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Denon DBP-4010UDCI - Page 11

post #301 of 1124
12/23/09 at 7:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Let's both call today.

And my Ironman disc works on my other 9 playrs I have here. It is the 4010 (has the latest update as well)...

Checked Iron Man (Region B) out on mine just now and it worked perfectly. Looks like a Region A disc/player only issue then.
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post #302 of 1124
12/23/09 at 6:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by awhb View Post

I had a similar issue when I hooked up my 4010 to the 4810, I couldn't get the blasted third light to come on. In the end I did the following:
With both units on and AVR-4810 receiver on the DBP-4010 input:
i) On the DBP's setup menu go to Denon Link and set to off.
ii) On the AVR's setup, go to input setup for the DBP and set HDMI only (i.e. remove DLink).
iii) On the AVR then switch to another input and switch back to the DBP input
iv) On the DBP go back to the set-up make sure that HDMI audio is set to bitstream and then re-enable D/Link 4th - accept the HDMI Control prompt.
v) ON the DBP come out of the menu and press the HDMI Mode button on the remote -> HDMI On.
vi) On the AVR menu, go back to the DBP input and re-enable D/Link.
vii) Put BluRay disc into DBP and hopefully this time you'll see the illusive third light!


hehe thanks az I think mentioned this procedure involves a camel as well to work. By the look of things you need to be tickling the camel under the chin while giving it a kiss on the lips as well ! for the camel to pass through the eye of the needle oh sorry I ment for the clock signal to pass

when is denon going to get it so it just works I wonder ?

all right I'll give the rigmarole a try when have a chance. but not keeping my hopes up !
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post #303 of 1124
12/24/09 at 2:35pm
I made the choice of the Denon based on the picture and analog sound quality. Assuming that the 4010 is equal or better than the 3930, I can't see how I would go wrong. Has anyone compared the analog audio and picture quality between the 4010 and 3930? I suppose that another option would be to buy the 3800 closeout, assuming the equivalent picture and analog sound quality. But I would prefer one unit in the rack.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

ak2000,

If Denon is your player of choice and you require blu-ray, then the answer is yes. I'm not sure of the implementation, but I believe they use the same Burr Brown 1796 DACs.


Respectfully,
Willie

Quote:
Originally Posted by ak2000 View Post

My 3930CI has the best analog audio quality of any player I've ever owned for CD, not to mention the incredible 7CH analog audio. So any reason not to replace my 3930CI with the 4010? It would be nice to have everything play from one unit.
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post #304 of 1124
12/25/09 at 5:58am
DL4 cable and clock light

my clock light is stable on now playing BD's

tried the $500.00 DL4 cable and aside from it looking/ feeling like a more expensive cable there is no difference I can discern: back it goes

Note that if you disconnect the DL4 cable while the unit is running, or if it not seated tight, you need to restart the 4010 to re establish DL

also note HDMI control option should be grayed out in menu: means it is locked on
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post #305 of 1124
12/26/09 at 6:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ak2000 View Post

My 3930CI has the best analog audio quality of any player I've ever owned for CD, not to mention the incredible 7CH analog audio. So any reason not to replace my 3930CI with the 4010? It would be nice to have everything play from one unit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ak2000 View Post

I made the choice of the Denon based on the picture and analog sound quality. Assuming that the 4010 is equal or better than the 3930, I can't see how I would go wrong. Has anyone compared the analog audio and picture quality between the 4010 and 3930? I suppose that another option would be to buy the 3800 closeout, assuming the equivalent picture and analog sound quality. But I would prefer one unit in the rack.

ak2000,

I would think the video and audio quality would be similar and now you would have a one box solution with the addition of blu-ray. Both players use the HQV Realta and Burr Brown 1796 DACs so I wouldn't expect any discernable differences between the 4010 and 3930 in video or audio. You may actually feel in some instances that the 3930 looks better.

Good luck with your purchase.


Respectfully,
Willie
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post #306 of 1124
12/26/09 at 7:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

Both players use the HQV Realta and Burr Brown 1796 DACs so I wouldn't expect any discernable differences between the 4010 and 3930 in video or audio.

