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The Official Sony HDR-CX500V/HDR-CX520V Owners Thread - Page 5

post #121 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by lenkiatleong View Post

The box of HDR-CX520E prints "full HD" but the recording is in 1920x1080i (interlace). Wherelse, other similar makers print 1080p 24fps.

The question is, is CX less superior than those cam that prints 1080p?

Hard to tell how much of that is hype given today's target playback devices. I've seen one posting that suggests that 60p can produce better playback on PCs but 60i is just as good on HDTVs. 60i clips look fantastic played back on a Sony XBR 46" HDTV - essentially the same as HD broadcasts if filmed on tripod with good light, etc. If 60p is noticeably better, it must be spectacular, and I really haven't heard anyone gush about it in that way in these forums or in reviews. This question probably has a complicated answer. I certainly have no concerns personally about having a cam that does 60i.

I think Full HD is a marketing term that refers to the resolution (1920 x 1080) instead of the interlaced/progressive side or the frame rate. Or it might be a combination of the frame rate and the resolution. Someone suggested Sony was the first to use it so you know they wouldn't define an impressive term for something they didn't support!
post #122 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Gull View Post

Hard to tell how much of that is hype given today's target playback devices. I've seen one posting that suggests that 60p can produce better playback on PCs but 60i is just as good on HDTVs. 60i clips look fantastic played back on a Sony XBR 46" HDTV - essentially the same as HD broadcasts if filmed on tripod with good light, etc. If 60p is noticeably better, it must be spectacular, and I really haven't heard anyone gush about it in that way in these forums or in reviews. This question probably has a complicated answer. I certainly have no concerns personally about having a cam that does 60i.

I think Full HD is a marketing term that refers to the resolution (1920 x 1080) instead of the interlaced/progressive side or the frame rate. Or it might be a combination of the frame rate and the resolution. Someone suggested Sony was the first to use it so you know they wouldn't define an impressive term for something they didn't support!

I'm not sure how camcorder that records in 1080i and 1080p affects the playback on HDTV that supports 1080p.
But i understand that when i playback 1920x1080i, e.g., TV broadcast, the PQ is noticeably lower quality than blu ray playback that bitstreams 1920x1080p to the same TV. Maybe, this is not a fair comparison as the blu ray materials are recorded with top end cam.
Nevertheless, if Sony flagship for this category can only records in 1080i, i am sceptical that others are really recording in 1080p.
post #123 of 373
When steaming from PC to PS3 and then to HDTV, i believe you are using m2ts file. The question is, is the video smooth on HDTV or the same as cam directly to HDTV via miniHDMI?

I encounter problem streaming HD mp4 file (converted from the m2ts file) to my Marantz AV8003 pre/pro. The video is not as smooth (judder) compare to cam direct to HDTV. However, using PMB, i convert the m2ts file to wmv and mpeg2 files. Now, the video is as smooth as the cam method but of course the PQ has been compromise a bit.

So, if the PS3 could display smoothly, i suspect my AV8003 is not fast enough to handle HD mp4 files. Oh boy, just because of this excellent cam, one has to upgrade many things....So, PS3 owners, what is your comments??
post #124 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by lenkiatleong View Post

When steaming from PC to PS3 and then to HDTV, i believe you are using m2ts file.

Not necessarily.
Get yourself a program called PS3 media Server and install to your computer. It will allow you to stream MP4, MKV, AVI, AC3... and many others.

I can stream pretty much anything to the PS3 as smoothly as it is coming from the cam. I'm running nothing special... Hardwire ethernet from my PC to an older 100M lynksys router, then to the PS3
post #125 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by lenkiatleong View Post

...
Nevertheless, if Sony flagship for this category can only records in 1080i, i am sceptical that others are really recording in 1080p.

If they claim it, they're probably doing it. It just means they're not doing something else that the Sonys are doing - for example, face and smile detection, GPS registration, advanced electronic image stabilization, etc. Remember that all of this capture and processing is done real-time and the cams don't go back and post-process your clips to look good after the fact. So it's all about computing power and memory management tradeoffs. Each cam has a target market and each vendor has a philosophy about what sells.

But a question similar to yours might be: why did Sony choose not to burn CPU/GPU cycles, storage, and cost to produce 60p high-res recording, instead putting those things into other deliverables? Were they just dumb? Or do they have reason to believe that some things are more important than 60p to their target markets? Or do they figure this will simply go away as an issue in a few years as hardware improves, so they want to sell other types of features now instead of just pushing the technical limits?

Presumably all the vendors are looking for the marketing sweet spot and bending technology to fit that.

