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ADA Mach 4......WOW!!!! - Page 11

post #301 of 2083
Quote:


Is there any chance we might see a version with digital outputs? This is becoming more and more common these days. I spoke to Adam-Audio earlier this year and they've begun to release digital input modules for their speakers.

Isn't the problem that to maintain full digital resolution the digital outputs must be HDCP encrypted? Meridian gets around this with MHR encryption. I don't know how Tact and Theta do it. What type of digital input do the Adam Audio speakers have?
post #302 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joelc View Post

As far as the above commentary goes is it in respect of an 861V6 versus i) an 861V4 or ii) an ADA Cinema Rhapsody MACH IV B.

I found it to be true for both (with the 621). But with the v6 much more so.
Let's say we put the Mach IV as a reference and add detail/accuracy/soundstage on a scale from 0 to 10, while 0 is the same as the Mach IV.

I'd say:
v4: +1 detail, +1 accuracy, +3 soundstage
v6: +10 detail, +10 accuracy, +4 soundstage

v4 and v6 are really totally different beasts. I personally could not imagine to go back to a v4 now. Even if it may sound like I'm bashing the Mach IV, I'm really not. It's an excellent processor, in my opinion it's much, much better than any Classé, Krell, Lexicon, Halcro, Primare and a bunch of others. Anyone shopping for a new unit and not considering it is making a big mistake in my opinion.

What I'm saying is based on audio quality only, not on ease of setup, software or features. For some there might be deal killers where the Mach IV has the better features and the clear choice to go for it (like 8-channel PCM vs. 6-channel only on a 861v4).

I think you will be very happy with your choice, it's truly an excellent processor. And as you have pointed out several times, it might be a whole different game in two years. You could throw out the Mach IV in two years, buy the best available then and still save money compared to other processors today.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GGA View Post

Isn't the problem that to maintain full digital resolution the digital outputs must be HDCP encrypted? Meridian gets around this with MHR encryption. I don't know how Tact and Theta do it. What type of digital input do the Adam Audio speakers have?

From what I've been told, AES/EBU up to 192kHz and 24 bit. Don't know about encryption. I have not played around with these. When I spoke to them earlier this year they told me that it would become an option on most professional monitors and the bigger home-series speakers (Gamma, Beta, Alpha). I'm not sure what the current status is, but back then their biggest dealer offered me to get whatever Adam speaker with digital inputs I'd like (if available) and put it side by side for me with any Meridian speaker I'd like to compare it to. I didn't have the time to take him up on his offer yet, but I hope to and fly in a day or two once I have a little more time at hand.
post #303 of 2083
Quote:


Don't know about encryption. I have not played around with these. When I spoke to them earlier this year they told me that it would become an option on most professional monitors and the bigger home-series speakers (Gamma, Beta, Alpha). I'm not sure what the current status is, but back then their biggest dealer offered me to get whatever Adam speaker with digital inputs I'd like (if available) and put it side by side for me with any Meridian speaker I'd like to compare it to.

The problem is that full resolution audio (24/48, 24/96, etc) from a BD sent over HDMI must be encrypted if you want to maintain full resolution, normally by HDCP. If you want to send unencrypted audio from one component to another HDMI demands that it must be down rezzed to 48/16.

Meridian uses their own MHR encryption which allows them to send full resolution audio to their digital speakers. It will be interesting to hear how Adams Audio handles this situation with their digital input speakers. It might be the best they can receive is 48/16. In the consumer world the only processors I know that have HDMI in and digital out are Meridian, Tact, and Theta.

I am surprised this encryption hasn't caused more complaints from the pro world where digital speakers are more common.
post #304 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephan View Post

You could throw out the Mach IV in two years, buy the best available then and still save money compared to other processors today.

That is an excellent point. The Meridian (inclusive of the 621, which I'd view as essential) is not far short of $30K. One would certainly expect an elevated level of perfomance.

Interesting point you make about the ADA versus other offerings. I've spent quite a bit of time with the Classe and liked it quite a lot - sounds like you were much more impressed with the Mach IV.

