Official InFocus Sp8602 owners thread. - Page 61

Can the HC4000 compete with this projector ?

Would love to buy it, just looks so so so big!! lol is i as big as it looks ?

That's a silly question. lol
Quick answer would be HELL NO!!
These are at totally two different price points, in your neck of the woods you can get the SP8602 for a steal new if you look in the right places.

Take the HC4000 and multiply it by 2.5, that's the difference in size between it and the SP8602.

Yah, the hc4000 doesn't have the blacks that he sp8602 does, the higher native contrast of the sp8602 will also allow a more vivid look to colors, this has something to do with darker colors appearing more contrasty next to mid-level bright colors (scenes just above evening time brightness).

The sp8602 is also said to have abnormally vivid colors compared to some DLP's.

That said, I'm not sure in regular BRIGHT scenes the difference would be noticeable, I'd have to see it, the Mits is slightly sharper. I'll give credit where credit is due though, the higher native + IRIS on the sp8602 is going to beat the Mits handily in movies with dark scenes, without any problems at all.

Also, the Mits is only good for smaller screens unless you have really high gain, otherwise it gets too dim for my taste, but I use high gain screens so I'm not affected.

And finally, the SP8602 has the 6x color wheel, and the hc4000 only has a 4x color wheel.

I wouldn't count out the Mits hc7800 however, the initial Cine4 reports show some VERY positive information, including an extremely sharp lens that sounds like the focus uniformity might be fixed too (which could mean a projector nearly as sharp as a w6000, with better color, better blacks, a better IRIS, and the best 3d ever made).

I am pretty sure the hc7800 will easily beat every projector in 3D, it can do more lumens in 3D mode with less loss, people are saying 300-400 lumens, that is a crapload of 3d lumens, you could get 600 lumens to start with even at 1.5 gain for 3D!

I'd say that under most circumstances the 8602 would always beat the HC4000.

The one area it wouldn't do as well in, is my circumstance. It's really a matter of selecting the right PJ for your room, and the 8602 is really more of a big room PJ, it would be overkill in my room. I only have a 80" screen (67" wide), in a small room. The 8602, besides being HUGE, is also louder, and would be right above my head. Plus it would just be too bright for such a small screen. I'm already running a .9 negative gain screen on my HC3800 and it's still on the bright side.

Not to say the 8602 might still outperform my HC3800 (or HC4000), but it would be quite weird in my set up. The Mits is much smaller, quieter, and better suited for a smaller screen (than the 8602). With the 8602 in it's place I'd probably have to were sunglasses.

But on a larger screen and larger room, the 8602 should be better in all aspects except noise level.

I've seen both machines but in 2 very different setups.

The mits hc3800 was set up with a good calibration in a batcave where it looked really spectacular and made me wonder why spend more.

I then saw the SP8602 in a very poor room with a crap screen(4:3 format too!) with some serious sheen issues and the SP8602 was set in some wierd mode, maybe vivid or something similar and it looked, hmm, not so good. The sales person didn't know much about projectors either so I wasn't able to get a good demo at all.

I was actually put off by this demo and decided on demo'ing a JVC instead.

However, reading all the reviews and personal experiences I decided to order the SP8602 anyways!

I got a good deal on it and hope it will perform better in my room than the demo I got.

So I guess what I am saying is, a properbly setup Mits hc4000 will look awesome and I hope my forthcomming SP8602 will beat what I saw the mits do!

Not sure if you guys have paid attention, the 8602 uses an RGBRGB color wheel. The HC4000 uses a RGBWYC. Unless there's another color that starts with w that I've forgotten about, this is a white segment. Technically I don't see how they would compare in any scene. The white segment is used to boost brightness, the negative impact of this is a loss of color saturation. This type of color wheel is found more in presentation style projectors than home theater.

The 7800 probably uses a cw similar to the 8602. Which is a good thing!

SP8602 versus HC4000
I have been following this thread since the beginning and also the HC4000 threads. I had an Infocus 7205 that was dying in late 2010. I was very interested in the SP8602 and placed an order with AVS. There were numerous delays before the SP8602 ever shipped and my order was never filled. In early March I bought an HC4000. I use a 110 gray screen with 1.3 gain.

