Denon DBP-4010UDCI - Page 38

David, thanks a million for the time to respond to me

I already had that setting changed. In fact I called Denon today, and they walked me through my entire setup, and it was all setup as best as it should be. I even did a initilaize reset per the Denon rep's recommendation, set all the settings again, and still it didn't work.

What I did notice is on my 2500, the TRUE HD light did not light up when I tried Risky Business today... On the 4010 it played the audio track 1 which was 5.1, but it wouldn't play in True HD, when I switched it to audio track 2 on the remote, it left DD 5.1 on my Krell and went to DTS Neo6 which is a matrix 2 channel mode... I did the SAME setup on my 2500, and what I again noticed (mentioned above) is that the logo on the unit itself stayed on DD 5.1... SO the only thing I can deduce is that the DVDO will not allow the player to push BD codecs to it... I know the 2500 plays BD Codecs when it was hooked to my 4808 AVR... now that it is going to the DVDO as a switcher, it won't...

So, since 2 similar machines made by the same company and hooked up to the same DVDO switcher both do not play BD Codecs, it would make sense this was the problem... I hooked up the 7.1 analogs today after figuring all this out and it sounds great. On Risky Business, I honestly can't tell much between DD5.1 and TrueHD swapping between the tracks, but at least I know it is setup for other movies...

On to another problem that reared it's head after doing all of this, my right rear channel SBR on the analogs doesnt seem to be outputting much. I tried Transformers 3, Tron Legacy which are both 7.1 movies, and I have SBL output but no SBR... I swapped the RCA inputs thinking I had a bad cable, same thing, SBL, no SBR... SO I thought maybe my amp or speaker was the culprit... I ran a 5.1 surround sound cd which will play on both my rear and side surrounds (per the Krell setup) and both the rear speakers work great... This leads to a problem with the 4010 not outputting the SBR channel properly... (I came from car audio world, there's a lot of trouble shooting sometimes, hahaha)...

Does anyone have a similar problem with their analog out puts? Would doing a software upgrade fix this? This is a BRAND new unit with a 9/09 MFD, it was a display that was never hooked up at a dealer... I doubt it's had any updates. Hooking up internet to it is not to trivial since it's in a bedroom that doesnt have hard wire internet. my XBox and PS3 are both wifi... Should I run a long @%# cable from my downstairs up to it and get it up to date? Im one of those guys if it's not broke, dont fix it... worried I do an update it might make the transport stop reading discs or something. lol

Have you run the 4010's internal test tones for analog out 7.1? If not, try Setup>Audio Setup>7.1ch Audio Out>MultiChannel>Channel Level>Start...you may have already done this. Hope you don't have a unit with a defective SBR out, IMO I don't think this is something that a firmware update will fix. Can you verify the 4010 is outputting a test tone from SBR and channel level is set properly?

Ha, this is something I didnt do! I copied all my settings from my Krell which I setup using a mic'd RTA (XTZ)... I am going upstairs to try this now, will report back asap.

David, just did the test, as I was expecting, NO SIGNAL at all from the SBR... all other channels work fine. not even a faint signal I could turn up db wise, just 100% dead silent.

Im stuck now whether to keep this thing and have it repaired or send it back... it is new which I like but it doesnt work... After reading all the fun people have had with these things, Im to the point of why bother. Also after A/Bing it with my Krell cd player, the Denon sounds harsh and high pitched with no sub bass and very little mid bass... That's not really the sound I am after. The Marantz 9006 probably sounds the same as this thing since they are basically brother's right?

Matt,
I am sorry things with the 4010 have not gone well for you...I use Denon Link and HDMI most of the time, but have also experimented some with the 7.1 analog outs using the Mch bass management in the player. Perhaps the settings in that menu need some tweaking? I set all speakers to small, set all crossovers to 80, try that it might help the bass.
You are correct about the Marantz I believe the two units are VERY similar from what I've read, however I have never heard one.
As much as I hate to say this, these are "older" universal players from D&M and they have their quirks, slow loading times, GUI and setup can be confusing, and there is some history of problems...you might want to consider an OPPO 93, 103, 95 or 105. I have never heard one but they are well reviewed and the customer support from OPPO is outstanding. If your priority is HDMI, the 93 or the new 103 would be fine and cost less. For enhanced analog performance that many rave about, the 95 or 105 would be worth auditioning IMO. I almost went in this direction, but since I have Denon AVRs (4310 and 4311) I tried Denon Link and found the DBP-A100/AVR-4311 to be quite a "dynamic duo". I agree with you about the sound being on the brighter side neutral at times, but using Audyssey XT32 room correction and a few other tweaks have helped me overcome this, YMMV of course!
Hope things work out OK for you!
David

In the 4010's analog Mch bass management setup menu there is an option to boost the LFE level 10dB, you might want to try this...not sure if your pre/pro has bass management for Mch analog, most don't...my AVRs will accept 7.1 EXT in analog but there is no bass management, EQ, etc. so I have to handle BM within the player.

