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Slim center with towers

post #1 of 30
9/7/09 at 5:00pm
Thread Starter 
Hi all,

So, I am still continuing my search for a set-up (taking my time to make sure I get the right speakers).

As I posted in an earlier thread, I am limited by WAF on the placement of my center channel. I keep my TV on a stand (see earlier thread) and don't really want to buy one of those omni stands since it wouldn't satisfy my girlfriend. So I am thinking I will just put the center on the entertainment stand with the TV. I will put in on the center of the stand right in front of the TV.

Therefore, I need a low-profile center (about 4 inches tall, 5 inches max) and not too deep either (6 inches max). However, I want to get towers as my mains and then either towers or bookshelf as the surrounds. I have had a tough time identifying good speakers for this requirement. Of course I want my center to timbre match the other speakers I will get and want decent towers.

My budget is limited because we are students. So I am thinking about $400-500 but I am willing to just buy the front three now and then get the surrounds after the holidays and after I buy a sub.

Any thoughts or suggestions? Thanks again, in advance, for everyone's help!
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post #2 of 30
9/7/09 at 5:47pm
If you're so limited by your center channel choices, why not go w/o a center? Just let the front main speakers handle the center dialogue.
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post #3 of 30
9/7/09 at 8:57pm
Thread Starter 
I've thought about it and have been doing that for the past couple months, but I really prefer the sound of having a center instead of a phantom center. Without the center, the dialogue tends to sound a little off centered when not sitting in a single spot. I figure that for my needs when I often have friends joining us for movies, I may prefer even a slightly small center with 3.25 inch woofers or 4 inch woofers than a phantom.
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post #4 of 30
9/7/09 at 10:19pm
Definitive Technology makes some nice lower profile center channel speakers. The Mythos Seven would be Ideal, but your looking at almost your whole budget just for the center. And the Mythos floor standers are down right expensive. Definitive also makes a unit called the ProCenter 1000 which is just over 1/2 the price of the Mythos, still low profile and might work, but your still looking at pricey floor standers as an issue.

looking for slim stuff I found the Polk Audio VM20 that might just work however it might be a little too tall, it is however about the same price as the cheaper Definitive at Crutchfield And with Polk you can get some ok floor standers for a more reasonable price.

I would say your best bet for getting ok sound is to look for 3~4.25" drivers, pressured coupled to passive bass radiators. And stick to better brands, your problem is that most of the good centers that meet your size requirement are going to be more expensive than similar quality larger speakers, because it is much harder to get the sound you want for a center out of a 3.5" driver than it is with a 6" driver.

When you have a center hooked up the receiver is going to direct a lot of sound it's way, if it is a poor quality speaker with small drivers, it can end up being worse than not having a center at all.
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post #5 of 30
9/8/09 at 8:43am
Thread Starter 
So, just briefly looking at some brands, I have found a few options with the kinds of things mentioned.

First off, how important is it that I stay in the same series of the same brand rather than just staying in the same brand?

For instance, Infinity makes the TSS center channels (4000, 1200, 1100). Could I pair one of those with the Primus line? Or would it sound funky?

Also, Athena (which I am less familiar with and can't seem to find many of their products online) has the WS-60 and LSC-50 which fit into my requirements. I could put that with Athena towers, like the LS-500 or WS-100 (unless slim towers aren't worth it).

I'm sure there are other options too, these are just the first ones I found.

Any thoughts on the necessity to stay within the same line or if staying within the brand will work well? Anything I need consider when determining how well things will match?
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post #6 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:00am
how bout the RC mini center? 4.75" tall and 6.5" deep? Then you could get RC 30, 50 or 70 towers to go with it.
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it...rgy-rc-mini-cc
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post #7 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:21am
Thread Starter 
I will have to measure the depth again when I get home because that would cut it close. But I would love that set-up (just may take me a little longer to afford it!).

