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Official Rythmik Audio Subwoofer thread - Page 263

post #7861 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by K5/SS View Post

Congrats Stanley. I was going to let you come over and listen to mine but I thought you already ordered the XS30. The wait defiantly sucks but Brian is the man and gets them out quick. Rythmik sure is making waves lately....smile.gif
Yeah, I had but had to cancel but then it was on again. Long story. At least in the end it turns out fine. Yep, it was the HSU making waves awhile back but I guess it's Rythmik now. Both fine subs of course.
post #7862 of 15163
PSA is making waves too, there's a reason why they've sold out of two production runs now.
post #7863 of 15163
PSA is making waves too, there's a reason why they've sold out of two production runs now.biggrin.gif
You did get a great sub though!
post #7864 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

PSA is making waves too, there's a reason why they've sold out of two production runs now.biggrin.gif
You did get a great sub though!

For sure. If I hadn't run into a snafu I'd have a PSA on the way. Either way it's a win situation.smile.gif
post #7865 of 15163
Stanley if you ever make your way north of the border you can stop by and have a listen to my dual XS30s. I wish someone on the west coast would do a GTG.
post #7866 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

Stanley if you ever make your way north of the border you can stop by and have a listen to my dual XS30s. I wish someone on the west coast would do a GTG.

I've been to Mexico but never to Canada and I don't really live that far away. I'm just scared of Canuks. Too many horror stories of what they do to visitors. biggrin.gif

Yeah, a GTG sure would be nice on the west coast. Like in Seattle.
post #7867 of 15163
Haha those are "mostly" just rumours.
Edited by jbrown15 - 1/9/13 at 8:29pm
post #7868 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by XStanleyX View Post

I just make one sweep at the main listening position till I get it close to zero. After that I run all positions.
There is no need to get 0 on the AVR.
For Audyssey, the LFE trim range is -12dB to +12dB. As long as the trim is showing within -11dB to +11dB, it's good. (This is mentioned too many times in the Audyssey thread)
The Pioneer MCACC calibration should be similar.
post #7869 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skerlnik View Post

The fact that the AUTO isn't working, and my sub doesn't move air around tells me something is definitely up. The gain on my AVR is set to +5, and I have the volume cranked to like 80% just to hear it. It's hard to determine how accurate music is at this point since with my current situation it's hard to discern the sub from my fronts, and my fronts have always been quite accurate. I haven't done any MLP or angle measurements yet, just a single YPAO pass so far to get levels and distances.
To check if your subwoofer is playing the bass tone, try to play the AVR buit-in LFE test tone (normally in speaker level check menu). The subwoofer should come alive.
post #7870 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by vertigo4 View Post

Exactly. I'll try adjusting it down first (since that's what makes sense in my head too) and see what happens. Should this ultimately create any type of difference I would be able to hear?
YPAO works just like Audyssey as far as setting the sub volume. What are your sub and avr crossover settings? Sometimes YPAO will set the fronts back to large. Double check they are still small.
post #7871 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylinestar View Post

There is no need to get 0 on the AVR.
For Audyssey, the LFE trim range is -12dB to +12dB. As long as the trim is showing within -11dB to +11dB, it's good. (This is mentioned too many times in the Audyssey thread)
The Pioneer MCACC calibration should be similar.

From the Audyssey FAQ thread:

10.Observe what trim level Audyssey sets in the AVR. Ideally, it should be in the -3 to +3 dB range. If it is too far towards either limit, go back to step 5 and use either a lower or higher target gain level, depending on your final results.

Sure, you can get away with -11db to +11db but "ideally" -3db to +3db is what you shoot for. You can do it your way and I'll do it mine smile.gif
post #7872 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

YPAO works just like Audyssey as far as setting the sub volume. What are your sub and avr crossover settings? Sometimes YPAO will set the fronts back to large. Double check they are still small.

I have MCACC since it's a Pioneer receiver. Don't know if there's ultimately any real difference. Anyway, the crossover on the AVR is set to 80Hz. The sub is set to 120HZ since that's where Rythmik suggests it be set as a starting point. Also, MCACC did set the fronts to large so after it was done with its setup I changed them to "small."

