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The Official AVS TiVo "Series4" Premiere topic - Page 71

post #2101 of 3305
But you need the Desktop software to initiate a transfer, right? It just goes directly from one TiVo to another?
post #2102 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

EXCEPT the DESKTOP with PC Never Sees 1080i Video.

Video quality is reduced to the PC.

The PC Transfer is Slow as H-LL because of the video conversion.
Where would the video quality be shown?
post #2103 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Possumgirl View Post

But you need the Desktop software to initiate a transfer, right? It just goes directly from one TiVo to another?

YES - TiVo to TiVo
post #2104 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Possumgirl View Post

But you need the Desktop software to initiate a transfer, right? It just goes directly from one TiVo to another?
From what I see on the web site, first answer is no and second answer is yes. The web site also mandates wired connections for streaming so don't trust everything you read there.
post #2105 of 3305
I often record on one and watch on another Premier. Have no Series 3 experience, but I understand that the S3's network capability is poor (s-l-o-w).
I am running Wireless-N (5-GHz) to my three Premiers, and they are the ONLY devices on that network. My wireless access point is in fairly close proximity to the Premiers (about 35ft max, and through one or two walls) and I get very good network speeds to them. I can start watching a show on one unit that was recorded on another, and within 2 minutes or so I can "30-sec jump" through commercials. I almost never use FF on the TVo's, ever. I do often use the "15-min" jump however.

You can also just "transfer" the show from one TiVo to another. This takes me about 20 minutes for an hour-long show. No PC is required to do this.

I have only transferred shows to PC once or twice when I first got the TiVo's, mostly just to prove that it worked. I don't recall that it was "slow as H-LL", but I can't say for sure. I also don't recall that there was a reduction in video quality, but again I can't say for sure. When I do this type of transfer, the transfer may be to a hardwired computer, or to a computer on the Wireless-N (2.4GHz) side of my network. The router handles everything to get the TiVo's on the "N" side to communicate with everything else on the rest of the Network.
Edited by WS65711 - 1/26/13 at 12:30pm
post #2106 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by WS65711 View Post

I have only transferred shows to PC once or twice when I first got the TiVo's, mostly just to prove that it worked. I don't recall that it was "slow as H-LL", but I can't say for sure. I also don't recall that there was a reduction in video quality, but again I can't say for sure.

There is NO reduction in quality when transferring to a PC. This is because TiVos don't have the horsepower to convert the video on the fly. The exact recording is transferred with a DRM wrapper (which can easily be removed to have the pure mpeg-2 video). The only caveat is if the cable company sets the CCI byte which will restrict the recordings you are allowed to transfer (generally this is just premium channels).
post #2107 of 3305
^^
Ok. Just to be clear, I didn't say there was a reduction in quality. Someone else said that. I just said that I didn't remember noticing a reduction in quality, if there was one. smile.gif
post #2108 of 3305
^^ And your transfer rate of 20 min for 1 hour of 1080i is about right too. This is what the web site indicates for the Streamer to a iPad.
post #2109 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Possumgirl View Post

But you need the Desktop software to initiate a transfer, right? It just goes directly from one TiVo to another?
Using a wired network.
The Premiers' transfer speed to PC is 40Mbps -- that is >2X the bitrate of any recording. Premier to Premier is faster because between TiVo's they transfer the transport stream as it is stored on the disk and don't have to mux the output into an MPEG-2 file like they do for PC transfer. The TiVo HD transfer speed to PC is much slower -- 10-14 Mbps -- which will bottleneck a Premier <--> TiVo HD transfer to the lower speed. You cannot watch a TiVo HD based transfer as soon as you start the transfer (except ABC), you have to give it some initial transfer time.

You do not need TiVo Desktop software running on a PC to transfer between TiVo's -- the two functions are unrelated. You do not even need TiVo Desktop software to transfer from TiVo to PC if you elect to use kmttg instead; there is also a direct FTP method. TiVo Desktop has value in that the Desktop server runs in the background and will automatically transfer series recordings to PC if you are collecting. It will also "publish" PC folders to your TiVo so they are available to you in the TiVo playlist. A Tivo could be set to record a series; Tivo Desktop could be set to automatically transfer each recording of the series as soon as it is recorded to your serving PC; TiVo Desktop can publish those recordings so they can be accesses by any other TiVo in your household.

More options:
Tivo is not limited to playing .tivo files. It will play .VOB files (from DVD) and .mpg files (HD/5.1). You can rip movies or TV episodes from your DVD's as single .VOB files; store them on your TiVo Desktop server and have them available to all your TiVo's for transfer and playback from your TiVo playlist. You can transfer TiVo HD/5.1 recordings to your PC then edit out commercials with Video ReDo and save them as .mpg files; then store them on network storage where they can be published by TiVo Desktop to be accessed by your TiVo's or shared by Windows so they can be accessed by any media players on TV's without a TiVo -- whole-house media. If you don't need two TiVo's but occasionally need more than two tuners, you can buy an inexpensive PC tuner (I have the dual-tuner HD Homerun) to record the overflow, then edit commercials and save to .mpg and publish for transfer/playback on your TiVo.

When you went from the DHG to a TiVo you acquired a very sophisticated piece of kit with far more capability than the DHG ever had, beyond DVR functionality, due to TiVo's network capability. Right now people are into nit-picking minor capability differences and ways of doing things. Once they get over this and get into the network features, they will find a whole new world of capabilities the DHG could never provide. The first post of this thread has a lot of information that is still relevant and answers a lot of these things.
post #2110 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by atmusky View Post

You have to have an active subscription on all Premieres for Streaming and/or transfering programs between them to work. Assuming you have subs on both units both steaming and transferring will work with OTA content TiVo refers to transferring of a program as Multi-room viewing.

