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JTR Captivator - Page 153

post #4561 of 4725
^^ Thanks carp.. I'm going to work on them this whole weekend. I don't have REW or a Omni mic. But I do have a SMS-1 that I will use to see whats going on. If I have to move them around till I get a fairly flat FR then so be it. But I won't use the SMS-1 to EQ the subs. I'm going to use a Anti mode dual core 2.0 to do the EQ and maybe a house curve. So my workflow will be...
SMS-1 to view the graph of the FR.
Move subs around till I get a fair FR
Replace the SMS-1 for the Anti mode
Run anti mode to EQ subs
MCACC calibration on my SC-09tx
Then do a house curve with the Anti mode.

I'll post some graphs...
post #4562 of 4725



Best I got so far. I had to move two of the S2's at the back of my room. All four up front co-located was OK. But they seats to the left and right of MLP had some funky FR. The two at back is about 1/3rd in from the sides. Man I'm tired of moving these fat asses. I think I leave the quads where its at now. I'm gonna continue tomorrow. Only this time I'll pull the SMS-1 out of the chain and link up the Anti Mode 2.0 dual core. Other then that everything's fine, no hum from the subs. Oh yea, I have one question. Is it normal to have the volume on the sub plate all the way up? I'm 0 at the receiver. But I had to max out the knob on the sub to get up to 80 on the rack shack SPL meter...
post #4563 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post




Best I got so far. I had to move two of the S2's at the back of my room. All four up front co-located was OK. But they seats to the left and right of MLP had some funky FR. The two at back is about 1/3rd in from the sides. Man I'm tired of moving these fat asses. I think I leave the quads where its at now. I'm gonna continue tomorrow. Only this time I'll pull the SMS-1 out of the chain and link up the Anti Mode 2.0 dual core. Other then that everything's fine, no hum from the subs. Oh yea, I have one question. Is it normal to have the volume on the sub plate all the way up? I'm 0 at the receiver. But I had to max out the knob on the sub to get up to 80 on the rack shack SPL meter...
Rhed the set up looks awesome and nice room too. I am not as familiar with the anti mode, will you have individual delay control over each sub? Congrats on the setup.
post #4564 of 4725
Rhed
Wait till you trade out that Mythos ST system for JTR. I could not believe what the difference was between the Supertower vs the Triple 12s.eek.gif

With the ST I stopped listening when my ears could not take anymore. With the T12s I quite listening when my face hurts from smiling like a Fool. (like this biggrin.gif )

Chris
post #4565 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post




Best I got so far. I had to move two of the S2's at the back of my room. All four up front co-located was OK. But they seats to the left and right of MLP had some funky FR. The two at back is about 1/3rd in from the sides. Man I'm tired of moving these fat asses. I think I leave the quads where its at now. I'm gonna continue tomorrow. Only this time I'll pull the SMS-1 out of the chain and link up the Anti Mode 2.0 dual core. Other then that everything's fine, no hum from the subs. Oh yea, I have one question. Is it normal to have the volume on the sub plate all the way up? I'm 0 at the receiver. But I had to max out the knob on the sub to get up to 80 on the rack shack SPL meter...


I used to own a sms-1 and there were things I liked about it but using it to measure the response was not one of them. I think it's like 1/3rd smoothing? I highly recommend getting an omnimic. After I got the omnimic I realized that the sms-1 graph was completely worthless when it came to see what frequency response I was getting.