My wife wasn't home until late last night and my 2.5yo can't stay quiet for long enough, so I wasn't able to do much with changing settings last night. Only got to run MCACC one time after I made some changes to the settings on the subwoofer that I realized I should have had set the first time. Due to that, I didn't mess with the volume/level. I wanted to see how it would come out first after the changes. This time it set the AVR output to -6.5db.

Since the installation guide states:

"4.2 Volume knob settings
We recommend setting the volume so that the RoomEQ system is not using greater boost or trim than necessary. If the boost or trim is greater than 6 dB, then volume adjustment is recommended."

I'll adjust the volume level on the subwoofer and rerun MCACC. I'm not sure what the reasoning is behind this (does anyone know?) but since they recommend it, I'll follow the directions.

Thanks!
post #7873 of 15163
I may be completely making this up, but I think I read the trim on the AVR should be relatively close to zero (some say within 3, I always heard 5, someone just said 6) because there is a concern that too much trim can impact the EQ? Not sure if there is any evidence on that.

Does the AVR trim boost and attenuate, or is it only attenuating (even though we think of a + number as a boost, it really isn't)? If it is boosting that's not great, potential distortion sooner at higher levels??? maybe?

I traditionally run sub either level with mains or hot. So I'd always aim to have my trim around -3 on the AVR for level. That way could go up some without getting into the + too far. However with duals I'm getting more impact and am running hot much less, I may redo and aim for 0 trim to be level with the mains as I could see myself trimming down in some cases.
Edited by dstew100 - 1/10/13 at 9:40am
post #7874 of 15163
I have a question for some owners out there. What mode are you running your sub in...max output or max extension?

I only ask because when I first got my sub I had it set to max output and I was amazed at how it sounded. Just last week I decided to give max extension a shot and to me it sounded and felt better in max output mode. Now I have not had too much time to fiddle around with the settings and my placement options right now are pretty much where it is now but I am not sure if maybe I have some of the settings on the back wrong. I forget exactly what I have on now but I know I know I have the rumble filter set to off/1 and I am pretty sure the extension filter is set to 14 high.

If anyone could let me know what their settings are and what they preferred I would appreciate it. I can tell you that my normal TV and video gaming is done at around -30db and movies are watched normally around -10db if this helps.
post #7875 of 15163
I think you know I run in max extension mode. The thought process being, I'm not going to use those extra few db, 99% of the time, I want the deeper bass (which really is only on certain content).

Honestly I haven't even tried max output, which is prolly dumb.

Are you sure your SPL is calibrated to the same level? What is sounding different to you?
post #7876 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMFDMvsEnya View Post

Have you by chance connected the Multichannel Subwoofer INPUT rather than the Sub 1 PRE OUT? Plenty of folks have done it once or twice, clearly they will not admit to it. wink.gif

From what you have described that might be the issue, also the receiver does support two subs but perhaps Sub 2 Out has been connected but the settings have number 2 toggled off.

One possible method to determine if the Amp is DOA is hookup a cd or MP3 player to to the sub's input and select some bass heavy music. If you do this set the gain midway and slowly turn up the volume on the player, in order to avoid any loud surprises.

Good Luck
KvE

PS Thecablemonster, if there is a burning smell it maybe defective. Also there is a small toggle near the bottom of the AMP for voltage, is it by chance set to 220-240V instead of 110-120V? Assuming you are in the US.

So, please forgive me, because this is my husbands forte and I am handling it in lieu of him. He is using a cable (not the typical red and white), it is purple and only one area matches up to this color. There are two inputs for it on the back of the receiver, one is white and the other is checkered (I'm guessing to appear gray). It is labeled subwoofer, but nothing says in or out. The sub does work, it just doesn't work to the level he would expect for a sub larger than our previous one, it is working equivocally.

The receiver is an onkyo (I know that means nothing), I can't find the model on the front. It is more powerful than our old one that couldn't power our old sub. Regardless, we only have one sub connected, we have tested two different subs on it, not at the same time.

It is a good point about the 220-240V vs 110-120V setting, and I did think it was possible, but not surprisingly, my husband had it set on 110-120V, he is very particular about setting things just right.

Brian does suspect that it is defective, he is going to handle it with my husband when he gets back.
post #7877 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylinestar View Post

If it's that hot, it's a faulty unit.