Glad to hear it as I like the folks at ADA very much.
post #305 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by ca1ore View Post

That is an excellent point. The Meridian (inclusive of the 621, which I'd view as essential) is not far short of $30K. One would certainly expect an elevated level of perfomance.

This was one the factors / points -- as note din my earlier posting -- that made me "leave the Meridian fold" in favour of other less costly but still very competent options...

Also, as a user of non-Meridian speakers, I have cocnerns as to how long Meridian will support non-Meridian speakers as they seem solely focused on digital everything (i.e. they no longer make amplifiers, they no longer make non-DSP speakers, etc.)...



Quote:
Originally Posted by ca1ore View Post

Interesting point you make about the ADA versus other offerings. I've spent quite a bit of time with the Classe and liked it quite a lot - sounds like you were much more impressed with the Mach IV.

Glad to hear it as I like the folks at ADA very much.

I am very interested to hear how the ADA sounds once fully configured and rest assured I will share my experience...now, back to work so I can pay for the toys...
post #306 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephan View Post

A Mach IV with digital outputs combined with a Adam S6X or even S7A would sure be a killer combination for a HT.

I have been waiting for a high-end manufacturer to do that for some time now, and other that Tact Audio their has been no other option. The ADA unit has so much that I like, but I'm still waiting for the right unit with digital outputs.
post #307 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by GGA View Post

In the consumer world the only processors I know that have HDMI in and digital out are Meridian, Tact, and Theta.

Hate to correct you being a Theta luver, but:

(1) The Theta CB3 HDMI 1.4 upgrade isn't available yet and still being worked on. Hopefully it will come to fruition for us Theta owners.

(2) There has been NOTHING OTHER THAN CONJECTURE about the Theta Generation VIII V2 DAC being revised for HDMI AND having a new encryption to satisfy HDMI.
post #308 of 2083
I am standing corrected.
post #309 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by GGA View Post

I am standing corrected.

You can get out of the corner now!@@@
post #310 of 2083
Interesting info. Meridian thumbing their nose at their customer base saying "our display is good enough" when customers are asking for an upgrade and, quite frankly deserve one considering the price; coupled with their distancing themselves from their customers tactics easily equals shooting off their own foot, in the long term.

I don't care if their unit blows popcorn and sounds like angels; if they regard their customers so narrowly and treat them this way they can keep their products. YMMV.
post #311 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by GGA View Post

I am surprised this encryption hasn't caused more complaints from the pro world where digital speakers are more common.

Probably not an issue there since the digital audio is not passing thru HDMI in a production environment.
post #312 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crunchyriff View Post

I don't care if their unit blows popcorn and sounds like angels; if they regard their customers so narrowly and treat them this way they can keep their products. YMMV.

As noted before and elsewhere that was certainly my view...

And now back to our regularly scheduled programming and more information about the ADA Cinema Rhapsody MACH IV B...
post #313 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

Is this the customer with the Halcro?

If so then I hope you can compare the 2, that would help out a lot.

I have the Halcro SSP and amps, if someone cares to send me the ADA unit I'd be happy to compare the 2 and report

Still no response to my earlier question, will ADA be supporting 3rd party control systems like the Philips Pronto Pro? If they could write a slick XCF module like what Kaleidescape did then that would be a big plus for me buying one.
post #314 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joelc View Post

As noted before and elsewhere that was certainly my view...

And now back to our regularly scheduled programming and more information about the ADA Cinema Rhapsody MACH IV B...

that's exactly why I'm following this thread. I can't wait to hear a few full user reviews.
post #315 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

The beginnings of audio tracks are cut off whilst the decoder detects the bitstream type. The reviewer was quite vexed. I was too, with the SSP, but beta 2.03 finally showed they could fix it, with no ill effects.

I was a bit 'vexed' at the time yes but knowing there is a fix that apparently works (I take it you have tried it?) cooled my blood somewhat

I hope to get my Suite 7.1 HD updated shortly to find out for myself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonhawk View Post

Can this unit be controlled with an IR remote such as Harmony?