Just want to verify though (dumb question!), it will be alright to put a center channel directly in front of the TV like that on the same stand? Will the fact that it is rear vented (as all that I am looking at are) impact the TV at all when I turn the volume way up?
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post #8 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by afrogt View Post

how bout the RC mini center? 4.75" tall and 6.5" deep? Then you could get RC 30, 50 or 70 towers to go with it.
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it...rgy-rc-mini-cc

+1... Though those towers arent going to fit into his budget for the front sound stage...

Check your other thread too. I was inquiring as to if you could put the center on top of the stand in front of the LCD. The Energy C-C50 is 5 3/4" tall and 7 5/8" deep. Would this fit there for you? It is much cheaper than the RC-Mini center...
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post #9 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecomovie View Post

Just want to verify though (dumb question!), it will be alright to put a center channel directly in front of the TV like that on the same stand? Will the fact that it is rear vented (as all that I am looking at are) impact the TV at all when I turn the volume way up?

Though I am still messing with some EQ issues and Dialog (which the rear port won't effect), we have our C-C50 in this positions and is working great...
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post #10 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:34am
ecomovie ; What kind of height length do you have under your TV stand ?
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post #11 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:51am
Thread Starter 
i was thinking the RC's are out of my price range too, but they would be so great!

closer to my budget is ideal though since i may get in trouble from the better half for spending much more than what we discussed.

I can fit a center that is about 5 inches tall maximum and about 6 inches deep. I think the Energy C-C50 is just a little too deep for the TV and the stand. The base for the TV is about a foot wide and the TV stand is just under 20 inches wide, but I want a couple inches in the back since the stand sits right next to the wall and I get back there every so often to mess with wiring and such.

I have about 6 inches clearance under the TV stand, but everyone mentioned that I wouldn't get the greatest sound by having it on the ground under the stand.

Xbox, do you think it is the position that is giving you issues with EQ and dialogue?
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post #12 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecomovie View Post

Xbox, do you think it is the position that is giving you issues with EQ and dialogue?

I don't really think so because that SHOULD only effect the bass output of the center channel. The C-C50 performs well with all sound effects (that come through the center), it is just the dialog that is a little quiet for my taste and am starting to blame my receiver for it. We will see what I come up with...

Maybe you should look at the RC Line a bit closer... Grab that RC-Mini center and if you don't mind the Cherry finish you can add (2) RC Mini bookshelf speakers to it for a total of $379.88. This would complete the fronts for you and your next upgrade/purchase could be towers or larger bookshelfs then moving your minis to the rear... just a though... check it out...

http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it..._c=site_search
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post #13 of 30
9/8/09 at 11:17am
Thread Starter 
Yeah, the RC's are tempting, but unfortunately I need to stick with a darker finish to match the furniture (but since most people make those now, I didn't really mention it). It just means that the RC's are a little out of my pricerange at the moment.

Just to re-ask a few earlier questions I had and see if anyone had any insight on them:

How important is it that I stay in the same series of the same brand rather than just staying in the same brand? Like with the aformentioned Infinity, Athena, or Energy lines.

Anything I need consider when determining how well things will match?
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post #14 of 30
9/8/09 at 11:55am
matching a small center perfectly with towers is going to be difficult for you. Here's an option that might work. I don't know how this Jamo center sounds, but I can confirm the sound of the towers.

http://www.jamo.com/na-en/products/a...4-description/
someone on ebay is selling the center and throwing in two small surround speakers
http://cgi.ebay.com/Jamo-A-3CEN-4-Ce...=p4295.c0.m299

Then add these Jamo E660 towers.
http://www.wwstereo.com/default.aspx...103__0_0_0_-1/

You might get out of there for way under your budget. The E660 is a good slim tower and actually you could get 4 of them plus the A 3CEN.4 center and still be under budget.
http://www.wwstereo.com/default.aspx...103__0_0_0_-1/

I can't vouch for the center speaker but you've pretty much limited yourself with those size constraints!
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post #15 of 30
9/8/09 at 9:13pm
Thread Starter 
Thanks for finding that center for me afro gt. Aesthetically, it didn't pass the WAF test though, lol, it was too plasticy, but not sleek, I guess.