The 4010 uses ABT instead of HQV, so there's definitely the potential for video differences.
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post #307 of 1124
12/27/09 at 6:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

ak2000,

Both players use the HQV Realta and Burr Brown 1796 DACs so I wouldn't expect any discernable differences between the 4010 and 3930 in video or audio.


Respectfully,
Willie

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

The 4010 uses ABT instead of HQV, so there's definitely the potential for video differences.

gsr,

Thanks for pointing that out. I knew they used different video processors, but my fingers were moving faster than my brain.


Respectfully,
Willie
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post #308 of 1124
12/27/09 at 2:04pm
was watching black hawk down yesterday and paused it while went off to do something else. I like how the denon dims the whole picture when left on pause. Which would be kind for plasma's so it doesnt give them image retention on pausing.

on un pausing though I noticed it was quite a bit out of synch ie with picture and audio ! never seen this kind of thing with any other player. not really knowing what to do I paused it again and then unpaused which removed the issue immediately...phew. dont want to see that again ! I wonder if clock control will help wiht this kind of thing ? the track was a lpcm one on black hawk down so clock control would no doubt benefit it audio wise.

one other nice little thing I found while pausing is, while in pause if you hit pause again it does a frame advance, and with a subsequent frame advance with every press of the pause button. nice touch
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post #309 of 1124
12/27/09 at 2:36pm
I had a funny little episode myself yesterday with the George Michael Live in London BR.
I'd put the disc in and got sidetracked and I could hear the menu run through about 4 cycles (2-3 minutes of applause) before I actually got to sit down. When I did I then tried to move the cursor to setup and it wouldnt.

The "not allowed" symbol was appearing on the screen so I knew the remote was responding though I couldnt get the cursor to move on the screen and hitting enter/return would not start the concert either.

I then hit the eject button on the actual 4010 (not the remote) and that wouldnt work either.

I didnt even bother with the soft power off, I just went straight for the power cord.

That fixed it.
Full menu opperation once it all came back up again.
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post #310 of 1124
12/27/09 at 5:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azz View Post

I had a funny little episode myself yesterday with the George Michael Live in London BR.
I'd put the disc in and got sidetracked and I could hear the menu run through about 4 cycles (2-3 minutes of applause) before I actually got to sit down. When I did I then tried to move the cursor to setup and it wouldnt.

The "not allowed" symbol was appearing on the screen so I knew the remote was responding though I couldnt get the cursor to move on the screen and hitting enter/return would not start the concert either.

I then hit the eject button on the actual 4010 (not the remote) and that wouldnt work either.

I didnt even bother with the soft power off, I just went straight for the power cord.

That fixed it.
Full menu opperation once it all came back up again.

Presumably you have updated the firmware to the latest version?
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post #311 of 1124
12/27/09 at 11:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azz View Post

I had a funny little episode myself yesterday with the George Michael Live in London BR.
I'd put the disc in and got sidetracked and I could hear the menu run through about 4 cycles (2-3 minutes of applause) before I actually got to sit down. When I did I then tried to move the cursor to setup and it wouldnt.

The "not allowed" symbol was appearing on the screen so I knew the remote was responding though I couldnt get the cursor to move on the screen and hitting enter/return would not start the concert either.

I then hit the eject button on the actual 4010 (not the remote) and that wouldnt work either.

I didnt even bother with the soft power off, I just went straight for the power cord.

That fixed it.
Full menu opperation once it all came back up again.

was actually hoping to get that disc, will let you know if experience anything odd when give it a go.

I suspect players like this though very slick. are just not as bug free as eg my 5000es that is bullet proof. not seen even the hint of a bug anyplace. with the denon we see glimpses of bugs. which tend to go back under the floor boards once we whack them on the head !
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post #312 of 1124
12/28/09 at 1:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View Post

was actually hoping to get that disc, will let you know if experience anything odd when give it a go.

:

It's on special at JB at the moment..