Yes, there is a profile for the ADA Suite 7.1 in the Harmony database although it is restricted to the day to day functions rather than the full functionality available.

I also wanted to add that as Neil mentioned there is a way to use 2-Way RS232 control without the additional ADA RS232 hardware but it is unsupported and you use it at your own risk.

I currently use a Nevo Q50 via this method and it works very well. If anyone planning to use a Nevo needs the commands I am happy to share my profile which should make a good starting point and will save a bit of time adding the Hex codes.

I initially got round the Issue of no OSD for volume etc. by making a few hard buttons setting the volume to -20dB, -10dB, 0dB etc., which works well until you get the 2-way setup.

Adam
post #316 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crunchyriff View Post

Interesting info. Meridian thumbing their nose at their customer base saying "our display is good enough" when customers are asking for an upgrade and, quite frankly deserve one considering the price; coupled with their distancing themselves from their customers tactics easily equals shooting off their own foot, in the long term.

I don't care if their unit blows popcorn and sounds like angels; if they regard their customers so narrowly and treat them this way they can keep their products. YMMV.

I've had my issues with Meridian over the years, and your opinion is your own, however, consider the following .....

Prior to the invetment by Muse, Meridan were on a slippery slide to oblivion - clearly changes in the business model were needed. Given limited resources (and compared to many other hiend companies they have done wonders with what they have), they 'chose' to prioritize some things over others. If that drives some customers away, so be it; but for me, 'sounding like angels' trumps ALL thsoe other things.

Now, back to out regularly scheduled programming .....
post #317 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelEyes View Post

I was a bit 'vexed' at the time yes but knowing there is a fix that apparently works (I take it you have tried it?) cooled my blood somewhat

If we're both talking about the SSP-800, yes, the latest code (2.0.4) fixes the CD playback issue.
post #318 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by ca1ore View Post

I've had my issues with Meridian over the years, and your opinion is your own, however, consider the following .....

Prior to the invetment by Muse, Meridan were on a slippery slide to oblivion - clearly changes in the business model were needed. Given limited resources (and compared to many other hiend companies they have done wonders with what they have), they 'chose' to prioritize some things over others. If that drives some customers away, so be it; but for me, 'sounding like angels' trumps ALL thsoe other things.

Now, back to out regularly scheduled programming .....

Yes we all have our own opinions. But when what "sounds like angels" suddenly sounds like crap, or makes no sounds at all, or a firmware issue needs to be addressed, etc; well THAT's when the rubber really hits the road with a product. When that unit has an issue, all bets are off about how good it really is, if it is malfunctioning, or not functioning at all. It is now a high-end brick until the problem is remedied. I come from a background in cust svc with a large company, so this is my turf.

That said, how a company stands behind and supports their product (and their customer) after the sale, imho is of paramount importance to me at least... ESPECIALLY at this price point. When you buy a new component, you are buying more than just the piece of gear itself. You are buying-in to that company, and at the support level as well as the hardware level. Let's face it, if people don't buy product x, the mfg goes under and fails to exist. There are ways to streamline cust svc more efficiently without penalizing the customer. It's about priority. Sounds like today you get less for your $$ spent with them than they used to deliver, post-sale. Not good. That tells me a lot about their new priorities, which is unfortunate with a company with their history.

That said, we all have choices and one can choose to have to deal with that, or not. I'm really liking what I hear about ADA's accessibility and direct communication with their customer base. This is the way it SHOULD be, again, imho. Meridian, like ADA, serves an exclusive tier of customers that are relatively few in number in contrast to the rest of the A/V mkt. It's not like Meridian is churning out (to use an automotive example) a million vanilla camry's not to mention the rest of the product line they offer. I'm hoping they will remedy their situation.

Now back to you, thread.
post #319 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crunchyriff View Post

Yes we all have our own opinions. But when what "sounds like angels" suddenly sounds like crap, or makes no sounds at all, or a firmware issue needs to be addressed, etc; well THAT's when the rubber really hits the road with a product. When that unit has an issue, all bets are off about how good it really is, if it is malfunctioning, or not functioning at all. It is now a high-end brick until the problem is remedied. I come from a background in cust svc with a large company, so this is my turf.

