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Denon DBP-4010UDCI - Page 35

post #1021 of 1226
^ David,
It's great that you are liking the SQ of DL.

If you have another disc player and duplicate discs available, and are ever inspired to do so, it would be cool if you'd attempt to duplicate my A/B tests as reported in this thread.
post #1022 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by PLA View Post

156 min firmware update for 4010, 80% done at the moment, another 40 min to go, wish Denon would upgrade their servers to a faster speed. 4 min update of BE Firmware.

Do we know what this FW update is about?

What is BE Firmware?

Anything different after update?
post #1023 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

^ David,
It's great that you are liking the SQ of DL.

If you have another disc player and duplicate discs available, and are ever inspired to do so, it would be cool if you'd attempt to duplicate my A/B tests as reported in this thread.

@SoM
Thanks, yes the SQ of DL3 for RBCD,SACD & DVD-A based on my initial, very subjective listening is EXCELLENT and improves upon the player's HDMI and analog out SQ(which is damn good,too!) Watched a SD DVD concert and was very impressed with the PQ (using the player's upconversion to 1080p).
Just as you reported, DL4 SQ may or may not be "better" than HDMI I'm going to have to listen more...
Don't really have another player that is "equal" to this one for me to do an A/B test shootout,could put it up against a Marantz UD-5005 that will do DSD as 88.kHz PCM over HDMI and compare that to DL3 on the Denon. Have always thought about getting an OPPO not sure if I will...the Denon is a bit SLOW but the build quality, PQ and SQ is very good IMHO.
Can you suggest a budget-friendly device or app (?) that I could get to level-match for an A/B comparision?
Thanks David
post #1024 of 1226
"I'm not trying to sell you anything, just letting you know my results so you can consider your options. That's why I said 4311 + 4010 is a killer combo."
Quote from Sound of Mind

+1 . Agree 100%
thanks SoM glad I took the plunge!
David
post #1025 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidbarrickman View Post

...thanks SoM glad I took the plunge!

You're welcome!

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidbarrickman View Post

...could put it up against a Marantz UD-5005 that will do DSD as 88.kHz PCM over HDMI and compare that to DL3 on the Denon. Have always thought about getting an OPPO not sure if I will...the Denon is a bit SLOW but the build quality, PQ and SQ is very good IMHO.
Can you suggest a budget-friendly device or app (?) that I could get to level-match for an A/B comparision? Thanks David

IMO there's no point in your even considering getting any current Oppo unless you need its particular feature set for another system in another room. The Marantz output is the same as Oppo PCM so that is a pretty good comparator, though DSD bitstream from the Oppo always had a slight edge over PCM to my Denon AVRs.

Level-match does not require accuracy, just consistency. Any Rad Shack SPL meter would do nicely. There's prob a phone app that would do. I'm assuming you don't OmniMic or other measurement system.

Using a pink noise test signal off a disc would be the best way to level-match, but often I just find a consistently loud section of music to use. Then, I adjust one input trim till I get the same reading from both players with MV at the same level. Then, after I do some A/B tests, if I find one superior, I crank up the poorer SQ one (lets call it B) by .5 dB and do another A/B just to be sure it wasn't a sloppy level-match that made A sound better.
post #1026 of 1226
Has anyone experienced a problem with gapless playback of DVD-Audio discs (5.1-channel, 48-kHz, 24-bit) on the 4010UDCI? I have mastered a disc which is set to gapless and yet the 4010 is putting less than a second of gap between some (not all) of the tracks. The authoring software was Chrome II. The gaps occur whether the audio is going through HDMI or DenonLink 4 (really 3 with DVD-Audio, of course).

I've tried the same disc on a OPPO BDP-93 and there are no gaps. I've also tried it on a Mark Levinson car DVD-Audio unit (DVD-Audio track) and there are no gaps. I'm going to try a disc tonight that worked on my old Denon DVD-5910 unit (which I traded-in for the 4010) and see if that also now has gaps.

To me it's almost like the 4010 is dumping its buffer at the end of the track and then having to refill, causing the slight gap. Unfortunately for demo'ing, that's makes the player useless for me.

