AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › The Official Panasonic G20/25 Owner's Discussion Thread [no price talk]
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

The Official Panasonic G20/25 Owner's Discussion Thread [no price talk] - Page 11

post #301 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

G20/25 reference settings have been posted

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1232441

Nice! Man you weren't kidding about the gamma in custom mode...is there any situation at all where you'd recommend custom over thx considering thx puts out a lot more light this time?
post #302 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank D View Post

Can the G20 do 96 hz to avoid judder?

Nope. The G20, like the G10, is limited to 48 fps when viewing 24fps film source in direct cinema (not the right words) mode. Viewing this way gets rid of the slight judder from 60 FPS w 3:2 pulldown, so you get perfectly smooth motion, but some people see flicker when the screen is running at 48fps. It's important to emphasize the "some." I regularly screen PAL DVDs in native mode on my 10 year-old Panny plasma, which means I'm watching them at 50 fps. I occasionally notice the flicker, but it doesn't bother me. (People in Europe have been watching all their TV at 50 fps forever.)

The alternative with a G20 is to watch at 60fps with 3:2 pulldown, which is the way we all watched movies before BluRay - and is the way 90% of people watch BluRay today.

If you want 96fps with film (which you can think of as 4:1 pulldown) you'll have to go to a V20 or V25.
post #303 of 8511
Hmm when I'm checking the number of hours on my set it gives me something like 24832:00 ... how do I read that?
post #304 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismayscareyou View Post

Hmm when I'm checking the number of hours on my set it gives me something like 24832:00 ... how do I read that?

413 hours I think
post #305 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by peters_john View Post

The reason to create a wireless bridge using an old WRTG54 router is that it is cheaper than buying a wireless adapter. In order to do so you will need to buy a new router and follow one of the many DIY guides available online. Once you turn the router into a bridge, you connect up to 4 devices to it using ethernet cables and you are good to go.

IE you can have the bridge sitting in your TV rack connect via wires to your Blu-Ray player, TV, and TiVO. It then connects all of those products wirelessly to your home network. The beauty of it is that anything you plug into the bridge thinks its attached to a wired network.

Thanks for your response! I really appreciate your help on this!

Pat
post #306 of 8511
No problem Pat. If you need help finding a good article, let me know and I can point you in the right direction.
post #307 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericthemidget View Post

413 hours I think

That's what it seemed like to me too, but I've only had the set since last Friday so it can't have more than probably 120 hours...
post #308 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

G20/25 reference settings have been posted

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1232441

So I looked over the setting and being new to the Plasma World it is a pinch confusing but I will figure it out. But my question is, are these the best setting to go with right out of the box (literally)? Do I need to do any kind of break in period or anything along those lines?

Thanks!
post #309 of 8511
Why anyone would purchase a set before greater than 1000 hour black level measurements are made? For such a large purchase, I'd want to make sure that Panasonic's supposed improvements to the MLL algorithms are working.
post #310 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred69 View Post

Why anyone would purchase a set before greater than 1000 hour black level measurements are made? For such a large purchase, I'd want to make sure that Panasonic's supposed improvements to the MLL algorithms are working.

Maybe they want a TV.
post #311 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by barrist View Post

Maybe they want a TV.

Right but there are a lot of tvs out there. Since black level issues are not considered a warranty issue, if this does happen to you outside of the return window, then you are stuck. It would take 41 days running the unit day and night to get to the 1000 hour mark.

This happened to me on my S1 2009 Panasonic. It's really irritating. My only hope is that there is a firmware fix or a panel exchange for affected customers.
post #312 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismayscareyou View Post

That's what it seemed like to me too, but I've only had the set since last Friday so it can't have more than probably 120 hours...

Mine reads 5632:40 and I've only had it for two days, so that can't be in minutes. Did you figure out how to convert that number?
post #313 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcoakley View Post

Mine reads 5632:40 and I've only had it for two days, so that can't be in minutes. Did you figure out how to convert that number?

Still trying to figure it out. Mine's up to 26112:40 now.
post #314 of 8511
the settings that were posted for the g20/25 can you use then right away ? or do i have to follow panasonics 100 hour break in procedure first that they emailed me ? thanks
post #315 of 8511
You got a break in procedure from panasonic?
post #316 of 8511
yes i did . some say you dont have to do anything . some say you do . who knows . so whats the answere to the post
post #317 of 8511
I called Panasonic a few days ago about Netflix and Skype being missing from Vieracast. The guy I talked to said that they aren't scheduled for release until June 1st...
post #318 of 8511
I didn't do any break in i am gonna be watching everything in zoom for a while though and hope for the best

damn no netflix till June 1? Good thing I have my ps3
post #319 of 8511
New Plasma owner here and a complete novice, too. I received my 50G25 last wednesday and it is pretty amazing, much better than my previous lcd's. My only question is, is it possible to reset the service menu settings? I don't want to mess with that stuff unless I know there's a way to reset the whole thing.
post #320 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by burgerdog View Post

New Plasma owner here and a complete novice, too. I received my 50G25 last wednesday and it is pretty amazing, much better than my previous lcd's. My only question is, is it possible to reset the service menu settings? I don't want to mess with that stuff unless I know there's a way to reset the whole thing.

