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The Cinemar Home Theater Construction Thread - Page 35

post #1021 of 2773
12/18/11 at 8:10am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by scl23enn4m3 View Post

Your (beautifully crafted) columns can clearly stand and maintain an upright position on their own. So the screws won't be under much stress, they'll just be playing the role of preventing an accidental tip over and making sure the columns hug the wall. Based on that thought process I think you should be fine with 4 screws. Why are you limiting yourself to 4 though?

Here's what I ended up doing yesterday before I posted.

I attached (4) 16" 2x2 furring strips to the wall using (2) screws each.
Then I elevated the column with a 1/2" mdf board to get it off the ground. Leveled and screwed it in where the crown is going and the chair rail.

I'm trying not to use too many furring strips in case I need that space inside the column down the road for larger speakers or sound treatments.

The columns are going to be sandwiched on each side by more furring strips for the fabric on the top half of the column and 3/4" mdf on the bottom 2'6" of the column for the wainscoting. If I don't screw in where the mouldings are going to hide the screws, I'll need to screw in 3/8" from the edge of the mdf. So I tried not to do that so I didn't break off the edge. I guess I could shoot a few extra 16 ga 2" finishing nails in close to the edge if you guys think it will be necessary. Just having the screws gives me an easy option for disassembly if needed.




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post #1022 of 2773
12/18/11 at 8:27am
Thread Starter 
Quick question.

As I mentioned I'll be attaching 3/4" mdf in between the columns from the floor to 2'6". Should I use any adhesive when attaching to the wall or just screws? Remember the first layer on the wall is OSB. I have some green glue left over. I could put some of that on before screwing into the wall.
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post #1023 of 2773
12/18/11 at 8:30am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post


Mario,

Congrats on the progress! I made some progress on my theater, the lumber yard delivered according to the delivery record 4,500lbs of material

My back, arms, and legs agree with their weight calculation

Luckily I had my dad, brother, and 2 neighbors and within 4.5 hours we got everything into the basement

Looks like i'll be starting my own thread very soon!

That's great. At least you had some help. Excited to see your new thread and follow along.
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post #1024 of 2773
12/18/11 at 8:54am
Mario, I'm not sure of your method of attachment of the fabric on the upper wall between the columns, If you are doing frames and attaching later you are good to go, If you are putting the fabric on furring on the wall you may actually want to do the fabric before securing the columns, that way you can staple on the sides of the furring that will be hidden by the columns.

I only did a couple of columns in my basement and I secured with screws through the front face into furring on the ceiling and floor. I put the screws where they would be hidden by crown and baseboard.
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post #1025 of 2773
12/18/11 at 8:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Quick question.

As I mentioned I'll be attaching 3/4" mdf in between the columns from the floor to 2'6". Should I use any adhesive when attaching to the wall or just screws? Remember the first layer on the wall is OSB. I have some green glue left over. I could put some of that on before screwing into the wall.

My brain isn't working today, but if I understand you you're using the 3/4" MDF for wainscoting.

I'm not sure of the sticking power of GG, but I would go with Liquid Nail and and some finish nails (no screws) and you'll never get it off
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post #1026 of 2773
12/18/11 at 9:09am
Stupid question here, why dont the columns touch the ceiling or floor ?
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post #1027 of 2773
12/18/11 at 9:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by HFGuy View Post

Stupid question here, why dont the columns touch the ceiling or floor ?

Floor for moisture as MDF doesn't make nice. I don't think it will be an issue but better safe thn sorry.

Not sure why for the ceiling
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post #1028 of 2773
12/18/11 at 1:13pm
Your column is constructed with MDF which is quite heavy, and is off ground about 0.5", so I would attach a piece furring strip horizontally at back side of front side and attach two 2x2" vertically on inside corners as two extra legs to support the column.
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post #1029 of 2773
12/19/11 at 1:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post

Not sure why for the ceiling

The gap at the ceiling is probably for clearance to make it easier to get the column in place. In the renderings, he has crown molding going around the top of the columns, so the gap should easily be hidden.
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post #1030 of 2773
12/19/11 at 7:47am
Thread Starter 
One more column mounted. I also cut the outlets for the electrical outlet in the column and optional subwoofer jack. I ended up adding one more furring strip near the bottom of the column. The baseboard will hide that screw.

