I suppose it's worth trying. When I had my cht 18.t in that corner I gained a bit of output but still had the dip.
buying another sub and amp is not really an option at the moment. I should be clear that I do enjoy the way they sound right now, just looking to see what I can improve without going too crazy. I will see how ir responds with one sub moved near field.
Try one CHT18 behind the seat. See if that makes a difference.
OK - did my first REW sweeps with the Caps in my room. In short, I have some pretty major work to do as they look pretty bad. I did sweeps with each sub individually, then both combined. It seems my nasty dip at ~23hz is intensified when both subs play together. BTW if it isn't evident this is the 20hz tune, no port plug is in. 90hz crossover with my yamaha avr.
Red - Right cap only
Green - Left cap only
Blue - Both caps combined
Pic is attached - ugh, where to start? I REALLY like the aesthetics of where they sit right now and there isn't much room to work with in the front soundstage. I'm thinking of moving one of them to the rear and leaving one up front. I think it's clear that this is not a theater by any means but I would like to make as many feasible improvements as a I can. I do have a Behringer EQ that I could use if needed to start with, it just looks so awful with the other equipment. I'm not opposed to picking up something like a Minidsp. Thoughts?
It looks like the 23 hz is a phase issue and the 40hz is placement. Try facing the driver in all 4 different directions and see if that helps with the null.
It looks like the 23 hz is a phase issue and the 40hz is placement. Try facing the driver in all 4 different directions and see if that helps with the null.
I was thinking the same, I will try that. Thanks for the input.
I also ordered new speakon connectors so I'll be trying one in the back of the room sometime next week.
All of a sudden I'm getting terrible on and off hum and occasionally, god awful thumps and pops from my Cap during playback.
You figure I have my power cord for my Crown, the power cord for the Behringer MIC 2200, the RCA sub cable to the RCA barrel connector to RCA to XLR cable to the mic 2200 and the XLR to XLR connectig rhe 2200 and the amp back there so a lot going on, cable-wise.
I THINK it's the RCA to XLR going into the mic 2200 that's the problem (vibration setting it off occasionally?) as I did a bit of jostling and it wasn't happy, but even moving the XLR to XLR (between the 2200 and amp) a bit produced some hum.
I try as best I can to give the cables some breathing room but the reality is that they're all going in and out of components right next to one another so closer proximity is a bit unavoidable. I've been fine till now, you suppose that RCA to XLR just went to $hit? No hands or pets back there, but I guess anything's possible?
Anyone else ever had this issue? I think my cable was Hosa...any other reasonably priced suggestions?
And last do I have to worry about the power cords for the amp and pre amp and speaker wire running near the XLRs/RCA's? I thought I'm pretty safe these days and it's never been an issue before.
All of a sudden I'm getting terrible on and off hum and occasionally, god awful thumps and pops from my Cap during playback.
You figure I have my power cord for my Crown, the power cord for the Behringer MIC 2200, the RCA sub cable to the RCA barrel connector to RCA to XLR cable to the mic 2200 and the XLR to XLR connectig rhe 2200 and the amp back there so a lot going on, cable-wise.
I THINK it's the RCA to XLR going into the mic 2200 that's the problem (vibration setting it off occasionally?) as I did a bit of jostling and it wasn't happy, but even moving the XLR to XLR (between the 2200 and amp) a bit produced some hum.
I try as best I can to give the cables some breathing room but the reality is that they're all going in and out of components right next to one another so closer proximity is a bit unavoidable. I've been fine till now, you suppose that RCA to XLR just went to $hit? No hands or pets back there, but I guess anything's possible?
Anyone else ever had this issue? I think my cable was Hosa...any other reasonably priced suggestions?
And last do I have to worry about the power cords for the amp and pre amp and speaker wire running near the XLRs/RCA's? I thought I'm pretty safe these days and it's never been an issue before.
Maybe just some 101 re-fresh is what I need.
This sucks!
Thanks,
James
Is it random, or pretty steady?
If it's regular, I guess the first thing to do is power it all down and check connections. Then on to eliminating components from the chain.
^ no, it comes and goes, mostly. The problem of course is that it's with same - source cables and not components (I realize you may have not meant components in the A/V sense) so any removal is going to stop sound, period of course.
I know what you're getting at though, I'm pretty confident it's the RCA to XLR so I'll prolly start there and see what happens although I'm not a big believer in a cable just "going" sitting around, stationary. Crap happens though I guess.
^ thanks. Well, anything's possible I suppose. However I don't find it coincidental that when I move wires I can duplicate the baddies.
Could that be the function of a bad amp/pre amp? Perhaps, but I'm still leaning towards the cable even though conditions are unchanged.
I'm tempted to bypass the 2200 and go straight to the Cap- that would effectively point the problem to bethe RCA to XLR or amp, but the 2200 provides my HPF and I can only imagine what it's keepng from the Cap driver below 15hz.
^ thanks. Well, anything's possible I suppose.