Two analogies that are also computer-based:

1. Artificial intelligence in games: I read some great articles that talked about how programmers do AI in real-time games. Basically, there's a budget for every cycle of computer time, and it has to be allocated out among graphics, data management, I/O, etc - and the amount of cycles used to determine what the computer will do in the game besides responding to user inputs. This AI budget is almost always incredibly tight, so the quality of the AI often hinges on how many other cycles can be freed up to be used by it. When you complain about dumb AI, the root cause is often that the hardware just isn't powerful enough yet to give the AI budget enough power.

2. Scanning of photographs: the first photos I scanned in the early 1990s were scanned at 150 dots per inch, I believe. This was about the max the scanners supported and the files contained at least twice as much data as could actually be shown on a PC monitor. The output device was behind the capture device (I think monitors averaged 72 dpi at the time). Printer output was similarly primitive by today's standards. So there was virtually no market for high-resolution scanners because you couldn't do anything with the output anyway. As the dpi you could route to an output device climbed sharply, so did the resolution you could capture with even the average scanner, and the prices kept dropping over time as the capabilities increased.

I'd bet we're in the same world with these digital camcorders - they are in fact digital, their storage is digital, their processing is digital, their output is digital. So the features a vendor selects to implement today will seem primitive 10 years from now, and every vendor must have a lot of fun trying to figure out what to implement in what order. If you build some patently great resolution but no one can use it, you'd better have superb salesman because you're really not giving people what they want or can use today. The two places where I suspect that's going on now are capture at 60p at high resolutions and the bitrates used. The measure of a cam for you is whether it does what you need and can use. You may factor in a bit of thinking about the future, even, and buy HD now though you have no HD displays in your home. But there's a point where highly touted features are what people claim they are but they're not worth paying for if you can't take advantage of them.
So if you buy a cam because of marketing claims but you don't really know if they are something you can touch and feel and use, I think you've been fooled somewhat.

The bad news is that, being largely computers now, it's a good idea to dig into the specs and uses of these cams before buying, and many people don't have time to do that. The other thing to watch for is advancements in the sensors, their resolutions, the optics, and so forth. But I think those will occur less frequently than the annual processor-based feature improvements.

The good news is that every year will yield better cams and it won't be that long before you can fix a buying mistake if you make one, at a lower price than what you bought before. It may take a few years, but cams aren't going to sit still any more.
post #126 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbarney View Post

Not necessarily.
Get yourself a program called PS3 media Server and install to your computer. It will allow you to stream MP4, MKV, AVI, AC3... and many others.

I can stream pretty much anything to the PS3 as smoothly as it is coming from the cam. I'm running nothing special... Hardwire ethernet from my PC to an older 100M lynksys router, then to the PS3

I don't have PS3 yet. No budget from the wife. From your comment, i assume that PS3 can handle HD videos (converted from m2ts) without judder/jerky. I believe you experience smooth videos just like from the cam direct to HDTV.

My HD videos are stored in Dlink DNS323 (NAS) and connected to Linksys WRT54G router. The Marantz AV8003 is also connected to the same router. As all of them are enjoying 54mbps which is more than enough for HD videos (max 24mbps), i still get judder on my Samsung 61" DLP HDTV (1080i). Would anyone please comment which is the weakest link in my setup?
post #127 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Gull View Post

The bad news is that, being largely computers now, it's a good idea to dig into the specs and uses of these cams before buying, and many people don't have time to do that. The other thing to watch for is advancements in the sensors, their resolutions, the optics, and so forth. But I think those will occur less frequently than the annual processor-based feature improvements.

You are spot on Tom. I was fooled by the sony box which described full HD 1080 which in Singapore means 1920x1080p (progressive). 1080i over here means HD Ready or 720p. As you described earlier on, cam makers described full HD 1080 loosely or half truth.

Nevertheless, just curious. Have you ever play around those cam that record in 1080p? If yes, would be good to post some comments. I don't have the luxury.

Ya. I bought this cam on the spot without researching the facts in Sony shop. I was so impressed by the cx520e zoom and PQ. The salesperson showed me a 10 dollars note which has a very very very fine print at the top. To naked eyes, it looks like a horizontal line. He moved the note very close to cx520e lens which is on a tripod and connected to Sony bravia HDTV via miniHDMI. From the bravia, i can now read those fine prints and it looks incredible. I was sold on the zooming capability and very clear video on display to the bravia.