Yes, probably, Brian is working with us on it
post #7878 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by XStanleyX View Post

Yeah, I had but had to cancel but then it was on again. Long story. At least in the end it turns out fine. Yep, it was the HSU making waves awhile back but I guess it's Rythmik now. Both fine subs of course.

I'm having a similar conflict right now. My heart wants 2 Rythmik FV15HP but my head/wallet is telling me to get dual XS30's. Does Rythmik offer multiple purchase discounts?
post #7879 of 15163
Add two to cart and find out wink.gif
post #7880 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstew100 View Post

I think you know I run in max extension mode. The thought process being, I'm not going to use those extra few db, 99% of the time, I want the deeper bass (which really is only on certain content).

Honestly I haven't even tried max output, which is prolly dumb.

Are you sure your SPL is calibrated to the same level? What is sounding different to you?

I do not have my own calibration equipment...just Audyssey. I did re calibrate it when I made the switch (not sure if that is necessary) but it just seems like I lost some of that slam I felt the first few weeks...it could also just be in my head too though. I guess I will have to mess around with it and see what I can do.
post #7881 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDean View Post

I'm having a similar conflict right now. My heart wants 2 Rythmik FV15HP but my head/wallet is telling me to get dual XS30's. Does Rythmik offer multiple purchase discounts?

There is definitely a multiple sub discount. Not sure if the website will auto do it or if you have to email / call Rythmik. They honored my second sub loyalty discount many months after my original purchase. I believe it is 10% off EACH sub.

Tough choice between the two, there was a thread recently that compared the measurements which essentially came down to sealed vs ported diffs. I believe at and above the port tune the Rythmik has the advantage, somewhere the XS30 catches up, maybe around 60 HZ, and the XS30 wins below port tune as a sealed should (around 12 hz I think, tune is 14). With the Rythmik you also get the Servo which should translate to lower distortion. PSA are the new guys, but the owners have been around and are well respected, reputable folks.

I am very pleased with my dual Rythmik FV15HP's and I have heard the bigger subs (JTR+Seaton) and a smaller PSA. This Rythmik is a high quality build, very clean accurate sound, and all around high performance. Top notch product and top notch customer service. We are fortunate consumers in the ID sub business these days.
post #7882 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smigro View Post

I do not have my own calibration equipment...just Audyssey. I did re calibrate it when I made the switch (not sure if that is necessary) but it just seems like I lost some of that slam I felt the first few weeks...it could also just be in my head too though. I guess I will have to mess around with it and see what I can do.

The calibration should have taken care of the level match for you, I'd trust it. I suppose you could be getting more air movement at lower frequencies maybe???? Perhaps it's more tactile???? Does anyone else have an opinion on this (max extension vs max output)?

Do you think it actually sounds different with content that doesn't have deep deep bass? Or do you think it feels different? I was thinking the only different sound in max extension was if the content had bass between 14 and 20 (or 28). And the difference for max output would only be at louder volumes, the sub will get louder before compressing.
post #7883 of 15163
When I first got mine, I had it running with 2 ports open then I switched it to 1 port just to experiment and prefer the 1 port open for extension in my ~2700 ft^3 room. I usually listen at -10db below reference with sub running 3db hot. I only use my sub for movie though.
post #7884 of 15163
I believe above 40hz the XS30 holds the advantage. Below that the FV15HP does.
post #7885 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cowboys View Post

When I first got mine, I had it running with 2 ports open then I switched it to 1 port just to experiment and prefer the 1 port open for extension in my ~2700 ft^3 room. I usually listen at -10db below reference with sub running 3db hot. I only use my sub for movie though.

<15hz is what got me looking at the XS30. Should I also consider the F15Hp or will I be able to tell any difference at these frequencies opposed to one port blocked? I'm new to HT subs so regardless of what I choose I'm sure I'll be ecstatic. I just have it in my head that going as low as possible is more important to me that a sub with the highest output. I'm not sure there is really much content down there but if there is I've convinced myself I want to feel it.

I may be nitpicking at this point and if that's the case someone set me straight please.
post #7886 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

I believe above 40hz the XS30 holds the advantage. Below that the FV15HP does.

I'd have to go back to look at the graphs but I believe you, 60 just came from reading it the one time and bad memory. The general theme was right though.

