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Sherwood R-972 User Thread - Page 69

post #2041 of 3156
Yes, they had/have the standard 90-day refurbished warranty. I didn't get one in the end, though if the sale pops up again I might pull the trigger on one then.

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #2042 of 3156
Augmont, how does it sound?
post #2043 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Crash View Post

Augmont, how does it sound?

 

I haven't had an opportunity to really listen to the R-972 Trinnov with a discerning ear as i'm limited on quiet time (have a 9 yr old with as much energy as a nuclear reactor).  He's going to a b-day party this weekend so that will give me a few hours.

 

I'm still making changes to my subwoofer settings as i'm getting a better understanding of the amps controls.  I've also been toying with the idea of relocating my subwoofer to the back underneath the end table but i have fear that it would be localized (i'd build a new subwoofer enclosure if it worked there).   As you can see, i'm very limited in options and my  only other location would be to moved to the left side of the TV. 

 

1000


Edited by Augmont - 1/8/13 at 1:07pm
post #2044 of 3156
I ordered one of the 1saleaday refurbs after reading this thread. I am an "old school" 2-channel audiophile at heart (Audio Research and Moscode tube gear, Linn turntable) and until now have been using an old Kenwood Sovereign 5900 THX 5.1 receiver (via an A/B switch at the amp, the other input being my tube preamp and turntable), when I wanted surround sound for movies. This is my first foray into 7.1, and with the R-972 it seems I'll be jumping into it in a big way.

Both my room and equipment are a bit challenging, so I would appreciate any and all advice on proper setup, especially using the Trinnov Optimizer. My front speakers are bipoles (Mirage M3si), and my 4 surrounds are dipoles (Energy RVSS). The center speaker (a Mirage MCsi) is conventional. Placement wise, due to room limitations my sofa is almost up against the rear wall. So the rear surrounds will only be about a foot behind the sofa, and the side surrounds will be a foot or two forward of it rather than directly to the sides. I know this is far from optimal, but it's not a deep enough room to allow anything else.

I read an article by Atlantic Technology - see http://www.atlantictechnology.com/Upload/PDFs/tech_tips/AT-TT-No10-print.pdf - saying that if you're using dipole surround speakers in 7.1 you should reverse the left and right channels on the rear surrounds (but not the side surrounds), and point the 4 surround speakers such that the null is in the listening position. However this of course assumes optimal speaker placement . With my listening position further back than optimal, is that still a good idea? Also, how will the Trinnov Optimizer handle that? If I follow that advice, when in test mode the microphone will have to find that two rear channels even though the left rear is coming from the right rear corner and vice versa. From my limited understanding, that won't work, will it? As I understand it, even the fact that my surrounds are dipoles could make things challenging for the optimizer to handle, let alone the left and right rear channels being reversed. So, if I'm right about that, this means I'd have to set the left and right rears up correctly during the Trinnov setup, and then reverse the two channels after setup, right? Is that advisable? Any thoughts, on setup, placement, etc.?
Edited by busdepot - 1/8/13 at 3:32pm
post #2045 of 3156
busdepot - I read the Atlantic technote that you provided the link for. Their recommendation is accurate based on my experience. I just switched the left and right speaker on the rear wall when I was using dipole speakers. I'm not sure what Trinnov will do in regards to changing the phase of speakers. If you can place your speakers temporarily on stands or boxes or something else, you will have an opportunity to experiment and determine what placement sounds best to you (and you can physically switch the speakers after running Trinnov also). This is useful also in other situations such as when deciding whether to utilize front wide or height speakers in a 9.1 arrangement.

You specified that your side surrounds are going to be a foot or two forward of the listening area. Since you are using dipoles, this will not be as big a problem as it would be with direct firing speakers which are much easier to localize. I would recommend mounting them several feet above ear level to further decrease localization issues at the listening position. Again, if you can set things up temporarily first, that is ideal.

