*Unofficial* Mitsubishi HC3800 Thread - Page 11

Offset is constant to image height (or diagonal). I think, if you change distance and zoom with constant diagonal, offset remain the same.

If the distance is constant (given for PJ which is mounted), changing zoom provide to change of offset (with change of diagonal)...

Check the Benq store often. I've seen refurbed W20000's show up in there for about $1600 (about 3 months ago). Yes it's a refurb, but its BenQ selling them, with a warranty.

I (like you) would have bought it in 1/2 a heartbeat, but alas, the zero offset (practically 0) won't work for Me . I'm just as upset about this as people who can't use a PJ they want due to Too much offset.

I don't check their store anymore, 'cause of course I can't make the W20000 work for me...

bsampson -- No, the HC3800 offset is relative to the bottom (or top, if ceiling mounting) of the screen.

Only those PJs, that have lens shift, refer to "0" offset as being relative to the screen center.

wiatrak -- Your second paragraph is confusing the issue. If you zoom the PJ, you are, effectively, changing the screed size. The offset is based on screen size only (a percentage of the screen height). It is assumed that the owner will zoom the image to fill the screen height (for a 16:9 image or 4:3 image, only).

Claus,

So does the distance between the bottom or the screen (or top in ceiling mount) and the center of the lens remain constant when zooming in or out?

I think I know what you are trying to ask.

You're asking if the offset (in %) is different for the same screen size, but the projector at different zooms. So say 100" diagonal = 87" x49"H.

34% of 49" High = 16.66" offset.

This will be the offset regardless if you mount the projector 10ft from the screen and zoom to 100" dia or mount 15ft from the screen and zoom to 100" dia. The offset will be 16.66" (assuming it's actually 34%) either way.

While we are waiting for the first units to ship, here is some marketing information on the HC3800. It helps understand what the design brief was.

http://www.projektoren-datenbank.com...ihc3800-en.pdf

I also note that the European model seem to be dual voltage, whereas the North American spec sheets only talk about 110V (which may be wrong)

I wonder why the brochure says "Convenient Power zoom/focus and lens shift" when we all know it doesn't have lens shift.

The brochure says also: "0.74" 3-DLP® (with Micro Lens)".

I think it is copy/paste bug from new LCD PJ specs...

I asked a guy in Magnolia today... he said that BB would not be carrying the 3800 Between that, the pricing of the Optoma HD20 at $1099, and the general lack of knowledge about projectors with their staff (I had to talk to two guys before I got someone who knew what I was talking about) I wonder why BB is even in the projector market.

Yes. The image remains centered on the screen.

wiatrak -- The only difference between your quote and the one in the brochure for my HC5500, is the replacement of "LCD" by "DLP". AFIK, there are no 0.74" DLP chips (their closest one is 0.7"). Your conclusion that it is a "copy/paste" error is correct, IMHO.

laeriq -- Because they can make a lot of money/PJ for the ones they do sell (more than they do for flat panel TVs, since they have local competition for those). Also, warehouse costs are a lot lower, so they have a higher profit margin. Their only competition are other BB store managers who chose to lower prices to move more product.

That's assuming they sell them... at least in the two stores I frequent I don't see many moving. I see lots on clearance... in fact the one I was at today the HD20 was the only non-Magnolia projector they didn't have on clearance. They had the Optoma HD71, Epson 6100, and Sony something or other (older 720P). I just think that if they carried items like the HC3800 and actually promoted them like they do flat panels that they would enjoy all the advantages you describe. I know for one that I would take a hit on sales tax just to buy a HC3800 as soon as it the store.

Also "Micro Lens" (Array) is describe of LCD panels... Next one typo.

In other place of this brochure, it is corectly written: "0.65" 1-Chip DMD, DDP3021".

Bummer, but figured as much due to lower profit margin .

Thanks for the info .

Jason

Bummer. That seemed to be the ideal offset for my room. I'll have to see what the final spec is, but it probably is that 35% someone mentioned on the xx1000.

Best Buy will not carry any fp that does not have lens shift.They had so many problems with the old Mit 3000 that they learn their lesson.To many people return them because they could not get it to work in their room.Got this info from a store manager.

They carry several without lens shift including the Optoma HD65.
I wouldn't put much faith in the word of store managers...