I've been searching a lot and the Athena website says that their different lines are designed to "sonically match" all other Athena speakers. Is this possible? If I tend to stick within the same brand but different lines, will I be alright, or is this a big no-no? Does anyone have any experience with this or have different lines in their set-up?

Thanks again!
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post #16 of 30
9/8/09 at 10:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecomovie View Post

I've been searching a lot and the Athena website says that their different lines are designed to "sonically match" all other Athena speakers. Is this possible?

If they're using the same tweeters, yes.

On the other hand, what they say is a bit questionable. Why would a manufacturer want to have different product lines, if they all essentially sound the same?

Quote:


If I tend to stick within the same brand but different lines, will I be alright, or is this a big no-no?

It's a matter of experimentation I guess. Sometimes you may be able to find a close match. Other times, not.
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post #17 of 30
9/8/09 at 10:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecomovie View Post

Thanks for finding that center for me afro gt. Aesthetically, it didn't pass the WAF test though, lol, it was too plasticy, but not sleek, I guess.

I've been searching a lot and the Athena website says that their different lines are designed to "sonically match" all other Athena speakers. Is this possible? If I tend to stick within the same brand but different lines, will I be alright, or is this a big no-no? Does anyone have any experience with this or have different lines in their set-up?

Thanks again!

I own the Athena Audition series. F2.2 and C1.2 Not a bad setup but at really high volumes, the center cannot keep up with the towers

also Athena has been bought out and the name is defunct.
Klipsch bought them along with Energy and Mirage. Those names will live on.
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post #18 of 30
9/9/09 at 1:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecomovie View Post

Thanks for finding that center for me afro gt. Aesthetically, it didn't pass the WAF test though, lol, it was too plasticy, but not sleek, I guess.

I've been searching a lot and the Athena website says that their different lines are designed to "sonically match" all other Athena speakers. Is this possible? If I tend to stick within the same brand but different lines, will I be alright, or is this a big no-no? Does anyone have any experience with this or have different lines in their set-up?

Thanks again!

The Athena WS speakers use the same Teteron tweeter as the AS-series (AS-F1, F2, B2, B1, C1, etc).

The newer LS series speakers have a completely different tweeter and wont match with the older AS or WS line.

It is also true than Athena was purchased by Klipsch and they discontinued the product line. It should still be supported by Klipsch but I would worry if they keep enough inventory for repair. When I called Klipsch last year, their support people knew less about Athena products than I did. Maybe since they're eliminating the line, they're not planning to give much support?

I never had any of my Athenas break on me and i've owned all of them over 5 years. Speakers generally don't have problems unless you abuse them.

Of course it didn't pass the wife test! you need a bigger and better center as well as something not plastic! Figure out a way to make some room for a C60 center!
http://www.amazon.com/Jamo-C60-Cente.../dp/B00120Y3NC
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post #19 of 30
9/9/09 at 6:50am
Would these fit? Will they pass the WAF Test?

http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it..._sku=544999074
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post #20 of 30
9/9/09 at 6:56am
Or This...

This is a very small 5.1 ENERGY setup. Adding towers later would move you up to a 7.1 setup or whatever you planned out. These also come with an 8" powered sub, which will help fill the void of these smaller satellites...

http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it..._c=site_search
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post #21 of 30
9/9/09 at 7:45am
Thread Starter 
wow, i really appreciate everyone's help and answering my questions on what to look for and ideas of potential speaker. this is a daunting task (but plenty fun too)

both of those would pass the test and fit, but they are a little smaller than I would prefer. A few weeks ago, I was thinking I would just dive in a a full surround set, but that would have been out of my price range to get a good set, so I am thinking now to just get the front three. It would be nice to have the full surround at the moment, but I'm patient.

Perhaps I can increase the depth to 7inches, but that would be pushing it and that Jamo is already at 7.5, so probably won't fit.

To consolidate threads (the other one was just used in the past to determine placement), I suppose its possible if it doesn't overhang very much...

