*Unofficial* Mitsubishi HC3800 Thread - Page 104

Here is what we know so you don't have to back and read the thread:

You can still get a bad unit even if it is purchased from new stock, but it is far less common than a pre-Dec 2009 unit. A good majority of pre-Dec 2009 units appeared to have the shutdown issue, whereas a much fewer number of newer units have it. On rare occassions, certain shutdown issues could be HDMI related and can possibly be worked around by changing your HDMI setup (but if you get a shutdown that can be fixed by doing this, you probably still have a unit that is too sensitive or "barely defective", and I would still recommend sending it back to play it safe).

There is a bunch more info related to this, but if you get a shutdown unit it's best to just send it back and not obsess as to why it occurs.

Hey all,

been lurking for a while on the forum- and finally pulled the trigger from pjpple. It is supposed to be delivered this Friday!! Upon setup I am going to connect ps3, apple tv, and time Warner all via hdmi through monoprice switch.
I am planning on calibrating with my DVD essentials through the ps3.

Currently I have the following pj's:

epson hc 720- (>30hrs.)pm if you would like to buy
sharp xv-z2000-(>12hrs.)pm if you would like to buy

in the past I have owned or setup:

infocus x1, 4805
sanyo z4
sim2 domino 80
sim2 c3x

I am really curious to see how this budget unit stacks up to the others I have viewed and will post a review soon. Thanks for reading this far and happy viewing!!

Sounds like you got a setting wrong on your player's output.

Read the below article:
http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/ca...vels-xvycc-rgb

Ensure whatever device you are viewing has "normal" settings while changing the contrast on your projector. For instance, the device your using might be altering the contrast by itself.

You guys have me laughing on the contrast settings. +28 on contrast, no you should not leave it at +28 unless you are projecting onto a really odd surface as I cannot imagine a +28 contrast being correct, or unless your device is messed up.

I could see very slight blotching on skin tones at anything above -5 to or so, major blothcing at +10... According to Spears and Munsil, my correct contrast was about -9 or so.

I've been looking at picking one of these up to replace an aging CRT projector. At Tiger Direct they have two different HC3800 listed with a $50.00 difference. Does anyone know/have thoughts on the difference between the two listings? I'm wondering if one is old stock and the other new. Also, does anyone have an opinion on the lamp rebate when purchasing through TD, it's not listed on the website. Thanks for any help.

Stu

Thanks for the reply.

With the hc3800 do you normally watch everything in eco "best mode"? Do you ever use the brightest setting or is the normal "best mode" just as bright as other projectors on their brightest settings?

Bottom line, I don't want to be forced to use the highest brightness on the hc3800 and get a green tint, just so that I can have enough brightness to handle some ambient light. Why don't people complain about the tint and why hasn't it been fixed by Mitsubishi?

Ok, well as I had mentioned before, the HC3800 was the only PJ I've heard that would shutdown during a video sync issue, which it shouldn't do.

Yes, there are other brand PJ's that have shutdown problems, but none (that I know of) did it due to just switching sources.

There were some (you?) that seemed to post that the HC3800 shutdowns from switching sources wasn't necessarily a defect, that other PJ brands shutdown too. Some of the posters here even wrote like it was their 'fault' it shutdown 'cos they did too many source switching.

I think I had made the point before that no PJ should shutdown due to vid sync issues and that I haven't heard of another that did (other than another mits model---hd1000?). I think maybe you posted something about posters having the same/similar problem in the panny thread, etc. To me it isn't the same problem if it doesn't happen during a source switch.

To me it seems like the guys in the Panny thread just didn't know 'why' since it was more random. With the HC3800 it was quite obvious what was triggering the shutdowns.

Cool!

What size/type screen?

I looked and it is strange they have 2 different HC3800's listed. Seems to be a listing error. One unit they have as 30lbs the other 11 lbs!

Anyway, I wouldn't order from Tiger.....they have no lamp rebate listed on their site, so no ammunition against Tiger if Mits denies the rebate.