Initially I was planning to just staple the bottom openings in the columns with GOM and then install the moulding over it. This forces me to paint the moulding before installation since it'll be right next to the GOM fabric. Another problem is if the fabric ever got damaged or torn, it would be a big production to remove the moulding in order to replace the fabric. So I'm thinking of making those removable as well. I was going to use 1/4" hardboard for a frame, but I'm looking for those screw clamps that you see on cabinets to hold the speaker frame tight to the frame. They look like a small 3/4" l-bracket with a screw that tightens. Anyone know what these are called and where to pick them up? I think Menard's may even carry them.













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post #1031 of 2773
12/19/11 at 8:26am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post

Floor for moisture as MDF doesn't make nice. I don't think it will be an issue but better safe thn sorry.

Not sure why for the ceiling

You definitely want to allow some gap at the ceiling. I happened to allow just enough space for me to tilt the column upright from the ground and just clear the ceiling (1.5" gap). Ceilings are never perfectly flat/level either. It's just one less variable to fight with. The crown will cover the gap anyways.

It's challenging moving something that heavy into place with the gap let alone no gap since you can only lift it about an inch off the ground without scraping the ceiling.
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post #1032 of 2773
12/19/11 at 8:26am
Something like this or this?

Why no gap under the wainscoting mdf?

EDIT: It looks like you haven't secured those panels in place yet. What I thought was a screw was in fact a smudge on my screen.
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post #1033 of 2773
12/19/11 at 8:40am
I thought it was wiser to place columns after the carpet is installed.

Looks great, BTW!
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post #1034 of 2773
12/19/11 at 8:41am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

Mario, I'm not sure of your method of attachment of the fabric on the upper wall between the columns, If you are doing frames and attaching later you are good to go, If you are putting the fabric on furring on the wall you may actually want to do the fabric before securing the columns, that way you can staple on the sides of the furring that will be hidden by the columns.

I only did a couple of columns in my basement and I secured with screws through the front face into furring on the ceiling and floor. I put the screws where they would be hidden by crown and baseboard.

I'm still on the fence about this. My goal is to handle all fabric at the end...after painting everything and tackling the acoustics of the room. So putting the frames up before the columns is out.

My original plan of attack was to staple the GOM on to the furring strips that were already on the wall. Then put 1/4" x 1 1/2" flat moulding to hide the staples on each sides of the column. The crown and chair rail would hide the horizontal staples.
It may look a little sharper though with the fabric butted against the column and no moulding piece against the columns. My biggest frame inbetween the column would be 4'8.5" x 5'. With a frame that size, could I build the frame with the fabric on it and have it not warp from the tension of the fabric while securing it to the frame?

Then I could just staple/glue the entire frame in between the columns.

Thoughts?
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post #1035 of 2773
12/19/11 at 8:57am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by scl23enn4m3 View Post

Something like this or this?

Why no gap under the wainscoting mdf?

EDIT: It looks like you haven't secured those panels in place yet. What I thought was a screw was in fact a smudge on my screen.

Not quite. I took a picture from one of my store bought cabinets.

This is what I'm looking for:


Yeah - I just pre-cut the MDF but haven't secured it yet. Although there is no plan for a gap. I'm just going to put 3/4" MDF on the wall to match the depth I'm doing on the top half of the wall because of the denim I'm attaching. Then I'll be putting the moulding right onto the 3/4" MDF. INitially I was going to build a frame of 3/4" then 1/2" in the middle. But that 1/4" recessed look would be barely worth all the work and probably not even noticable.
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post #1036 of 2773
12/19/11 at 9:00am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themarkkram View Post

I thought it was wiser to place columns after the carpet is installed.

