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The Avengers - Page 34

post #991 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Closet Geek View Post

So to continue on, I'm not buying this and still would like to know who this guy is or what his sources are. After a second viewing last night there was nothing here indicating magical mind control from the scepter. Nothing was ever said or revealed in any way that this is what was occurring.

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Sure Loki could use the scepter like he did on Hawkeye but that's about it. The only thing even close that was mentioned about it was during the big argument when Black Widow said Loki was manipulating Banner. It was all a matter (or at least filmed and edited) of bringing these strong independent type personalities together in the same room. Everyone has their opinion, everyone is right and the result is pointing fingers and conflict. I don't remember the dialogue but Banner was clearly upset at Black Widow directly AND he was upset to find out SHIELD was making weapons. He felt deceived and used not to mention that he learned that the cage that Loki was held in was really for him.

I'm sorry you're not buying it. I'm guessing the guy is a comic nerd and that his sources are Marvel canon. While it can't be confirmed 100% that is what Whedon intended:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
it is well established through Marvel comics that Loki has multiple magical powers, including the power to hypnotize people, including his brother Thor, and that he also has the ability to influence others actions, across great distances. Much of this was established through the early issues of Journey into Mystery in the 60's. However, these have been brief influences. My guess is that Whedon and Co. used the staff as the differentiator to semi-permanent influence - and really, those were under the influence of the tessarac, indirectly through Loki's control of the cube - more magic - go back and listen to some of the statements the scientist makes - "the cube has shown me everything" or something like that. Same with Hawkeye - the cube told him what it needed. So the staff actually connected everyone to the cube, while Loki "influenced" (perhaps using the staff as an "amplifier") the Avengers in the lab through his own magic. And "nothing was ever said or revealed" - you don't take the fact that Banner didn't even know he was holding the staff/scepter until someone told him to put it down as a "revelation"?


Makes perfect sense to me based on comic canon. I have no idea why this is giving you and others so much trouble.
post #992 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike1812 View Post

I'm sorry you're not buying it. I'm guessing the guy is a comic nerd and that his sources are Marvel canon. While it can't be confirmed 100% that is what Whedon intended:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
it is well established through Marvel comics that Loki has multiple magical powers, including the power to hypnotize people, including his brother Thor, and that he also has the ability to influence others actions, across great distances. Much of this was established through the early issues of Journey into Mystery in the 60's. However, these have been brief influences. My guess is that Whedon and Co. used the staff as the differentiator to semi-permanent influence - and really, those were under the influence of the tessarac, indirectly through Loki's control of the cube - more magic - go back and listen to some of the statements the scientist makes - "the cube has shown me everything" or something like that. Same with Hawkeye - the cube told him what it needed. So the staff actually connected everyone to the cube, while Loki "influenced" (perhaps using the staff as an "amplifier") the Avengers in the lab through his own magic. And "nothing was ever said or revealed" - you don't take the fact that Banner didn't even know he was holding the staff/scepter until someone told him to put it down as a "revelation"?


Makes perfect sense to me based on comic canon. I have no idea why this is giving you and others so much trouble.

My memories of Loki from his past Marvel appearences as well as the cutting back to Tom Hiddleston's facial reactions in the scenes in question led me to think pretty much what you mention in the hidden bit of your post.
post #993 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike1812 View Post

I'm sorry you're not buying it. I'm guessing the guy is a comic nerd and that his sources are Marvel canon. While it can't be confirmed 100% that is what Whedon intended:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
it is well established through Marvel comics that Loki has multiple magical powers, including the power to hypnotize people, including his brother Thor, and that he also has the ability to influence others actions, across great distances. Much of this was established through the early issues of Journey into Mystery in the 60's. However, these have been brief influences. My guess is that Whedon and Co. used the staff as the differentiator to semi-permanent influence - and really, those were under the influence of the tessarac, indirectly through Loki's control of the cube - more magic - go back and listen to some of the statements the scientist makes - "the cube has shown me everything" or something like that. Same with Hawkeye - the cube told him what it needed. So the staff actually connected everyone to the cube, while Loki "influenced" (perhaps using the staff as an "amplifier") the Avengers in the lab through his own magic. And "nothing was ever said or revealed" - you don't take the fact that Banner didn't even know he was holding the staff/scepter until someone told him to put it down as a "revelation"?