Picture is so-so though audio was fantastic. I have to the audio is one of the best concert BR/DVD's that Ive had the pleasure of listening to.

awhb - unless there's been a new firmware come out in the last week, I'm running the latest.
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post #313 of 1124
12/28/09 at 2:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azz View Post

It's on special at JB at the moment..

Picture is so-so though audio was fantastic. I have to the audio is one of the best concert BR/DVD's that Ive had the pleasure of listening to.

awhb - unless there's been a new firmware come out in the last week, I'm running the latest.

thanks for the heads up az, see if I can grab one tomorrow

ps with player hooked upto the net, I checked for you. with last update you and I did when first got the players. We have the latest and no other update I can see to be done
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post #314 of 1124
12/28/09 at 2:39am
Has anyone done much in the way of playing with picture settings on the 4010 as yet?

Ive adjusted my TV rather than the 4010 though did apply a bit of Noise Reduction last night when watching the George M BR and it worked quite well.

Al, Thanks for the confirmation.
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post #315 of 1124
12/28/09 at 2:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azz View Post

Has anyone done much in the way of playing with picture settings on the 4010 as yet?

Ive adjusted my TV rather than the 4010 though did apply a bit of Noise Reduction last night when watching the George M BR and it worked quite well.

Al, Thanks for the confirmation.

not tried anything in the 4010 picture settings az, sorry I should have got back to you, but checked the thx optimiser for brightness, contrast and colour, sharpness and found what I had in the kuro for the sony player to be pretty sweet. so just left things as they were.

out curiosity what did you end up adjusting the noise reduction to ?
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post #316 of 1124
12/28/09 at 5:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View Post

not tried anything in the 4010 picture settings az, sorry I should have got back to you, but checked the thx optimiser for brightness, contrast and colour, sharpness and found what I had in the kuro for the sony player to be pretty sweet. so just left things as they were.

out curiosity what did you end up adjusting the noise reduction to ?

+2 on the NR.
The background of the set is a massive LED panel and it was causing jaggies against his suit jacket quite often. The above appeared to tidy it up.

Something I'd like to play with in greater detail though.

With TV settings, like yourself I didnt have to change anything from the settings I had for the 550.
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post #317 of 1124
12/28/09 at 3:23pm
Jumping in, but what's the considered view on the video processing of the 4010 ABT vs the AVP realta?
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post #318 of 1124
12/28/09 at 3:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by klnc View Post

Jumping in, but what's the considered view on the video processing of the 4010 ABT vs the AVP realta?

klnc I came across this post by I-Spy over on avforums the other day that I think may help with your answer.
Apologies if I've stepped on any forum etiquette in copying and pasting the below.


"Just a reminder in my video chain I have:

the 4010 (ABT 2010 chipset)
the AVC-A1HD (Realta sxT2 HQV chipset)
the JVC DLA-HD750 (HQV Reon VX chipset)

And I wanted to see which gave the best PQ. I used Pirates of the Carribean DVD as it has plenty of face close-ups, dark scenery, panning shots, and good use of colour.

ABT upscaling - very, very good. OK, there are some artifacts on the faces at mid-distance, perfect faces at close-up, and some artifacts on straight lines (i.e. ropes on the ship deck). But very smooth motion and I have to admit this is the first time I've watched a DVD and thought that - apart from the odd artifact especially shadow outlines of people at a distance - this was very close to what I'd get on Sky HD.

Realta upscaling - I set the 4010 to source direct to the amp which did the upscaling to 1080p24. I've always thought that the Realta was top notch (at least compared to the 2500BT's own video chipset) but it really stood no chance against the ABT. The main difference? Lot's of sampling problems that introduces jaggies, etc. I'd never really noticed it before but the ABT chipset is seriously outgunning the Realta. I'm a bit disappointed actually as I was hoping that the Realta would be similar if not superior (and I could go for an Oppo in source direct mode).