That said, how a company stands behind and supports their product (and their customer) after the sale, imho is of paramount importance to me at least... ESPECIALLY at this price point. When you buy a new component, you are buying more than just the piece of gear itself. You are buying-in to that company, and at the support level as well as the hardware level. Let's face it, if people don't buy product x, the mfg goes under and fails to exist. There are ways to streamline cust svc more efficiently without penalizing the customer. It's about priority. Sounds like today you get less for your $$ spent with them than they used to deliver, post-sale. Not good. That tells me a lot about their new priorities, which is unfortunate with a company with their history.

Is there an echo in here...you sound exactly like me, especially with respect to the 2nd paragraph...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Crunchyriff View Post

That said, we all have choices and one can choose to have to deal with that, or not. I'm really liking what I hear about ADA's accessibility and direct communication with their customer base. This is the way it SHOULD be, again, imho. Meridian, like ADA, serves an exclusive tier of customers that are relatively few in number in contrast to the rest of the A/V mkt. It's not like Meridian is churning out (to use an automotive example) a million vanilla camry's not to mention the rest of the product line they offer.

Now back to you, thread.

Again, you are exactly and perfectly echoing my sentiments, albeit in a more eloquent fashion...I could not agree more...
post #320 of 2083
Mine's comi g tomorrow. I'll soon be able to add my 2 cents.
post #321 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Mine's comi g tomorrow. I'll soon be able to add my 2 cents.

Looking forward to comparing notes with you...
post #322 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crunchyriff View Post

Yes we all have our own opinions. But when what "sounds like angels" suddenly sounds like crap, or makes no sounds at all, or a firmware issue needs to be addressed, etc; well THAT's when the rubber really hits the road with a product. When that unit has an issue, all bets are off about how good it really is, if it is malfunctioning, or not functioning at all. It is now a high-end brick until the problem is remedied. I come from a background in cust svc with a large company, so this is my turf.

That said, how a company stands behind and supports their product (and their customer) after the sale, imho is of paramount importance to me at least... ESPECIALLY at this price point.

I don't disagree with anything you say, but also keep in mind there are plenty of hiend companies who ask/expect consumers to go through their dealer network when there are repair issues. I'd wager that companies like ADA, and in my experience Lumagen and Oppo, are more the exception than the rule in terms of directly entertaining consumer issues. To be fair, here in the US at least, Meridian continues to be responsive to customer inquiries, and when I've had repair issues - and I have had a few - I've never been left with a 'brick'.
post #323 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by ca1ore View Post

I don't disagree with anything you say, but also keep in mind there are plenty of hiend companies who ask/expect consumers to go through their dealer network when there are repair issues. I'd wager that companies like ADA, and in my experience Lumagen and Oppo, are more the exception than the rule in terms of directly entertaining consumer issues. To be fair, here in the US at least, Meridian continues to be responsive to customer inquiries, and when I've had repair issues - and I have had a few - I've never been left with a 'brick'.

Although I do not disagree with you I think that the point that is being made is that given a choice between Company A (which conducts business like ADA, Lumagen, Oppo) or Company B (which conducts business like Meridian) then it is better / preferred to gravitate towards Company A...

As I have said elsewhere, the acid test will be when the system is fully calibrated and I will be able to determine how the ADA Cinema Rhapsody MACH IV B's sound quality compares to that of the Meridian 861V4/621 combination....and, should it be close, then there will be no doubt that I have made the right decision in selected the ADA over Meridian because:

Close / equal sound quality + company direct support + company road map (i.e. development plans) + greater configurability + preferred pricepoint (i.e. @ 25% of the cost or 4 times the number of upgrades) = WINNER to me...


@ Jeff, really looking forward to your feedback...
post #324 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joelc View Post

Although I do not disagree with you I think that the point that is being made is that given a choice between Company A (which conducts business like ADA, Lumagen, Oppo) or Company B (which conducts business like Meridian) then it is better / preferred to gravitate towards Company A.