I have trim settings I can play with on the Pre-Pro to adjust bass... it's not only that the bass is low, the mids and mid bass sound almost gone too. heh, and I have it setup at 80 and all speakers to small... same way my Pre-Pro is setup. I think it's the Denon sound they are after, which doesn't suck, it's just harsh and you cant play it loud without getting a headache. The louder I play my Krells' the better it sounds... to a point I can stand to be in the room anymore because db levels are way over 130...

I talked to the dealer and Denon, luckily I do have a warranty from a valid dealer (per Denon's lookup of the dealer to verify they were in fact authorized), so Im going to take it to a local repair facilty and hope they dont scratch it up and actually do repair it.

I need a high end player with analog outs. My Pre-Pro is older (Build date of 2/08) and doesnt do HDMI... the new version of the same pre-pro I have basically is 10 grand USED... I am fine without having HDMI.

FYI my dad has a 3800 Denon DVD player and an Oppo... he A/Bed them and the video and audio were much improved on the 3800... He also compared the 3800 to his new Mac MVP 881 which is essentially a Denon A1 player with a pretty front face, and the MVP and 3800 had similar pictures, but the MVP did actually sound better as well over the 3800. I was floored at how bad the Oppo actually was, so I am NOT getting anything that says Oppo on it... I guess I will try to get this fixed and hope for the best.

Don't know what model OPPO your dad has, but if it's a BDP-95 or BDP-105 I'm a little surprised by your impressions, but that is only based on what I've read, not actually auditioning either unit. On the other hand I've read some criticism of the 95 and 105 analog sound from some posters and reviewers, so I totally respect where you're coming from. Your Krell pre-pro is probably way more revealing than my AVRs, good luck with getting resolution for your issues with the 4010. If I can be of any more help, please post or pm me.

His is actually an 83, so maybe that is why it wasn't NEAR as good, BUT that said, we were comparing all through HDMI... no analog cheating or shortcuts... The 103/105 just came out, so I havent a clue about either of them and their upgrades vs the 83/95 series. Ill stick to my Denon stuff, just hope the repair place can fix it up properly without scratching it or messing something else up.

Thanks again for your help!

For those of you experiencing the "no disc" error, I have found the replacement optical assembly for 45 bucks. Purchased from Liberty Electronics' ebay store. Also fits Denon 1610. Doesn't seem like a difficult repair.

Selection of Disc Layer Question:

When I place a multichannel SACD in my DBP-A100, it frequently chooses the Stereo SACD layer rather than the Multichannel SACD layer. Is there any setting that will direct the unit to preferably choose the multichannel layer? Could this be due to a weak laser?

The manual states that the player will remember the last setting used, but my player often chooses the stereo layer even when the last disc was played in multichannel.
Edited by Hi-Res - 4/5/13 at 2:25pm

My dbp-a100 finally quit playing any blu-ray discs. Not sure if I'm going to drop it off at the local service center (dyna-tronics in Phoenix), or ship it back to NJ. Anyone have recommendations which is better, or no difference?

My 4010 died a few months back

That's what prompted me to go for the Marantz AV8801 instead of the Denon 4520 since as much as I like DenonLink, I just didn't like the idea of the finicky Denon universal transport

Don't know anything about that shop but barring bad info on them, I'd give em a try.
I myself had an exc experience with my local shop for my AVR 4310. No shipping delays and risks. Exc hassle-free fast service.

Well tonight I became a member of the "no disc" club w/blu-ray discs on my DBP-A100 purchased a year ago (almost to the day)...CDs DVDs DVD-As & SACDs will still load but no joy with BDs. Tried unplugging for 10 minutes and also did an initialization (press front panel disc layer, play and eject buttons simultaneously while unit is already powered on with no disc in tray)...even BD discs that have loaded & played fine in the past are not loading. I did purchase it from an authorized online dealer and warranty is for 5 years...I just got my AVR-4310 back from Denon PanurgyOEM (2nd trip to NJ) and finally got rid of it's FM HD radio "motorboat" sound issue, looks like I'll have to now ship the player. There is no Denon service center where I live, I'm almost certain they'll want me to ship it to Panurgy.
Can't say I'm surprised, I had read of this issue on AVS and AVforums in the UK, it seems to be caused by the lens being dirty and/or the drive mechanism/unit failing and needing replacement. Probably would not have purchased if it didn't have the extra 5 yr Denon 100th anniversary warranty...just was hoping I wouldn't be dealing with this just 1 year in. I'm afraid to open unit and try to clean the lens myself, has anyone here had any luck using a cleaning disc (brushless is best?)...seems like I remember someone reported at least temporary sucesss using compressed air...although my gut instinct tells me (especially after re-reading posts tonight on AVforumsUK 4010 thread) that the drive unit is going to have to be replaced. I have had very occasional instances where certain discs wouldn't load but tonight out of nowhere the failure is 100% with ALL BDs.
Sound of Mind, how is your A100 doing? I remember you posting some concerns about it a few months ago, did you have to get it serviced?
jasonmichaelh were you able to get your 4010 repaired?
@ Woof Woof how exactly did your unit die? I certainly agree with your comment about "finicky" irt Denon transports, wonder if the newer DBT-1713 and 3313 units are any better...
Being a user of Denon Link 3/4 w/AVR-4310 & 4311 (I have 2 A100'players) I certainly love the SQ but starting to get a bit frustrated with the "issues"...the Denon Link HD thing only makes matters worse.