Anyway, you can get it cheaper from either of AVS's forum sponsors and they list the rebate, so no reason to pet the Tiger

Thanks btiltman. HDMI Output Range is set to Standard(default). And there's Black Level Control, which is set to lighter. But that feature doesn't apply with HDMI. I guess I'll leave contrast at zero.

Without rehashing the debate, my main debate topic was that most will probably get a good unit and the problem is not as common as people were thinking. I'm not trying to prove anyone was right or wrong, I'm simply trying to establish for the fence sitters not to be so worried about an issue that can easily be taken care of (by RMA, vendor exchange, etc..).

IMHO the hc3800 has no competition in its price range and with the newer units it also appears to be at the top of the QC , we'd have to compare the QC of the other PJ's that we should assume to be competing (AE4000u, 8500ub, Sanyo z3000, Benq w6000, LG cf181d). I don't even consider the Optomas, Viviteks, or the other sub $1,500 projectors to be competetive on image quality with the hc3800, so we can throw those out. It also seems the 8500ub does not have that much 3D pop, so in all honesty I think most are going to prefer the hc3800's 3Dish image even over the $2,300 Epson (and certainly over the Epson 8100). I cannot comment on the LG cf181D as it is harder to discern, but based on Art's review, it doesn't seem to have that much ANSI contrast, but just a lot of brightness. We also know that the BENQ would be the most similar looking to the hc3800 except a bit more contrast and sharpness, if you are willing to risk the worse RBE, worse QC, and lesser warranty for double the price (no thanks), then the Benq w6000 might be the perfect choice (not for me).

Since I am seeing a consensus on the Panny 4000 having some of the most 3Dish POP of all the LCD's under 3K, then I am fairly convinced on the Panny (to me 3D pop and shadow detail are more important than some pitch black muddy looking scene that the 8500ub is capable of). Not to mention the Panny 4000 has more features than the others (motorized ZOOM and auto 2.35:1 adjusting here I come!). If I could find a DLP without RBE (sharp XZ-15000?) and the Panny turns out to not be what I want, then maybe I'll go back to DLP, but let's hope not...

I will probably soon own a Panny, so we shall see how this goes...

I've read the other threads, and I can tell you that the hc3800 has fewer issues overall as long as you get a unit without shutdowns (and most people should according to the poll).

There are so many returns on the 8500ub, and the reason the Panny users tend not to NOT know what the problem is because there are so many different issues on them that people are not focused on one ISSUE (hence some had convergence, some shutdowns, some color problems, some Iris breaking, some lamps, some focus breaking, etc..)... That said, the Panny still has FAR fewer issues than it appears that the Epson 8500ub has, I never saw several people having to return 4-5 units in a row on the Panny thread like I did in the Epson thread. The Epson 8500ub on the other hand had the RED-LINE issue, but more importantly has severe QC with convergence and CA on certain units.

So one the more interesting comparisons I have seen for the Panny 4000 I might buy was VERSE what was originally a $7,000 DLP - the sharp XV-Z20000. The poster seemed very knowledgeable and honest about the comparison, and I think it reflects that DLP still has a more 3Dish POP look to it than LCD (so you guys are lucky with the hc3800), but he still really liked the Panny too... Of course the Sharp is going to be superior to the hc3800 by a bit too most likely, but this gives me a general idea of what I might lose going from LCD to DLP in today's world.

Panasonic 4000
---------------
Better shadow detail than the $7K sharp (wow, suprising)
Blacks not quite as good (well they should still easily beat the hc3800)
Good Pop but cant quite match DLP's ANSI (Still trying to find some reliable ANSI readings on the Panny, it might get close to the hc3800 in a correct setup, but it will lose ANSI faster)
Superior Motion to even last year's DLP's (suprising somewhat, we shall see if this is true)
Sharpness not as good but close (suprising, he said the sharpness on the Panny did not bother him at all compared to the DLP SHARP, even if it was a 1/2 notch down, cool!)

$7000 dLP - Sharp XV-Z20000
------------------------------
More 3Dish POP in some scenes due to higher ANSI contrast
Better Blacks in some scenes (well it is a 7K projector after all)
Slightly sharper
Worse motion handling


I could probalby live with those things as long as I get some 3D pop on the Panny (as long as it is say 80% of the hc3800's POP).