Reon VX upscaling - I actually ended up trying this out purely by accident. I had set the 4010 to source direct and forgot to turn on the I/P in the amp. I sat watching it for a good 5 minutes thinking bloody hell this is giving the ABT a run for its money (at the time I thought I was watching the Realta so I wasn't actually that surprised). However, when I did finally realise that it was the JVC chipset doing the upscaling on a 576i signal being passed straight from the disc through the amp I was actually pretty shocked. The Reon easily outguns the Realta and is very, very close to the ABT so perhaps the Oppo is back in with a shot!?

And so I have written off the Realta as a good upscaler (at least compared to the ABT and Reon) and I have spent the last hour comparing ABT/Reon. And what do I think? The ABT chipset is doing the better job. The Reon just softens the image a touch too much and is not digging out the black levels in quite the same way as the ABT. I will say it again chaps the ABT chipset is very, very good and I'm fussy especially when I'm watching an upscaled DVD on a 15ft screen!

I've just started looking at PQ on blu-rays but, to be honest, I'm finding it very difficult to make a useful comparison of the three chipsets. So far, there is very little about the 4010 playing BD's (except load times) that has made me sit up and think that it's superior to the 2500BT. If there is one area that I think could be an improvement and that is black level detail (by the way, I double-checked brightness/contrast with HD Essentials blu-ray before doing any tests). On some films (Mamma Mia, Transformers2, Batman Begins) there have been occasions with the 2500BT where I thought that the picture was too dark even though the display is properly calibrated. With the 4010 I am pretty sure I am seeing a lot more detail in the picture. Will keep testing and let you know."
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post #319 of 1124
12/28/09 at 3:52pm
Azz

could you provide a link to the post on the other forum?
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post #320 of 1124
12/28/09 at 3:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by markrubin View Post

Azz

could you provide a link to the post on the other forum?

As requested.
http://www.avforums.com/forums/blu-r...l#post11040161
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post #321 of 1124
12/28/09 at 9:21pm
I am not surprised with his Blu ray findings... The days of spending a lot on a Blu ray player are completely gone for me. And that includes the 4010...
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post #322 of 1124
12/29/09 at 3:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I am not surprised with his Blu ray findings... ~.

hardly suprised with his findings either. the scaling chipsets have really no real relevance for blu-ray at all. for DVD sure with his initial comparisons. But with the level of chipsets today really do we honestly think there is going to be anything much in it between one and the other ? perhaps its like audio where its not just the $2 dac chip but the way its implemented.

Have to ask yourself too, just how many scalers do we need ? one in the plaeyr, one in the avr/processor one in the display / pj. My self I'm just running the denon on pure direct sending native to my kuro to let it do its thing to great result. so not even bothered really about the abt scaler in the player or the hqv realta in the denon avp !

Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

! The days of spending a lot on a Blu ray player are completely gone for me. And that includes the 4010...

depends really what you buy a player like the denon for I guess. PQ wise I do think it is warmer more natural than my sony 5000es has for instance. was pretty happy with the sony ofcourse so not really the reason why I purchased the denon looking for PQ.

Audio wise I do think there are gains to be made with the denon. Sounds sensational. I'd swear a notch up from the sony. Its also for its audio capabilities as a universal player I'd suggest why many might consider this player. was probably the main reason for me. and it is a lovely player in that role. Also with a decent analog output probably another reason people might buy it.

So yeah I dont think its just as a blu-ray player people would buy this one joe, theres plenty of other options out there. So not suprised if others might consider something else if just looking for a plaeyr to foot that bill.

It is a class player though. I could not step down from the lovely sony been using and this one has more than filled its shoes for me
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post #323 of 1124
12/29/09 at 4:24am
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post #324 of 1124
12/29/09 at 4:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by awhb View Post

One annoying niggle I haven't been able to sort out with the AVR-4810 is that when I switch inputs to another (HDMI) source (e.g. PS3), if I switch the AVR's source input before the source is turned-on, I get picture but no sound; this is even though both picture and sound are configured via HDMI.

Switching the source off & on again, or switching to a different input on the AVR and back again don't make any difference; the only way I have found to regain sound is to switch the AVR off and back on.

If the source is already on when switching inputs initially, then all is fine.

Has anyone else experienced this? Any suggestions?

that is strange behaviour indeed not something have seen with my denon avp. the denon seems almost immune to this kind of thing.