But never mind all that for now... how does the bass sound and feel to you right now? I've heard dual Cap S2's before so I imagine quads is beyond impressive! smile.gif


Hmmm odd that you have to crank the amp gain so high - what is the sub trim level set at on your receiver and what are the speaker trims set at?
post #4566 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post




Best I got so far. I had to move two of the S2's at the back of my room. All four up front co-located was OK. But they seats to the left and right of MLP had some funky FR. The two at back is about 1/3rd in from the sides. Man I'm tired of moving these fat asses. I think I leave the quads where its at now. I'm gonna continue tomorrow. Only this time I'll pull the SMS-1 out of the chain and link up the Anti Mode 2.0 dual core. Other then that everything's fine, no hum from the subs. Oh yea, I have one question. Is it normal to have the volume on the sub plate all the way up? I'm 0 at the receiver. But I had to max out the knob on the sub to get up to 80 on the rack shack SPL meter...
Take a look at the numbers for the gain knob and make sure you are not turning it down instead of up. It is a little confusing and I had it all messed up for about a week before I figured out I needed to turn it to -12 to get it to 75db.
post #4567 of 4725
Thanks carp.. I'd really want to get on the omni mic and REW gear. The only thing is I don't have a laptop yet. But I will soon. Just checked my sub and speaker trims. They are all at 0.
post #4568 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

Take a look at the numbers for the gain knob and make sure you are not turning it down instead of up. It is a little confusing and I had it all messed up for about a week before I figured out I needed to turn it to -12 to get it to 75db.

Is going counter clock wise on the knob (towards the infinity symbol) turning down the sub volume? Right now I'm at 0 at the sub knob.. Thanks
post #4569 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by countryWV View Post

Rhed
Wait till you trade out that Mythos ST system for JTR. I could not believe what the difference was between the Supertower vs the Triple 12s.eek.gif

With the ST I stopped listening when my ears could not take anymore. With the T12s I quite listening when my face hurts from smiling like a Fool. (like this biggrin.gif )

Chris

I believe you. And I can't wait till I change my LCR and surrounds.
post #4570 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post

Thanks carp.. I'd really want to get on the omni mic and REW gear. The only thing is I don't have a laptop yet. But I will soon. Just checked my sub and speaker trims. They are all at 0.

I bought a cheapie HP laptop for 200 bucks that I use to control my main computer through remote desktop. It works great, I never actually have to use windows 8 (not a fan) since I just use it for remote desktop. However, this only works if you have a computer already hooked up to your system.



You have a lot of wiggle room then, you could turn your speaker trims down a lot so you could have more room to turn up the subs hot if that's how you like them. You could turn your speaker trims down 10db's which would mean that reference level would be when your master volume is at +10 on the receiver (assuming you used audyssey to calibrate?)

I think this would be better than leaving the speaker trims where they are and turning up the sub trims above 0. I have read many times that you want the sub trims to be negative or at least no higher than 0 so that you don't clip the SW output from the receiver.

However.... if you get JTR speakers then you will need some other solution (something to boost the signal coming out of your receiver SW out) since I assume they will be far more efficient than your current speakers.
post #4571 of 4725
rhed,

Looking good so far! If you get a laptop that has HDMI out, which most do these days, I strongly recommend saving your money and just getting a calibrated USB mic from Cross-Spectrum Labs, to use with REW. That'll save you a couple hundred bucks off the price of an Omnimic, and it's a piece of cake to setup.
post #4572 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post




Best I got so far. I had to move two of the S2's at the back of my room. All four up front co-located was OK. But they seats to the left and right of MLP had some funky FR. The two at back is about 1/3rd in from the sides. Man I'm tired of moving these fat asses. I think I leave the quads where its at now. I'm gonna continue tomorrow. Only this time I'll pull the SMS-1 out of the chain and link up the Anti Mode 2.0 dual core. Other then that everything's fine, no hum from the subs. Oh yea, I have one question. Is it normal to have the volume on the sub plate all the way up? I'm 0 at the receiver. But I had to max out the knob on the sub to get up to 80 on the rack shack SPL meter...

I'm opposite...............

I had to lower the gain in order to calibrate to 75 dbs............................what receiver? Imput signal must not be strong enough..............


Ooops..................late
post #4573 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post

Is going counter clock wise on the knob (towards the infinity symbol) turning down the sub volume? Right now I'm at 0 at the sub knob.. Thanks
You have it all the way up. It is strange that it is only at 80 db with the test tones.
post #4574 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post

I'm opposite...............

