from the PS3 - just put them on an USB stick to transfer them.

bye
Benny

Well running things off of my PS3 via USB stick is the plan, but having tried to track down any of the demo material you mentioned only exhausted all of my usual means with no net result.

I managed to find some Sharp demo material, but unfortunately that XS1 specific one is impossible to find for download. I now have the full Kuro experience BD and a bunch of HDTV demos from SONY, Panasonic and a few others, I think I have enough eye shattering material for my own amusement. Of specific interest is the Kuro and Panasonic demos because they are designed to showcase the strenghs of Plasma technology, motion resolution and black levels which are LCD weaknesses.

Unfortunately, the problem with colourful eyecandy such as these is that they give a mostly pretty false impression of what a given display will look like during normal use. Rare is the occurrence of a theatric Blu-ray movie that looks even a fraction as good as those.

The real test will be when I throw on a dark movie with a decent transfer, that is when the sets flaws will rear their heads. My previous SONY come preloaded with a few demo images, there was one of a sunflower field and when you put that on the screen the quality was breathtaking, but the thing is the set never ever was allowed to perform that well displaying normal stuff.
post #43 of 116
I have found some info from Japan Official website, maybe there is slight different than the US model, they have the manauls download either.

http://www.sharp.co.jp/aquos/lineup/...feature02.html
http://www.sharp.co.jp/support/aquos/pdf_list.html
post #44 of 116
I don't know if this is a stupid question, what is the different between the RGB-LED (like XS1 and XBR8) and the regular LED (samsung 8000)? Thanks
post #45 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisfsk View Post

I don't know if this is a stupid question, what is the different between the RGB-LED (like XS1 and XBR8) and the regular LED (samsung 8000)? Thanks

The XS1 and the XBR8 are similar in that they use Red-Green-Blue LED's to create white light for the backlight, but they are very different in the implementation of the dynamic dimming. The XBR8 dims the different color LED's together, thus a standard dimming system, but the XS1 dims each color of LED separately, thus it can dim in color.
post #46 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

Well running things off of my PS3 via USB stick is the plan, but having tried to track down any of the demo material you mentioned only exhausted all of my usual means with no net result.

I managed to find some Sharp demo material, but unfortunately that XS1 specific one is impossible to find for download.

It's in the list I linked to - just download the separate parts ("1-2-3-4") and unpack them.
I'm sure that Sharp won't object, given that you will be one of the few owners of this set ;-)

Quote:


I now have the full Kuro experience BD and a bunch of HDTV demos from SONY, Panasonic and a few others, I think I have enough eye shattering material for my own amusement. Of specific interest is the Kuro and Panasonic demos because they are designed to showcase the strenghs of Plasma technology, motion resolution and black levels which are LCD weaknesses.

I agree to that - especially the Kuro material should be a very good test.

Quote:


Unfortunately, the problem with colourful eyecandy such as these is that they give a mostly pretty false impression of what a given display will look like during normal use. Rare is the occurrence of a theatric Blu-ray movie that looks even a fraction as good as those.

But they do exist, IMHO:
The Dark Knight, Iron Man, Speedracer, Transformers and of course CG-movies like Cars, Kung-Fu Panda and Wall-E

bye
Benny
post #47 of 116
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisfsk View Post

I don't know if this is a stupid question, what is the different between the RGB-LED (like XS1 and XBR8) and the regular LED (samsung 8000)? Thanks

Sharp XS1 backlight and Panel:


SONY and Samsung backlights:
post #48 of 116
Thread Starter 
Well folks, I have a major setback to report for those awaiting an owner review of this set. It took the wonderful shipping company until the delivery date where I was all giddy with anticipation to call me and tell me that the package was not on on its way because it had for some days been held back by customs, don't you love those golden boys at customs though? Nothing but fond anecdotes about them I have, ah, the good times.

It gets worse actually, the shipping company, after an aditional day, returned to me with the duty amount, running up to 437 CAD, with a 150 CAD cut for themselves for filling out a few forms, how do they get away with it? Better still, even with the money paid, I still have some forms to fill. And best still, they do not take credit card folks, yes, wonderful innit? So I have to actually mail them a damn check, to a address they are prolly going to take a few days to inform me of.

So at best things are set back by about 2 weeks until I fill the necessary paperwork, mail it with a check in the amount, to the address I do not have. Then they have to get off their arse and cash it and then lastly my package will be released, a procedure that I imagine is going to take a few more days at least and then add in a few more days for it to arrive here from the border via truck.