Are "optical assembly" and "drive mechanism" 2 terms for the same part or 2 different things? On AVforums UK there are posts referring to replacement of the "drive mechanism", sorry if this is a stupid question. I went back and re-read posts on this thread and it appears to me you are the AVS member who used compressed air with the drawer open. If you or anyone else has any suggestions about how to avoid having to ship my unit to Panurgy (at least for a little while) I'd appreciate it. Thanks in advance.
Edited by davidbarrickman - 5/25/13 at 11:56pm

No idea how. I had hooked it up and played the occasional DVD-A and multichannel SACDs on it hooked up to my AVR4810. But when I tried playing some BDs, it stopped working.

It's still hooked up to the new Marantz AV8801 but I might take it out and use the rack space for something else eventually.

As for finicky, it had problems reading 2 of my 3 copies of Brothers in Arms SACD. One always read as a CD, one as a HDCD (I have no idea why) and only one copy registers consistently as an SACD. My Oppo 83, 93, 95 all see all 3 discs as SACDs consistently.

I have a Marantz SA8004 which does exhibit similar problems with SACDs.

Thx for your reply Woof Woof. In contrast to your experience, I've so far had very few problems with SACDs. In fact they load faster and with less "strain" than RBCDs on my 2 units. I've also been able to acess stereo, MCh and CD layers on SACD discs with only the very occasional glitch. Guess it's just a matter of time before I start having more problems with discs other than Blu-ray.

David, so sorry to hear about the DBP-A100 but glad they made good on the 4310. I'd try benign home treatments like compressed air but would do nothing to void the warranty like replacing parts as I fully expect Denon will fix your DBP.

BTW, when I purchased my used DBP A100 in Oct 2011 I was told by the orig owner that he'd had the transport replaced under warranty "as a precaution" so he could feel confident selling it.

What I posted about was that it seemed a bit noisier with the whirring and soft clunking as it loads. But I'd changed cabinets about that time and I don't have any vibrational isolators under the feet so I wasn't sure if the noise had really changed at all.

Also, at that time I bought a new big 3D "smart" Sammy TV and picked up a used "smart" Sammy BRP for 3D. So now I play all BluRays through that, as DenonLink doesn't make any diff on BluRay to me. I use the Denon strictly for music on a daily basis and it still works wonderfully with the AVRA100 via DL. That is, other than the player's inability to send HiRes PCM to get around the -10dB LFE MC SACD issue in the AVR. But I have an easy workaround in my subs- with a single button push on the sub remote control I select a dedicated preset for MC SACD that provides the boost.

DL is the ONLY reason to get an expensive, finicky Denon transport IMO. I couldn't agree more with you-as DLHD and DL3/4 are not compatible so IMO it makes no sense to invest in a new Denon transport unless upgrading to a new DLHD equipped AVR. There's the new X4000 but I'd prob not want anything less than a 4520. However based on others who've upgraded from 4311 to 4520, I'm skeptical there's much if any SQ benefit, except possibly Neo:X for film.

My analysis isthat its unlikely to be worth all the trouble buying/selling/switching out gear/new Audyssey Pro license/recalibrating etc for a 4520/3313 combo. So barring equipment failure I may well wait till the next year's models, hoping for other features/improvements. With my level of gear I believe there's smaller and smaller returns in chasing SQ with gear unless the gear offers something significant like the change from Audyssey MultEQXT to XT32. What would make a certain improvement is fixing my room acoustically but that's another can of worms.
Edited by SoundofMind - 5/26/13 at 4:57am

Woof, have you made comparisons that allow you to render an opinion on whether the 8801 matches or exceeds SQ vs Denon gear connected with DL?

I've considered that model as it has XT32, is Audyssey Pro capable, etc. though of course no DL. I think I heard the 8801 may have some fairly effective jitter-control strategy along with more "audiophile" analog preamp stages (though I'm only interested in the analog circuits that are post digital processing, I doubt I'd be feeding it analog)

The Oppo 103 also reportedly has low jitter via HDMI so may be a particularly good combo with the 8801?