Looks great, BTW!

Thanks.

Too late now...but not sure why it would matter. I'm doing all the column construction within the theater because it's just too cold outside. So putting in the carpet too soon just wasn't an option. With the 1/2" gap at the bottom, the carpet guy can probably sneak padding right underneath.
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post #1037 of 2773
12/19/11 at 9:10am
Gotchya. What you're looking for is a z-bracket, or an offset-bracket. I didn't come across any at the 3/4" size after a quick search, but they do come in many sizes.

I'm not sure if it'll be easy to find one with a hole threaded for a machine screw though.

EDIT:

Just kidding, here you go:
http://search.digikey.com/us/en/cat/...fset%20bracket

It has 6-32 threads.
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post #1038 of 2773
12/19/11 at 9:14am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by scl23enn4m3 View Post

Gotchya. What you're looking for is a z-bracket, or an offset-bracket. I didn't come across any at the 3/4" size after a quick search, but they do come in many sizes. (Digikey even has a few.)

I'm not sure if it'll be easy to find one with a hole threaded for a machine screw though.

Let me know where you found them. I just threw out 3/4" but I may be able to use a different size.
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post #1039 of 2773
12/19/11 at 9:16am
http://search.digikey.com/us/en/cat/...fset%20bracket
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post #1040 of 2773
12/19/11 at 4:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Thanks.

Too late now...but not sure why it would matter. I'm doing all the column construction within the theater because it's just too cold outside. So putting in the carpet too soon just wasn't an option. With the 1/2" gap at the bottom, the carpet guy can probably sneak padding right underneath.

you dont work with carpet guys much do you?

they will be pissed when they see those columns...its not easy to maneuver it under a bunch of columns at once (carpet has very little give)....and the resistance is going to go up tremendously after it is under a couple of columns.

they may try to convince you to let them cut around them...(which definitely makes the columns permanent then, unless you want to change the carpet, lol)
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post #1041 of 2773
12/19/11 at 4:57pm
1/2 inch gap is what you leave under the baseboard molding to just tuck the edge of the carpet under, no room for tack strip or pad. Carpet and pad under the columns is not in your future. I would have built and installed the columns before carpeting myself.
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post #1042 of 2773
12/19/11 at 5:21pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by scl23enn4m3 View Post

http://search.digikey.com/us/en/cat/...fset%20bracket

Thanks for the link. At a $1.75 each I may just go with my original plan to save a lot of time and the money on these. If one rips, I can then go to this plan of a removable option as a replacement.
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post #1043 of 2773
12/19/11 at 5:25pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by longtimelurker View Post

you dont work with carpet guys much do you?

they will be pissed when they see those columns...its not easy to maneuver it under a bunch of columns at once (carpet has very little give)....and the resistance is going to go up tremendously after it is under a couple of columns.

they may try to convince you to let them cut around them...(which definitely makes the columns permanent then, unless you want to change the carpet, lol)

Actually I never had any intention of putting carpet below the columns. If I'm tearing out columns down the road, it's likely I've got bigger problems. If they can sneak the pad underneath its just a bonus and may help with sound a bit.
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post #1044 of 2773
12/19/11 at 5:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

1/2 inch gap is what you leave under the baseboard molding to just tuck the edge of the carpet under, no room for tack strip or pad. Carpet and pad under the columns in not in your future. I would have built and installed the columns before carpeting myself.

BIGMouthinDC,

Thanks for the reassurance. Any thoughts on my question about the fabric between the columns and their large size? The height of my lower wall mdf may need to be ripped down a bit if I go with large frames that I attach.
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post #1045 of 2773
12/20/11 at 6:35am
Just a thought but why not build all your columns and wait to attach them until carpet is in? This way the carpet guys can go wall to wall, your columns will be removable if need be and everyone is happy? I dont think that either way is wrong just my $.02 worth.
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post #1046 of 2773
12/20/11 at 6:54am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iusteve View Post

Just a thought but why not build all your columns and wait to attach them until carpet is in? This way the carpet guys can go wall to wall, your columns will be removable if need be and everyone is happy? I dont think that either way is wrong just my $.02 worth.