Makes perfect sense to me based on comic canon. I have no idea why this is giving you and others so much trouble.

I'll admit that the depth of my knowledge of Thor is not as strong as all the other characters but I do have limited familiarity with what you mention. But this is something that one sentence somewhere in the screenplay could have clarified.

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
And if this "influence" was so apparent then why not influence Fury to NOT assemble the Avengers? But again, how it all played out on film simply doesn't translate to the background you provided. And no, I don't take Banner holding the scepter as any type of revelation, I take it as a guy who's uptight, aggravated and/or pissed off picking something up in the heat of the moment. When I get uptight, nervous or whatever, I pick up a baseball or even a bat that I keep laying around the house. The only time they really focused on the scepter "doing anything" (in the lab) was when they were arguing and Hawkeye was approaching. Right before the cut to the scepter (when it was making that noise) the bridge systems started reporting the virus. If the magic and influence is the back story or what Whedon intended it just wasn't translated well if at all.


Having said all of that, this conversation is all probably moot because there are apparently directors cut scenes that quite possibly explain all of this.
post #994 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Closet Geek View Post

Having said all of that, this conversation is all probably moot because there are apparently directors cut scenes that quite possibly explain all of this.

I had read that Whedon's initial cut was closer to 3 hours, and that basically all deleted footage will be included on the BD release.
post #995 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwebb1970 View Post

I had read that Whedon's initial cut was closer to 3 hours, and that basically all deleted footage will be included on the BD release.

I'd be curious to know if he considers the theatrical version as his director's cut or if he plans to revisit the editing room for the home video release.
post #996 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

I'd be curious to know if he considers the theatrical version as his director's cut or if he plans to revisit the editing room for the home video release.

I'm repeating myself, but he's stated the "director's cut" is the one shown in theaters.
post #997 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonwolf615 View Post

I'm repeating myself, but he's stated the "director's cut" is the one shown in theaters.

sorry I didn't know he already addressed the question.
post #998 of 1397
http://www.boxoffice.com/latest-news...midnight-shows

As of today:

"Disney reports that the domestic cume for Avengers is currently $270 million, while the international total is now $533.3 million. The worldwide gross is sitting pretty at $803.3 million."

post #999 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by daryl zero View Post

http://www.boxoffice.com/latest-news...midnight-shows

As of today:

"Disney reports that the domestic cume for Avengers is currently $270 million, while the international total is now $533.3 million. The worldwide gross is sitting pretty at $803.3 million."


So it will probably beat Avatar as the fastest movie to hit 1 billion worldwide. I think Avatar took 3 weeks.
post #1000 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg_R_STL View Post

So it will probably beat Avatar as the fastest movie to hit 1 billion worldwide. I think Avatar took 3 weeks.

THE AVENGERS opened on 4/25/12

AVATAR hit $1 billion worldwide 17 days after release.
post #1001 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by daryl zero View Post

http://www.boxoffice.com/latest-news...midnight-shows

As of today:

"Disney reports that the domestic cume for Avengers is currently $270 million, while the international total is now $533.3 million. The worldwide gross is sitting pretty at $803.3 million."


I see my going a second time last night gave them a good push.
post #1002 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

THE AVENGERS opened on 4/25/12

AVATAR hit $1 billion worldwide 17 days after release.

Avengers didn't open in the US until May 3/4. Was Avatar staggered too? Avengers might hit that 1 billion mark after this coming weekend. I'm not sure that Dark Shadows is going to do much to take away the Avengers' business.
post #1003 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by daryl zero View Post

Avengers didn't open in the US until May 3/4. Was Avatar staggered too? Avengers might hit that 1 billion mark after this coming weekend. I'm not sure that Dark Shadows is going to do much to take away the Avengers' business.

