Panasonic G10 or Samsung B650

The majority of the people here seem to prefer the Sammy over the Panny. Input lag isn't an issue when Game Mode is on, but while it's off - yes it's a noticeable issue. IR is struck on my set like lightning, but from what I'm hearing it's probably just my specific set. Buzz isn't on my set, though - I have about 10 people to back this statement up, we've walked all around the room and could not hear any buzz at all. Just my 2 cents.

I went back and fourth and back and fourth again on this as well. I found that a good number of people here have had buzz problems. I just didn't want to take that risk. I'm going with the G10. Wish I could afford the V10!

What do you base that statement on? I've seen the opposite here at AVS and on other forums. I continually see many posts from unhappy Samsung owners who returned it for a Panasonic and said the Panasonic was better. Alternately, it's very rare that i see a post from someone who returned a Panasonic and got a Samsung instead. I'm not bashing, but i read tons of threads here and the overwhelming theme is that Panasonic is preferred over Samsung, very often by people who have owned both.

And here are a few polls:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1175276

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1170224

Do you not see the irony in your own post? You question the validity of Dizzy's observation of posts seen here. You support your argument using the same method, posts you've read here.

Yeah but i read most of the Samsung threads and all of the Panasonic threads here on the Plasma forum, and have for over 5 years and the trend i keep seeing is the opposite to what Dizzy has claimed. That's why i asked him what he's basing it on - because it has to be more than just AVS members.

I bought the 58B650 and ended up returning it for the 54G10 because of the buzzing issues. I love this TV and only wished my wife didn't force me to buy a TV right away and could of waited for the 58V10 to be released.

This is now my second Panasonic plasma and I don't think I'd ever buy (or attempt) another brand again.

Dizzy and Randy are both overstating. There is strong support for both in the forum these days. It certainly wouldn’t be accurate to say more people here prefer Samsung – I don’t know how you could justify that statement with the available facts. I would say based on poll results and posts whenever someone does one of these (practically once a day) “should I get the Samsung or Panasonic” topics that there is still a little more support for Panasonic, but it's not overwhelming for one side or the other. Historically there has been more support for Panasonic because until the last year or two Samsung wasn't in the same league. They have been catching up fast and AVS old-timers like Randy (I’m one too), who also happens to be a hardcore Panasonic fan, haven't wrapped their heads around considering Samsung in the same sentence with Panasonic. To them it will never be in the same tier, no matter what. The problem is that as Samsung popularity grows, it is at the expense of Panasonic, so feelings are bound to remain sensitive on this issue.

There are plenty of happy Samsung owners and one of the reasons its support is growing so fast is because they have differentiators from Panasonic that appeal to some people – a different design aesthetic, a picture with more out of the box pop, different menus and features, swivel stands, etc. Not to mention somewhat lower price points for the comparable models, which used to be Panasonic’s exclusive corner of the market for tier 1 plasma sets.

That said, there is no doubt the 2009 Samsungs have an issue where a meaningful minority of people are ending up with sets that buzz too loud. And it is pretty clear that Samsung customer support for this sucks, whereas customer relations is a strong point for Panasonic.

Some of us go into this eyes wide open because the unique qualities of the Samsungs make it worth the risk. I personally owned a Panasonic plasma I was very happy with and recently bought a Samsung I am loving and that has no buzz issue. But to each their own. There is no clear no-brainer answer. It depends on how strongly you prefer one versus the other and what your appetite for hassle is.

Good luck.

I was in the same boat..I went ahead and purchased the Sammy PN58B860....Yes Major BUZZZZZZ issues. Luckily BB is going to be delivering another next week to replace this one. I cant believe the PQ of this sammmy thats why Im hoping the 2nd one wont be a buzzer....If it is I may just go to the LCD version at only 55" :-(....or jump ship and go for the Panny

Though the G10 is hard to find, there are a LOT of G15's (in my area anyway--metro DC). Why don't you get one of those? No difference from the G10 except a slight diff in width and front bezel design.