I'm tempted to bypass the 2200 and go straight to the Cap- that would effectively point the problem to bethe RCA to XLR or amp, but the 2200 provides my HPF and I can only imagine what it's keepng from the Cap driver below 15hz.
James
Exactly, going direct from the Denon's LFE out with the same cables would tell the tale ... unless of course the problem lies in the Denon ...
I figure now I can have one cable from my Denon 4311 to the MIC2200 without a barrel connector to join my existing RCA and RCA to XLR cable.
James
James - Just be sure to double check the pins with a meter when you get it. Myself and others had a few bad batches that were miswired. Easy enough to fix and they offered a credit so no worries.
All - I had a chance to test out my Crown XLS5000 with my pair of Caps this afternoon. I'm now also running a dedicated 20A line for my sub amp. Holy ##@! this amp has some MAJOR power. It's like listening to different subs now. My lamp in the back corner of the room actually fell off the table. My tv started doing weird things when the bass would really slam, heh. Since I'm not yet running a HPF I limited my listening to music for now. Yes, the fan is LOUD, but I'll see what I can do about swapping it out. It does vary quite a bit but after 20+ minutes near clipping in 2 ohm stereo it was like a mini-tornado, lol. At that point the air coming out of the amp was finally warm. For the first 10 minutes or so it was still ice cold. To give you a point of reference, the loudest the fan got was 78-80db right in front of the amp and would ramp down to 68-70db-ish once the abuse settled a bit. I'll probably take a look at that fan that's in there, but I'll leave it alone for a bit. After listening to the caps blasting, the ambient noise of the fan didn't quite seem so bad anymore.
Cranked up a little dubstep, running the subs about 4-5db hot at reference. I'm talking SOLID (not peak) 125+DB from the listening position in a 8000+ cubic foot room open to at least another 6000. The meter was pegged several times as you can see from the clip below. For reference, when using my Berry with similar music it would usually average around 118ish and peak in the low 120s. Even in my room the pressure of the room was insane. Funny enough, the subs are nowhere near ideally placed either. I'll be experimenting with that later this week - although it's not like I really want any more output. I can't imagine what one of these would sound like in the corner, nearfield. I'd imagine 130+DB RMS at the LP easily. I can't tell you that this amp will be flat to 2hz as some are concerned with, but I can tell you there is a tremendous difference between this and my EP4000 I previously had powering them. So far LOVING this amp, just need to figure out the fan situation if possible.
A sample below. Warning: My iphone camera mic apprently does not like this type of pressure being recorded so keep your volume down, heh.
So those miswired RCA to XLRs could be causing a hum? I just finished installing a new 20A circuit in my theater area. Tested it; everything looks fine. Plug in the amp and I have a nasty hum.
The odd thing is it was previously plugged into a circuit that was apparently not grounded and there is no hum at all when plugged in there. Trying to diagnose now as I would really like to use my properly grounded, 20A circuit :-(
What are you going to use for highpass w/ the Crown?
I've also been looking hard at the minidsp. Seems hard to beat for anywhere near it's price. I looked at something simple like the Ed eq also, but the minidsp offers so much more.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea
gorilla - and with that news I'll likely be buying a mini dsp and a crown xls this weekend.
Woot. Hope you like it man, it seems like a real powerhouse. if you're already hitting a clean 125db in your room, I can't imagine what it would sound like with the crown. I honestly wouldn't need/want much more than this thing offers. For the true sickos or those with massive rooms, you could always run one of these on each cap at 3750 watts a piece at 8 ohm mono.
Just be sure you're ok with the fan noise for now. I hear crown's warranty support is great and it does carry a 3yr no fault. I'm trying to decide if I want to mod it.
I'm now also running a dedicated 20A line for my sub amp. Holy ##@! this amp has some MAJOR power.
Did you use the Behringer with the new dedicated line at all? The reason I ask is I'm wondering how much (if any) of the increase in output is due to having a dedicated 20A line?
That is really amazing. Thanks for the video, very impressive. I'm not touching those levels in my 3300 cu. foot pretty much sealed room. Using C weighted slow response the highest I've seen is 116 at my listening position (17 feet away from sub) with my single Captivator/Behringer combo with no dedicated line and I assume 15A.
Did you use the Behringer with the new dedicated line at all? The reason I ask is I'm wondering how much (if any) of the increase in output is due to having a dedicated 20A line?
.
I have not tested that scenario yet, but it was rare that the ep tripped the breaker. That does not mean that voltage was not dropping though. Even with the 20a/12 gauge wire the crown would still cause a big voltage drop - I saw as low as 114v from a normal 120! Without a regulated power source I think it would be hard to get full rated power out of this thing.
Continuing to play with the DSP in hopes of dialing in an acceptable FR in my bear of a room.
The blue line represents the raw response of the room, green line my 1st attempt at PEQ adjustments and the red line the most recent adjustments.