I had to lower the gain in order to calibrate to 75 dbs............................what receiver? Imput signal must not be strong enough..............


Ooops..................late


I have a old receiver. It's a Pioneer Elite SC-09tx. I dont know if this info matters. But at the SC09 thread they say Th receiver should be able to drive a pro amp. 1.5 vrms. I don't know if that's the info you guys need to know. Hmm, maybe I should pull the SMS-1 and see if that's the culprit!.. I don't know, but i really do appreciate your help. Thanks..
post #4575 of 4725
I will be taking out the SMS-1 anyways. I'm gonna link up the dual core. Anyway this the specs on the dual core. It shows the output voltage on the unit. Don't know if you guys need to know that..

http://www.dspeaker.com/en/products/20-dual-core.shtml
post #4576 of 4725
Please let me know about my sub volume on the plate amp situation. I'm gonna be out for couple hours. Gotta head out to the gym. Got a trainee to do. But any other suggestions, help appreciated. Thanks..
post #4577 of 4725
HOOOLY SH!!!!t!!! Ok guys, I'm not quite done yet! Didn't put the Antimode dual core into the link. But kinda played with it a bit. Now, sub knob is at -4 and RX trim at 0. The FR came a little better from previous. I layed down the 2 S2's at back from previous upright position. Did make a slight difference. But anyway just wanted to hear the subs in action. Popped in TIH sonic cannons scene. And......smile.gifeek.gifeek.gifeek.gifsmile.gifsmile.gif.. You guys have to try this at home! Forget the chest pounding stuff. Feels like your whole body gets slammed with a truck! I don't know if it's just me but you can actually feel some kind of wave or air or some kind of pressure with sudden slams. F@>eek.gif Btw, volume was playing at -7db...smile.gif
post #4578 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post

HOOOLY SH!!!!t!!! Ok guys, I'm not quite done yet! Didn't put the Antimode dual core into the link. But kinda played with it a bit. Now, sub knob is at -4 and RX trim at 0. The FR came a little better from previous. I layed down the 2 S2's at back from previous upright position. Did make a slight difference. But anyway just wanted to hear the subs in action. Popped in TIH sonic cannons scene. And......smile.gifeek.gifeek.gifeek.gifsmile.gifsmile.gif.. You guys have to try this at home! Forget the chest pounding stuff. Feels like your whole body gets slammed with a truck! I don't know if it's just me but you can actually feel some kind of wave or air or some kind of pressure with sudden slams. F@>eek.gif Btw, volume was playing at -7db...smile.gif


Ok......................I have one S2 and feel the same way in certain scenes.........................................4- S2's................................that's NUTS! cool.gif

I have engineered my room for maximum dampening.....................it's soundproofed, isolated from rest of house..............................and one S2 gives crazy tactile feeling. Can't comprehend 4! One S2 can be felt on my 170ft long, 8 ft high, 8 inch thick retaining wall that is 25 ft away from room..........................4 S2's would most definitely knock it over!!!!!!wink.gif
post #4579 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by nube View Post

rhed,

Looking good so far! If you get a laptop that has HDMI out, which most do these days, I strongly recommend saving your money and just getting a calibrated USB mic from Cross-Spectrum Labs, to use with REW. That'll save you a couple hundred bucks off the price of an Omnimic, and it's a piece of cake to setup.
Nube, Is this the mic you are talking about from Cross-Spectrum Labs?

http://cross-spectrum.com/measurement/calibrated_umik.html


I have been using my SMS-1 mic for years and did not realize until recently the smoothing the SMS uses for the graph and would like to move on to REW and a calibrated mic. What exactly are the differences between an Omnimic and the Cross-Spectrum Labs mic? I would love to save a couple hundred as you mention if there are no major downsides vs Omnimic.


