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The Official ChromaPure thread - Page 143

post #4261 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by xitman View Post

Ah bummer! Amazon had it for $171 brand new. Guess I'll have to figure out HCFR with your guide or go with CalMAN. Thanks for the reply.

I think you will find the same problem with Calman.
post #4262 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsinger View Post

I think you will find the same problem with Calman.

CalMAN supports both the i1 Display Pro retail and OEM.
post #4263 of 5345
Ok I was about to buy this, so this might sound like a stupid question. What is the point of imposing restrictions like this? Isn't the meter meant to be used with software like CalMAN and Chromapure in the first place?
post #4264 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by holmern View Post

Ok I was about to buy this, so this might sound like a stupid question. What is the point of imposing restrictions like this? Isn't the meter meant to be used with software like CalMAN and Chromapure in the first place?
My guess would be that Xrite wants to make more $$$ and it might cost a lot for the retail meter license.
post #4265 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by xitman View Post

Ah bummer! Amazon had it for $171 brand new. Guess I'll have to figure out HCFR with your guide or go with CalMAN. Thanks for the reply.
Be careful not to confuse the i1 Display Pro with the ColorMunki Display. The former is selling on Amazon now for $213 and the latter is selling for $169. There is a real performance difference between the two.
post #4266 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

Be careful not to confuse the i1 Display Pro with the ColorMunki Display. The former is selling on Amazon now for $213 and the latter is selling for $169. There is a real performance difference between the two.
You get $40 off at checkout. It's under special offers and promotions on product page.
post #4267 of 5345
Tom, getting error messages when I try too pull up the detailed post calibration reports.

They wont load, the simple report option does load though.

Any ideas?
post #4268 of 5345
One more question Tom, do you have the capability too do a recalibration on my i1Pro?

I think its a D.
post #4269 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

Tom, getting error messages when I try too pull up the detailed post calibration reports.

They wont load, the simple report option does load though.

Any ideas?

If you have non US windows, you should check this post
post #4270 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

Tom, getting error messages when I try too pull up the detailed post calibration reports.

They wont load, the simple report option does load though.
Yes, this is addressed in 2.4.1. I can give you a beta now or you can wait a few days for the full release. This is caused by our addition of a 0% reading to the grayscale and a contrast ratio in the report. If the meter cannot read 0%, it just returns 0, and then when CR is calculated a divide by zero error occurs. You can also use the Excel report now.
post #4271 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

One more question Tom, do you have the capability too do a recalibration on my i1Pro?

I think its a D.
Yes, but the calibration will only be good in CP. If you want recalibrated readings outside of CP, you'll have to contact X-Rite.
post #4272 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

Yes, this is addressed in 2.4.1. I can give you a beta now or you can wait a few days for the full release. This is caused by our addition of a 0% reading to the grayscale and a contrast ratio in the report. If the meter cannot read 0%, it just returns 0, and then when CR is calculated a divide by zero error occurs. You can also use the Excel report now.


I actually skip reading zero because I gave up after about 8 minutes, and saw a Chromapure is not responding message.

Oddly when doing the on/off contrast reading it completes the reading in about 5 minutes.

I think I'll wait for the full version, by Friday maybe?

Hopefully the new version will do a better job at 20ire, at present the readings are pretty dramatically all over the place from one reading too the next.

I'm using your Display 3 Pro on the new VT60 plasma by the way.

Thank you for the great support by the way.
post #4273 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

Yes, but the calibration will only be good in CP. If you want recalibrated readings outside of CP, you'll have to contact X-Rite.


That's awesome, price?

Thanks again.
post #4274 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

I actually skip reading zero because I gave up after about 8 minutes, and saw a Chromapure is not responding message.
Skipping reading zero has the same effect. It returns zero for black level and the error occurs.
post #4275 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

That's awesome, price?

Thanks again.
$150.
post #4276 of 5345
Is there an exact number as too how low my Display3 Pro will go because when im doing on/off contrast ratio it comes back 0.000 with a final reading of 77, 567 on my VT60 plasma.
post #4277 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

Is there an exact number as too how low my Display3 Pro will go because when im doing on/off contrast ratio it comes back 0.000 with a final reading of 77, 567 on my VT60 plasma.

From Tom's X-Rite’s Display 3 Tristimulus Colorimeter Review:

''The results of this test confirm that the Display 3 reads down to 0.003 cd/m2, or 0.001 ft-L.''

See Video here.

You VT60 propably is turning off instantly or after ~1 sec. (iD3 needs propably over 3-5 sec to read that low luminance level) it's pixels when it's getting Black 16 signal.

What's the complete xyY reading you are getting?
post #4278 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

How's it coming?

Like everything else - 2 steps forward, then 1 step back!
post #4279 of 5345
If calibrating a Panasonic LED LCD with and upgraded i1 Display Pro/Chromapure, what display mode would be best to select as I don't have one specifically for that type of display.