These are some of my observations about both projectors:
HC4000 has not required any firmware upgrades, SP8602 has had several.
SP8602, seems many have required repairs and had various failures. HC4000, I recall one post about a failure.
HC4000 requires at least an 8ft ceiling. SP8602 has lens shift, but for maximum brightness requires mounting in a specific sweet spot, somewhat negates lens shift.
HC4000 does not have an iris but many SP8602 owners have complained about the iris.
HC4000 small size and light weight make it easy to mount.
HC4000 is quieter that SP8602
Based on reviews and tests the SP8602 would produce a marginally better picture.
HC4000's value is far beyond its price. I use it about 1200 hours per year, after 2 years I can afford to replace it.

Marginally better image? Man are you kidding me? What have you guys been smoking? lol
What ever it is can I get some?

Lens shift is exactly that lens shift, it's clunky but works well

No mechanical issues with mine
Lamps can be replaced for under $200

Iris can be used in manual for those that desire it, when tuned properly the dynamic Iris works extremely well, better than not having one at all.

No Iris at all on DLP equals a washed out image in bright, medium and dark scenes.

Combine that with white segment color wheel, you are losing info in color, saturation,contrast and black levels.

It makes no sense to compare these two, no one in their right mind viewing both in the same environment would think the Mits IQ is better.

Last time I checked I didn't see Art on projector reviews comparing the Mits 4000 to the flagship JVCs..did I miss something in his reviews?

Some of the above I agree with by Joesyah, however a couple corrections:

The Mits hc4000 and hc3800 has a 6-segment RGB-RGB wheel, it does not have a white segment like some of the previous Mitsubishi DLP's did.

My source, Mitsubishi's web site below:
(http://www.mitsubishielectric.com/bu...me/hc4000.html)

Actually a projector with an IRIS in bright scenes would have no effect 90% of the time as the IRIS opens back up on any scenes above evening time brightness. If it did have an effect, then it would generally be an unwanted effect (usually). That said, that isn't a 100% rule, and all IRIS's work differently, so unless I tested the specific IRIS, I cannot say the exact effects. I have been analyzing IRIS's somewhat and trying to figure out their algorithms, it appears the most sophisticated IRIS's are based on chaotic algorithms of equations of derivatives. A chaotic algorithm doesn't mean exactly what it sounds like it means, it just means that the predicative values of reaction upon derivatives are long and partly theoretical formulas, rather than based on an exact math. That is why IRIS's are all over the place in how they function. Some IRIS's don't even use derivatives much, they use plotting or some much simpler math, and that is why they fail.

The Mits hc4000 is no slouch, but the sp8602 creams it in dark scenes, that's where the difference is, heck that's where the difference almost always is for all more expensive projectors. As far as color saturation and color vividness, I know for sure the sp8602 will have better color in evening-time brightness or darker, but I'm not sure in brighter scenes, and no-one can know that unless dual comparisons are made, they should be very close in bright scenes, but I expect the sp8602 to have slightly better color.

It also wouldn't surprise me if the sp8602 actually had slightly higher contrast in bright scenes, because even bright scene contrast isn't 100% translated from ANSI, and the 8602 is likely to maintain a very high ANSI just like the Mits but also the sp8602 will have a greater contrast across the range of scenes, in that sense it is possible to get ahead of the Mits in bright scenes a little, but it would not be night and day.

Go to features and spec's http://www.mitsubishi-presentations.com/hc4000/ . Mits goofed on the CW thing on one of these sites.

Generally 6-segment color wheels don't have a white segment on HT projectors, but I'm not 100% on that, but I'm pretty sure that the Mits hc4000 does not have a white segment in the color wheel.

Exactly, but presentation/ht projectors do sometimes have the white segment.

Yah, but the Mits doesn't have the white segment AFAIK, the lack of saturation is for other reasons, it's that the sp8602 might have better processing and a better color wheel even though they are both based on the same design. Even the internal lighting and contrast will have effects on the colors after the light goes through the color wheel.

It could actually have similar CW to the entry level Benqs? RGBCMY
I see it has adjustments for those colors separately, the same as the W1000, W1100 and W1200.
Not too mention, a variable in light engines used and the reduction of scattered light making huge differences in IQ.