If I have time this weekend, I'll try hooking up my Boston Acoustics VRS Pro and 575x speakers (these are all THX certified dipole speakers) in my lower man cave system (with R-972) and report back on how well it works as well as whether the Trinnov calibration runs smoothly with those speakers.
post #2046 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Encom Tron View Post

I would recommend mounting them several feet above ear level to further decrease localization issues at the listening position.

That would be my preference, but I've found it somewhat difficult to find affordable stands that will hold 15 lb speakers that high up. (One wall has a full length window and the other a stone fireplace with no mantle, so stands are my only choice.) The closest I found were the Sanus Hover stands, which are 58 inches tall, but they're only rated for 10 lbs each. So, unfortunately, I may have to settle for 48 inch tall stands.

Like I said, it's a very challenging room ... :-(
post #2047 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

Chales...if you need more bass, just turn the gain up on the subwoofer. That would be doing effectively the same thing as the boost file.

not true... if you're not happy about the bass output, read a bit of this forum. through. in early days - I got one of the first r-972 guinea pigs - the actually files were a true God send. A lot of us ended up using and liking the 6dB, thinking that was a fairly neutral setting that corrected for an initial problem with the r-972 that could NOT be adjust by cranking gain...
post #2048 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by scott911 View Post

not true... if you're not happy about the bass output, read a bit of this forum. through. in early days - I got one of the first r-972 guinea pigs - the actually files were a true God send. A lot of us ended up using and liking the 6dB, thinking that was a fairly neutral setting that corrected for an initial problem with the r-972 that could NOT be adjust by cranking gain...
Actually, if you read the thread, per Curt Hoyt, the files actually do the same thing as turning the gain up on the subwoofer.
post #2049 of 3156
Quick question on firmware... 1.47i or 1.47v? Or was there another working firmware version that should be used? tia
post #2050 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by avsmoss View Post

Quick question on firmware... 1.47i or 1.47v? Or was there another working firmware version that should be used? tia
How do you determine which firmware the receiver has?
post #2051 of 3156
To check firmware, in Standby mode, press DISPLAY and ENTER/MEMO button on the unit together.
Turn the multi control knob to the right. FW, DSP FLASH, etc will be displayed.

DSP FLASH 090318/991119.
If you see 391119, it means that +6dB is applied. If it shows 691119, it means that +3dB is applied.
post #2052 of 3156
Mine says 1.47i(latest?). When I scroll to HDMI Part it says ver 1.11. Is that right or should it be v1.4? Also the screen that says 972 USA RDS is off. Can that be turned on so the station call letters and song info show up?
post #2053 of 3156
Where is the newest firmware download available? I can't seem to find it, and I want to load it first thing when I get mine.
post #2054 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by scott911 View Post

not true... if you're not happy about the bass output, read a bit of this forum. through. in early days - I got one of the first r-972 guinea pigs - the actually files were a true God send. A lot of us ended up using and liking the 6dB, thinking that was a fairly neutral setting that corrected for an initial problem with the r-972 that could NOT be adjust by cranking gain...

 

I tried a Onkyo TX-NR818 while I still had the R-972 (with the +6 boost) and found the bass was very similar (in volume). Now I didn't bother running Audyssey XT32 on the Onkyo since the vocals were so dramatically different (bad) coming from the bottom of the screen... the R-972's remapping instantly ended any thoughts of using the Onkyo based on my room's configuration.

post #2055 of 3156
Just curious to see what other receivers 972 owners compared/ or had before buying a 972? I had a H/K AVR2600. Compared a H/K AVR7550HD and a Yamaha RX-A820.
post #2056 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by scott911 View Post

A lot of us ended up using and liking the 6dB, thinking that was a fairly neutral setting...
Since our human hearing is less sensitive in the lower frequencies, no surprise that a 6dB boost sounded fairly neutral.
post #2057 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

Actually, if you read the thread, per Curt Hoyt, the files actually do the same thing as turning the gain up on the subwoofer.

just sharing my first hand experience... I'm not sure where curt ( i know who he is) chimed in, but initially that was not the case. Perhaps a subsequent firm wear upgrade resolved the issue that REQUIRED the 3db, 6db - whatever...
post #2058 of 3156
The bass files were just basically an easier "preset" way of adding back the bass without having to use the more time consuming method of using a SPL meter and adjusting the sub gain control.
post #2059 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Augmont View Post

 

I haven't had an opportunity to really listen to the R-972 Trinnov with a discerning ear as i'm limited on quiet time (have a 9 yr old with as much energy as a nuclear reactor).  He's going to a b-day party this weekend so that will give me a few hours.