I have modes for Sony, LG and Samsung LED LCD, plus generic LCD.
post #4280 of 5345
***Help, please***
This is all relative to a 10-month-old Sony VPL-VW95ES. (I’m sorry in advance that this post is so long.)
I purchased Chromapure + an i1 Display 3PRO (with the extra calibration) + auto-cal about two months ago with the addition of a DVDO Duo about three weeks ago and yes, I’m still non-stop calibrating. I’m obviously a novice calibrator and I’ve put in well over 200 hours trying to get all of the numbers within range. This includes working on calibrating all day, all weekends including most Friday nights from around 5pm, well into Saturday mornings until around 6am and many weeknights from 5 to 10pm, too. (Skipping meals and working pretty much non-stop, but enough about that.)
There have always been one or two small issues to resolve when I get close to an acceptable calibration, so there have probably been over 50 restarts, but last night I thought that I had finally hit the jackpot. The grayscale was great all the way from 10 IRE to 100 with dEs of less than 1.5% all throughout. The chromaticity readings were superb, as well, with no color deviating more than .6%. Gamma was right where I wanted it, at 2.3 (+/- .01) straight across the board. Finally, the brightness was right on, too, with the 17 bar on the AVS disc still flashing.
So, what could be wrong, right? I threw chapter four (and a few others) of Fifth Element on the screen and everything was acceptable there. BUT, what has manifested itself is the color red slightly, but VERY noticeably permeating fade-to-blacks and this is also very obvious in both the AVS and Spears & Munsil (volume 2) test discs, when checking the brightness and contrast levels. Both the brightness and contrast patterns exhibit extremely noticeable pinkness in the flashing bars and all grayscale step-patterns show the obvious pinkness at the lightest end of the scale, too. (I’m currently at work, so I’m sorry, but I couldn’t post my Chromapure post-calibration reports online at this time.)
Now near the end of this most recent calibration I had also noticed a faint redness within the letterbox portions of the screen, so I went into the 0 IRE level and lowered red in the Duo as much as possible, before it would cause the 10 IRE level to drop – then this cured the letterbox red problem.
The only time that the overt redness problem shows up within Chromapure is in the reporting stage, where it’s reflecting a 4% error there. I don’t understand why the colorimeter isn’t picking this redness up during the calibration, producing otherwise, great numbers?
The reason why this post isn’t in the “Sony VPL-VW95ES calibration forum” is because I know that it’s not some inherent defect issue with the projector that’s causing the problem. How do I know this? Because, right when a prior auto-calibration resets its Duo settings to “factory”, before a fresh auto-cal is started, the pinkness in the grayscale completely goes away. The pinkness/redness is also not evident if I use one any of the other un-calibrated Sony settings, such as Cinema 1, 2, 3, etc.
Are there any very experienced, either professional or amateur calibrators out there that could please tell me what might be behind this excess redness that isn’t reflected in graphs/charts when calibrating the projector - fixing my obviously imperfect, but otherwise excellent calibration?
Here are all settings for the 95ES at calibration…
“User 2, Custom 3”
Contrast 90
Brightness 50
Color 50
Tint 50
Sharpness 0
Both Auto Iris & Gamma off
Lamp on Low
(Of course, Motion & Film settings off.)
Blu-ray player – OPPO 93 playing via “Source Direct” and all its other settings at default/off.
Screen – 100” Stewart StudioTek 130
The four Chromapure auto-cal selection settings prior to running are 4:4:4, 1080p24, Field & 75 on the first tab and Rec. 709, 2.3 gamma on the second tab.

Thank you very much,

Rob
post #4281 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

Yes, this is addressed in 2.4.1. I can give you a beta now or you can wait a few days for the full release. This is caused by our addition of a 0% reading to the grayscale and a contrast ratio in the report. If the meter cannot read 0%, it just returns 0, and then when CR is calculated a divide by zero error occurs. You can also use the Excel report now.


Got the beta, it has improved noticeably on the lowend.

Unfortunately its calculating on/off contrast ratios all wrong.

0.001 black level reading and 36.987 foot lamberts on the white should give a much higher reading than 12,000, prebeta release had the same readings but a more accurate 28,975 on/off contrast ratio.
post #4282 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoxieRob View Post

***Help, please***

Thank you very much,

Rob
I have 2 ideas. You may have already done them, but I don't know from your post.
First, make sure the room is absolutely, bat cave dark. Any glow from equipment indicators, any sunlight leaking around a curtain, etc needs to be eliminated. Reduce your laptop backlight to minimum and make sure it is pointed away from the screen.
Second, lay the proper groundwork for your Duo calibration by setting the white balance gains on the Sony to minimize dE at 100%.
post #4283 of 5345
Thank you Chad, but unfortunately I've got those two covered. The room is completely blacked-out, the computer is facing backwards, away from the screen and while auto-cal runs, I have a towel covering the screen completely. Then while I tweak afterwards, the screen is still half covered, plus I'm sitting way off-angle from the screen, basically against a side wall.
As far as the settings for "Custom 3" go, I calibrate the Sony to the closest I can get to good readings via its own menu, before I begin auto-cal. I had discovered during some of my previous gazillion calibration attempts what I think that you're alluding to, that the Duo had too much ground to cover on its own with the Sony's menu zeroed-out, so I'd essentially helped it along with pre-calibrating the projector using its own settings. (I can't attest for 100% sure that the excess redness isn't there before handing off to the auto-cal + subsequent tweaks, but I'm pretty sure that it isn't there.)
It's just really puzzling why the colorometer isn't picking up on the excess redness while I'm calibrating (tweaking after auto-cal runs), it only reflects it in the post-cal report.
post #4284 of 5345
Tom - using both an Accupel 5000 and a Radiance at 75% luminance in the Color module set for 75% Rec.709 I'm getting White output at about 100 cd/m2. Like this:



When I switch to the ADV Color module using 75% intensity I get White at 86 cd/m2 and the dE goes out the window. Any idea what is happening? Running CP v. 2.4.1.15701



post #4285 of 5345
Tom - using both an Accupel 5000 and a Radiance at 75% luminance in the Color module set for 75% Rec.709 I'm getting White output at about 100 cd/m2. Like this:



When I switch to the ADV Color module using 75% intensity I get White at 86 cd/m2 and the dE goes out the window. Any idea what is happening? Running CP v. 2.4.1.15701



post #4286 of 5345
Quote:

Originally Posted by DoxieRob

***Help, please***

Thank you very much,

Rob

On the New S&M 2 and the AVS 709, Contrast turns Pinkish if you have it pushed up too high!
I've always, not only watched which levels blank out then reappear, but also at which point as you're turning the Contrast Down, the Pink disappears. You have 2 things to watch out for.
post #4287 of 5345
Just wanted to chime in. I was out of town when Tom sent me a link to a newer beta the other day, and have just been able to download and mess with it tonight.

On my VT50, the 10 and 20 stimulus readings are pretty darn consistent, and the speed is fine too. I made several runs, in and out of other patterns, and the repeatability was very good IMO.
post #4288 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoxieRob

***Help, please***

Thank you very much,

Rob

On the New S&M 2 and the AVS 709, Contrast turns Pinkish if you have it pushed up too high!
I've always, not only watched which levels blank out then reappear, but also at which point as you're turning the Contrast Down, the Pink disappears. You have 2 things to watch out for.
Quote:
Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

Quote:

On my samsung d6500 plasma i leave contrast at 95. My greyscale is much too red throughout. I measured with my meter in default Movie Mode. In a white clipping pattern it looks as if there is pinkness in the upper white stripes causing you to lower the contrast which might not be necessary. However when I adjusted my red gain to bring it closer to 100% this pinkness dissappears. I left the contrast at default .
post #4289 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

Got the beta, it has improved noticeably on the lowend.

Unfortunately its calculating on/off contrast ratios all wrong.

0.001 black level reading and 36.987 foot lamberts on the white should give a much higher reading than 12,000, prebeta release had the same readings but a more accurate 28,975 on/off contrast ratio.
Nothing has changed regarding CR calculations. A black reading of 0.001 is below the capability of the meter. You are not going to get an accurate CR reading with a black level that low.
post #4290 of 5345
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoxieRob View Post

Thank you Chad, but unfortunately I've got those two covered. The room is completely blacked-out, the computer is facing backwards, away from the screen and while auto-cal runs, I have a towel covering the screen completely. Then while I tweak afterwards, the screen is still half covered, plus I'm sitting way off-angle from the screen, basically against a side wall.
As far as the settings for "Custom 3" go, I calibrate the Sony to the closest I can get to good readings via its own menu, before I begin auto-cal. I had discovered during some of my previous gazillion calibration attempts what I think that you're alluding to, that the Duo had too much ground to cover on its own with the Sony's menu zeroed-out, so I'd essentially helped it along with pre-calibrating the projector using its own settings. (I can't attest for 100% sure that the excess redness isn't there before handing off to the auto-cal + subsequent tweaks, but I'm pretty sure that it isn't there.)
It's just really puzzling why the colorometer isn't picking up on the excess redness while I'm calibrating (tweaking after auto-cal runs), it only reflects it in the post-cal report.
Please post some actual data. It is hard to troubleshoot this without seeing the report and QuickReports for grayscale/gamma. It may be that the the redness is only at very near black and simply does not show up at 10%. My JVC RS45 had exactly this problem and I fixed it by adjusting the 5% gamma level using the JVC's own controls. Unfortunately, the Duo does not have a 5% adjustment. BTW, a 4% grayscale error at very low light levels is a relatively small error, a dE of between 2-3 depending on the method used. An error that small at the very low end would not be easily visible. In short, I don't think that's the issue. Measure the white balance at 5% (continuous mode) and see what it reads.

If you are seeing a pinkish hue on ramps, but not on individual white test patterns, then this is a gamma issue. I would experiment with different gamma settings. Try both 2.22 power law and BT.1886. I would also try lowering contrast a little.
Edited by TomHuffman - 5/19/13 at 1:06am
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