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Simple Offset Driver HornResp Tutorial - How to design your own Bass Horn - Page 3

post #61 of 85
No one has 10ft ceilings anymore?

How about using it as a really big HT stage area?

I'll talk someone into doing one, or letting me do it for them one day... freaking recession.
post #62 of 85
Could I build it into my crawl space?
post #63 of 85
I just moved a second couch into my dedicated theater room. Looks like I'll be building a riser with a horn sub in it.
post #64 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by LHD21 View Post

I just moved a second couch into my dedicated theater room. Looks like I'll be building a riser with a horn sub in it.

When you start the thread, make sure you post a link here so we can all follow it.
post #65 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerParty View Post

When you start the thread, make sure you post a link here so we can all follow it.

Yeah. I'm 99% sure I'll put a horn sub in it. I probably could use some more bass traps but oh well.
post #66 of 85
Thread Starter 
For a 'proof of concept' project, I am going to make a small, front loaded horn with the Tang-Band WS-1139SI or the W8-740P which is currently on sale at PE...

The new thread will encompass a folding tutorial as well...basically from simulation to realworld, just like lilmike is doing with his tapped horn...

JSS
post #67 of 85
What specs do you look for when finding a driver that you want to use? So far if I find a sub with a high BL and a large XMax they seem to model very well. The high BL seems to make them model very well with a small rear chamber, and the small rear chamber cuts down on the speaker displacement.

I just modeled dual Tang Band W8-740P 8"( on sale at PE right now ) subs in a 400 liter offset horn. Before running out of xmax, corner loaded it models to give me right around 124 db from 20hz+. I would love to see that kind of output out of 2 cheap 8 inch subs.
post #68 of 85
Thread Starter 
Hornresp record for this dual TB horn???

The TB W8-740P is very good for horns...I also look for high BL, low Le, low Qts, high Xmax.....then I just plug it in and see...takes me about 10-15 mins to figure out what size and extension horn it would work well in...

JSS
post #69 of 85
Stumbled upon this thread while seeing what tutes are out there for hornresp. I've put together a very quick and dirty tute on getting started. It's meant for those who want to have a crack at it NOW! Then get the details later. Here it is ...

http://redspade-audio.blogspot.com/2...orn-basic.html

I'm putting together a bass horn series, there will be more tutes and more articles on the way ...

One comment about stage bass horns. They do have some appeal, but also keep in mind that they will generally be loaded into 2 pi space and so they need to be very big. Loading them into a corner allows 1/4 of the size of the mouth. So imagine if you take two of those "stage horns", and instead ran them along the front wall firing into corners - kind of like an oversized fireplace. You give up just a bit of floor space (perhaps make it half a metre deep), but a horn like that will easily load down to 20 Hz. It really depends on the room. Some rooms have a very high ceiling, others are long. If you have a long room then perhaps you can get away with losing some length and having a bass horn that looks like part of the room. I'd say it will often work out less intrusive, even when not considering that it can be much smaller due to corner loading.
post #70 of 85
im hoping this is in the right place this is my first BLH design and im looking for some criticism either constructive or destructive


i attached the export file also if you want to check it out or make improvements

its for 2 small 4" polk drivers per enclosure





 

polk.txt 20.40234375k . file
post #71 of 85
Your FRD plot is the horn output only. You need to use the combined response tool to see system response.
post #72 of 85
Thread Starter 
Attach the hornresp record, not the schematic export file so we can help....

Bill is right, you are looking at the horn only.....

JSS
post #73 of 85
I have been hanging back reading this for awhile and messing around with hornresp. But I'd like to know about taking these measurements, folding and constructing. I've constructed simple speaker cabinets before but I don't know where to go with this. Thanks.
post #74 of 85
Thread Starter 
Wish you would have posted this a week ago....had last week off.

You start with goals to be met: output/extension/max cab size.

Then you pick a driver, and if you trust the published T/S parameters, you go into hornresp and start simulating horns. Trial and error will lead you to a design you can be comfortable with. Then you need to fold the horn up, a simple, unfinifhed tutorial (aren't they all?) is here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1222472

NOTE: I use PAR instead of CON for horn profile/flare, as PAR is the way I build, with parallel sides and non-curved tapers.

It takes a while to learn how to play with hornresp and Sketchup, but you can design a decent horn for yourself....you must realize the limitations of horns. They get output, but they trade bandwidth, irregular freq response and size in return.

JSS
post #75 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmercy View Post


NOTE: I use PAR instead of CON for horn profile/flare, as PAR is the way I build, with parallel sides and non-curved tapers.

PAR stands for parabolic, it is a curved taper, usually seen in so-called 'saladbowl' midrange horns.
post #76 of 85
The PAR function in Hornresp does not correlate directly to a "salad bowl" flare. In order to facilitate that type of flare you would need to input the inverse of an m or T to define the parabola.

In this case the PAR function is used with a set variable that follows the area expansion rate of a horn with non-rounded walls, a rectangle frustum if you will. It seems a little odd until you run through the math for yourself.
post #77 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by soho54 View Post

The PAR function in Hornresp does not correlate directly to a "salad bowl" flare. In order to facilitate that type of flare you would need to input the inverse of an m or T to define the parabola.
.

Model a short PAR midbass horn, with the length and mouth cross-section of similar dimension, look at the schematic.
post #78 of 85
That is the two-dimensional representation of a 3d volume.

Like I said do the math. Export your horn and plot it out as a typical two parallel wall horn. You will find it is a straight frustum every time, and that was the idea. You can check the volume and cross sectional areas at any points, and they will match up. The function is to better match the volume under the curve of non-cylindrical horns.

The PAR function is no good for things like salad bowl horns, as you have no control over the parabolas focus point. It would be like the HYP function not allowing you to alter the T. Unless the default variable was just right for your horn it would be a waste of time.
post #79 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by soho54 View Post

That is the two-dimensional representation of a 3d volume.

As are the schematics for all the flare types used. Before carving your pronouncement in stone I'd converse with Dave McBean. It matters not to me, I don't use PAR flares anyway.
post #80 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

I'd converse with Dave McBean.

I have.
post #81 of 85
I have two questions for those in the know and this seems like the most appropriate thread to ask in.

First off, I am trying to model a midbass horn demonstrated here:
http://hifiheroin.blogspot.com/2010/...-part-iii.html

Its a tractrix 65hz flare.

I've read through most of the tutorials I've found but still have the following questions.

1) How do I alter the profile in hornresp between Hypex, Exponential, Tractrix or other?

2) How do I examine the off-axis reponse?
post #82 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioJosh View Post

1) How do I alter the profile in hornresp between Hypex, Exponential, Tractrix or other?

You need to input a single segment Nd horn, and then if L12 is still showing double click the S2 box to choose Tractrix. If L12 is something else (or just L12) you can click the L12 box and press the "T" key. You can set the horn flare cutoff frequency with F12.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioJosh View Post

2) How do I examine the off-axis reponse?

Calculate the horn, and then go to the SPL Window. Now go to Tools>Directivity. Here you will find a handful of different ways to view the off-axis response.

Hope this helps.
post #83 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

Your FRD plot is the horn output only. You need to use the combined response tool to see system response.

How do I get the combined response?
post #84 of 85
Thanks all for a great link and thread. Much value here, well done.
post #85 of 85

THANKS FOR THE INFO WHAT SOFTWARE  YOU ARE USING WHERE CAN I BUY IT

 

RETXED2003

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