 

I'm still making changes to my subwoofer settings as i'm getting a better understanding of the amps controls.  I've also been toying with the idea of relocating my subwoofer to the back underneath the end table but i have fear that it would be localized (i'd build a new subwoofer enclosure if it worked there).   As you can see, i'm very limited in options and my  only other location would be to moved to the left side of the TV. 

 

1000

It doesn't appear that i'm going to address my subwoofer placement anytime soon as i have too many other projects going on but i wanted to give some initial feedback on sound for Trinnov.

 

I've been very impressed so far with Trinnov and how well the 3D mapping sounds for watching movies on Directv (HBO, Starz, etc.).  My surrounds are much, much improved and i get a sense of being surrounded by sound without localization.  Before, my surrounds were barely noticeable and when they were used then they became very noticeable and localized.  We've also notice a better presentation of the vocals from the center and the sound REALLY does appear to be coming from the screen and not below like before.  We have yet to watch any blu-rays movies (i know......it's horrible) but hopefully we'll be able to watch something this weekend.

post #2060 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Encom Tron View Post

busdepot - I read the Atlantic technote that you provided the link for. Their recommendation is accurate based on my experience. I just switched the left and right speaker on the rear wall when I was using dipole speakers. I'm not sure what Trinnov will do in regards to changing the phase of speakers. If you can place your speakers temporarily on stands or boxes or something else, you will have an opportunity to experiment and determine what placement sounds best to you (and you can physically switch the speakers after running Trinnov also). This is useful also in other situations such as when deciding whether to utilize front wide or height speakers in a 9.1 arrangement.

You specified that your side surrounds are going to be a foot or two forward of the listening area. Since you are using dipoles, this will not be as big a problem as it would be with direct firing speakers which are much easier to localize. I would recommend mounting them several feet above ear level to further decrease localization issues at the listening position. Again, if you can set things up temporarily first, that is ideal.

If I have time this weekend, I'll try hooking up my Boston Acoustics VRS Pro and 575x speakers (these are all THX certified dipole speakers) in my lower man cave system (with R-972) and report back on how well it works as well as whether the Trinnov calibration runs smoothly with those speakers.


This weekend I setup the Boston Acoustics 575x speakers as side surrounds and re-ran Trinnov. Everything worked fine during calibration but I did notice that the processor sent 9 test tones to the 575x speakers (they are dipoles) but only 3 test tones to the other 5 non-dipole speakers. I watched the first 15 minutes of Terminator 2 again (DVD) and then played Goldeneye 007 (Nintendo 64) for about half an hour. Both sounded great with this mix of dipoles and non-dipoles. Next weekend I'll try out running dipoles for the rear surrounds and report back how well that works.
post #2061 of 3156
The more time I spend with this receiver the more I am impressed. Just watched Casino Royale and heard things that I hadn't heard before. I use this as my test disc for video. There are many small sounds that come out. This thing also extracts every little bit out of a standard DVD. For movies, this piece is the best I have heard. As far as quirks, it definetly has them. I was all for returning it and keeping my 5508 when it comes back from having the HDMI board replaced. I really wish Onkyo would get Trinnov. That combination would be unbeatable.
post #2062 of 3156
I forgot to mention that I hooked up a Sony Playstation 3D display to one of my R-972s and it passed 3-D with no problems. My wife and I picked one up at Best Buy on black Friday for $99 and I finally opened the box this past weekend. I tested it with a 3D blu ray movie as well as a 3D enabled PS3 game and both worked fine. I was surprised at how good the Playstation 3D display looks but with a screen size of 24 inches, I think that our 60 inch display will be the one that is hooked up most of the time. Now I really wish that the 972 had a 2nd monitor out ( and that there was a lot more 3D material). So now I gotta look into an HDMI splitter.
Edited by Encom Tron - 1/16/13 at 1:55pm
post #2063 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Augmont View Post