Do you have a pic of your set-up xbox? I'm curious how your C-C50 fits.
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post #22 of 30
9/9/09 at 7:54am
If you're going Energy Take Classic, get the setup with the ESW-V8 sub which is better than the entry level sub that comes with standard system. The standard Take Classic sub is 50 watts RMS, 200 watts peak. The V8 sub is 200 watts RMS, 800 watts peak. Plays louder, deeper and looks better.
http://www.wwstereo.com/#/ecommerce/...rs/33/144992//

Or if you have room for a much bigger sub, this package from Acoustic Sound Design with the Bic H-100 sub.
http://www.acousticsounddesign.com/c...pid=1466&sc=61
Comes with this sub.
http://www.acousticsounddesign.com/c...pid=1062&sc=32
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post #23 of 30
9/9/09 at 8:07am
Thread Starter 
I'm not sure the Take classics will satisfy me though, they may sound too small for my taste. I know I really put myself in a corner with my size limitations, but I think I can at least get dual 3.25" to 4.5" woofers. Just need to find one that has towers that can match it...
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post #24 of 30
9/9/09 at 8:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecomovie View Post

Do you have a pic of your set-up xbox? I'm curious how your C-C50 fits.

By some quick math, it looks like you should have room on your stand if you were to give up the 2" in the rear of the unit? What are the exact dimensions of the tv base and the top of the unit?

Here is a drawing (I draw EVERYTHING before I buy it) of the complete setup and I went ahead and threw some dimensions on the side view. Sorry but I don't have any pictures on me except from my blackberry, and they are not very detailed. Hope this helps... In my situation our Sharp 52" screen was just high enough for me to be able to double up the rubber feet on the front of the C-C50 to angle it up a bit (as shown below). Keep in mind you could always get some rubber feet like this and lift your TV up a 1/2" or so to help...


LL
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post #25 of 30
9/9/09 at 8:20am
Any issues with the sub's magnet wiping out your PC's hard drive in this setup? Or is it magnetically shielded?
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post #26 of 30
9/9/09 at 8:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete7874 View Post

Any issues with the sub's magnet wiping out your PC's hard drive in this setup? Or is it magnetically shielded?

Still unclear on this one, lol. The PC was just moved here when I added the C-100's last week. Need to check on the magnetic shielding on the sub. It is working fine so far...
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post #27 of 30
9/9/09 at 8:27am
Not to hijack... but CONFIRMED...

Straight from Product Description on Amazon...

"And movie fans will delight in the magnetic shielding, which protects nearby TVs and video monitors from video distortion."
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post #28 of 30
9/9/09 at 9:44am
Thread Starter 
well, the stand is 20 inches and the base is 12 inches. I suppose I could try to give up that two inches to fit a 7-8 inch deep center (I'll ask tonight ). The main difference between my stand and yours though is that your conceals the side view of the center pretty well and makes it seem less awkward since most views are from a frontward angle, making it appear cleaner and not having a big box on the stand (what a slightly smaller center would minimize).

If so, what options would everyone recommend within my budget?
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post #29 of 30
9/9/09 at 10:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecomovie View Post


If so, what options would everyone recommend within my budget?

I fear that if you go much smaller, pairing something this small with towers in the future will be quite unbalanced...

Where as the C-C50 matches perfect with the C-300 towers and at at $130 each (Vanns) you can't go wrong. that would be the C-C50 center and (2) C-300 towers for around $340, depending on what we can find the center for...
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post #30 of 30
9/11/09 at 11:54am
Thread Starter 
alright, so it appears that I will be able to put a center in front of the TV on the same stand and move the TV to the back of the stand to get a bigger center (woohooo!).

I can fit up to 8 inches depth on the stand before the centre would start to overhang (which I would prefer not to do). Height maximum is still around 5 inches (give or take a half inch).

With these new options, what would everyone recommend for the aforementioned budget I have (about $400-500 for the front three), mainly for movies and TV with some music every so often.

I have been looking the Energy C-series, but the C-C50 is getting tough to find. And I would like to be able to compare it to other recommendations. Any thoughts?

Thanks as always!
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