I am now seriously contemplating just blowing the whole thing off and marching straight into my local Sonystyle and getting me a damned XBR8, right now. The extra expense I don't mind much, I was half expecting a nasty surprise buying from across the border, though I was foolishly expecting a bill half as painful, its the waiting that makes me writhe in pain.

As the classic gods as my witness there is little I loathe more than continually waiting with anticipation for something that just refuses to arrive as the days pile on. And I've been always so very "fortunate" and "blessed" with stuff like this. Of course, if I have been a really good little boy, maybe after the whole torturous regiment I'll unpack that badboy and be visited by a nice big crack across the screen, at whick point I might as well just break down weeping. Dear people working in the customs offices of the borders of the nations of the world, I am sure you are fine fellas, only doing your jobs, is all, but I curse all and every single one of you all the same to a horrible, painful death, I think its only fair.
post #49 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

Well folks, I have a major setback to report for those awaiting an owner review of this set. It took the wonderful shipping company until the delivery date where I was all giddy with anticipation to call me and tell me that the package was not on on its way because it had for some days been held back by customs, don't you love those golden boys at customs though? Nothing but fond anecdotes about them I have, ah, the good times.

Well, the good thing seems to be that a set is headed your way!

Quote:


Dear people working in the customs offices of the borders of the nations of the world, I am sure you are fine fellas, only doing your jobs, is all, but I curse all and every single one of you all the same to a horrible, painful death, I think its only fair.

Customs offices seem to be overworked in every country and mine is no different. I once ordered a computer part in the US and it was transported within three days from the sender to the fair city of Hamburg, Germany. There it took nearly two weeks to get transported from the main customs office for all incoming packages from the US to the office in downtown where I could claim it.
The wait wasn't so painful in this case because it was a spare part but I suspected that it got lost and therefore tried to track it. Incidentally, a day after I called them I got a postcard in my mailbox to come and get it (and pay the taxes...).

bye
Benny
post #50 of 116
If you close to border, I would suggest you ship to the US shipping company and go there pick up by yourself.

Do you know where TV is make? will you be charge duty?

Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

Well folks, I have a major setback to report for those awaiting an owner review of this set. It took the wonderful shipping company until the delivery date where I was all giddy with anticipation to call me and tell me that the package was not on on its way because it had for some days been held back by customs, don't you love those golden boys at customs though? Nothing but fond anecdotes about them I have, ah, the good times.

It gets worse actually, the shipping company, after an aditional day, returned to me with the duty amount, running up to 437 CAD, with a 150 CAD cut for themselves for filling out a few forms, how do they get away with it? Better still, even with the money paid, I still have some forms to fill. And best still, they do not take credit card folks, yes, wonderful innit? So I have to actually mail them a damn check, to a address they are prolly going to take a few days to inform me of.

So at best things are set back by about 2 weeks until I fill the necessary paperwork, mail it with a check in the amount, to the address I do not have. Then they have to get off their arse and cash it and then lastly my package will be released, a procedure that I imagine is going to take a few more days at least and then add in a few more days for it to arrive here from the border via truck.

I am now seriously contemplating just blowing the whole thing off and marching straight into my local Sonystyle and getting me a damned XBR8, right now. The extra expense I don't mind much, I was half expecting a nasty surprise buying from across the border, though I was foolishly expecting a bill half as painful, its the waiting that makes me writhe in pain.

As the classic gods as my witness there is little I loathe more than continually waiting with anticipation for something that just refuses to arrive as the days pile on. And I've been always so very "fortunate" and "blessed" with stuff like this. Of course, if I have been a really good little boy, maybe after the whole torturous regiment I'll unpack that badboy and be visited by a nice big crack across the screen, at whick point I might as well just break down weeping. Dear people working in the customs offices of the borders of the nations of the world, I am sure you are fine fellas, only doing your jobs, is all, but I curse all and every single one of you all the same to a horrible, painful death, I think its only fair.
post #51 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecgz88 View Post

If you close to border, I would suggest you ship to the US shipping company and go there pick up by yourself.

Do you know where TV is make? will you be charge duty?

That's not a bad thought, but of course we have no idea where you're located in reference to the pickup location. I'm surprised they didn't look into this shipping issue before sending it to you.

In any event, it's a shame if you don't get the set. I was looking forward to the hands on review.

Mike
post #52 of 116
Thread Starter 
Well I don't know what to say the lofty duty sum should hopefuly be Heading their way tomorow. The confusing paperwork they sent me is completed though, I found out after about 20 emails back and forth that two of three of them were not meant for me at all.