I've been very impressed so far with Trinnov and how well the 3D mapping sounds for watching movies on Directv (HBO, Starz, etc.).  My surrounds are much, much improved and i get a sense of being surrounded by sound without localization.  Before, my surrounds were barely noticeable and when they were used then they became very noticeable and localized.  We've also notice a better presentation of the vocals from the center and the sound REALLY does appear to be coming from the screen and not below like before.  We have yet to watch any blu-rays movies (i know......it's horrible) but hopefully we'll be able to watch something this weekend.

That is what impresses me the most, no longer listening to the speakers but listening to a wall of sound that surrounds you.
post #2064 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkpro View Post

The more time I spend with this receiver the more I am impressed. Just watched Casino Royale and heard things that I hadn't heard before. I use this as my test disc for video. There are many small sounds that come out. This thing also extracts every little bit out of a standard DVD. For movies, this piece is the best I have heard. As far as quirks, it definetly has them. I was all for returning it and keeping my 5508 when it comes back from having the HDMI board replaced. I really wish Onkyo would get Trinnov. That combination would be unbeatable.

I agree, the 5508 is a better all around pre-pro and musically I find it more satisfying but for movies Trinnov is too good to give up. I am just crossing my fingers that Trinnov makes it into another reasonably priced pre-pro soon, the only other alternative is the ADA which costs $10K for the Trinnov EQ alone on top of the $8K pre-pro eek.gif
post #2065 of 3156
Hi new user here!

I purchased a second hand R-972 that appears to have a few HDMI issues.

It has firmware 1.47I, and I was wondering if anyone could send me the 1.47v version or better.

I am having issues with DTS-HD MSTR tracks muting and having popping sounds when switching back and forth between HDMI inputs. This goes away when the V.Upscale is sent to Auto, which is a curious issue. No issues with Dolby TrueHD tracks.

But, when V.Upscale is set to Auto, again when I switch between inputs back to the blu-ray, the picture is a greenish/purple which is only cured but again, switching back and forth between menus on the blu-ray or HDMI inputs on the receiver.

The R-972 is connected to a Panasonic BDP-85 in HDMI1. I have tried the blu-ray player in HDMI2, 3 and 4 and same issues persist. No issues with an Oppo DV-980H DVD Player or an LG DVR/HDD player.

Thanks for any assistance.
post #2066 of 3156
vectorized - You have the most recent firmware update (1.47i). I have only had 1 HDMI issue on one of my R-972s which went away as soon as I swtched the video upscale to bypass. When the video upscale is set to bypass, the video upscale indicator lights up and stays lit which is what other users have reported in this thread.
post #2067 of 3156
Mine still hasn't shipped yet from 1saleaday
post #2068 of 3156
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhazard View Post

Mine still hasn't shipped yet from 1saleaday

Your not alone! mad.gif
post #2069 of 3156
If I put in V.Bypass, my DTS Master Audio drops out and doesn't come back without a bunch of cycles of HDMI inputs. This is getting very annoying.

If I leave the Video Scaling in Auto, I get audio without the pops and dropouts, but I have the issue with the picture going a purple/green and other picture related issues. I don't trust that the scaler is better than the one in the Panasonic player.

Its a version 1.47i and HDMI 1.11, Refurbished unit.

Any assistance is greatly appreciated. I love the sound and the unit appears to be high quality, but the interface is questionable for a $1800 list product. I'm afraid now of selling my Denon AVR-888 now as it works flawlessly even though it has no on-board lossless decoding and only 2 HDMI ins.
post #2070 of 3156
I would try another HDMI cable just to make sure. What resolution are you sending out of the Panasonic? I have the BD-85 and have none of the issues with the 972. I have the scaler by passed.
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