I emailed David Katzmaier from CNET regarding the overall PQ of both these sets.

"Hey David, I saw your best top 5 TVs for picture quality and best TVs
overall. On your picture quality rankings you had the G10 as 2nd. On the
best tvs overall you had the g10 as 7th. But on the best overall you
had the Samsung B650 higher than the G10, and on the PQ the B650 is
below the G10. So my question is which one would you recommend for best
PQ overall? G10 or B650?"

"I would choose the G10, which is why it's ranked #2 on that list. The
"Best overall" list breaks ties (the B650 and the G10 have a tie in all
rating numbers, including performance) by placing the newest reviews
first.

Hope that helps,

David"



I guess it depends on personal preference and your viewing conditions. If you like more accurate colors go with the B650, if you want slightly deeper blacks, go with the G10.

What minimum black level has the G10 been measured at (either fL or cd/m^2 is fine)?

I've consistantly measured 0.0077fL - 0.0091fL.

Would the S series measure the same? I'm considering a 58S1 as there is no 58" G model.

the biggest flaws in the g10 series changed my mind

The greenish look in the picture due to the issues with panasonics green color decoding which cant be fixed, Plus the G10 has more grainy look when watching movies. Yes it has darker blacks but with its color issues, i couldnt over look that.

the buzz issue is so blown out of proportion. I have had two 650 series plasma and neather one has a buzzing sound. IR is a little bit more prone on the samsung but goes away in a second. not that big of a deal. plus the G10 cant handle 24p video without causing a serious flicker. If your going to get a 54 inch g10, why not just get a 50in V10. the v10 still has color issues but its a whole lot better. 650 has better color than any of the panasonics t.vs just slighty and i mean slighty litter blacks. check the Cnet reviews

I had the 58 650 and the 50 650. The 50 inch did not buzz but the 58 had horrible buzz. I have a V10 now and I couldnt be happier. The 650 can have semi deep blacks with the sacrafice of shadow detail. If you want good shadow detail, prepare for LCD blacks. Color is superb with great saturation. Picture is sharp and crisp. You will def see image retention, but after 100 hours or so, you stop seeing it less and less. Didnt notice motion issues except for 24p cant be used since the mode has an issue when engaged, the picture becomes washed out.

The panasonic has much deeper blacks which are very close to 8g kuro, in fact, only in full screen blacks will it show a hair less deep. Shadow detail is superb, better than the Kuro imo (i had 8g and elite 9g). Colors are more natural looking than the samsung imo, though I could only speak on the V10. No noticeable buzz, no IR, no dirty screen effect (minor on samsung and more than minor on the Kuro.) Panny gets brighter it seems also.

Look for a V10. Clevland plasma has great price on it.

I returned two B650s. Great picture but it's hard to enjoy when you have a headache from the buzzing. As soon as I can get my hands on a 58V10 I will.

Important disclosure before my point. I lack the knowledge on this stuff that many opine with here on this forum. But with that said I'm hoping my input can help someone. With that said, go check out my new topic, "G10 UNPACKED and WOW factor not overly impressive"

Yes

The 54V10 would be my choice. Add a bluray player and you get 24p proper. Can't get 24p with the G series.

THIS.

Personally I'd rather have better and accurate color and have 'slightly' weaker blacks than to have innacurate color and slightly darker blacks...And Panasonics THX Mode is gimped because it lacks in brightness.

Samsung for me.

Well you can, but it causes flickering because of the lower refresh rate (48Hz vs 96Hz). Panasonic should have used 72Hz instead.

So CNet was full of it when they said in their review that the S1 had worse blacks than the G10?


http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-t...-33497899.html

Why 72hz? Is it the most proper way to eliminate judder? I thought it doesn't matter which you use (48,72,96 hz). They all eliminate judder. As long as they don't flicker its all good.

Appeared lighter could be gamma not black levels. Measurements would stay the same but it would look more washed out with lower gamma.

The reason in bold... sure it eliminates film judder, but it introduces flicker because the refresh rate is too low.

I said proper.