Anywho going to the ontario border is out of the question, Its only a 20 hour drive away and I doubt that monster will fit in the car outside of me taking a saw to it.

As the wait continues I will cross my fingers for the paper based part of the excercise not causing any more problems and the set actually arriving factory sealed and unharmed when all is said and done.
post #53 of 116
To help pass the time, here's a review from Japan

I can't read Japanese, maybe someone could give an impression of their conclusion.
post #54 of 116
Thread Starter 
Thought I'd throw in a update, I have not heard back from the shipping company, I think somehow everyone there seems to be on vacation right now, which is just dandy.

Besides, even if it were to arrive I could not test it because now I have no access to my apartment for the next two months due to circumstances out of my control, sorry anyone who was anticipating a review of any sort, but mostly I am sorry for myself, living without HD for that long sure is going to be a bit annoying, but I'll make due. I just hope the set, regardless of quality at this point, at least arrives in one piece, it is nearing one month ago since I ordered it and I don't think giving back a faulty one is going to be easy this late.

On a lighter note the set has had a further price dive on the site I ordered it from, it now can be had for 2395, which is a steal in my opinion.

Here is a link for anyone who might be interested, if you order now you are guaranteed to start enjoying it long before me ya lucky bastards.

http://www.techforless.com/cgi-bin/t...ihS&mv_pc=1738

Also currently, other, if you are that way inclined, more reputable sites have the set for a little more money, about hundred and fity more to be a little more precise. Try to search for XS1 on nextag.com for the sellers. With the XBR8 becoming more scarce and the Samsung 8500 still a little ways off I think it would be a shame for people in the market to never consider this potential contender, specially for this price. Right now it is doomed to obscurity.
post #55 of 116
I just checked with Sharp, this set is made in Japan, so duty applies
post #56 of 116
Thread Starter 
Ah, well that explains it then I guess. I thought I had heard things about items coming into Canada from across the border are exempt from duties if they were made there. I wonder how the customs figured it out though, I sure as hell hope they didn't take out the set to have look at the sticker on its back, I hope they just read it off the packaging.

God I hate those villainous customs inspectors, every time I think of them I am reminded of Terry Gilliams Brazil...

Still, the added expenses of importing aside, I think it can only be viewed as a positive that the set was actually manufactured in Japan rather than in China or some other third rate location.
post #57 of 116
Thread Starter 
Well the set has finally arrived, fashionably late by about two weeks. To the credit of the place I bought it from it arrived factory sealed, responsibly packed in a larger box and is in general in pristine condition save for a tear around the handle area of the box.

I will give it the only review I can in the forseeable future and here it is, it looks great off, the blacks of the powerless set are excellent. For the rest I, and the rest, will have to wait until I can move it to some place with access to power, which sadly wont happen any time soon.

The wait continues... but here is a treat, this is as much enjoyment as I'll get out of it for now.
LL
post #58 of 116
Pretty crazy to even see that thing in pictures.
post #59 of 116
Any idea when you'll have access to power? The suspense would be killing me. I'd want to make sure it at least worked.

BTW, did it come with the pedestal?

Mike
post #60 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Kamikaze=- View Post

Sharp XS1 backlight and Panel:


SONY and Samsung backlights:

hello.
thank you for posting these pictures; they are very enlightening!
however, like many enlightening things, they bring up more interesting questions which i hope you could answer.

1) The Backlight Image of the XS1. it looks like it has a grid in the picture. whether simulated or actually there, i'm assuming it is representing LED "zones". i had thought that the point of a "zone" was that all LED's in that zone would act as one, as in they would all be the same brightness/color. this does not seem to be the case in the XS1 image. am i wrong in what i believe a zone to be?

2) The Backlight Image of the Samsung. now this is what i expected a backlight image to look like! i've heard the samsung backlight is 12x8 zones, so i expected a backlight picture to look like a screen divided up into 12x8 giant blurry pixels, which is what i see here.

3) The Backlight Image of the Sony. sony's first and only locally dimming set is the XBR8, correct? so that's what i'm assuming this is. but i've heard that the XBR8 also has fairly few zones, like 16x9. however, the "zone resolution" on this backlight is so high i can actually tell that i'm seeing jellyfish! how is this possible? am i wrong in what i believe to be a "zone" again? also, the XBR8 has RGB-LED's, so how come the jellyfish look completely white?


thanks for any info!
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