Amazing setup rhed! Wow! eek.gif
post #4580 of 4725
Alright guys. Pulled out the sms-1 and linked up the Dual Core. One thing I like about this unit is out has sub outs. Still gotta run this thing. I'll let you how it goes.

post #4581 of 4725
carp may have already mentioned this - but his SMS-1 limited dynamics as well. You may want to verify yours does not. It was at high levels - 120dB range IIRC, but it did seem to limit the max dynamics as opposed to taking it out of the signal chain on both his Submersive HP and a Dayton dual opposed 18" we tested with.
post #4582 of 4725
OK.. I have a nasty dip in my FR. Looks like around the 70-80 region.. Thoughts? Hmm, what if I Xover 100? Will that be very localizable? All subs are individually matched to 75db from the MLP with a spl meter.


Edited by rhed - 12/8/13 at 7:42pm
post #4583 of 4725
The dip at 70 - 80 Hz could be a boundary cancellation. If your sub is about 3.5' to 4' from a wall, try moving it a little closer (eg. 3'). That would raise the cancellation frequency above 80 Hz. If your crossover is at 80 Hz then the null should disappear.
post #4584 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhed View Post

OK.. I have a nasty dip in my FR. Looks like around the 70-80 region.. Thoughts? Hmm, what if I Xover 100? Will that be very localizable? All subs are individually matched to 75db from the MLP with a spl meter.

Rhed not sure if you answered my question above about the Antimode and its ability to independently time align, but in addition to the boundary issue you should also check time alignment of the subs with the mains. I had almost the same dip and it was completely corrected with time alignment. Hope you find the answer.
post #4585 of 4725
I thought I'd ask this in this thread, but will start my own if that's recommended.

What kind of comparison do you guys think about dual Cap1000's (with supplied JTR amp) vs dual FTW-21's both in sealed 6cf cabs, with an XLS1500 on each?

Room is over 6,000cf, that has an opening 14' X 9' on one side to the rest of the house (1800sqft) basically.
post #4586 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by fish323 View Post

I thought I'd ask this in this thread, but will start my own if that's recommended.

What kind of comparison do you guys think about dual Cap1000's (with supplied JTR amp) vs dual FTW-21's both in sealed 6cf cabs, with an XLS1500 on each?

Room is over 6,000cf, that has an opening 14' X 9' on one side to the rest of the house (1800sqft) basically.

I'd also be interested in knowing how the Caps compare with FTW21s and other DIY subs!
post #4587 of 4725
What does the program select button on the back of the cap amp do?
post #4588 of 4725
It's my understanding it does nothing. But I don't mess with it, just in case. smile.gif
post #4589 of 4725
I've got an opportunity to buy a Crown XLS 5000 used for $500. I currently run two EP4000 amplifiers using one amp to drive each 2400 Cap into 8ohm (I have dual Caps). I know the crown amp will be a better fit for dual Caps than the BehringerEP4000's but just have a couple of questions. I rarely drive the Caps to levels at which the Behringer amps start clipping due to neighbours proximity. Occassionally I will do a demo for someone which may be around the 120dB mark but this is rare. Will I gain any benefit at lower listening levels with the Crown amp compared to the Behringer? I'm also reluctant to rewire the Caps to 2Ohm could I still run Dual Caps at 8Ohm using just the Crown amp?
post #4590 of 4725
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ72 View Post

I've got an opportunity to buy a Crown XLS 5000 used for $500. I currently run two EP4000 amplifiers using one amp to drive each 2400 Cap into 8ohm (I have dual Caps). I know the crown amp will be a better fit for dual Caps than the BehringerEP4000's but just have a couple of questions. I rarely drive the Caps to levels at which the Behringer amps start clipping due to neighbours proximity. Occassionally I will do a demo for someone which may be around the 120dB mark but this is rare. Will I gain any benefit at lower listening levels with the Crown amp compared to the Behringer? I'm also reluctant to rewire the Caps to 2Ohm could I still run Dual Caps at 8Ohm using just the Crown amp?

I know what I'd do... =)
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