I was able to fix some of my nasty 40hz null by moving the main listening position back approx. 18 inches.....of course, there's no free lunch and the fix at 40hz cost me another dip at 56hz. Still fiddling with placement but, as noted previously, my options are limited.
Additionally, I purposely did not cut the lowest 1/5th octave as I prefer the extra oomph down there. Overall...making progress. Slowly
Continuing to play with the DSP in hopes of dialing in an acceptable FR in my bear of a room.
The blue line represents the raw response of the room, green line my 1st attempt at PEQ adjustments and the red line the most recent adjustments.
I was able to fix some of my nasty 40hz null by moving the main listening position back approx. 18 inches.....of course, there's no free lunch and the fix at 40hz cost me another dip at 56hz. Still fiddling with placement but, as noted previously, my options are limited.
Additionally, I purposely did not cut the lowest 1/5th octave as I prefer the extra oomph down there. Overall...making progress. Slowly
It's looking better! So, are you happier with the output and sound in your room as a result, because that's the most important thing in all of this! Lest we forget that we're supposed to actually like what we hear, not just be able to post silly pancake graphs.
I made an offer on the crown xls5000 amp at uniquesquared.com We'll see if they oblige... I didn't feel like creating another new account to take advantage of the 10% off coupon.
It's looking better! So, are you happier with the output and sound in your room as a result, because that's the most important thing in all of this! Lest we forget that we're supposed to actually like what we hear, not just be able to post silly pancake graphs.
Definitely like it better....hearing how bad a 15-120hz sine sweep sounded with my room's raw response really emphasized the importance of a flat response to my listening habits. The peaky, boomy response masked a lot of detail in the remainder of the soundtrack as well as distracted me with undue buzzing and rattling.
Save for a kick at the low end, I definitely prefer a flat response run about 3 dbs hot for movies and music. It just sounds so smooth and, above all, realistic. Watched one of the early gunfight scenes from Live Free or Die Hard blu-ray after the most recent PEQ tweaking and was just grinning like a fool. I never even liked the movie before but couldn't stop watching today, lol.
For anyone looking for some fun demo material outside of the usual suspects on the scuba demo disk, you've gotta check this one out. The first big gunfight scene involves suppressed assault rifles that "thwunk" at about 25-30 hz and, obviously, in rapid fire succession. The scene definitely gave the Captivators a workout!
I've had my two passive captivators for a few days now and done some fiddling. The lucky comment refers to my wishful thinking that they wouldn't need eq in my room. Nope. Not even close.
Thus far I am not as impressed as I hoped to be, but I'm sure most of that is attributable to the subs not being "dialed-in." I also was not able to do a sub crawl as WAF dictated that the caps could only be in the front corners
And now, after EQ'ing just a little bit...
Quote:
Originally Posted by _Avarice_
Definitely like it better....hearing how bad a 15-120hz sine sweep sounded with my room's raw response really emphasized the importance of a flat response to my listening habits. The peaky, boomy response masked a lot of detail in the remainder of the soundtrack as well as distracted me with undue buzzing and rattling.
Save for a kick at the low end, I definitely prefer a flat response run about 3 dbs hot for movies and music. It just sounds so smooth and, above all, realistic. Watched one of the early gunfight scenes from Live Free or Die Hard blu-ray after the most recent PEQ tweaking and was just grinning like a fool. I never even liked the movie before but couldn't stop watching today, lol.
For anyone looking for some fun demo material outside of the usual suspects on the scuba demo disk, you've gotta check this one out. The first big gunfight scene involves suppressed assault rifles that "thwunk" at about 25-30 hz and, obviously, in rapid fire succession. The scene definitely gave the Captivators a workout!
Are you as impressed as you thought you'd be? Do they outgun your Empires by alot? Give us some details, man!
I'm glad it's worked out for you. JTR makes solid, solid products. They ain't cheap, but nothing good is.
A couple other things to note. That Live Free or Die Hard scene is definitely well known as a demo. The whole movie is! As Archaea says, adding subs makes it the main event!
Also, I wouldn't bother with an Audyssey XT32 receiver down the line, if you're still considering one. I'm not convinced at all that the results are worth the huge price tag. I think you'd be much better off with amp + the simple external EQ of, say, a miniDSP. But, that would probably require you to get REW capabilities. Not that going there is a bad thing, by any means; it's prolly the best overall choice to make in the long run.
I made an offer on the crown xls5000 amp at uniquesquared.com We'll see if they oblige... I didn't feel like creating another new account to take advantage of the 10% off coupon.
I made an offer on the crown xls5000 amp at uniquesquared.com We'll see if they oblige... I didn't feel like creating another new account to take advantage of the 10% off coupon.
I know one of the guys from the CHT forum had luck with the same 534 shipped offer that the coupon would provide, not sure if it can be pushed any further though. It's weird though - it says offer price does not include shipping charges so be wary of that when offering.
I'll probably take a look at that fan that's in there, but I'll leave it alone for a bit. After listening to the caps blasting, the ambient noise of the fan didn't quite seem so bad anymore.