My question for all of the 4010 owners who play 5.1-channel DVD-Audio discs is, have you experienced slight silence gaps between any DVD-Audio tracks that shouldn't have gaps? If so, which discs?
post #1027 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidbarrickman View Post

Attachment 247755


this thread helped a lot thanks again!!

OK, I have to ask. How did you get the third light to appear? Can you describe the steps you took? I gave up after my fifth attempt. The other two DenonLink indicators work perfectly but not the third light.

I did succeed in getting HDMI CEC to turn-on my projector when I didn't want it to. But, the third light just doesn't want to function for me. I obviously am not "one with the third blue light".
post #1028 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by markrubin View Post


another member was kind enough to provide me some more info: I will try this tonight

From the Audioholics review of the A1....http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/t...-a1udci-config

* Enable HDMI control on both the AVP-A1HDCI and DVD-A1UDCI.
* Turn Denon Link off on the DVD-A1UDCI. (This has to be off to change settings for HDMI.)
* Set HDMI Audio to auto on the DVD-A1UDCI
* Turn Denon Link 4th on in the DVD-A1UDCI
* Set HDMI Mode to HDMI Dual (Auto) on the DVD-A1UDCI
* Assign Denon Link to the appropriate source on the AVP-A1HDCI
* Set the Input Mode to Auto on the AVP-A1HDCI

Earlier in this thread, Mark posted a link to an Audioholics page regarding set-up. This is what worked for me. Be sure to make the settings first with no disc in the tray...after making settings then insert disc and load. That's when the elusive 3rd light should appear.
In my case AVP = AVR4310
DVDA1UDCI = DBP-A100 (4010)
Hope this helps.
If not, you MAY have to enable HDMI control elsewhere (I have it on for my Sony XBR-4)
I'm short on time right now but will post more later if you need more help or ?.
post #1029 of 1226
And here's a link too....


http://avppoaowners.wetpaint.com/pag...+Configuration


I must say that at least for me the Audioholcs page (scroll down to Denon Link 4 setup) was the "charm" for me.
post #1030 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post


I've done a search for "third light" on the thread as I initially had difficulty as well. You have found and followed this great post by awbh. Perhaps something in this post or mebbe this one will help.
Note: If you have a Kuro display see this and this.

This post by SoM references some others re the 3rd blue light...
I would like to report a "quirk" of the DBP-A100(4010) that it shares (at least in my set-up) with another D&M player Marantz UD5005. Discovered this with two different
DVD-A discs one is 5.1/ 88.2 kHz and the other 5.1/96 kHz. When players are set to HDMI output 1080p or AUTO, hi-res Mch PCM is output just fine to my Denon AVR and can verify using AVR's Information/Audio Input Signal page. If you change the players' output resolution to SOUCE DIRECT instead of 1080p or AUTO, the 5.1 PCM is output at 48 kHz instead of 96 kHz. I reported this in the UD-5005 thread, thought I might mention here. Very annoying. To make sure hi-res PCM 5.1 or 2.0 isn't output at 48 kHz I'm forced not to use source direct HDMI setting which is most bothersome on the Marantz since it doesn't have the Anchor Bay processing that the Denon player has....would like to run the Marantz source direct and use the Anchor Bay processing in the AVR.
Strangely when playing a DVD-V disc with DTS96/24,these HDMI output settings for video resolution don't affect the audio resolution, 96 kHz is output regardless. Go figure...and yes I have checked to make sure that the PCM down sampling options on the players are NOT selected.
post #1031 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidbarrickman View Post

Earlier in this thread, Mark posted a link to an Audioholics page regarding set-up. This is what worked for me. Be sure to make the settings first with no disc in the tray...after making settings then insert disc and load. That's when the elusive 3rd light should appear.
In my case AVP = AVR4310
DVDA1UDCI = DBP-A100 (4010)
Hope this helps.
If not, you MAY have to enable HDMI control elsewhere (I have it on for my Sony XBR-4)
I'm short on time right now but will post more later if you need more help or ?.