Don't want to take anything away from the PSA, it's a solid sub for sure. I have it's little brother, the XS15, which is a great price to performance ratio. I do think it's interesting that these two subs (XS30 + FV15HP) are fairly close in output (trading back in forth who's out front over their respective frequency ranges) when the PSA has two 15in drivers. Is that box size differences, driver output differences, both???? I'm not a DIY sub design fella obviously. In the end it's the performance that counts and they are both very very nice.
post #7887 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDean View Post

<15hz is what got me looking at the XS30. Should I also consider the F15Hp or will I be able to tell any difference at these frequencies opposed to one port blocked? I'm new to HT subs so regardless of what I choose I'm sure I'll be ecstatic. I just have it in my head that going as low as possible is more important to me that a sub with the highest output. I'm not sure there is really much content down there but if there is I've convinced myself I want to feel it.

I may be nitpicking at this point and if that's the case someone set me straight please.

It's the nitpickinck every little inch out of your system for what comes out of your wallet that's fun, at least for me. I want high performance and high value. Good call that you are going to be ecstatic, those are three very nice subs you are looking at. Definitely look at the F15HP as well. Their FR + output are a little different but I think an influential difference between them is size also. You realize we aren't talking about small subs here right?

Traditionally folks say sealed are more musical and ported is more home theatre. However the FV15HP is known to really close the musical gap; we think because of the servo design. There is a review earlier in this thread where the fella says he hears a difference between the F15HP and FV15HP but it is very minor and subtle.

A ported design will give you less rolloff and more output down to port tune, but is not very happy below that. A sealed design start to roll off sooner (AKA the XS30 started rolling off at 40HZ) but does so very gradually. That's why the FV15HP has a fairly decent advantage from 14ish Hz to 40Hz but above and below the XS30 creeps back on top. In the end it is personal preference, and in the very end you're gunna have a bad arse bass system. I do think under 20Hz matters but diminishing returns is pretty heavy down here below 20Hz too. I measured -3db at 10Hz in my room (room gain rox) with one Rythmik, still need to measure the duals (on a radio shack meter, man I need a real mic). How much under 14Hz content are you looking at playing?

Obviously I went with the Rythmik after much research and can tell you I'm very happy I did, so I lean that way, but I'm not gunna ding anyone going for the PSA. I can't believe what this $750 XS15 can do. No it doesn't dig as deep or as loud as my Rythmik, but wow, $750!! I do feel that Rythmik and PSA are a better value than HSU or SVS right now but they are still doing better than the big box brands. JTR, Seaton, and Funk are a little more money than this price point.

Hope this helps and good luck with your decision. Don't worry, there are no disappointment land mines in the options you are looking at.
post #7888 of 15163
This will sound silly since I bought the thing a year ago but how can I make sure my driver is a DS1510 instead of say, a DS1505 and same with the amp (550 vs 370)? Also I noticed with certain members posting pics, their box says FV15HP while mine just says FV15. Better to be safe then sorry cool.gif
post #7889 of 15163
^^^
One should be able to tell by the ampliifer. The HP version has an HP box on the amplifier model number (which located around 1/3 from the bottom on the amplifier). Also the power consumption will list as 1000W (not 600W as in regular power version).
post #7890 of 15163
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstew100 View Post

The calibration should have taken care of the level match for you, I'd trust it. I suppose you could be getting more air movement at lower frequencies maybe???? Perhaps it's more tactile???? Does anyone else have an opinion on this (max extension vs max output)?

Do you think it actually sounds different with content that doesn't have deep deep bass? Or do you think it feels different? I was thinking the only different sound in max extension was if the content had bass between 14 and 20 (or 28). And the difference for max output would only be at louder volumes, the sub will get louder before compressing.

To me it is more of a feel thing than sound but like I said it could all be in my head. I guess what got me thinking was when I was watching the BD of Black Hawk Down. I heard a couple and saw on the bass list that this is either a 4.5 or 5 star for bass but I just did not feel it. There is a specific scene where the choppers are taking off where a forum member raved about how his subs were just going crazy during this scene and for me I just did not get that feeling. I should mention though that his system contained two LMS ultra 18" subs in a sealed boxes so that is possibly why he was getting all of that real low bass and I was not.

I still feel it is probably just because I have limited spots to place my sub and have not really messed around with too much yet. I am sure if I spent a day trying to dial it in (not too sure what to do to dial a sub in though) I would get better performance.
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