Thanks for the reply, was only looking at TD because of the 15% from bing, but if you don't get the free lamp it kind of negates the savings.

Stu

Yes, I watch everything in eco mode. I do not see the need for anything brighter. As a matter of fact, with all my current settings and running in low lamp mode I would say that the image is bias towards slightly overly bright - depending on the content. Football looks great. Hockey, with all the white ice, may be slightly too bright. Most movies and tv are perfect.

The green tint you refer to I only see if I go with "Sport" mode. I don't go with sport mode. I use "Video" gamma mode. The lamp is on low. I turn down the green contrast and green brightness in the color temp menu. I turn up the contrast, brightness, color and sharpness. Brilliant Color is on. Color Management in the image menu is on.

100 people could look at the same image and you could get 100 different opinions. That is to say that I am sure there are people that would disagree with my settings - just as I strongly disagree with how every crime drama on tv these days is shot as if though nobody ever turns on a light - way too dark. But, in general, the 3800 is a very bright and accurate projector and it does a fantastic job making those dark shows watchable.

I just got my package from Dell and though I would post some info about it. I tried to find out from our rep is the stock was indeed from Mits USA but he could not confirm so I just went ahead with the purchase. Here are some pics to confirm it is definitely from Mits USA.





I am at work now so I have not had a chance to turn it on but I hope I will have a little time with it tonight. Almost forgot to mention the serial number is 75xx.

Thanks. I went back and read 'em anyhow. It would be nice to know why they shutdown, but not the least bit important. It's new and it doesn't work right - return it. Simple.

I sent mine in to Mits last week. Waiting on the new one.

Hmmm....it only shows 10% today, which brings it very close to the forum sponsors prices....

Don't know about the CMS setting but will check it next time I fire up the 3800. Those contrast settings are way too high, I can get that high too with certain patterns according to the bars but it is not the proper setting.


LOL, that's pretty dang funny. I checked for everything like that down to reflections from something in the room (pulled the pj down and put it in another room on a different screen... still there).


-10 is probably the safe spot for most people using Panasonic bd players but I discovered through my custom set-up that I could bump to -8 without any negative effects (color push).


Contrast at 0 is still going to be too high .

Are you maybe passing through an AVR/scaler that alters the signal?

Jason

If anyone can measure the lens edge diameter size (o.d. and i.d. if possible)?

I think I'll order an ND2 filter before I order the HC3800 as I have a small screen now (60") and I'd like to test out the HC3800 on that screen 1st for any problems....before I spend $$$ on a new screen (bigger and .9 gain) just for the HC3800.

Thanks.

DooLocsta, thanks for the pics. It looks like it was drop shipped directly from Mitsubishi. Also good to hear the SN was a high number.

If 0 is too high, what should I set it to? I have the Pan. BD60 and Toshiba HD-A2 hooked up(HDMI) to the Insignia NS-R5101HD receiver, then 1 HDMI cable to projector. The receiver does not have any signal conversion or upconversion. But whether it's messing with the contrast I don't know. Is anyone else using the 3800 with the BD60 or HD-A2? If so, what are your contrast settings? Thanks.

Just spoke with Mitsubishi again to find out when I may be getting my replacement 3800. The guy said that they should be releasing the "new units" tomorrow. Hmm, I didn't ask, but maybe they have a new batch of 'em coming out. Sounded like it, anyway.

If I could find my micrometer I would be happy to do it but since my last move it has not turned up . I'm sure somebody else here has one and can do the deed for everyone.



While I have not used the BD60 I have read that they produce the exact same image and use the same processing as the BD35 so I would suggest a contrast setting of -10. Can you try to bypass the AVR and do a direct HDMI connection from the BD60 to the 3800 (just for testing purposes) so that you can verify the AVR is not altering the signal?




I too have a brand new unit coming direct from Mits in the next few days, they are even going to inspect it (check it out) before shipping (as arranged by my exceptional vendor) .