Thank you. I'll give that a try this weekend. Thinking about my last attempts, I suspect I may have had a Blu-Ray disc in the tray while trying the procedure. I will try again with what you wrote.

Appreciate the help!
post #1032 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

Do we know what this FW update is about?

What is BE Firmware?

Anything different after update?

Changelog for the European version:

Changelog of DBP4010
25.04.2012
B/E Ver000309
compatibility improvement of DVD /BD play ability

12.12.2011
B/E Ver000308
DVD-"Bones" do not start.
BD Udo Lindenberg MTV UNPLUGGED do not play at all.

06.10.2011
SYS Ver000243
Can't play different BD's from Sony Pictures.

When the playback of BD, the unit can't work display correctly.

Specific BD DISC (НАЧАЛО) cannot be played.
"
Can't play a Disc of "Surround Records International LLC" BD9 format.

Can't play a specific BD-RE.

The preview video doesn't display in BD-Live of Sony Pictures.

15.07.2010
B/E Ver000210
DVD disc "AVATAR" made in Germany might be not reproduced. After inserting it only shows PLAY in Display.

14.06.2010
B/E Ver000209
When BD software "Ole Bull Violin Concertos" and "" was reproduced, the "mShuttle" function might be not worked.
BD-Live doesn't work with "Iron Man" and "Unsere Erde" BD discs.

03.06.2010
B/E Ver000208
When BD software "THE HAPPENING" was reproduced, a menu screen does not output it after updating of the unit for BD AVATAR.
We are modified unit by indication from the DVD Copy Control Association (DVD CCA).

20.05.2010
B/E Ver000207
DENON LINK 4th does not works when use the unit with TH-P50VT2 (Panasonic Plasm TV, correspond with HDMI1.4 ARC).
A lot of customers experience a problem while updating DBP-4010UD via DPMS since latest Firmware

21.04.2010
B/E Ver000207
The red caution might be indicated, and unit might be not replayed at BD disc "AVATAR".

13.04.2010
B/E Ver000206
When unit reproduces specific BD which made in only the "Twentieth Century Fox Film Corporation", unit displays a text that promoting update of the firmware, and unit might reproduce the main title
When unit reproduces DVD-Audio, the audio signal might output without any sound or noise signal or/and the video signal might output without any picture
Sound skip occur when play a specific BD "TRONDHEIM SOLISTENE" [2L50SACD]
Crackling noise on surround back speakers during playback of "DTS-HD-MSTR 6.1 disc".
The unit freeze when stop playback of BD-RE
The unit won't turn on. No red LED light of power indication comes on
When "AMX DIRECT SEARCH 19" is searched, but unit searched "10".
When press the "POPUP MENU" button while playing SACD disc, unit might be stopped.
Layer Break of DVD is clearly visible when playing back DVD9
Addition of "Web control" function

Please RESET your unit after updating and re-setup your unit again, otherwise you will probably not be able to use DENON LINK 4th.

15.02.2010
B/E Ver. 000120
"Sleeping Beauty (BD Disc)" will not play without an SD card inserted in player.

When play a DVD-AUDIO, if push STOP button twice then open SETUP-menu then close then push a PURE-DIRECT button to change the mode to OFF-ON-OFF, a HDMI indicator blink and a audio and picture does not out from HDMI.

When play a "DER ROSENKAVALIER (BD Disc)" and "Leon: The Professional (BD Disc)", can not chapter search correctly.
The color deviation during upscaling of DVD PAL-content.

The black belt might output under the picture when the layer of the DVD disc changes.

When a DBP-4010UDCI/4010UD turn off the power during version up, there is the thing that version up is not possible.
When setting of "BD Audio Mode" turn on the power in "Mix Audio Output", the sound might be not output from "SBL/SBR".


17.12.2009
B/E Ver. 000116
When turn on the power of the unit from standby mode after set "Quick Start Mode", picture is not output from component terminal.

"DENON LINK 4th" does not work when the unit connects to a plasma TV (KRP-500A: Pioneer).

Start playback only DVD-Audio disc automatically when operate "SETUP".