I wonder if this is hdmi control related ? or somethign with the 4810 specifically. as am not using either. sometimes can be display related too. what display or pj are you running.

ps az, I got the george michael music BD today. boy BDs are cheap now ! this one was half the price have seen some DVDs at ! anyways I left the menu circulating about 4 times but it let me select the setup tab no probs. suspect your issue just one of those where caught the 4010 out. lovely disc though, only watched a few tracks. excellent audio and video. one will definitely have to get back to
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post #325 of 1124
12/29/09 at 6:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azz View Post

klnc I came across this post by I-Spy over on avforums the other day that I think may help with your answer.
Apologies if I've stepped on any forum etiquette in copying and pasting the below.


"Just a reminder in my video chain I have:

the 4010 (ABT 2010 chipset)
the AVC-A1HD (Realta sxT2 HQV chipset)
the JVC DLA-HD750 (HQV Reon VX chipset)

And I wanted to see which gave the best PQ. I used Pirates of the Carribean DVD as it has plenty of face close-ups, dark scenery, panning shots, and good use of colour.

ABT upscaling - very, very good. OK, there are some artifacts on the faces at mid-distance, perfect faces at close-up, and some artifacts on straight lines (i.e. ropes on the ship deck). But very smooth motion and I have to admit this is the first time I've watched a DVD and thought that - apart from the odd artifact especially shadow outlines of people at a distance - this was very close to what I'd get on Sky HD.

Realta upscaling - I set the 4010 to source direct to the amp which did the upscaling to 1080p24. I've always thought that the Realta was top notch (at least compared to the 2500BT's own video chipset) but it really stood no chance against the ABT. The main difference? Lot's of sampling problems that introduces jaggies, etc. I'd never really noticed it before but the ABT chipset is seriously outgunning the Realta. I'm a bit disappointed actually as I was hoping that the Realta would be similar if not superior (and I could go for an Oppo in source direct mode).

Reon VX upscaling - I actually ended up trying this out purely by accident. I had set the 4010 to source direct and forgot to turn on the I/P in the amp. I sat watching it for a good 5 minutes thinking bloody hell this is giving the ABT a run for its money (at the time I thought I was watching the Realta so I wasn't actually that surprised). However, when I did finally realise that it was the JVC chipset doing the upscaling on a 576i signal being passed straight from the disc through the amp I was actually pretty shocked. The Reon easily outguns the Realta and is very, very close to the ABT so perhaps the Oppo is back in with a shot!?

And so I have written off the Realta as a good upscaler (at least compared to the ABT and Reon) and I have spent the last hour comparing ABT/Reon. And what do I think? The ABT chipset is doing the better job. The Reon just softens the image a touch too much and is not digging out the black levels in quite the same way as the ABT. I will say it again chaps the ABT chipset is very, very good and I'm fussy especially when I'm watching an upscaled DVD on a 15ft screen!

I've just started looking at PQ on blu-rays but, to be honest, I'm finding it very difficult to make a useful comparison of the three chipsets. So far, there is very little about the 4010 playing BD's (except load times) that has made me sit up and think that it's superior to the 2500BT. If there is one area that I think could be an improvement and that is black level detail (by the way, I double-checked brightness/contrast with HD Essentials blu-ray before doing any tests). On some films (Mamma Mia, Transformers2, Batman Begins) there have been occasions with the 2500BT where I thought that the picture was too dark even though the display is properly calibrated. With the 4010 I am pretty sure I am seeing a lot more detail in the picture. Will keep testing and let you know."


Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View Post

hardly suprised with his findings either. the scaling chipsets have really no real relevance for blu-ray at all. for DVD sure with his initial comparisons. But with the level of chipsets today really do we honestly think there is going to be anything much in it between one and the other ? perhaps its like audio where its not just the $2 dac chip but the way its implemented.

Have to ask yourself too, just how many scalers do we need ? one in the plaeyr, one in the avr/processor one in the display / pj. My self I'm just running the denon on pure direct sending native to my kuro to let it do its thing to great result. so not even bothered really about the abt scaler in the player or the hqv realta in the denon avp !