Yes, I got that - and all other things being equal, I'm with you in going for 'Company A'. Indeed, perhaps the way the hiend is going (specialty dealers going away, like Sound by Singer in NY; and manufacturers suffering major financial problems), it will be increasingly necessary for a 'direct-to-consumer' model. We'll see. I just felt the need to point out that Meridian is not a 'bad' company simply by asking that conumers go through their dealer network for product support.

'nuff said on the matter.
post #325 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

If we're both talking about the SSP-800, yes, the latest code (2.0.4) fixes the CD playback issue.

Sorry I took that out of context and thought you were talking about the ADA

Adam
post #326 of 2083
I had a two to three hour listening session in my hiome theatre tonight now that there are actually seats in the theatre to sit in...

I have to say that teh advent of a music server (in my case a SONOS system) connected directly as a source makes it easy to listen to a wide range of music...

I will not, in this thread, comment on the acoustics or other aspects of the new home theatre as that is addressed in another thread in the Dedicated Build Forum but I will comment on the ADA Cinema Rhapsody MACH IV B...I can not comment on what it can / will sound like once tweaked to its limits but I can and will say for music lovers who like listening to their music through all channels that ADA QuadBypass is fantastic...and, no matter what other modes (DPL II Misuc, etc.) none of them even came close to QuadBypass in terms of my enjoyment...

In terms of Meridian (becasue I know that someone will ask)...ADA's QuadBypass is very enveloping and makes good / strong use of all speakers, I really enjoyed it...Meridian's trifield makes good / strong use of the L/C/R but little / subtle use of the other speakers...which is better is likely a matter of taste but, to my ears, the ADA went up a notch because the QuadBypass so envelopping that it draws you in...


PS. Jeff, are you connected yet and, if yes, please give me your thoughts of QuadBypass...
post #327 of 2083
Hi Joel

Please give some more details on the sound quality. I have to order mine in couple of weeks or so .... Hows the sound quality compared to other pre/pros you have heard- ....details...dynamics...sound stage ...bass etc...
post #328 of 2083
Hello There,

can I just ask the people who have a Rhapsody processor what they are using for everyday control of the unit, ie. to change sources,vol control, switching on,selecting audio modes, etc..

Thanks.........Alan
post #329 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by mani View Post

Hi Joel

Please give some more details on the sound quality. I have to order mine in couple of weeks or so .... Hows the sound quality compared to other pre/pros you have heard- ....details...dynamics...sound stage ...bass etc...

Mani, I may be able to give you a better response in a couple weeks time as as a few friends of mine who have Anthem AV50, Classe SSp-800 and a Meridian 861V6/621 combination among them may come by for a head to head comparison noting that I really need a head to head comparison to give you a detailed answer because I do not know how much of the difference that I am hearing is a result of the chnage in processor or the change in environement (i.e. new speakers, accoustically engineered room, etc.)...apologies but I need to be completely honest and straight forwward here...

That said, I am very happy with the sound quality knowing that I will be even happier once the new QSC DSP configuration file is loaded (as of know not all speakers are working) and the system is calibrated...the things that stand out are the clarity, the detail, the imaging, all of which were, at least to my ears, very good...

With that, I will post more after BOTH the i) hoped for shootout and ii) the calibration...
post #330 of 2083
Quote:
Originally Posted by euphonium View Post

Hello There,

can I just ask the people who have a Rhapsody processor what they are using for everyday control of the unit, ie. to change sources,vol control, switching on,selecting audio modes, etc..

Thanks.........Alan

Alan:

I have two ways of controlling the pre/pro...

1. Crestron control system which is not yet up and running; and

2. Because the Crestron is not up and running I am now using my laptop with the ADA Suite configuration software...the only problem with this approach is that one really needs a wired connection the ADA Suite software i) provides 2 way communication when using a wired connection but i) provides 1 way communication (i.e. no feedback) when using a wifi connection...

I hope that helps..
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