Disc "The Wrestler" can't be started by selecting "Play".
post #1033 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by alk3997 View Post

Has anyone experienced a problem with gapless playback of DVD-Audio discs (5.1-channel, 48-kHz, 24-bit) on the 4010UDCI? I have mastered a disc which is set to gapless and yet the 4010 is putting less than a second of gap between some (not all) of the tracks. The authoring software was Chrome II. The gaps occur whether the audio is going through HDMI or DenonLink 4 (really 3 with DVD-Audio, of course).

I've tried the same disc on a OPPO BDP-93 and there are no gaps. I've also tried it on a Mark Levinson car DVD-Audio unit (DVD-Audio track) and there are no gaps. I'm going to try a disc tonight that worked on my old Denon DVD-5910 unit (which I traded-in for the 4010) and see if that also now has gaps.

To me it's almost like the 4010 is dumping its buffer at the end of the track and then having to refill, causing the slight gap. Unfortunately for demo'ing, that's makes the player useless for me.

My question for all of the 4010 owners who play 5.1-channel DVD-Audio discs is, have you experienced slight silence gaps between any DVD-Audio tracks that shouldn't have gaps? If so, which discs?


I think I figured this out. There is a flaw in the 4010 firmware but it is on the mild side.

The DVD-Audio spec allows for every track in the group to have at least one still photo included. It also allows for none of the tracks to have photos. What it doesn't allow for is for one track to have a photo and then the next track to not have a still photo.

From whatever reason the 4010 cannot handle the "no photo on every track" option with gapless tracks. The player seems to dump its buffer when it hits the next track and the track doesn't have a photo. If a photo is present, then the player continues without any problems (or any gaps).

So, the bypass is to always include a photo with each track. The only reason I hadn't included any still photos was this was a test disc. A gapless commercial DVD-Audio disc without any still photos should produce the same gaps, but I can't think of any ones that were ever sold.

I'll going to let Denon know, but it really isn't that big of a problem.
post #1034 of 1226
Guys, my DVD-3800BDCI needs a new scaler and drive mechanism. Cost = 850 (direct from Denon NJ)

Is the DBP-A100 pretty much the same machine as the DBP-4010UDCI?? Are there any substantial differences, I can't seem to figure this out.

I've had an AVR-5803 since '02, (shes been a rock, can't justify upgrading just for the DL) and have been using the analog outs of the 3800 to the 5803.

Thanks,
Chuck
post #1035 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrondB View Post


Changelog for the European version:
Changelog of DBP4010
Thnx, man!
post #1036 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgun View Post

...Is the DBP-A100 pretty much the same machine as the DBP-4010UDCI?? Are there any substantial differences, I can't seem to figure this out.
I've had an AVR-5803 since '02, (shes been a rock, can't justify upgrading just for the DL) and have been using the analog outs of the 3800 to the 5803.
The A100 is indeed a 4010, with a few minor modifications that earn it that it the 100th Anniv Ed badge on the gloss black faceplate . Those include iron feet, a special capacitor, 5 yr warr and certificate that it was tested to specs prior to leaving the factor-and oh yeah, it lists for $500 more. It is very doubtful any of that makes a sonic difference IMO.

Chuck, do you have the DL3 upgrade for your 5803? see here.
post #1037 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

The A100 is indeed a 4010, with a few minor modifications that earn it that it the 100th Anniv Ed badge on the gloss black faceplate . Those include iron feet, a special capacitor, 5 yr warr and certificate that it was tested to specs prior to leaving the factor-and oh yeah, it lists for $500 more. It is very doubtful any of that makes a sonic difference IMO.
Chuck, do you have the DL3 upgrade for your 5803? see here.

Schweet, much appreciated, I can get a better deal on the A100!!

The 5803 is stock, I would love to upgrade to a newer DL, but I can't live without her. Two- three weeks would end a beautiful relationship!! wink.gif


By the way the 3800BDCI had horrid bass management. Just awful.
post #1038 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgun View Post

Schweet, much appreciated, I can get a better deal on the A100!!
The 5803 is stock, I would love to upgrade to a newer DL, but I can't live without her. Two- three weeks would end a beautiful relationship!! wink.gif
By the way the 3800BDCI had horrid bass management. Just awful.