I would just like to point out that in the case of the Silicon Optix Realta and Reon chips, implementation does play a significant part in their performance. This might explain why the above poster (I-Spy from AVForums) felt the HQV Reon VX chipset in his JVC DLA-HD750 projector performed better than the Realta sxT2 HQV chipset in his Denon AVC-A1HD processor.

In my system, I have a Denon AVP and a Denon 3800 which both have the Realta chipset. As one example of implementation variances, the Realta in the 3800 allows for all the adjustment settings availabe on that chip, while the Realta in the AVP does not. I cannot attest to any performance differences, as I never checked.

I also have an Onkyo TX-NR905 with a Reon chip in my family room system. The 905's implementation has issues with colorspace & 4:3 material, if memory serves.

To make a long story short, the performance of Silicon Optix Realta and Reon chips may vary between products, if recent history is any guide. I agree that a scaler is not really needed for Blu-ray. However, if you are using the player to spin DVD discs, a scaler that can do 480i to 1080p/24 is probably useful.

Mark
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post #326 of 1124
12/31/09 at 1:56pm
I remember the Denon DVD-A1UD being slower at loading Blu-Ray titles (Especially Java ones even compared to an older Panasonic BD30) and also slow to startup from power off without the quick start feature implemented.

Is the 4010 any faster than the A1UD in both of these regards as I have an Oppo BD83 which is a speed king and was hoping Denon has now caught up in this regard via firmware updates or other means.
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post #327 of 1124
12/31/09 at 2:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spizz View Post

I remember the Denon DVD-A1UD being slower at loading Blu-Ray titles (Especially Java ones even compared to an older Panasonic BD30) and also slow to startup from power off without the quick start feature implemented.

Is the 4010 any faster than the A1UD in both of these regards as I have an Oppo BD83 which is a speed king and was hoping Denon has now caught up in this regard via firmware updates or other means.

no, it does not seem to have improved in that regard
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post #328 of 1124
12/31/09 at 7:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spizz View Post

I remember the Denon DVD-A1UD being slower at loading Blu-Ray titles (Especially Java ones even compared to an older Panasonic BD30) and also slow to startup from power off without the quick start feature implemented.

Is the 4010 any faster than the A1UD in both of these regards as I have an Oppo BD83 which is a speed king and was hoping Denon has now caught up in this regard via firmware updates or other means.

spizz I can only comment vs the 5000es which I considered pretty quick player and the 4010 I have measured with a few discs to be faster to boot up and load discs.

cant comment on the dvd-a1ud.

there are some boot times and disc load times etc posted earlier in the thread which will give you some idea of how speedy this machine is.
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post #329 of 1124
12/31/09 at 9:19pm
does anyone know when HQV is releasing there new video Processors am guessing it will be in there next universal player from Denon has anyone heard any think about them. Cheers
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post #330 of 1124
1/1/10 at 1:39am
hey guys, can a 4010 owner please confirm for me please...

have noticed that on pure direct output the best I'm getting otu of it for blu-rays is 1080i for some strange reason.

I did take the player over to a friends place the other day and not sure if something with the last update but it wont send 1080p though in source direct when that is format on disc eg with a blu-ray. I can force it to 1080p mode and it does pass through.

my pplayer hdmi picture relatad settings are as per below.

deep colour : auto
auto format : max res
I/P Direct : Off
Color space : YCbCr

checking the settings on the avp.

it shows for hdmi info, signal info

for pure direct on the player
Resolution 1080i -> 1080i
coor space YCbCr 4:4:4 -> YCbCr 4:4:4
Pixel Depth 12 bits -> 12 bits

for 1080p on the player
Resolution 1080p -> 1080p
coor space YCbCr 4:4:4 -> YCbCr 4:4:4
Pixel Depth 12 bits -> 12 bits

the kuro is showing output from the player as 1080i when player set for pure direct and 1080p when player set to 1080p.

could someone else confirm please for a 1080p bluray
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