Even the Benq w1000+ has no white segment in the color wheel, only the 1000 does as far as I know. The Mits does not have a white segment in the color wheel, even the specs say it doesn't, I don't know why it was misprinted, but I don't think even the Benq w1100 or 1200 has a white segment either, pretty much after the 1000 they stopped doing it.

I've never seen an HT projector with a 6-segment color wheel and a white segment on a recent model.

Lets put this to rest.

The HC3800/4000's do not have a white segment.

They both have RGBRGB CW's.

Every review I've read that mention segments mentions that.

Plus, FWIR, cine4home took apart the HC3800 (or 4000, can't remember) and it had a RGBRGB wheel.

Well, they goofed on that site

Is this a bluray, how would an update of a projector affect tearing of one movie, I don't follow...

Sounds like a bluray player issue or the movie was mastered poorly or burned incorrectly to disc.

Maybe mechanical components such as the focus motor introduce varied response.

Recieved my Infocus SP8602 yesterday and got it hooked up. Screen is arriving today so first impressions were on a white wall and bed sheet over my TV lol.

Even still, my wife got so caught up in Avatar that we ended up watching most of it even under these poor screen conditions.

I had it calibrated with ISF day and ISF night. Night mode is with Dynamic IRIS. ISF day is Iris full open. Both modes are with lamp in low.

I got a CalMan calibration report and it sure has changed the factory settings alot so I hope it was worth the extra $$

Well it looked great. Spend most time with the "ISF night" setting. I do notice the IRIS alot and tbh I might prefer it off. Still a bit to early to call judgement and I havent even seen it in action on a decent screen yet - for which it was calibrated as well.

It's very bright indeed, so bright infact that the text gets far to bright really. It's blinding in white scenes, flashlights etc.

So far very happy!

Here's a fun shot

If need be you can use the manual Iris settings. I had to make some adjustments to fine tune the Iris. On regular TV, I used the manual iris settings, on movies dynamic Iris. I found the projector and player set both to input and output (limited RGB) worked best with the Iris. Some found different results. You'll know when you've got it nailed. The Iris action with the majority of movies will become less noticeable.

You think it's bright now, wait till you get the screen up! lol

Have fun!

What was your old projector if you don't mind me asking, or is this your first?

Pretty fun to get in a new projector, whilst us JVC folks are stuck here waiting, waiting, and then waiting some more...

Talked with the person who calibrated it today and he is very helpful. He suggested I copy ISF night to "user" and then adjust as convenient. I'll try without the DI.

I also got the screen up last night. The screen itself seems very good, and totally dissapears leaving just the image there. It's a grey screen so to my eyes atleast, the blacks are good enough that other aspects of the image are more important to me.

Right now the color space is REC 709, I'm not sure about RGB? Using a PS3 at the moment, but considering the oppo 93.

I've previously owned a Barco CRT, then a Sanyo Z3 afterwhich I gave up frontprojection. Since then I moved into a new house and got the "bug" again

Still a bit early to give final impressions, as I havent even watched a whole movie yet. We just got a baby boy as well, so not enough time to evaluate!

Oh wow, coming from those older projectors you should be absolutely blown away once you see some good content that shows the image off. Home projectors have improved so so much since those days, and the Infocus sp8602 is at the top of its game, so you really should enjoy it much more than those older ones.

I certainly already do. I've been to many demos as well though, so wasn't completely surprised to find it good and much better than my previous Z3.

Again, haven't spend enough time yet, but rented some new movies today so will watch those and just enjoy a full movie.

Picture is vibrant, sharp and bright. Star Trek looked amazing and the space shots are incredible. It really IS a good projector and a bargain price I got it for! I do feel fortunate right now.

Here the codes for ISF Day/Night settings

on Remote

up/down/up/down then Select

a very simple code.

Hope, anyone found the Service code or ISF code

Ah cool. I managed to copy ISF night to user and can modify as needed with that. I can then disengage the DI and tweak as I like.

It throws an amazing picture to be honest and can't wait to watch some more movies!

Recently watched "Paul" and the pictures was razor sharp and popped right into my living room. By my estimates I think I have atleast 20 fl, which isnt too bright even. I guess I like it bright

What sharpness setting does people with this projector prefer?

And what does flesh tone correction actually do?

/claus