That's exactly why DenonLink is such an advantage. This way all bass management is done in the AVR-5803 (about to sell an AVR-5803A, if I can get time). Actually either in the case of the analog multichannel inputs or the DenonLink input, all bass management should be done in the 5803/5803A.

Of course, the worse possible thing would be to have bass management enabled in the player and the receiver.
post #1039 of 1226
Hello current and former owners and thread followers of the 4010UDCI.

I currently own a Denon DVD-3930CI. I've had it since April 2011. I've always wanted the device because of it's build quality and outstanding performance with DVD upscaling, reference level SACD/DVD-A and redbook CD playback ability. It is by far my favorite device in my ensemble. By the way, it came with an extra NIB laser assembly just in case I experienced any issues with the on board part. Not bad for $372.00 shipped. Thank goodness, I haven't had to use it the extra part (knock on wood redface.gif). Overall, it hasn't disappointed at all. As a matter of fact, it's exceeded expectations.

I also own a Sony BDP-S5000ES that I purchased last year from the AV Science Store for $350.00 (Deal of the Decade) and it's just strictly for blu-ray playback and it too is a finely built device. Because of the laser issues that are prevalent in the 3930CI, I am considering the Denon DBP-4010UDCI to replace the 3930CI. Other than the HQV Realta vs. the ABT video processing, the blu-ray playback capability and the cleaner and more modern look of the 4010, they seem to be the same player.

Here's my quandary.... My 3930CI is working flawlessly. Everything functions perfectly. It's used primarily for redbook CD playback, with the occasional SACD/DVD-A play or DVD movie I don't have in my blu-ray collection.
The Sony BDP-S5000ES has also exceeded expectations. I find no fault with that player at all. The sometimes slow load times are not an issue to me. The blu-ray performance (video and audio) and the refine operation of the device is very impressive. May I again emphasize the impeccable build quality of this device? It's top shelf. Again, no complaints.

So, should I purchase the 4010 (by the way, the price is insanely low Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
$749.00
with full warranty) and sell the 3930CI to avoid what seems like the inevitable, failure of the laser assembly.!?!
The 4010 would provide me with an all in one solution, giving me similar if not the same audio playback quality as the 3930, but given the performance of the Sony there seems to be no reason to replace the Sony because I have to believe that the 4010 offers no advantage when it comes to BD playback. Is that a foolish assumption confused.gif
Given my setup (open link under my signature), would purchasing the 4010 be a lateral move or an upgrade. And let me be clear, 3D is of no interest to me at this point and time. So the Oppo BDP-95 has to bring something else to the table.

I also submitted this inquiry in the "Denon DVD-2930 and 3930CI" thread to hopefully gain perspectives from both sides of the equation.
Edited by ldgibson76 - 6/11/12 at 2:03pm
post #1040 of 1226
^You are amazing at finding bargains!
I have followed the Oppo player threads for some time. Most experts there say that BluRay bitstreamed from any decent player should be the same as the player is being used as a transport only.
post #1041 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

^You are amazing at finding bargains!
I have followed the Oppo player threads for some time. Most experts there say that BluRay bitstreamed from any decent player should be the same as the player is being used as a transport only.

Hello SOM.

Thank you for the acknowledgement. "Amazing" is too generous. Sadly, there's really nothing amazing about what I do. I'm what you call the consummate bottom-feeder. It's an exercise in patience and recognizing when opportunities meet expectations (finding and knowing a good deal when I see one). I search diligently for the closeouts, refurbs, and meticulously cared for pre-owned devices that are being offered at wallet friendly prices. My whole system has been purchased for 1/3 of the original MRSP, that includes the cables and other accessories.