That's a great idea and I tossed it around, but it would delay many things. Plus, I would really need to have the columns in place in order to continue with all the other items. I plan to cut all the mouldings inside the room as well. I'd rather not do that with the carpet installed already. I wouldn't want the carpet to hold things up as I'm sure it would cause scheduling problems.

If I was really concerned about the ability to convert the room later, I would probably go down that road. If I or someone is going to lengths to remove the columns, replacing the carpet will be a small price to pay given everything else that would have to be torn out.

Great idea though.
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post #1047 of 2773
12/20/11 at 7:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post


My original plan of attack was to staple the GOM on to the furring strips that were already on the wall. Then put 1/4" x 1 1/2" flat molding to hide the staples on each sides of the column. The crown and chair rail would hide the horizontal staples.
It may look a little sharper though with the fabric butted against the column and no molding piece against the columns. My biggest frame in between the column would be 4'8.5" x 5'. With a frame that size, could I build the frame with the fabric on it and have it not warp from the tension of the fabric while securing it to the frame?

Then I could just staple/glue the entire frame in between the columns.

Thoughts?

As I understand your current method of column attachment is 4 screws, That Means in 30 seconds you can remove the screws and pull the column away from the wall. Do your fabric work and replace the column this time screwing through the front face at the very top and bottom were it will be hid by crown and baseboard molding.

You will actually be saving yourself some time as you won't have to cut and mount all those strips to hide the staples.

You could actually paint them in place before removing and doing the fabric work.

OR

If you are still wanting to do fabric panels make them of two strips of 1/2 inch plywood. I had good luck with Home Depot Sand-ply. Just overlap the butt joints as I did for the Bacon Race. If you make them 2 inches wide you will have no problems with warping, as you get smaller there can be a problem, We did 1 1/2 at the BR to minimize the % of the wall with hard surfaces and had to use midspan spacers for the the long dimensions.







I glued and banged them together with 7/8 inch long 14 inch crown staples.
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post #1048 of 2773
12/20/11 at 7:49am
Thread Starter 
Great info.

I think I'm going to go with your 2nd option of building fabric panels then attaching after the columns and treatments are on the wall and painted. That provides me with more flexibility.

I'll just need to rip down my lower wall MDF to accomodate for the bottom of the fabric panel frames.

I'm planning on going with a 3" chair rail. 1 1/2" would be on top of the fabric panel and the other on the lower wall 3/4" mdf. I'm pretty sure this is fine but it would probably be better that I staple the fabric on the outer edges of the panels rather than wrapping them all the way around to the back side and creating more thickness. Any foreseen problems with this strategy?
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post #1049 of 2773
12/20/11 at 8:02am
No just don't underestimate the thickness of the fabric and make the panels too tight. Make sure all the staples are seated. Forcing tight panels in will scrape the paint.
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post #1050 of 2773
12/20/11 at 8:19am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

No just don't underestimate the thickness of the fabric and make the panels too tight. Make sure all the staples are seated. Forcing tight panels in will scrape the paint.

I've been using a right angle ruler when building all the speaker frames for the columns to get the perfect fit. If I could squeeze the right angle ruler thickness into the space, it worked out perfectly so there was just enough space for fabric on all sides.

I did a quick test with some fabric and a small piece of 3/4". I could definitely see there was some ruffling where the staples landed when I put them in on the side of the board. So I may try to wrap the panels around to the backside. So I get a sharper edge by time the fabric wraps around to the visible front edge. It's possible I just didn't pull the fabric tight to prevent this. So another test might be in order.
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