Hey guys I always see Art's reviews use the term "best mode". What exactly does he mean by best mode? When in best mode what settings is he using, high lamp, gammas, etc...

Thanks
Legairre

By "Best" Art means the settings that provide the Best Cinematic image.

On many projectors this is also the dimmest image as it the settings that give you the greatest contrast and best blacks.

However, on the HC3800 this "Best" setting also provides very high lumen output... not maximum, but much higher than on most projectors.

Art will list in the calibration section of the review the settings he used to obtain this... however as every projector and bulb are different those settings will Most Likely not be the same as what we would need with a different projector..., but for many they provide a good "starting point" from which you can try and calibrate your projector for your room conditions, screen, and bulb.

As the projector Art was using was just an "engineering sample" he may not have posted the settings used yet... he will probably wait until he gets an actual "production" model to publish those settings.

The only thing I don't like about Art's reviews is that he normally has the projector's bulb set to high power.

I seem to remember he tests them both ways.

Thanks Steve that explains a lot.

I wish it was more clear when he was in high and when he was in eco-mode.

I agree. And because of the confusion, you don't know if you can use his settings. Are you listening ART?

Hey guys I found the throw distance calculator for the HC3800. Just click the link under the pic of the projector. http://global.mitsubishielectric.com..._features.html

Legairre & Jim McC -- Art is very specific about how he does his reviews. All of the calibrations are done in the "high" lamp mode. He also includes the effect of using the "low" lamp mode, as well as the effect of using the zoom. Complaining about common details (of the "cut & paste" variety) is being totally unfair to Art. After all, he is the only person doing the large number of PJ reviews that he posts. Only recently has he gotten calibration support from Mike (http://www.surfremotecontrol.com/). Remember, that each PJ may need a different set of calibration settings for your setup -- they vary from unit to unit and depend on your screen and viewing conditions. Reading more than one or two reviews of Art's will make this information very clear (he tries to be very consistent, so the reader can make the needed comparisons). He also specifically states that his "screen shots" are intended to support his text, and not the other way around (ie, comparison of relative PJ performance).

If it sounds like I'm a "fanboy" of Art, I am. I have been reading his reviews for the last 5+ years, and I'm very familiar with them. His reviews are very through and contain sufficient detail for me to make an intelligent purchase. This is contrary to the one page "summary" type reviews that are published by Evan Powell and his staff at PJC (and some of their recent ones seem to have included more errors than usual).

For the most part, switching from "high" lamp to "low" lamp power will not effect the calibration settings significantly. It didn't for my current 1080p PJ. This is also why Art states that each owner should do his own calibration, YMMV. In his newer reviews he does state that his calibration settings could be used as a ""starting point", but is not a substitute for doing your own calibration.

CT with all due respect I've read many of his reviews and it's not always clear when he's in high and when he's in eco mode. Some reviews it's very clear and others it's not. I also don't ever remember complaining about any cut and pasting. I asked a simple question, got an answer from Steve and replied that I wished it was more clear which mode he was in. Nothing more, nothing less.

With that calculator, it seems like ceiling mounting is a no go with ceiling 8 ft. and under. I tried getting at least a 120 in. diagonal screen that is about 3 feet off the ground and it just wasn't going to work. The largest screen I got to fit was 80 in. which seems quite disappointing for a projector..

Grimm, You can get a 120" with a 8' ceiling, but you'll have to tilt the HC3800 up a bit. My current projector(HC1500) has a 35% offset (34% for the HC3800) and with the slight tilting the viewable area of the screen is 19" off the floor with no bowing of the image.

According to the HC3800 calculator the image will be 5" higher due to the 1% difference in offset from my current projector which would put the image 24" off the floor and I have a 7'4" ceiling in my basement.

With an 8' ceiling and slight tilting of the projector you should be able to get a 108" image at about 30" off the floor. Bump it up to 120" and your probably at around 20" off the floor like my 108" screen.

If you look at the pic 20" off isn't that bad. I know it's not the 36" you want but it is do-able.

Are you using the keystone feature to straighten the image out?

No keystone at all. Myself and several others with the Mitsubishi HC1500, HC1600 and HD1000U, tilt the projector without any keystoning. You can tilt a certain amount before getting the trapezoid effect. I've noticed I can tilt enough to raise the screen about 5 inches, after that I get the bowing /trapezoid effect.