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Official OPPO BDP-83SE Analog Audio Discussion Only Thread - Page 193

post #5761 of 5806
yes, if I disconnect HDMI or turn off HDMI in Rotel setup menu then OK but I need HDMI video+7.1 analog, HDMI video+2.0 analog and HDMI Video+HDMI audio on different inputs. External HDMI switcher can help me too
post #5762 of 5806
I'm really f**king wondered with it(((
Oppodigital recommends use bdp-83 with analogue audio connection and bdp-80 for digital connection. so why bdp-83 check hdmi inputs for dsd compatibility when I turn off hdmi audio in oppo setup menu? It must be switchable (on/off).

This is really not necessary because if somebody want to convert dsd to pcm then you can turn it in setup menu and be happy! Now in setup menu I choose DSD but hearing PCM - it is not right!!((( If I strongly need this stupid conversion then I can turn it by my hand in setup menu! Why it turns on automatically without any ways to turn off?

If I have AV-processor/receiver with hdmi 1.3-1.4 and want to use dsd via hdmi then why I payd for 83SE(!!!!) - I can buy bdp-80 only for HDMI only connection!
post #5763 of 5806
What you want to do works in the 93 and 95: Set HDMI Audio OFF, and SACD Output DSD works on the Analog outputs regardless of your HDMI devices.

I don't know if the hardware in the 83SE would let them implement the same thing there. You could send them an email to ask.
--Bob
post #5764 of 5806
http://www.oppodigital.com/blu-ray-b...3-Support.aspx

************************************************************ ****

Help & Support
Firmware Release:

Latest Public Beta Test Release

Release date: November 8, 2011.

Category: Public Beta Test Version

Main Version: BDP83-57-1026B
Loader Version: BE2800 or BT0500
Sub Version: MCU83-27-0326
Installation Instructions and Download Link: Click Here



Latest Official Release Version

Release date: March 17, 2011.
Category: Latest Official Release

Main Version: BDP83-55-0226
Loader Version: BE2800 or BT0500
Sub Version: MCU83-27-0326
Installation Instructions and Download Link: Click Here


To check the firmware version installed on your player, please go to the Setup Menu and select "Device Setup - Firmware Information".
post #5765 of 5806
Hey, just an analogue output question, I just tried hooking my SE up to my Onkyo 885P pre/pro a little differently ( at least for me) I had been using the 7.1 channel output with great results, but last night I tried using the 2 channel output ( which supposedly has better DAC's) for the fronts and the regular multi channel outputs for the centre, surrounds and sub. I thought it sounded great for the 1 movie I watched, but without going back and forth hard to tell if it's an improvement.
Is there any drawback to connecting this way?
cheers,
post #5766 of 5806
Never mind I found it, the 2 channel is a downmix of the multi channel so it would introduce sounds meant for the rear channels.
post #5767 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Htdude14 View Post

Never mind I found it, the 2 channel is a downmix of the multi channel so it would introduce sounds meant for the rear channels.

Correct. Also it will be out of balance with the other multi-channel outs since the down-mix has to lower the volume over all to allow headroom for the channels coming in as part of that down mix.

The 95 introduces a new feature that lets you reassign the dedicated L/R stereo analog outs to be used as if they were the LF/RF analog outs from the multi-channel set -- i.e., what you were trying to do. When you do that, the L/R pair respond to all the settings/processing that would normally affect LF/RF. For example, crossover processing to steer bass to the multi-channel sub output from them.
--Bob
post #5768 of 5806
The reassignment of the multi channel fronts to the dedicated stereo outs was the main reason I upgraded from the 83 se
post #5769 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Correct. Also it will be out of balance with the other multi-channel outs since the down-mix has to lower the volume over all to allow headroom for the channels coming in as part of that down mix.