I knew that the cx520e was good because my Samsung mobile phone, i.e., i8910 HD could not zoom in and show a clear video (it is grainy). Using i8910, i tried to record my daughter's choir handheld. Without zooming, the video is clear as it is (records in 1080i too). The problem comes when:
1) I tried to zoom. The video got grainy. I reckon that i8910 does not have optical zoom. It has only digital zoom. Here's is where the cx520e outperforms hands down.
2) Hold the i8910 on hand and walk/move. The video is jerky and its worst than watching Cloverfield. Here's where cx520e outperforms too.

Based on above 2 factors plus the excellent PQ on 42" Bravia HDTV, i bought the cam on the spot. I did notice that there's a print "full HD 1080" on the back of cx520e LCD. So i thought that this cam is recording in 1080p and i did not ask the salesperson (my mistake) as the word "full HD" is a common definitive for 1080p in Singapore. Oh boy, real mistake.

I sounded upset because i am not getting 1080p recorded by cx520e wherelse the box and label on the cam say "full HD 1080".

Nevertheless, i am still very happy with cx520e and am now exploring what other features it can do.
post #128 of 373
1) Do you set x.v.color to ON? All my HDTV supports x.v.color but i reckon that i can only enjoy x.v.color via the cam direct to HDTV. BIGBARNEY: Have you tried using x.v.color and stream via PS3 to HDTV? Any significant improvement?

2) Setting Steady Shot. I don't understand why i could not get or see the "Active" setting sometimes. I only get "Auto" or "Off". But sometimes, i get "Active", "Standard" and "Off" selections.

3) The slow motion records only a few seconds. Can i activate the slo mo while recording in normal mode? And how can i record slo mo for more than a minute?
post #129 of 373
1) Excellent question!!! Anyone?
2) Active is not available in Photo mode, because Active is a real-time analysis of the video to digitally rotate the video, to compensate for user-caused rotation. (this is why the image is cropped too - so I leave it on Auto)
3) Yes. No. No.
post #130 of 373
CX500V. The A/V connector on the right side of the camcorder -the one for Component plus Stereo or Composite plus Stereo - has anyone else noticed the following:

1) The plug is very very tight - hard to get in and hard to pull out - like you're going to break something doing it.

2) The socket in the camera itself MOVES in and out a bit - as if, sure enough, something is breaking from such a tight fit. I'm talking about the metal part that is on the camera, the half-circle socket that sits inside a black plastic square. Does yours move in and out about a millimeter or maybe 1/2 millimeter when pushed / pulled while plugging the cable in/out ? Is my camera defective??

Thanks!!!
post #131 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by lenkiatleong View Post

I don't have PS3 yet. No budget from the wife. From your comment, i assume that PS3 can handle HD videos (converted from m2ts) without judder/jerky. I believe you experience smooth videos just like from the cam direct to HDTV.

My HD videos are stored in Dlink DNS323 (NAS) and connected to Linksys WRT54G router. The Marantz AV8003 is also connected to the same router. As all of them are enjoying 54mbps which is more than enough for HD videos (max 24mbps), i still get judder on my Samsung 61" DLP HDTV (1080i). Would anyone please comment which is the weakest link in my setup?

You can move the m2ts files direct from your cam to the PS3's hard drive or a USB hard drive and play them unconverted. Presumably you could stream them as well. I never switch to another format for unedited or edited HD video unless I'm uploading something to YouTube, which has only been for the last three weeks or so.

That's a nice graphics chip in the PS3...
post #132 of 373
Very impressive so far. I have had the cx 500v for a week now and it is awesome in lowlight and hand held situations. I ordered the Sony Vegas movie studio 9 software so right now I am stuck with just the PMB software. Is it possible to combine clips with PMB and if so how? All I have been able to accomplish is video trim. Also is it possible to get an accessory that allows you to attach a light and a mic at the same time. That is about the only thing I don't like about the sony is the IAS shoe. Thanks to all on the forum for their insights and help, especially Tom Gull.
post #133 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjohns1126 View Post

Very impressive so far. I have had the cx 500v for a week now and it is awesome in lowlight and hand held situations. I ordered the Sony Vegas movie studio 9 software so right now I am stuck with just the PMB software. Is it possible to combine clips with PMB and if so how? All I have been able to accomplish is video trim. Also is it possible to get an accessory that allows you to attach a light and a mic at the same time. That is about the only thing I don't like about the sony is the IAS shoe. Thanks to all on the forum for their insights and help, especially Tom Gull.

You're welcome! And I might say the same thing to everyone else - thanks for your advice which accumulated in these forums. I read hundreds of messages on the forums here about the CX and XR cams before I decided what seemed right for me. I had found DVI and one other site before and ran out of threads to read before I was convinced. These and camcorderinfo.com (with its somewhat anti-Sony bias) and two German sites doing direct comparisons were all really helpful.
post #134 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by mojohio View Post

I've found a great method to compress and convert my HD .mt2s files to .avi files. If someone is interested in that process, I will share.

