"the upgrade company" <component mods> - Page 63  

Originally Posted by ronesp

But Dave, taken from the TUC website:

"We measure, record and quantify the performance of the stock unit in order to determine it's strengths and weaknesses. The objective data further aids in determining which brands and types of ultra high end parts to install. We employ both measurement equipment and recording equipment to record and quantify each unit's stock performance prior to any work being done. Using an advanced recording system, we make recordings of each unit before during and after the upgrade. We quantify the unit's performance both in it's stock OEM condition and just prior to shipping it back to the customer to have a very clear "before and after" record of the parts, shielding and wiring improvements. " My highlights.

So if he already has these measurements why does he have to take them again?

Originally Posted by ronesp

But Dave, taken from the TUC website:

"We measure, record and quantify the performance of the stock unit in order to determine it's strengths and weaknesses. The objective data further aids in determining which brands and types of ultra high end parts to install. We employ both measurement equipment and recording equipment to record and quantify each unit's stock performance prior to any work being done. Using an advanced recording system, we make recordings of each unit before during and after the upgrade. We quantify the unit's performance both in it's stock OEM condition and just prior to shipping it back to the customer to have a very clear "before and after" record of the parts, shielding and wiring improvements. " My highlights.

So if he already has these measurements why does he have to take them again?

Originally Posted by thezaks

We've double blind multiple participant A-B compared all of our competitors OPPO 83SE player mods and we've made sure our players are far ahead of them in both measurements and actual performance.

Originally Posted by ArthurPE

talk about redirection and splitting hairs (if there were any to split, it's clear as day)...

he said he will take measurements
then he says he has already done so (ie, has them)

it seems this is only lost on you...
he lied, and got caught up in it, lol

keep this thread alive, it's the 3rd thing that comes up in google when 'the upgrade company' is searched
edit: up to second now...

Originally Posted by thezaks

Hi ArthurPE,

I apologize if you have not understood the point that I made, regarding the two mentions of measurements in David's post.

Dave

Originally Posted by ArthurPE

no need to be condescending and apologize
if you 'hear things' re: tuc mods, you have enough to deal with...

I understood it, you misrepresented it...or didn't, or refuse to, understand tuc's post...
not surprising, it was written in gibber-ese

he said he had data
he said he needed to get data
a lie
everybody sees this except you...don't you see this as a problem?
or is everyone wrong, and you are correct...ego run amuck lol

Originally Posted by thezaks

Hi ArthurPE,

Sorry, not trying to be condescending, I'm just at a loss. You are forgetting the specifics mentioned in that post. He first mentioned he would get data - for the stock vs TUC upgraded 83SE. Later in the post, he mentioned that he did measurements for the TUC upgraded 83SE vs other upgraded 83SE's. These are different sets of measurements. Perhaps you can explain what it is that I am missing here?

Thanks in advance,

Dave

Originally Posted by ArthurPE

I know, comprehension seems to be selective with you...one sided, facts not required...

he said he had data
then said he would have to get said data
disingenuous and/or a lie

I don't think anyone here expects you to say anything contrary to tuc, that's cool, we are all wrong, you are right...that must be comforting

Originally Posted by ArthurPE

keep this thread alive, it's the 3rd thing that comes up in google when 'the upgrade company' is searched
edit: up to second now...

Originally Posted by rno63

Maybe people see what the fuss is and search a little further.

Most people however don't go past the first page anyways.

Originally Posted by thezaks

Hi ArthurPE,

Can you explain this further? You mentioned that my comprehension seems selective, one sided, facts not required. I'm not understanding why you are saying that??

You actually have it backwards. If you look at the post, he says:

Here's something for you guy's to chew on while we get caught up and take the measurements on the 83SE stock vs upgraded and the Onkyo 886 stock vs upgraded.

So he first says that they will be taking measurements for stock vs TUC upgrade, after they get caught up. Then, later in his post:

We've double blind multiple participant A-B compared all of our competitors OPPO 83SE player mods and we've made sure our players are far ahead of them in both measurements and actual performance.


Here, he mentions measurements taken for upgraded Oppo's - his and other Companies. So, I think you had it backwards, with regards to the context of this post. Or, am I still missing something?

Thanks,

Dave

Originally Posted by rno63

I see that. Maybe he is getting more hits on his site. Maybe people see what the fuss is and search a little further. When you click on the link it takes you to the first page where 3 customers are happy owners and another customer is waiting for his unit. Later he posts that he likes his player and then posts again with some comparisons. Most people however don't go past the first page anyways. The first page displays experienced happy customers and the rest are skeptical is all.