No you can't reset it. Just make sure you right down any value you change before you change it.
post #321 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by gbmannc View Post

No you can't reset it. Just make sure you right down any value you change before you change it.

Alright, thanks.
post #322 of 8511
I recently had the opportunity to check out the new Panasonic G25 along with the S2 at Cleveland Plasma. I was impressed with Panasonic's models last year, after they got the THX color decoding issue fixed. I continue to hear rumors about Panasonic hiring Pioneer's techs and using Kuro technology, but for now, the V10 is doing a good job holding us over. Could the G25 either bring us one step closer to the mighty Kuro, or at least give equivalent performance to the V10 at a lower cost?

One thing I noticed right away, before even turning the G25 on, is that the screen looks nice and dark. The feature list proudly includes what Panasonic calls "infinite black", and I have to say it does an outstanding job staying black in bright rooms. Because it's so dark, it does a good job of muting reflections. It is still possible to see glare in the G25's screen in a bright room, but it's much less distracting than I normally expect from a plasma. When it's turned on, the G25's blacks are dark for a plasma, but definitely not infinite black. The G25 does not have the internal reflection that causes the odd "double image" look on the V10 when looking from off axis. While I always felt that effect was more of a curiosity than a serious issue on the V10, nevertheless it's good that the G25 seems to have been engineered without the optical gap that caused it in other models.

The G25 is THX certified, so instead of a cinema mode there is THX mode. THX mode's color gamut is, by design, much closer to the HDTV standard than the other modes (and most other TVs). With the exception of the previously mentioned THX issue that was resolved by Panasonic last year, I have been a big fan of THX modes in most displays because of the natural color and detail. However, light output has always been the limiting factor: THX modes have had intentionally limited light output, with the idea being that if you truly care about an accurate picture, you'll be watching it in a dark room. I usually end up calibrating THX as a night mode, and then using custom mode for brighter daytime viewing. While the color isn't quite as accurate in custom mode, it can look much more acceptable when the TV isn't the only source of light in the room.

The G25 has an option for displaying a 1080P/24 signal at either 48 Hz or the conventional 60 Hz. 48 Hz has some advantages in theory, but I couldn't get past the severe flicker I saw with it engaged.

I began by measuring the performance in various modes as they come from the factory. I noticed right away that standard mode had an unacceptable graininess to the image. Attachments 1-3 show the performance in custom, standard, and THX. Custom and standard show severe problems with gamma and other more typical problems. THX mode looked good, though it needs calibration for the white balance to avoid looking a little drab and off-white. THX mode put out a surprisingly strong 46 fL of light with a small 100% white window, which is much higher than I routinely get from THX modes in other displays. Also, the contrast was set to 60 in THX mode, meaning that there is a chance even higher light output could be possible.

As I began calibrating THX mode, I found that yes, it was possible to get gloriously bright images even in THX mode on the G25! This is the first THX certified plasma I have worked with to allow such flexibility, and it's a very nice treat. Taking the contrast up to 68 brought the light output up to 56 fL, which allowed me to match it's peak brightness to the S2 sitting beside it. It appeared to have room to go higher if desired with minimal to no consequences like white crush or gamma issues.

Having finished the THX mode calibration in the service menu, I moved on to custom mode. Now that THX is bright enough for a typical room, there is less need for separate day and night modes, but it would still be nice to have an alternative that is fairly accurate. Unfortunately, no matter what I tried in the service menu or the advanced user menu, I could not get custom mode's gamma to be acceptably accurate. That type of an inaccuracy will cause a clayface or caked on makeup look on brightly lit faces, and it will also reduce the sense of depth and naturalness. For the best, most accurate image on the G25, THX mode must be used.

Resolution was good with 1080P and 720P, but a little soft with 1080i. There was a slight shadow around some lines in the sharpness test pattern regardless of where the sharpness control was set. It looks like the opposite of edge enhancement. I have seen this on some other Panasonic plasmas, but not all.

ANSI contrast measured 1663:1, and black level measured .0083 fL with my Trichromat-1 colorimeter, which is more accurate and reliable at very low light levels than either the Chroma5 or i1Pro. The rest of the calibration was done with the i1Pro, since it is better with everything else besides the very dark readings.

Looking at some familiar Blu Ray material, the G25 produced a great picture! Flesh tones were very good, though possibly just a tiny bit redder than I normally see in THX modes. I'm splitting hairs with that call, though. Contrast was very rich with lots of pop, and shadow detail looked good even though the measurements suggested they were a bit emphasized. The picture had a sense of razor sharpness and good depth. I did get a slight impression of artificial enhancement that I normally do not get in THX mode, but I believe that it was just due to the fact that I had calibrated THX mode to a higher light output than is normally possible; and higher light output, in addition to raising contrast, can give the impression of added sharpness and detail.