So how do you do it?

Thanks.
post #135 of 373
Guys!

How would you rate the autofocus of the CX5xx series compared to other Sony's and ohter brands, such as Panasonic TM300 or Sanyo FH1?

I am especially worried about performance of autofocus under "less-than-good" lightning conditions, such as indoor living room light.

In my experience with still cameras, they all seem to do well outdoor in sunlight, but indoor in darker conditions, the expensive ones really show why they cost more :-)
post #136 of 373
Funny thing happened on Sunday. I went to my nephew's house for his birthday and I took some movies with my CX500V and my father who has a degree in photography told me it was too dark in the house to take movies without a light attachment. Well when I got home I played them back on the camcorder and the camera with few exceptions was fine. I'm so proud of my purchase.
post #137 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by marlinman View Post

Funny thing happened on Sunday. I went to my nephew's house for his birthday and I took some movies with my CX500V and my father who has a degree in photography told me it was too dark in the house to take movies without a light attachment. Well when I got home I played them back on the camcorder and the camera with few exceptions was fine. I'm so proud of my purchase.

Even last year, I suspect he was right - at least to the degree that the film would have been so grainy as to be unsatisfactory. I certainly remember my Dad setting up a bank of four massive lights to take Super8 (mm) film at Thanksgiving and Christmas. Those suckers could have heated the house!

The new Exmor-R chip really seems to be a winner.
post #138 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Webmonkey View Post

Guys!

How would you rate the autofocus of the CX5xx series compared to other Sony's and ohter brands, such as Panasonic TM300 or Sanyo FH1?

I am especially worried about performance of autofocus under "less-than-good" lightning conditions, such as indoor living room light.

In my experience with still cameras, they all seem to do well outdoor in sunlight, but indoor in darker conditions, the expensive ones really show why they cost more :-)

Subjective impression from filming our new pets indoors: I didn't really notice any difference in autofocus speed for video. I'm not saying it's there or not, I'm just saying I have no memory of noticing slowness vs filming outdoors. Note that some people feel the Sony autofocus speed is in the middle of the pack and isn't the fastest generally.

When taking stills in darkened rooms, though, I do remember that the autofocus sometimes seemed to take a while to settle. For that, you actually press the button part way down to get focus, see a green light, and snap. You can do that quickly if you want to without waiting for the green light, but I routinely wait for the light to confirm focus is sharp.

The two might be different because the shutter is open for the video most of the time but open for the photo only when you depress the button enough - that's my speculation. I've commented before that the video's exposure seems to sit halfway between stills without flash and stills with flash, and I often prefer the video's levels to stills with flash. I'm pretty sure that for stills the initial green light is done with no flash so it's pretty dark at times. For the actual shot, the flash lights long enough before the shutter to improve the focus, I think. I remember that they're offset in some beneficial way.
post #139 of 373
Help me decide between the CX and the XR... I was going to get the CX because of all the manual settings and the better movement program, but I would also like to be able to add a Mic...

Why make such a camera without inputs????


Rick
post #140 of 373
I believe the CX can have a mic via the hotshoe. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

As far as manual controls, there are not many on the CX. Which are missing from the XR that the CX has?

I got the CX because of size, weight -and price (at the time)
post #141 of 373
CX500/520 owners, please help me with this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by thhowl View Post

CX500V. The A/V connector on the right side of the camcorder -the one for Component plus Stereo or Composite plus Stereo - has anyone else noticed the following:

1) The plug is very very tight - hard to get in and hard to pull out - like you're going to break something doing it.

2) The socket in the camera itself MOVES in and out a bit - as if, sure enough, something is breaking from such a tight fit. I'm talking about the metal part that is on the camera, the half-circle socket that sits inside a black plastic square. Does yours move in and out about a millimeter or maybe 1/2 millimeter when pushed / pulled while plugging the cable in/out ? Is my camera defective??

Thanks!!!
post #142 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by rich121 View Post

Help me decide between the CX and the XR... I was going to get the CX because of all the manual settings and the better movement program, but I would also like to be able to add a Mic...

Why make such a camera without inputs????

Rick

Using the accessory shoe for an external mic is correct - same with video light, stronger flash, etc.

Have you checked my comparison based on marketing specs dated around 10/22 after 10 pm in this forum? The only major difference not included in it seems to be the 3-Way Shake Cancelling that's only in the CX. Otherwise (beyond HDD vs flash and its effects on size, weight, and feel), it's mostly different menu style, viewfinder vs not, and the design of the manual control dials. I also am not aware of any significant difference in manual features being in one but not in the other.