Originally Posted by ArthurPE

nope, you wouldn't understand it, by cognitive ability or choice...but to put it simply, you are wrong...
I have it spot on, it's you who have distorted it for disingenuous reasons (go figure)

he said no data
then he said he had data
=lie
that's what happens you you lie by habit, you lose track of them and they are your undoing...

oh, what you are 'missing' could fill volumes...at least about audio engineering and con schemes
it's been explained by many, obviously not to your satisfaction (what a surprise), so keep on, keeping on...
denial = you are right, everyone else is wrong...perfection must be a heavy cross to bear, lol

Originally Posted by thezaks

Hi ArthurPE,


In this post, you have it in the right order, considering the context of Dave's post. You are right, he said no data, then he had data. More specifically, he said he would take measurements for stock vs TUC upgraded 83SE and Onkyo 886 after he gets caught up. I'm guessing this is what you are referring to as "no data". Later in that post, he mentions that the TUC upgraded 83SE measured better than the competitors upgraded 83SE's. I'm guessing this is what you are referring to as "he had data". I agree that one could assume that he might have the measurements for his TUC upgraded 83SE, assuming he kept the data. According to Dave's post, the stock 83SE measurements would still be missing, in order to provide stock vs upgraded measurement comparisons. Dave

Originally Posted by ronesp

Dave, not that I want to get in the middle of you and Arthur but as I posted earlier where I highlighted directly from the TUC website, he has these measurements on everything he works on. He's taken them before mods and after and records them (for future reference), to me that means he keeps them. I don't know Dave, I have a hard time following your rationalization on this.

Originally Posted by thezaks

Hi ronesp,

I really appreciate and respect your post - it's reasonable, well written and shows class. I definitely understand what you are saying, with reference to the TUC website. It would appear, from the website perspective, that he should have already done this and would just need to provide the info.

In my posts with Arthur, I've been speaking only from the perspective of David's post. I started talking about the post with Gizmologist, then with WilliamZX11, and then Arthur jumped in. Throughout, I've been speaking in the context of the post. I think if you read my posts, and consider them only in the context of Dave's post, then you might see my rationalization. The reason I've been sticking with the context of Dave's post is because it's the latest thing we've heard from him.

Now, taking all things into consideration, including not only Dave's post, but also his website, I can understand the confusion. The website mentions that measurements are generally taken, and Dave's post indicates that they need to be done. My guess is one of the following:

1) Measurements were not taken and need to be taken.
2) The measurements that Dave usually takes for his own purposes would not satisfy many folks here, so he wants to take measurements that are meaningful to this audience.

However, this is just speculation. It could be one of the above or something completely different. Only Dave can clarify this. That's why I keep going to his post. He seems to indicate that he's going to do the testing, which implies that it has not been done yet. Right or wrong, with respect to what the website says, I'd rather see folks give him a chance to provide the data that they've been requesting, rather than pouncing on him at this point. Do folks think that pouncing on him is going to encourage him to do the measurements and provide the data?

Thanks again,
Dave

Originally Posted by BWG707

With all due fairness you must understand that several people have requested "any type of measurements at all" several times, quite awhile ago, and was answered with double talk and his advertising. He never posted any data at all. He has had more than enough time to reply to these requests instead he continues to advertise and buy time. I am very curious to see if he ever comes back to post any "real" data as he stated that he would. He can post the test data that he continuously refers to in his web site , no need to do more testing. It really should be very simple.

Originally Posted by BWG707

With all due fairness you must understand that several people have requested "any type of measurements at all" several times, quite awhile ago, and was answered with double talk and his advertising. He never posted any data at all. He has had more than enough time to reply to these requests instead he continues to advertise and buy time. I am very curious to see if he ever comes back to post any "real" data as he stated that he would. He can post the test data that he continuously refers to in his web site , no need to do more testing. It really should be very simple.

Originally Posted by thezaks

Hi ArthurPE,

Interesting post. It's interesting because I'm genuinely trying to understand your viewpoint, but your replies have been more condescending than helpful. When I removed the unnecessary portions of your post, I was left with:

he said no data
then he said he had data
=lie

In this post, you have it in the right order, considering the context of Dave's post. You are right, he said no data, then he had data. More specifically, he said he would take measurements for stock vs TUC upgraded 83SE and Onkyo 886 after he gets caught up. I'm guessing this is what you are referring to as "no data". Later in that post, he mentions that the TUC upgraded 83SE measured better than the competitors upgraded 83SE's. I'm guessing this is what you are referring to as "he had data". I agree that one could assume that he might have the measurements for his TUC upgraded 83SE, assuming he kept the data. According to Dave's post, the stock 83SE measurements would still be missing, in order to provide stock vs upgraded measurement comparisons. Another thing to consider is that the measurements Dave took for the upgraded 83SE comparisons, may not be the same measurements (or may only be a portion of the measurements) that Dave would provide for the stock vs upgraded 83SE and Onkyo 886 comparison he mentioned in the post, especially considering the specifics that some folks here require - only Dave could answer that one.

The bottom line for me is that I see a post where Dave is offering to get and provide measurements for a stock 83SE vs a TUC upgraded 83SE. Wouldn't it be reasonable to give Dave some time to get this together? After all, he's agreed to provide what folks here have been requesting. Instead, folks continue to pounce on him. To me, it's obvious that many folks here will never be satisfied, no matter what data is provided. It's already been mentioned that there will be disbelief with anything that Dave provides. If it were me, I would not go down this road, and I would realize that folks like this are not a part of my customer base.

Dave

Originally Posted by ArthurPE

again, you are correct, everyone else is wrong...but the facts are:
he said he had data
then he said he had to get it
at best disingenous, at worst, a lie

as some will never be satisified, you will never be objective...
the facts are his mods impair fidelity, not enhance it...
physics compromises for no one, not even tuc and his laughable comprehension of electro-magnetic field physics...