The 95 introduces a new feature that lets you reassign the dedicated L/R stereo analog outs to be used as if they were the LF/RF analog outs from the multi-channel set -- i.e., what you were trying to do. When you do that, the L/R pair respond to all the settings/processing that would normally affect LF/RF. For example, crossover processing to steer bass to the multi-channel sub output from them.
--Bob

That is a cool feature, thanks for the info!
post #5770 of 5806
Bob:

I still can't wrap my head around why this even matters? I have a Denon 3805 that allows me to manually adjust the Ext In subwoofer level to +5db, +10db, and +15db. With my Oppo 83SE's SW trim at 0, I calibrated my dual SVS subs with the Denon Ext. In SW level at +10db. I've not encountered any issues with LFE clipping, etc. So, last night, I bumped the Denon Ext. In SW level to +15db per your suggestion below that +15db is the choice to use with the Oppos. and recalibrated my subs. The only thing that's changed is I've had to turn the 'gain' control on my SVS subs down from about 1/3 to 1/4now. So basically, I've increased the sub level in the Denon AVR while taking a bit of stress off the amplifiers in my two subs. Is that the reason it's suggested to have the Ext. In SW level at +15 in your AVR with the Oppo's? To take stress off the sub(s) amps? Does it really matter if I have the Ext. In SW level in my AVR set at +10db or +15 db? Thanks Bob...

George


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

A correction here. The LFE/Subwoofer multi-channel analog output of the Oppo Blu-ray players is -15dB down compared to the other channels, not -10dB.

Of that -15dB, -10dB comes from the way LFE is recorded -- allowing headroom for *LOUD* bass. The other -5dB is applied by the player to allow headroom for bass steered in from other speaker channels.

In the Oppo implementation, the -15dB holds true WHETHER OR NOT you have bass steering happening on the multi-channel analog outputs. I.e., whether or not all speakers are set to Large or some of them are set to Small.

Most AVRs will automatically apply +10dB boost on their multi-channel analog LFE/Sub input. That leaves +5dB to go. Some AVRs allow you to adjust the boost with typical choices being 0dB, +5dB, +10dB, and +15dB. +10dB would be the default for such AVRs and, +15dB is the choice to use with the Oppos.

If you can't get the correct boost in the AVR, and if the AVR is of the common type that applies volume trims only to digital audio (and NOT to the multi-channel analog audio), then a practical approach for dealing with this is to set the Sub output trim in the Oppo to 0dB, and then adjust the volume knob on the subwoofer itself using an audio calibration disc like the AIX Audio Calibration Blu-ray. That would mean you would be RAISING the volume on the sub by +5dB or +15dB depending on wether your AVR provided the standard +10dB boost on that path.

That's fine for analog but screws up the sub for your digital audio sources, so now you use the volume trim in the AVR to REDUCE the sub output from your digital audio sources to compensate for the raising of the volume knob on the sub. And that leaves everything properly balanced.

-----------------------------------------------

You don't want to raise the sub volume trim in the Oppo because that undoes the headroom that's been designed in. I.e., loud LFE passages mixed with loud steered bass contributions from the other speaker channels may cause the input to clip in your AVR (or sub if directly connected to the sub).

However if you are NOT doing bass steering in the Oppo -- that is if you have ALL speakers in the Oppo set to Large -- then the extra -5dB attenuation applied by the player is not needed. In which case you can safely use a +5dB subwoofer volume trim in the Oppo to undo that. And that, combined with the standard +10dB boost typically applied by AVRs, will get you where you need to be.

All of the above applies ONLY to the multi-channel analog outputs of the Oppo. This stuff is handled automatically for digital audio.
--Bob
post #5771 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5150zx View Post

Bob:

I still can't wrap my head around why this even matters? I have a Denon 3805 that allows me to manually adjust the Ext In subwoofer level to +5db, +10db, and +15db. With my Oppo 83SE's SW trim at 0, I calibrated my dual SVS subs with the Denon Ext. In SW level at +10db. I've not encountered any issues with LFE clipping, etc. So, last night, I bumped the Denon Ext. In SW level to +15db per your suggestion below that +15db is the choice to use with the Oppos. and recalibrated my subs. The only thing that's changed is I've had to turn the 'gain' control on my SVS subs down from about 1/3 to 1/4now. So basically, I've increased the sub level in the Denon AVR while taking a bit of stress off the amplifiers in my two subs. Is that the reason it's suggested to have the Ext. In SW level at +15 in your AVR with the Oppo's? To take stress off the sub(s) amps? Does it really matter if I have the Ext. In SW level in my AVR set at +10db or +15 db? Thanks Bob...

