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The Official KDL....EX700 Thread - Page 12

post #331 of 3673
3/6/10 at 7:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post

Here's a video from Asia explaining the UV2A.

http://www.diginfo.tv/2009/09/30/09-0298-r-en.php

Sharp explains it here also:

http://sharp-world.com/corporate/news/090916.html

Sharp does not address these as sub pixels at all - they are addressed as LCD Molecules. BTW - It doesn't matter how one arranges the RGB it's still RGB - rearranging the letters in an acronym does nothing to alter the end result. Sharp has RGB"Y" now but it doesn't matter where you place it either as it doesn't change what it does.

Based on these notes (that I have read before), I don't think we have seen any UV2A produced panels yet. It will be really obvious if they use it with the new Sharp panels with RGBY because there will be a yellow pixel in there.
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post #332 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:01pm
this is as good as I can get it. I was hoping to see some of the wires connecting the sub pixel thingies to help narrow it down but no good.

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post #333 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecraw View Post

Based on the panel size (55") and the way those look. 4 sub-pixels in a squarish bottom with two closely followed sub-pixels with only 2 apparent sub-pixels. I think it is one of the sony/samsung s-pva panel types or the auo a-mva panels. Sony and Samsung both use AUO panels in their smaller LCDs. I would be surprised to see them use an AUO panel in 55" but it really looks like that to me now.

It looks like on the 55EX501 it has the 4 sub-pixels and the squarish bottom has 4 areas that change light (see blue on the right side and also the green on bottom right has one quarter darker, three quarters light). The upper ones seem to have only 2 areas, the bottom one 4 areas? Not sure what that means though.
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post #334 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TVVQ View Post

Yes. Each "pixel" has 4 elements in both the EX500 and EX700. But a "real pixel" (a TV has 1920*1080 of those) has 9 of those "pixels" in the EX500 and 6 of them in the EX700. Please try to see that already

Edit: Actually 2 out of 3 "pixels" only have 2 elements instead of 4 in that panel. So I hope you see that the EX500 and EX700 are different now?

I see what you are saying. You are saying an actual pixel with all RGB elements combined. We don't actually know how many of these are combining to create a pixel by looking at them. You would have to measure and calculate. It could be that a row of rgb units and their subpixels could be one "real" pixel or it could be more than that. How they are aligned at the micro level doesn't matter because you cannot see that. It is how they are grouped and controlled. They may be related but they don't have to be.

I do agree now, photo quality or not that they are different just based on it being a 55" panel which sharp does not usually produce. I think it is an AUO panel from Taiwan.
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post #335 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:04pm
An UV2A panel dosen't have to have RGBY 4 pixels.
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post #336 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:04pm
So it does look like EX501 has different panel as was said. Not sure what type then, but interesting to see the differences.
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post #337 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holy bear View Post

An UV2A panel dosen't have to have RGBY 4 pixels.

I agree but what I am saying is the RBGY panel will be so new it will probably be made with the uv2a process so we will know something about that process when we see the pixels from a panel with rbgy pixels. We can then, perhaps, correlate that to newer panels that are only RGB.
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post #338 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwb1921 View Post

So it does look like EX501 has different panel as was said. Not sure what type then, but interesting to see the differences.

I wouldn't buy a 55" because I suspected they would be s-pva or mva and I already have a 52" one and the clouding/flashlighting is bad in dark scenes in a dark room. no problem the rest of the time though.
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post #339 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecraw View Post

I see what you are saying. You are saying an actual pixel with all RGB elements combined. We don't actually know how many of these are combining to create a pixel by looking at them. You would have to measure and calculate. It could be that a row of rgb units and their subpixels could be one "real" pixel or it could be more than that. How they are aligned at the micro level doesn't matter because you cannot see that. It is how they are grouped and controlled. They may be related but they don't have to be.

I do agree now, photo quality or not that they are different just based on it being a 55" panel which sharp does not usually produce. I think it is an AUO panel from Taiwan.

Cool. I was only trying to show that the EX700 and EX500 are different. The EX500 layout does look like AUO with a little bit different spacing. Would be interesting to see if the other sizes have different panels. Hopefully not though.
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post #340 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecraw View Post

I wouldn't buy a 55" because I suspected they would be s-pva or mva and I already have a 52" one and the clouding/flashlighting is bad in dark scenes in a dark room. no problem the rest of the time though.

On my EX501 there is no clouding/flashlighting. My 55V5100 did have some. The EX501 has better blacks and better picture overall than the V5100 it has replaced. I am very impressed with it. I was thinking if bad I would get the 52" EX701 from Costco but I am very happy with it. A big improvement over the 55V5100. That's why I thought maybe the panels were the same (EX700/EX500).
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post #341 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TVVQ View Post

Cool. I was only trying to show that the EX700 and EX500 are different. The EX500 layout does look like AUO with a little bit different spacing. Would be interesting to see if the other sizes have different panels. Hopefully not though.