If you are counting the $1 billion worldwide mark, then you have to start when The Avengers first opened - 4/25/12 Australia. That current $800+ million includes all the box office revenues collected before it opened in North America on 5/4/12 which I think is around $270 million - not sure.

http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?pag...avengers11.htm

No Avatar did not have a staggered release. Opened worldwide starting 12/16/09 (12/18/09 in NA)

http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?pag...&id=avatar.htm
post #1004 of 1397
Silly argument. WHO CARES?! Both films are making the studios rich. Huge success. Nicely done.

of course, AVATAR sucks and AVENGERS rocks.
post #1005 of 1397
FWIW:


I watched a Real 3D presentation today.
3D effects were fairly good.

YAYS:
Excellently plotted out by JW.
Each of the Avenger members gets their day in the sun...no one get short shrift here.
Lots of action.
Lots of humor.

NAYS:
Superhero drama suffers from an overabundance of attempted humor (not all of it works); this is THE AVENGERS, not the Keystone Cops.
Also, the movie seemed a little long.

I won't say this is the best Marvel movie yet, but it very well could be.
post #1006 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens View Post

Silly argument. WHO CARES?! Both films are making the studios rich. Huge success. Nicely done.

of course, AVATAR sucks and AVENGERS rocks.

Not really arguing. I would love to see a Joss Whedon movie at 1 billion. Of course, the world might end when that happens.
post #1007 of 1397
Looking forward to watch this on Monday again. Had my little break
post #1008 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by daryl zero View Post

Not really arguing. I would love to see a Joss Whedon movie at 1 billion. Of course, the world might end when that happens.

An exclusive club - there have only been 11 movies that have grossed over $1 billion worldwide:

http://boxofficemojo.com/alltime/world/
post #1009 of 1397
Alice in wonderland??????
post #1010 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superman2 View Post

Alice in wonderland??????

No kidding. And two effing Pirates of the Caribbean movies? I guess it isn't really an exclusive club for auteurs, just money-makers. Avatar is 2.7 billion world-wide.
post #1011 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTyson View Post

Why do you highly doubt it can top the The Dark Knight domestically? It easily beat The Dark Knight to the $100 mill point, the $150 mill point, the $200 mill point and will beat it to the $250 million point by 2 whole days. It sold about 4 million more tickets opening weekend. It's getting strong word of mouth, amazing reviews, many people are planning on seeing it twice (or more, including myself), many people going haven't been to the cinema in years (myself included). Next weekend could be a $120+ million weekend if it has a 40% drop or less. That means by the end of the weekend it may have $390+ million in two week. Don't wanna jinx it though, but we shall see. Guess it depends how much business Dark Shadows brings.

It may not reach The Dark Knight domestically, but I think it'll reach #3 of all time worldwide behind Avatar and Titanic at the very least.

"Early indications from matinees is that Disney and Marvel's Avengers, which smashed its way to a record-shattering $207.4 million last weekend, will pull in another $85 million to $90 million in its second frame."

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...a-still-323622
post #1012 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by daryl zero View Post

No kidding. And two effing Pirates of the Caribbean movies? I guess it isn't really an exclusive club for auteurs, just money-makers. Avatar is 2.7 billion world-wide.

Well at least it's an exclusive club for entertaining movies and successful filmmakers.
post #1013 of 1397
Thread Starter 
Seeing this tonight, can't wait!
post #1014 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

"Early indications from matinees is that Disney and Marvel's Avengers, which smashed its way to a record-shattering $207.4 million last weekend, will pull in another $85 million to $90 million in its second frame."

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...a-still-323622

$29.1 Million vs Dark Knight's $23.2 on the second Friday. Though a few days during the week it did slip lower than The Dark Knight on those days for a few weekdays (probably because Dark Knight was out when school was out which aided it during the weekedays), but jumped back over it on Friday. It's really hard to tell sometimes where it's going. Being out when school is still in may hinder the Avengers a bit during the weekdays a bit.
post #1015 of 1397
Saw it for the third time today.
post #1016 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToddUGA View Post

Saw it for the third time today.