George

You need a +15dB boost, and that should be provided external to the player (i.e., don't raise the output volume trim for sub in the player).

Whether it is provided entirely by the AVR, entirely by the subwoofer, or through a combination of the two of them is mostly a matter of convenience.

If your AVR offers the the +15dB boost, letting it do the job my make it easier for you to set a single volume level on the sub itself that works for both your Oppo multi-channel analog and for any digital audio sources you have.

There's nothing wrong with taking some load off the sub's built-in amp, but it's probably not that big a deal.

I think if your AVR offers the +15dB boost, and that causes no problems with your other sources, then you might as well use it. But beware that some AVRs screw up and apply that same boost to their digital sources, which is incorrect for them. So check the volume calibration for each source to be sure.
--Bob
post #5772 of 5806
^^

The SW boost on the Denon 3805 only applies to the multichannel analog inputs. I use the 3805 external inputs myself with a Panasonic player and the SW boost makes it possible to calibrate for both analog and digital.

George - most players send the the SW channel 10dB low (which is how LFE is recorded) and drop it another 5dB when bass management is engaged. It is my understanding that Oppo always sends it 15dB low regardless of bass management.
post #5773 of 5806
Thank you to Bob and BIslander, as I said, I set my Denon to +15db two nights ago and I will leave it as such. I've recalibrated and all is well...Thanks for this information I didn't know about regarding the Oppo's and the +15db...
post #5774 of 5806
^ Enjoy!
--Bob
post #5775 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

A correction here. The LFE/Subwoofer multi-channel analog output of the Oppo Blu-ray players is -15dB down compared to the other channels, not -10dB.

Of that -15dB, -10dB comes from the way LFE is recorded -- allowing headroom for *LOUD* bass. The other -5dB is applied by the player to allow headroom for bass steered in from other speaker channels.

In the Oppo implementation, the -15dB holds true WHETHER OR NOT you have bass steering happening on the multi-channel analog outputs. I.e., whether or not all speakers are set to Large or some of them are set to Small.

Most AVRs will automatically apply +10dB boost on their multi-channel analog LFE/Sub input. That leaves +5dB to go. Some AVRs allow you to adjust the boost with typical choices being 0dB, +5dB, +10dB, and +15dB. +10dB would be the default for such AVRs and, +15dB is the choice to use with the Oppos.

If you can't get the correct boost in the AVR, and if the AVR is of the common type that applies volume trims only to digital audio (and NOT to the multi-channel analog audio), then a practical approach for dealing with this is to set the Sub output trim in the Oppo to 0dB, and then adjust the volume knob on the subwoofer itself using an audio calibration disc like the AIX Audio Calibration Blu-ray. That would mean you would be RAISING the volume on the sub by +5dB or +15dB depending on wether your AVR provided the standard +10dB boost on that path.

That's fine for analog but screws up the sub for your digital audio sources, so now you use the volume trim in the AVR to REDUCE the sub output from your digital audio sources to compensate for the raising of the volume knob on the sub. And that leaves everything properly balanced.

-----------------------------------------------

You don't want to raise the sub volume trim in the Oppo because that undoes the headroom that's been designed in. I.e., loud LFE passages mixed with loud steered bass contributions from the other speaker channels may cause the input to clip in your AVR (or sub if directly connected to the sub).

However if you are NOT doing bass steering in the Oppo -- that is if you have ALL speakers in the Oppo set to Large -- then the extra -5dB attenuation applied by the player is not needed. In which case you can safely use a +5dB subwoofer volume trim in the Oppo to undo that. And that, combined with the standard +10dB boost typically applied by AVRs, will get you where you need to be.

All of the above applies ONLY to the multi-channel analog outputs of the Oppo. This stuff is handled automatically for digital audio.
--Bob

Many thanks for this explanation; I purchased the BDP-83SE just before it was replaced by the 9 series (I have a separate 3D player anyway) and ran into this issue when I started to use analog outputs.
post #5776 of 5806
I have a BD-83 SE Player that had some abuse by a family member and the small pulley to gear drive wheel for the tray got a couple teeth broken. I got it working but the tray makes a clicking sound as the missing tooth skips in it's rotation. I will probably need a complete new drive unit as finding that internal pulley/gear wheel except for a unit scrapped for parts will be difficult.