It is a bit frustrating to me as a consumer because all of these panels have different characteristics and performance and it really is like a dog's breakfast on some of these models where they have 2-3 different manufacturers of panels based on size of the TV. I shouldn't have to know or care about this but it matters, especially if you want to play games on the TV.
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post #342 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:22pm
Yea this is all for fun, none of it would make a difference when choosing a TV for me. Even if the pixels were made of Smurfs if it looks good, it is good enough..

Now to start looking for this awesome Smurf TV I heard about.
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post #343 of 3673
3/6/10 at 8:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwb1921 View Post

On my EX501 there is no clouding/flashlighting. My 55V5100 did have some. The EX501 has better blacks and better picture overall than the V5100 it has replaced. I am very impressed with it. I was thinking if bad I would get the 52" EX701 from Costco but I am very happy with it. A big improvement over the 55V5100. That's why I thought maybe the panels were the same (EX700/EX500).

That is good to hear. The panel on my Toshiba is a S-LCD made by the samsung/sony plant. It has the chevron type pixels. These panels are notorious for the clouding flash-lighting complaints and I have them too. Maybe AUO does a better job. They ship 20% of all the panels in the world and are really, really common below 40".

I also have a 32" panasonic with the ips-alpha panel in my office for my computer and it is great. no complaints!
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post #344 of 3673
3/6/10 at 11:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecraw View Post

That is good to hear. The panel on my Toshiba is a S-LCD made by the samsung/sony plant. It has the chevron type pixels. These panels are notorious for the clouding flash-lighting complaints and I have them too. Maybe AUO does a better job. They ship 20% of all the panels in the world and are really, really common below 40".

I also have a 32" panasonic with the ips-alpha panel in my office for my computer and it is great. no complaints!

I could not afford the 60" EX700 and I did not want to go smaller than 55" when I returned my 55V5100. That's why I gave the 55EX501 a try (wished they would have had a 55EX700/701). If it had the same look as the 55V5100 I would have gone down to the 52" EX700/701. Glad it worked out for me, now maybe the 60" EX700/701 will be something I look at in a year when hopefully I can afford it (and move the other TV to another room).

Thanks for all the discussion on the panels. It was very interesting to see what has changed in the last year even though we do not have all the answers.
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post #345 of 3673
3/7/10 at 1:20am
This has been really fascinating to see the difference in these panels, thanks!

If these aren't uv2a, then they're something from Sharp that may be a newer version of their x-gen line.
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post #346 of 3673
3/7/10 at 5:27am
Do we have pics of the 46" EX500-501? This was the size i'm most interested in, I'm wondering if it uses the same panel as the EX700?
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post #347 of 3673
3/7/10 at 3:05pm
I was wondering if an owner of an EX700 model can tell me if there is any lag when playing video games. Preferably Call of Duty MW2. Is there any so called lag when playing the game? Any delay in button presses? How is the picture? I am looking into getting a 60 inch version. I primarily play the XBOX 360 version. But i gues it wouldnt matter which system you played it on. If there is a lag or delay in frame rates it would be evident on any sytem. Im looking forward to hear from you guys.
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post #348 of 3673
3/8/10 at 6:10am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopesun View Post

I was wondering if an owner of an EX700 model can tell me if there is any lag when playing video games. Preferably Call of Duty MW2. Is there any so called lag when playing the game? Any delay in button presses? How is the picture? I am looking into getting a 60 inch version. I primarily play the XBOX 360 version. But i gues it wouldnt matter which system you played it on. If there is a lag or delay in frame rates it would be evident on any sytem. Im looking forward to hear from you guys.

I play COD MW2 all the time on my 60EX700. On PS3, but I'm sure it's not a big difference. I experience no lag at all, I do play in High Motionflow mode though as I felt that made it flawless.

I'm not sure if the professionals would agree since they have a more discerning eye, but to me, an average user, the game looks better on this TV than I've seen on any other. Colours are great, contrast, everything.

No delay in button presses either.
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post #349 of 3673
3/8/10 at 8:38am
Try the TV settings as AUTO1 with game mode turned on, this should inherently turn off motionflow automatically. That is what lag free feels like. Its the same with all 4 of my Sony LCDs. Game mode really makes the game feel as if there is no lag between the game and the TV.
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post #350 of 3673
3/8/10 at 8:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2K8CivicSI View Post

I play COD MW2 all the time on my 60EX700. On PS3, but I'm sure it's not a big difference. I experience no lag at all, I do play in High Motionflow mode though as I felt that made it flawless.

I'm not sure if the professionals would agree since they have a more discerning eye, but to me, an average user, the game looks better on this TV than I've seen on any other. Colours are great, contrast, everything.

No delay in button presses either.