Since a calibrated S2 was sitting right beside the G25, I was able to make comparisons between the two. Though I couldn't have them both on at the same time, I was able to switch from one to the other quickly. Room lighting was dark, and I used demo material from DVE and The Dark Knight Blu Rays. Both displays were calibrated to the same light output with a 100% white window.

With both sets turned off and the lights on, the S2's screen looked significantly milkier. The S2 picked up more visible reflection as a result. It was much harder to see my reflection in the G25 than in the S2.
Image quality was good on both, but had two very different perspectives. The S2's color was pleasing but less rich; the G25's colors looked more like how I know that material to look on reference grade displays.
The G25 looked more "contrasty", slightly richer, and slightly sharper. The S2, in comparison, looked very good but a little less exciting. There were a few occasions where I thought I detected some flashlighting or pumping in the G25, but not the S2. My overall impression was that the G25 is much more the Videophile's TV; it's accurate, and if that accuracy shows up flaws in the picture chain, that's the price you pay for having such a revealing display. On the other hand, the S2 is much more Everyman's TV; it's pleasant, looks very good, and never fails to impress your friends and family, but it's not quite being truly faithful to the image.

Overall I was quite impressed with the G25. The darker screen, higher light output in THX mode, very accurate colors, and good contrast and "pop" make it an outstanding plasma.

 

Pan G25 before standard.pdf 160.208984375k . file

 

Pan G25 before custom.pdf 156.724609375k . file

 

Pan G25 before THX.pdf 147.7734375k . file

 

Pan G25 after THX bright.pdf 144.2294921875k . file
post #323 of 8511
chad b . hi . could you pass along the settings you have your g25 set at in the thx mode ? im going to be getting the g20 and it would be a big help if you could . thanks
post #324 of 8511
@chad b
1st thanks for great reviews
Which are Brighter in vivid mode?g10 or g25?
post #325 of 8511
I ended up very close to default settings in THX mode. I went in to the service menu and adjusted the white balance and brightness, so the results you get will not be the same.
Any way, FWIW, I ended up with 68,54,49,0,35. I will not post the changes I made in the service menu since it will vary from one sample to another, and is best done with a meter and other test equipment.
I am not sure which is brighter in Vivid mode. Vivid is the least accurate mode to use, so I hardly ever mess with it.
post #326 of 8511
Hi Chad.

I am most interested in Blu-ray content with the G25. You said that the 48 Hz setting has pretty severe flicker. How is the 60 Hz setting? Is flicker still noticeable, or is it subdued enough to not be a deal breaker?

I only own a 27" CRT, so plasma is new to me. But I am concerned about watching Blu-ray movies as that will likely be my primary use for the 50G25.

Thanks.
post #327 of 8511
If anyone would care to share how they judge the G20/G25 handles less-than-pristine 480i source material, I'd appreciate it -- especially in regard to if there have been any significant improvements from the G10. I'm looking at a 42-inch (or possibly 46-inch, when released) G25 at the moment, and while I plan to use the clearQAM capabilities often, I expect that I'll be watching my cable company's SD content quite a bit as well, so any insight here (especially since my limited research on this seems to indicate that Samsung has held an edge in SD processing in the past) would be helpful.

Thanks to all for a very informative thread.
post #328 of 8511
hi, does any one know if it is possible to adjust the brightness in the thx mode and if so how would you do it ? i dont know much or anything about plasmas or calibrating just want the best picture for day and nite veiwing . thanks
post #329 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad B View Post

I ended up very close to default settings in THX mode. I went in to the service menu and adjusted the white balance and brightness, so the results you get will not be the same.
Any way, FWIW, I ended up with 68,54,49,0,35. I will not post the changes I made in the service menu since it will vary from one sample to another, and is best done with a meter and other test equipment.
I am not sure which is brighter in Vivid mode. Vivid is the least accurate mode to use, so I hardly ever mess with it.

The brightness control on these panels is interesting. If you set them to what a pluge pattern says it should be at, black levels can, and will, float with content. Did you make a compromise on the G25? I know my brightness settings is a compromise as the correct value should be 62 in THX mode (set with a Accupel 4000 and verified with AVS709 and S&M). 59 with my settings stops the floating blacks and minimizes the black crush between the 0 and 4% stimuli levels.
post #330 of 8511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad B View Post

I ended up very close to default settings in THX mode. I went in to the service menu and adjusted the white balance and brightness, so the results you get will not be the same.
Any way, FWIW, I ended up with 68,54,49,0,35. I will not post the changes I made in the service menu since it will vary from one sample to another, and is best done with a meter and other test equipment.
I am not sure which is brighter in Vivid mode. Vivid is the least accurate mode to use, so I hardly ever mess with it.

Chad,

What size windows did you use to get the 56ftL? Were they about the same size as the AVSHD709 windows for Calman?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Plasma Flat Panel Displays
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › The Official Panasonic G20/25 Owner's Discussion Thread [no price talk]