Jason

So, Jason, how are you able to determine that the -8 or -10 is about right for a Panasonic Blu Ray player? I understand from your posts that you are very adept at calibrating grayscale, etc., so contrast is probably a piece of cake for you, right? I used the DVE Blu Ray disc and it worked on the ramps test at settings up to 18 or 19. I thought this seemed high, but I do not like setting things "by eye", so I left it there. I do notice a bit of over saturation on the colors, but no blotching. What test pattern on which disc did you use to determine this? I have both AVIA and DVE Blu Ray. Thanks for your input, I would love to get the contrast dialed in.

Jack

PS I still say that the 3800 beats the z12k (not the mk II) for overall picture!!! And, no...it is not the lumens influencing me...or is it?!?! My z12k was ISF'd too and the 3800 isn't, yet. ;-)

What a wild ride. I went from originally wanting the HC3800, to discounting it because of initial issues, then to the vivitek HD1080, then the Benq W1000, then after finding out the whole color wheel speed thing I said screw it and was going to go for the 8500UB. Then they had the dreaded red lines but that got fixed and I could get one for 1950 shipped, then the Mits got their act together and offered a spare bulb, and many were getting good units...right back where I started. I ordered from Amazon moments ago. I can't wait.

Jack,

I use a pc (with a sensor/hcfr/colorfacts test patterns) and check the various settings for RGB & YCbCr at both 16-235 and 0-255. I then set the calibration memories based around what my sources are. I know my BD35 is sending YCbCr/16-235 and my Xbox360 is sending RGB/0-255 (how I have it set for gaming). After setting up the calibration memories I can check them against the actual sources and tweak if needed.

PS: I can see how you could prefer the 3800 to the 12K .

Jason

I will probably just take your word for it and lower it to -8. As you may or may not remember, I have a BD-55 also and I also play Xbox 360, but I use the component not the RGB. So I am sure if it worked for you that it will be fine for me... I used the dithering test on a black screen for my brightness and came up with +4 which I think seems to be about right from what I am seeing from others on here.

Did you ever find out about the rainbow artifact you were experiencing, that was very peculiar?

I am now at over 300 hours (serial #26xx, firmware 1.0) with no shut downs or issues other than the color shift, which has gotten a bit better, but it is still noticeable to me on solid white or gray screens. I heard someone saying it goes away with time, but I think that is bogus information... No big deal, I can live with it.

Jack

How are your thoughts these days against your MK2? (not counting the color shift stuff)?

You think it will replace your Sharp if you get a good unit?

[quote=DaGamePimp
While I have not used the BD60 I have read that they produce the exact same image and use the same processing as the BD35 so I would suggest a contrast setting of -10. Can you try to bypass the AVR and do a direct HDMI connection from the BD60 to the 3800 (just for testing purposes) so that you can verify the AVR is not altering the signal?
Jason[/QUOTE]

Thanks Jason. I'll run HDMI direct to the projector tonight and try the AVS709test patterns again.

REBATE question: Are we supposed to send in the white sticker that peels off the box for the rebate? The one with the model # and serial # on it?

Xbox360 numbers are a bit different than the BD player, don't recall them at the moment however. I am not using Component at all however so be sure to check those numbers .

There is something inside the light tunnel on the colored 'blob' issue, that unit is being sent back while I use 3800 #2 and wait for 3800 #3 .




It cannot match the 12K mkII for contrast (depth), black level or sharpness (not pixel fill or detail) but it bests it on just about everything else. While it cannot match the Sharp over-all the other benefits for my current room are certainly welcome additions.




Yes the entire white sticker needs to be sent in (from the box) in order to obtain the lamp. I had to cut mine off the box as trying to pull it off was only making it rip. You can pre-register for the lamp online if you go to the link on the rebate, this means you don't have to use the 'handwritten' submission form, you fill out the online form and print that one out instead (to send).

Jason

Thanks Jason. Back to the contrast issue, what's strange is my HD-A2 tests out at 22 contrast(with the AVS709 test patterns). I can't test out the projector until later. I wonder if there could be a problem with the AVS709 test patterns? I posted in the BD60 and HD-A2 forums also, to see if there's some problem I don't know about.