Has anyone here have any experience with Oppo in buying parts for their high end players like special edition?
post #5777 of 5806
Why not ask them? they do have loaders and parts available. Given the tendency for that loader to wear out, replacement is the best solution. Out of warranty repair is something like $60.
post #5778 of 5806
Hi all,
Today I added some flac files to my NAS and accessed them on the Oppo to find that the tracks are out of order!

FYI, I edit the ID tags for each flac file and set the track number to be correct (ie. 1/10) and even add a number in front of the track name in the folder.

It has worked in the past, and I have done one style of tag or the other and both have worked. Should I be using one style of tag or the other but not both? I am lost on this one...

I downloaded an HDTracks album a couple of days ago and it shows those tracks out of order, as well...

Any thoughts, no matter how obtuse!

Thanks,
Phil
post #5779 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil_in_CA View Post

Hi all,
Today I added some flac files to my NAS and accessed them on the Oppo to find that the tracks are out of order!

FYI, I edit the ID tags for each flac file and set the track number to be correct (ie. 1/10) and even add a number in front of the track name in the folder.

It has worked in the past, and I have done one style of tag or the other and both have worked. Should I be using one style of tag or the other but not both? I am lost on this one...

I downloaded an HDTracks album a couple of days ago and it shows those tracks out of order, as well...

Any thoughts, no matter how obtuse!

Thanks,
Phil

When coming from an NAS, the DLNA server is going to determine the sort order. Do you know what software is being used, and does it have a user interface where you can set options like that?

-Bill
post #5780 of 5806
Thanks for your reply, Bill. My NAS is a Netgear ReadyNASDuo, and AFAIK, there is no way to set any option for file handling...

Thanks for letting me know where the problem lies. I will investigate from the Netgear end now.

FYI, the 93 is the best disk player I have ever owned. It is a game changer!

Phil
post #5781 of 5806
is it possible to play dsd on a usb thumb drive?
post #5782 of 5806
Hello, I have a probably stupid question........ I have owned a BDP-83SE since 2010, I love it. I have never done a firmware update eek.gif
I guess you go to the website for these? At this point and time is it possible to do all the updates? Am I to far behind? would you recommend doing them?

Also, was considering the new BDP-105, do you think I will hear a big difference in sound quality over 2 channel and SACD< DVD Audio? I know it has many more bells and whistles but just considering the DAC's, do you think it would sound better?

Thanks ahead of time for any help!
post #5783 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by alabamawoody View Post

Hello, I have a probably stupid question........ I have owned a BDP-83SE since 2010, I love it. I have never done a firmware update eek.gif
I guess you go to the website for these? At this point and time is it possible to do all the updates? Am I to far behind? would you recommend doing them?

Also, was considering the new BDP-105, do you think I will hear a big difference in sound quality over 2 channel and SACD< DVD Audio? I know it has many more bells and whistles but just considering the DAC's, do you think it would sound better?

Thanks ahead of time for any help!

From one point of view it's good to keep updated, but on the other hand if everything is working for you, it's not urgent. If you report a problem then updating is the first thing we recommend.

You only need to do the most recent update.

Try the BDP-105 thread for thoughts on the differences.

-Bill
post #5784 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by alabamawoody View Post

Hello, I have a probably stupid question........ I have owned a BDP-83SE since 2010, I love it. I have never done a firmware update eek.gif
I guess you go to the website for these? At this point and time is it possible to do all the updates? Am I to far behind? would you recommend doing them?
Also, was considering the new BDP-105, do you think I will hear a big difference in sound quality over 2 channel and SACD< DVD Audio? I know it has many more bells and whistles but just considering the DAC's, do you think it would sound better?
Thanks ahead of time for any help!

http://www.oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-83/bdp-83-firmware-59-0117.aspx
post #5785 of 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

From one point of view it's good to keep updated, but on the other hand if everything is working for you, it's not urgent. If you report a problem then updating is the first thing we recommend.
You only need to do the most recent update.
Try the BDP-105 thread for thoughts on the differences.
-Bill

I've had no problems, it's done everything I've asked it to do. I am going to update it though. Hope it doesn't "mess" anything up!