Will see it again tomorrow Todd. It has to be in 3D this time due to session times.
post #1017 of 1397
Was planning on just taking the wife to this but my 14 year old daughter actually wants to see this. She has not paid attention to any of the other Marvel movies but this has crossed over even into teenage girl world.
post #1018 of 1397
Thread Starter 
After the foundation was laid early on, the film got a little to weighed down for it's own good, imo. Right around the time I noticed this and started to get anxious over it, the film kicked back into gear and I forgot the "issue" almost immediately.

Hulk was a big surprise for me, not having seen either of the two previous films. Now I'm afraid to watch them because I don't see how they could live up to the Hulk from this movie. Also, I hope the rumors are true for a Ruffalo-Hulk film... I'd see that in the theaters for sure.

The writing was extremely impressive, but for once so was the CGI. So much CGI these days all looks the same, but in this film it was crisp and believable. When someone like hitchfan hates on the advent of CGI technology in films, it's movies like this that counter that argument perfectly. This just couldn't have been made without it, and it was done perfectly.

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Was anyone else genuinely sad when Agent Coulson died? I was surprised at how much impact it actually had on my viewing experience. Especially when Fury threw the blood-stained vintage collector cards out on the table. I mean, not 10-15 minutes ago the mention of those same cards were being used for comic relief, and Agent Coulson was a loveable doofus. Ugh, talk about an emotional punch to the gut in the middle of a fun, blockbuster popcorn flick. A testament to the characters and the writing, for sure.


Also, I have to say, the best moment of the film BY FAR was:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
...the dude playing Galaga! I totally thought Stark was just talking out of his rear-end to be funny. It completely threw me off guard when the agent actually pulled up the game and started playing haha... just a brilliant little gag.


Anyway, a great cinema experience and a good, fun movie for all ages. A solid 8.5 out of 10 for me, and a definite purchase.
post #1019 of 1397
Quote:


It turns out Disney-Marvel’s “The Avengers” won’t have to vacate any Imax houses this weekend after all.

Disney and Warner Bros. agreed Monday to evenly split digital Imax showtimes this weekend between “Avengers” and “Dark Shadows,” leaving the Marvel pic in all 275 digital-only Imax screens from which it collected a record-setting $15.3 million last weekend. Originally, “Avengers” was slated to lose 200 of those Imax locations to “Dark Shadows,” as dictated by a pre-existing, three-year pact inked between Imax and Warners in April 2010.

Prior to Monday’s agreement, “Dark Shadows” had secured 225 Imax locations all to itself from varying U.S. markets — though many of the top-grossing venues fell within the 75 screens that “Avengers’” was slated to retain. By sharing screens and staggering showtimes, “Dark Shadows” now has runs in all 300 Imax houses, with approximately 25 print-only locations to itself (“Avengers,” a digital-only release, couldn’t play in those.)

http://blog.bigmoviezone.com/?p=13869
post #1020 of 1397
Quote:
Originally Posted by lwright84 View Post


Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Was anyone else genuinely sad when Agent Coulson died? I was surprised at how much impact it actually had on my viewing experience. Especially when Fury threw the blood-stained vintage collector cards out on the table. I mean, not 10-15 minutes ago the mention of those same cards were being used for comic relief, and Agent Coulson was a loveable doofus. Ugh, talk about an emotional punch to the gut in the middle of a fun, blockbuster popcorn flick. A testament to the characters and the writing, for sure.

Actually lwright, (huge spoiler ahead for those who haven't seen the film, you've been warned! )
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
I felt the same way and I like his character from the beginning. But..............he's not dead. He will be back in Iron Man 3 apparently. We see him taken by paramedics and unconscious but we never see him "dead". And the fact that Fury makes up the story about the cards shows us that there's something we're not told about Coulson. After all, if he was really dead, maybe Fury who is his friend, out of respect, wouldn't have used him as an excuse to motivate the guys.
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