I haven't been listening to multichannel stuff recently so haven't compared the two.

But for HT it does seem that going to a dedicated pre provides much more precise channel steering. Not that the 4810 is bad, but I am noticing much more precisely the 8801 places everything.

I havent done AutoEQ on the 8801. Lost the EQ on the 4810 for a few months so running it straight as well prior to the Marantz. Will get around to running EQ on it eventually.

^Dang, my room is so boomy I always immediately calibrate a new processor, new speakers, etc.

IME XT32 improves imaging in exactly that way for me over MultEQXT, while simultaneously providing more seemless integration of the surround bubble and increased detail. And Audyssey Pro takes all that up another notch.

But I wasn't referring to MC in particular. To me, there is a distinct SQ improvement to Stereo RBCD and Stereo SACD layer via DL, as well as for MC SACD and DVDA and that is why I'm hesitant to give it up.

Come to think of it, it wouldn't be that hard to do a Stereo A/B of
Denon player via DL->Denon AVR used as a pre/pro vs
Oppo player via HDMI-> Marantz pre/pro.

My amp has dual inputs. I currently use the RCA inputs on the amp for the Denon. So I'd use the XLR inputs for the Marantz, then just use the little switches on the back of the amp to do the A/B while playing level-matched short passages from sync'd identical discs. Hmmmm.... Worst case, I'd be out the return shipping on the Oppo and Marantz.

My subs are all into the room and not stuck in a corner and does seem to compensate well with their adjustments (Thiel SS2.2sx2 and a JL f113) and my main speakers are all placed for stereo, ie away from walls. So I've not experienced any noticeable boominess.

I will get around to implementing XT32 soon.

My centre channel power amp failed and I'm getting it fixed so I'm using my 4810 to drive the centre channel at the moment

I listen to stereo using my stereo setup. ARC Ref 5SE and either Playback MPS5 or EMM XDS1 for SACD. With a mini tweaked for music playback for hires audio (some ripped from DVDAs).

Good for you. that's the trick, getting placement right. But so far I haven't been able to do it despite careful placement of dual subs. I've got no front speakers near any corners and they're away from the back wall as well. I guess I can only do so much for this room without bass traps so I rely on Audyssey.

That's quite the Stereo pre. Streaming is on my to-do, looking for MCH HiRes. I was wondering if the Mar pre/pro "handled" that any better than 4311, 4520, etc
Edited by SoundofMind - 5/27/13 at 5:00am

The Thiels just need you to dial in the distance from the nearest walls. And the JL has its own calibration system.

hi
i have denon 4010 blu ray and denon avr 4810 i try to play with the blu ray 4010 via the denon link 4th there is sound but the lamp of the clock control (the 3rd lamp) in the 4010 not light i can not listen with the clock jitter please i need held how i can i make the clock jiiter lamp light
thanks
yaniv

Look at post 1028.

Belated thanks Sound of Mind for your reply. Glad to hear your DBP-A100 is still doing good and the sounds you noticed were related to the new cabinet. I have yet to contact Denon about my unit...after doing some more research online it appears that the Maxell BR-LC lens cleaning disc (brushless, uses air generated by 2 holes in the disc) may be worth a try. I may also try using compressed air. If these benign home treatments don't help, then I'll pursue warranty service/repair from Denon. CDs SACDs DVD-Vs & DVD-As continue to load and play OK...no joy with any and all Blu-ray discs. I do have a Marantz UD-5005 for a "back-up" player so my situation could be a lot worse. Grateful that I'm under warranty with the DBP-A100s, but not looking forward to the hassle & risk of shipping to Panurgy...

Please report back SOM if you do this, I would be very interested to hear your findings and impressions.

The maxwell disc, if it works at all, will likely just be a temporary fix. You may just want to plan on sending the player in for repair now.

I did wait until my unit completely stopped reading any bd disc before taking it in...I didnt want to deal with any run around. I don't know the protocol for repair with denon. If one disc played fine would they give it a clean bill of health and send it back to me?

If you try the compressed air and maxwell disc, the unit will probably operate intermittently, and you could be stuck waiting for it to fail completely again (on bd only), if your thinking is the same as mine. Thus why I suggest just get it repaired now. Plus, you will have more warranty time for any future issues, post repair.

Fyi - It's been almost 4 weeks since I dropped my player off at the local repair center, and I haven't heard back from them. I've got a ps3 and a Panasonic bdt-110 holding me over, but man I'm ready to get my a100 back.

Also, A guy over on the Denon A1 forum says the problem with no disc errors is usually stubborn grime on the lens, and the only way to clean is to remove and swab with windex. Supposedly alcohol will kill the lens. I won't take my a100 apart while it's under warranty, but might be useful information 4 years from now!