Thanks for the response. i wonder what the input lag is all about then? Do you connect the PS3 through HDMI? Also, do you connect to a surround sound receiver? I'm pretty much dead set on this TV. Im just waiting a bit to see it in action at a local store. Thanks again...
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post #351 of 3673
3/8/10 at 9:00am
There has to be at least 1 frame of delay before a frame is displayed on screen if you have motionflow turned on.
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post #352 of 3673
3/8/10 at 9:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JacobC1983 View Post

Try the TV settings as AUTO1 with game mode turned on, this should inherently turn off motionflow automatically. That is what lag free feels like. Its the same with all 4 of my Sony LCDs. Game mode really makes the game feel as if there is no lag between the game and the TV.

I dont even kow if this set has a game mode. I checked sony style and could only see Theatre Mode, Scene Select : Auto, Cinema, Sports, Photo, Music, Game, Graphics, OFF , Picture Mode : Vivid, Standard, Custom, Cinema, Game-Standard, Game-Original, Graphics, Sports, Photo-Vivid, Photo-Standard, Photo-Original, Photo-Custom.
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post #353 of 3673
3/8/10 at 9:22am
It has it. I am positive of it.
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post #354 of 3673
3/8/10 at 9:38am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopesun View Post

Thanks for the response. i wonder what the input lag is all about then? Do you connect the PS3 through HDMI? Also, do you connect to a surround sound receiver? I'm pretty much dead set on this TV. Im just waiting a bit to see it in action at a local store. Thanks again...


Honestly? The first I ever heard of input lag was while I was reading about it on this site. I'll assume it's a problem with LCD displays. This is my 2nd LCD display that I've owned and I've played games on many others but I had never noticed any kind of "input lag."

Maybe it's a problem for hardcore enthusiasts, but coming from an average guy, I've never noticed it. Now I can tell that there's a difference between when the Motionflow is off and when it's on, to me, it looks better when it's on. Maybe the worse difference with motionflow off is what input lag is, but if I didn't have something better to compare it to, I'd probably never notice what I was missing.

Anyway, yes, the PS3 is hooked up via HDMI 1.3.
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post #355 of 3673
3/8/10 at 9:43am
Someone help me decide...

KDL-40EX700 or UN40B6000 ???

I know this is a SONY thread but please try to be as fair as possible to the Samsung.

Most of my use is just TV watching and DVD \\ Blue Ray Movies, no gaming.

Thanks in advance...
Jimmy
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post #356 of 3673
3/8/10 at 10:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecraw View Post

I agree but what I am saying is the RBGY panel will be so new it will probably be made with the uv2a process so we will know something about that process when we see the pixels from a panel with rbgy pixels. We can then, perhaps, correlate that to newer panels that are only RGB.

There is no correlation other than the fact that the RGBY panels will also have UV2A.

UV2A has absolutely nothing to do with the pixel structure. UV2A is implemented on the transparent alignment layer and will be invisible (transparent, get it?) to the eye.
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post #357 of 3673
3/8/10 at 11:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post

Here's a video from Asia explaining the UV2A.

http://www.diginfo.tv/2009/09/30/09-0298-r-en.php

Sharp explains it here also:

http://sharp-world.com/corporate/news/090916.html

Sharp does not address these as sub pixels at all - they are addressed as LCD Molecules. BTW - It doesn't matter how one arranges the RGB it's still RGB - rearranging the letters in an acronym does nothing to alter the end result - it's the same technology no matter how you rearrange the letters or perhaps misspell something doesn't alter Technology one iota. Sharp has RGB"Y" now with the new XGEN Panel but it doesn't matter where you place the "Y" either as it doesn't change what it does.

UV2A and 4 color are not the same except that, like all Sharp panels going forward, the 4 color panels will have a UV2A alignment layer.

The 4 color panels will have RGBY and they do have a distinctive pixel structure.

Attachment 169372
LL
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post #358 of 3673
3/8/10 at 2:16pm
For those of you trying to decide between an ex500 and an ex700, like I am, here is a comparison someone did in the ex500 thread.

Just passing along the info...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post18271659
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post #359 of 3673
3/8/10 at 2:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrunner01 View Post

Someone help me decide...

KDL-40EX700 or UN40B6000 ???

I know this is a SONY thread but please try to be as fair as possible to the Samsung.

Most of my use is just TV watching and DVD \\ Blue Ray Movies, no gaming.

Thanks in advance...
Jimmy

Anyone?

Also It seems from reading some posts in this forum the Sony's are also a hit and mis with the flashlighting found in the Samsungs?

Thanks in advance...
Jimmy
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post #360 of 3673
3/8/10 at 2:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrunner01 View Post

Anyone?

Also It seems from reading some posts in this forum the Sony's are also a hit and mis with the flashlighting found in the Samsungs?

Thanks in advance...
Jimmy

Both are edge-lit LED so the same issue would apply. Now that said, if u absolutely have to pick one of the 2, if i were u, i'd come to a Costco and pick up the Sony 40EX700. You will have 90 days return policy plus if u keep it, the warranty is 3 years (4 years if u pay with AMEX i believe). The Sammy you listed is last year's model, so unless there is a bargain you can get, it wouldnt make as much sense.
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