I've been asking around on the BDP-105 thread. Love this place.
post #5786 of 5806

THank you!
post #5787 of 5806
I just picked up a used SE. I was using a BDP-80 via HDMI to an Onkyo 886 preamp. I have Mirage OM speakers, 7.1, and Emotiva XPA amps. It sounds excellent and I am overall very happy with it. The entire setup has worked flawlessly since the day I installed it. Since I was only using HDMI from the BDP-80, source direct, and both the 886 and my projector have good scaling chips the 80 fit the bill. Well things have changed slightly.

My wife was lucky enough to finally find a job about six months ago, after being out of work for almost 2 years. It is great that she found a job but that means no more late night rocking out sessions for me. That lead me to picking up a decent headphone setup, AKG-701s and Little Dot amp. They work well together. I thought about getting a Woo audio amp but they seem to match up better with higher impedance cans so I ended up with the Little Dot. Overall I am extremely happy with the headphone setup but something became obvious rather quickly. The analog outs of the 80 are far from excellent. They sound decent but I could tell I was missing a lot. I still have a HD-DVD XA2 in my rack. I mainly use it for the HD DVDs that haven't been released on BD yet. One of which is the Eagles live concert. It is an excellent sounding and looking disc. Anyway, the sound quality of that disc via the analog outs of the HD-XA2 sounds incredible! That led me to trying out a few DVDs, that I know have decent 2 channel PCM tracks, in both the 80 and the XA2 and comparing them. It was absolutely no contest. The XA2 is far superior. I had read the XA2 did have excellent analog outs and I completely agree. Once I heard how big the difference was I started looking for a used SE or 95. I found a reasonable deal on a SE so that is what I ended up with.

All of that brings me to my questions. I would like to be able to run the SE, XA2, and the cable box through the 886 so I can use it's zone 2 output to handle the switching and volume control. I had been running directly from the 80 to the amp. I just left the amp volume at 80% and used the 80's volume control to control the volume. The headphone amp is 18 feet away and having to get up to adjust the volume constantly is extremely annoying.

How much of a deduction in overall sound quality will I be losing by running through the 886 versus directly to the headphone amp? Also, I had heard that using the volume control of the 80/83SE can also degrade the sound quality. Is that true?

I will probably have to test this out myself but I wanted some opinions.
post #5788 of 5806
I came across something very strange tonight. I hooked up the stereo outs of the 83se directly to my headphone amp. I then tried to play the Dire Straits SACD in stereo mode. I got nothing over the headphones using the stereo layer. I switched to the 5.1 layer and I had sound but it sounded thin and just horrible. I then went into the player settings and changed the output from DSD to PCM. Now I had great sound in both stereo and 5.1 layer.

I am extremely confused. I thought the 83/83se could output dsd over both analog and digital. I know the 80 was limited to just dsd digital and pcm analog but the 83 is not.

What am I missing???
post #5789 of 5806
The problem I am having gets even stranger!!! I connected my headphone amp to the left and right channel of the multichannel analog outputs. I went into setup and set the downmix to stereo, set left and right speakers to large, and turned off the sub. So essentialyl the left and right channels should be outputting the same signal as the dedicated stereo outputs. I am aware the multichannel analog outputs and the stereo outputs use different dacs. Which is why I wanted to try this to see where the problem may lie.

So using the left/right outputs of the multichannel outputs I only get sound oout of the right channel when outputting dsd. This is the same whether I select the stereo layer or the multichannel layer. If I switch to PCM I get the proper sound again!

I believe it is safe to say there is a problem with the analog audio board. I talked to Oppo for a few minutes and they have never heard of such a strange issue but they agree it has to be a bad analog audio board.
Lucky me! I have contacted the seller I bought it from on Ebay but I haven't heard back from him yet. Hopefully he will cover shipping it to Oppo and the $79.00 repair.
post #5790 of 5806
I took the cover off, removed the analog board, reinstalled it and made sure all the connections were good. Hooked it back up and now DSD over analog, both the stereo and multi channel layer, are working properly!?!? Everything appeared to be fine before I removed the board but I guess something must have been off a smidge. Now I need to find some time to give the SE some serious listening to!
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