The actual marketing spec sheets on SonyStyle are always a good place to start since they run through the camera specs in almost directly comparable sections. That was where most of the information in my post came from.
post #143 of 373
Does the CX have the zoom mic function??



Does anyone know if there is any solution for mounting both a shotgun mic and a videolight in the same shoe, with f.eks. an "Y" adaptor or some kind of bracket??
post #144 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Webmonkey View Post

Does the CX have the zoom mic function??

Using the internal 5.1 mic setting, yes - assuming that means that the mic adjusts its inputs based on the optical zoom changing. Can't speak to use of an external mic through the shoe, I've never tried it.
post #145 of 373
I have the HDR-CX500V and though I do not expect to NEED the flash memory card I'd like opinions on the best choices for them. What's the best deal on 16GB and 32GB flash cards (Memory Stick Pro Duo) for use with the CX500V? Although I think most of the newer cards should be more than fast enough for the data rate the camera will spitt out while recording there is still an advantage to the faster cards when transferring to the PC. So, what's the best options for 16GB and 32GB cards?


Brian
post #146 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by thhowl View Post

CX500/520 owners, please help me with this:

I don't think most people (especially on AVS Forum) uses Composite or Component
I think most people use the Mini-HDMI if they want to go direct camcorder to TV
post #147 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raptorsys View Post

I have the HDR-CX500V and though I do not expect to NEED the flash memory card I'd like opinions on the best choices for them. What's the best deal on 16GB and 32GB flash cards (Memory Stick Pro Duo) for use with the CX500V? Although I think most of the newer cards should be more than fast enough for the data rate the camera will spitt out while recording there is still an advantage to the faster cards when transferring to the PC. So, what's the best options for 16GB and 32GB cards?


Brian

From another website's forums and strong advice there: just don't buy on eBay - you may get cheap knockoffs and never know until they fail.

I've bought the Sony 16GB chips on Amazon and never had problems with any of them. Current price is pretty nice - around $62. I see a new Sony 32GB chip there for $200, and it looks like it has some kind of USB adaptor that comes as part of that package (there's also a 16GB one with that). Not sure if that's valuable at all since the cam can stream its secondary chip via USB to a PC or a PS3 and my desktop PC also has the Sony reader built in.
post #148 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by nash123 View Post

Quote: Originally Posted by mojohio
I've found a great method to compress and convert my HD .mt2s files to .avi files. If someone is interested in that process, I will share.

So how do you do it?

Thanks.

The following is for compressing your .mt2s files to an .avi file. The results are excellent. The video I have used this for is mainly sports footage.

1) Download the AVS Video Converter (really good converter)
http://www.avsmedia.com/Downloads/AVSVideoConverter.exe

2) Download and install the following Video Codec (Xvid)
http://www.sidelinedata.com/downloads/xvid.exe

3) Open AVS Converter and edit the following settings:
a. Profile - Choose Custom from the Menu
b. Go to Edit Profile
c. Choose the Videocodec XVID MPEG 4
d. Change the Bitrate to 2500 and choose Frame Size and Frame Rate Original
e. Go to Advanced
f. Click on Target Quantizer to switch the settings to Target bitrate
g. Choose 2500 at Target bitrate (a) and click more at quality preset (b)
h. Type in 25 at Maximum I-frame intervall
i. Check the Turbo :-) box
j. Confirm with OK and Save the Profile as your preferred name.

Hope this is something that you will agree looks great.
post #149 of 373
Sony is coming out with a 32 GB pro duo card on their website. I bought an 8 GB for now for $49.95. I would expect the 32 GB to be about $200. I noticed today that Sony dropped their retail price to $999 on the CX500V. I bought mine at $799 when J&R dropped the price last week.
It is my understanding that one of the major advantages with a flash memory vs the HDD is speed of retreaving the playback plus the lack of moving parts in the unit.
IMO I've found the record button and zoom button on the LCD are the way to go to keep the camera still and have the zoom stay in focus better.
post #150 of 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by mojohio View Post

The following is for compressing your .mt2s files to an .avi file. The results are excellent. The video I have used this for is mainly sports footage.

1) Download the AVS Video Converter (really good converter)
http://www.avsmedia.com/Downloads/AVSVideoConverter.exe

But AVS converter does not support 5.1 channels if i'm not wrong. As CX520 supports dolby 5.1, i'm not sure if your method will output to avi with 5.1 channels.
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