In regards to the bitstreaming concept, you are correct in that assessment. But in my case, my current blu-ray player (S5000ES) does the hi-rez D/A conversion, decoding/converting the signal to LPCM then sending the signal via HDMI to the processor. My processor is only HDMI v1.1 capable and set to "pass-thru". The 4010, if I opt to purchase, will be used primarily for 2 channel/SACD/DVD-A and DVD playback. The blu-ray function is just a bonus, unless I discover that the 4010's blu-ray performance is superior to the Sony's, then it will become the primary digital device in my ensemble, which may push me to consider something 3D capable, like the Sony BDP-S790. shrug.gif
Edited by ldgibson76 - 6/17/12 at 8:28am
post #1042 of 1226
question

my 4010 will not recognize new BD 'My Week with Marilyn' the 4010 firmware is up to date

my Oppo 95 recognizes it and plays it OK

is this a known issue?

btw the 4010 is now being used with a Denon AVR100 and the DL4 works great

TIA
post #1043 of 1226
Hi, Mark. Welcome to the 4010/4311 group. I don't have that disc so cannot test it and search this thread turns up nothing. If you've done the FW update from just a few weeks ago (I haven't yet) and power cycled the player I don't have any suggestions. No posts on "Marilyn" on this thread or in google with 4010. I don't have the disc. There doesn't seem to be a lot of these players, or chatter about them.

Unrelated question 1: are you using DenonLink and if so, we'd be interested in any A/B comparisons to the Oppo as I'd done and reported previously on this thread starting here.

Unrelated question 2: Do you have any MC SACD with an LFE channel and if so, can you help us with some data on the potential .1 channel -10 dB issue recently discussed on the 4311 thread ?
post #1044 of 1226
Sigh with all these disc error problems on the Denon Universal transports, I'm beginning to second guess my decision to get the 4520 and a matching DL HD player.

Does anyone know if PQLS and HATS are cross compatible?
post #1045 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

Hi, Mark. Welcome to the 4010/4311 group. I don't have that disc so cannot test it and search this thread turns up nothing. If you've done the FW update from just a few weeks ago (I haven't yet) and power cycled the player I don't have any suggestions. No posts on "Marilyn" on this thread or in google with 4010. I don't have the disc. There doesn't seem to be a lot of these players, or chatter about them.

Unrelated question 1: are you using DenonLink and if so, we'd be interested in any A/B comparisons to the Oppo as I'd done and reported previously on this thread starting here.

although I have nothing I can quantify as to any sonic difference, I use DL whenever I can: I just prefer the sound

the Oppo 95 is the winner for speed and recognizing more discs

cannot help you on question 2
post #1046 of 1226
I was wondering:

has Denon announced any new players with DL?
post #1047 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by markrubin View Post

I was wondering:
has Denon announced any new players with DL?

Yes, the DENON DBT-3313UD Universal Blu-Ray Disc Player with Denon Link HD (A phono/RCA plug connection) and can be used with the new DENON AVR-3313 Home Cinema Receiver or the new DENON AVR-4520 Home Cinema Receiver.

No info about the DL HD link yet, AFAIK.

Deck
post #1048 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woof Woof View Post

Sigh with all these disc error problems on the Denon Universal transports, I'm beginning to second guess my decision to get the 4520 and a matching DL HD player...
In an effort to encourage your plan to pioneer the new Denons ;)I will state that I only recall a few disc reading problems mentioned here on the thread. And I believe that is pretty typical for most any player, other than Sony PlayStation which is apparently used by most studios to "test" their new releases. Of course there is the notable exception, as mentioned below of Oppo's CS dept, consistently quickly responsive to such issues. Note that Denon is still releasing FW updates for this model and would certainly be doing that for years to come on the new ones, but they're not as prompt as Oppo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by markrubin View Post

...the Oppo 95 is the winner for speed and recognizing more discs...
post #1049 of 1226
I've had to buy 4 Brothers in Arms SACDs. Only one (the last) could be read consistently as a hybrid SACD. Two were unreadable. One appeared as a HDCD. On the 4010.

On the 83 93 and 95 all appeared as Hybrid SACDs.
post #1050 of 1226
^Sorry to hear that. For clarity, are you talking about the 20th Anniv Ed BIA hybrid SACD? I have that version and it plays perfectly (all layers) in my A100 (4010) as it did in my Oppo 83 and 83 SE.
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