Danley DTS-10 "Super Spud" DIY kit - Page 10

SH-mini or SH-50

Hehe, Im looking forward to the comparison of the DTS-10 vs all those popular subs bantered around on the subwoofer forum.

There will be HUGE fireworks, disbelief, name calling.....the usual back and forth

I know the size isnt for everyone though....that will be the single biggest draw back but at 16" deep, there are many options that people won't think of.

I do hope they build a kit that will have the opening on the side so some of us can use its at a stage or platform.

The tapped horn does not need the regular horns large mouth.

Read about it here

http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/pdf/danley_tapped.pdf

That should clear up some questions.

Electrical impedance and acoustical impedance are very different animals and not really related.

The impedance of the DTS10 "all over the map" is not that different than any other loudspeaker.

Yes the peaks and dips are in different places (and with different quantities), but look at the MEASURED impedance of any normal loudspeaker and you will see the same "type" of thing.

Impedance is a very complicated number-NOT just a single number that is put on a spec sheet and FAR from being a constant.

That is why Danley provides measured data-not just single numbers.

Any complex question can be easily answered with a simple easy to understand WRONG answer.

Hello Tom,

There is something I don't understand here. Do recordings really have short peaks 30 dB (or whatever number) above the average? If the speakers can take the amplifier's maximum output, and the source has its peaks below clipping (e.g. 1 Volt on analog), then surely a much larger amplifier won't make a difference. It seems to me that such a dynamic recording with very loud peaks would play very softly overall to leave room on the medium for those peaks without clipping. If I need to crank the volume to 0 dB to hear 80 dB music, I know I should sit tight because a 120 dB peak could occur at any time. I couldn't have higher peaks that that because the source input would have clipped by then.

However, if the sources were momentarily clipped, and amps sounded different when playing back those short clipped parts, then that is very interesting. This should be investigated further (in spite of being OT for this thread). It could be an explanation of why some people hear differences in amps and others don't.

Well recorded-uncompressed recordings do have a MUCH higher dynamic range than a compressed MP3. That is why they sound so different.

Percussive sounds (piano-drums-plucked instruments etc) have the highest dynamic range. Short duration and very high peaks.

Having equipment (loudspeakers and amps) that can accurately reproduce those makes for a very different listening experience.

That is one reason live music sounds so much more dynamic (interesting) than recorded music that is played back through equipment that cannot reproduce that dynamic range.

A clipped waveform is DC for the length of the clip, whether it is clipped by the amp or was present in the source. And DC can cause damage to voice coils.

I'm already ready for it. I won't mention any fanboy brands(coughs coughv coughs), but it will be fun

I also was wondering about the side exit. That's where I intitially thought the exit mouth was going to be, but I was wrong. The side exit may be better for those who want to place it against a side wall and have the mouth facing the seating area. I can't wait for these to be finalized and the testing and comparisons can begin

And clipped waveforms have lots of harmonics at higher frequencies which put your mid/high drivers at risk.

If the exist is customizeable then more people could fit it. Heck a person could place it behind their wall unit.

Please allow for flexibility

I have 4 TC-2000 drivers, I have 1 AV15X driver, I have 4 Fi Q18s drivers, I have 4 cheap 12" woofers.

Whats another sub box

Seriously, if I can not buy a "stage" type kit then I can not put it in my HT room. I do not have a false wall currently, I would have to rebuild my HT room....Im not 100% against that

Ha haa! Go Penn! Could you, have enough drivers?

Isn't the idea (if you use it as a riser) that you would use two of them? That would make it 10' wide.

I do second the desire for different opening options. I'm anxiously waiting the final kit price, and hoping that it comes in somewhat south of $1K.

JP

Ivan,

"the measured impedance of the danley sub is all over the map across the bass. how does that provide a "match"? "

"Electrical impedance and acoustical impedance are very different animals and not really related."

I quoted that from someone else but somehow my response is MIA.

I agree w/your response, and would add that impedance matching is not even the goal w/speakers and amps (at least solid state).

It gives maximum power transfer, but also results in equal power dissipated in both source and load.

Thanks for the link, I'll check it out.

Yes too many, I have another 30 drivers in my garage for different main speakers

Ya, but it would be fun trying!

We may just need three or four to fit under that damn sectional we have honey. Ohhh man! Now the foot rests are too low, there a need for another one.

Why would you have to have two to make a riser? Just make two small matching risers to place on each side of the DTS-10.

Because 2 is always better than 1

I agree, but even one sounds "insane" for most HT's. Like most things, cost will be the determining factor for most people. If you guys price the kit aggressively, or allow for different driver choices, I have no doubt you will sell them in bunches.

Ivan,

will there be any issues putting screws through the cabinetry to secure the HT seats?

Noah,
Would you mind explaining the problems with the Ultimate AV's ultimate gear article on Transducers and how the inertia affects a speaker? I'm doing my best to get the correct knowledge, sometimes it can be challenging.

A clipped waveform technically isn't "DC for the length of the clip" because the DC doesn't last forever. In other words, the frequency content of a clipped signal does not contain anything at 0Hz. The lowest frequency present will have the same period as the clip time. It's the same reason that a square wave doesn't have any DC...

What a clipped signal does contain, however, is extra HF energy. The damage that ensues on the tweeter is usually going to be a burnt out coil instead of excursion damage.

hi ivan,

i was the one who made the comment about "impedance all over the map", not noah. i also said that i am new to this impedance matching idea. no ill will intended. i'm familiar with acoustic impedance matching in the way a trumpet works, but i don't know if the principal is the same for mr. d.'s latest creation.

has danley sound labs received a patent on the tapped horn design, is it still pending, or was it rejected? just curious. the patent office is so frustrating to deal with. for those who don't know, they have about a 2 year delay in granting patents. that's really poor customer service, especially for industries where 2 years is an eternity.

i'm still curious how the ground plane measurements translate to in-room measurements for this type of tapped horn design. it would seem that a 'regular' ported sub would benefit more from ground plane to corner placement than a tapped horn because of the directivity of the horn sub.

my last question is about placement. the idea of behind screen and used as a riser are being discussed. is one better than another? traditional subs benefit from corner placement with higher spl, but possibly more peaky modes, is the same true with this tapped horn design.

my apologies for all the questions, but since the tapped horn is so different, i have to at least question all the old assumptions and heuristics that we have come to rely on with respect to design/placement, etc.

thanks in advance for answering any of my questions.

I'm not too sure I agree with that...it's pretty easy to tell from just the impedance response what the speaker topology is, or what kind of unwanted leaks/resonances are present.

I've been mulling on this all afternoon, and I'm thinking that the tapped horn electrical impedance can be explained by the fact that the acoustical matching matters most at the mouth of the horn. And really, in order for the tap to happen, the driver needs to be "unloaded" at those frequencies.

I bring it up because I don't believe it is possible to increase the acoustic loading on the driver without it showing up in its electrical impedance response.

as for the side discussion on clipping, here is a controversial statement from qsc rmx 2450 user's manual (see last paragraph). if this were behringer, i would ignore it, but this is from qsc.