Most likely too costly for me.

So with that said; is there a very cheap way to get recorded shows from “one” TiVo to any HD TV in the house or at least “one” other HD TV?

Like maybe using an HDMI switcher? And how long can the run be? Etc.
post #2111 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Using a wired network.
The Premiers' transfer speed to PC is 40Mbps -- that is >2X the bitrate of any recording. Premier to Premier is faster because between TiVo's they transfer the transport stream as it is stored on the disk and don't have to mux the output into an MPEG-2 file like they do for PC transfer. The TiVo HD transfer speed to PC is much slower -- 10-14 Mbps -- which will bottleneck a Premier <--> TiVo HD transfer to the lower speed. You cannot watch a TiVo HD based transfer as soon as you start the transfer (except ABC), you have to give it some initial transfer time.

You do not need TiVo Desktop software running on a PC to transfer between TiVo's -- the two functions are unrelated. You do not even need TiVo Desktop software to transfer from TiVo to PC if you elect to use kmttg instead; there is also a direct FTP method. TiVo Desktop has value in that the Desktop server runs in the background and will automatically transfer series recordings to PC if you are collecting. It will also "publish" PC folders to your TiVo so they are available to you in the TiVo playlist. A Tivo could be set to record a series; Tivo Desktop could be set to automatically transfer each recording of the series as soon as it is recorded to your serving PC; TiVo Desktop can publish those recordings so they can be accesses by any other TiVo in your household.

More options:
Tivo is not limited to playing .tivo files. It will play .VOB files (from DVD) and .mpg files (HD/5.1). You can rip movies or TV episodes from your DVD's as single .VOB files; store them on your TiVo Desktop server and have them available to all your TiVo's for transfer and playback from your TiVo playlist. You can transfer TiVo HD/5.1 recordings to your PC then edit out commercials with Video ReDo and save them as .mpg files; then store them on network storage where they can be published by TiVo Desktop to be accessed by your TiVo's or shared by Windows so they can be accessed by any media players on TV's without a TiVo -- whole-house media. If you don't need two TiVo's but occasionally need more than two tuners, you can buy an inexpensive PC tuner (I have the dual-tuner HD Homerun) to record the overflow, then edit commercials and save to .mpg and publish for transfer/playback on your TiVo.

When you went from the DHG to a TiVo you acquired a very sophisticated piece of kit with far more capability than the DHG ever had, beyond DVR functionality, due to TiVo's network capability. Right now people are into nit-picking minor capability differences and ways of doing things. Once they get over this and get into the network features, they will find a whole new world of capabilities the DHG could never provide. The first post of this thread has a lot of information that is still relevant and answers a lot of these things.

So, just to be clear, I can transfer content between TiVos; I can watch immediately, during or after the transfer. FF and skip work as they normally do provided there is buffer.

What hasn't been answered is: Can I transfer copy-protected content between Tivos? I ask this because I CAN'T transfer copy-protected content from a TiVo to Tivo desktop or Ktmmg, at least not simply.
post #2112 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

So, just to be clear, I can transfer content between TiVos; I can watch immediately, during or after the transfer. FF and skip work as they normally do provided there is buffer.

What hasn't been answered is: Can I transfer copy-protected content between Tivos? I ask this because I CAN'T transfer copy-protected content from a TiVo to Tivo desktop or Ktmmg, at least not simply.

No, you can't transfer copy flagged content BUT you can stream copy flagged content between two premieres.
post #2113 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson

If you don't need two TiVo's but occasionally need more than two tuners, you can buy an inexpensive PC tuner (I have the dual-tuner HD Homerun) to record the overflow, then edit commercials and save to .mpg and publish for transfer/playback on your TiVo.

Thanks for the detailed explanation on transferring between units and the options available. I hadn't really looked into the HDHomerun, but that may turn out to be the right option for my needs. We'll see after the last DHG is laid to rest. wink.gif

BTW, I have read the first post (twice at least). Great info there but it can't cover all the questions we newcomers think of. smile.gif
post #2114 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

So, just to be clear, I can transfer content between TiVos; I can watch immediately, during or after the transfer. FF and skip work as they normally do provided there is buffer.

What hasn't been answered is: Can I transfer copy-protected content between Tivos? I ask this because I CAN'T transfer copy-protected content from a TiVo to Tivo desktop or Ktmmg, at least not simply.

1.) You can Transfer content between TiVo's to watch later. You may be able to watch this content from the destination TiVo during transfer.. not sure, never done it that way.
2.) You can watch "server" TiVo content immediately on the "client" TiVo, but that content is not actually saved to the hard drive on the client TiVo while you're watching it.
3.) Yes, FF and skip work during the second scenario.
4.) I dunno.
post #2115 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aero 1 View Post

No, you can't transfer copy flagged content BUT you can stream copy flagged content between two premieres.

Thanks, that's what I was looking for. As long as the fast forward and skip work well, it will suit my needs. I just don't want a fast forward that is like one gets on VOD- slow to act and fast forward is not very fast.
post #2116 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

Thanks, that's what I was looking for. As long as the fast forward and skip work well, it will suit my needs. I just don't want a fast forward that is like one gets on VOD- slow to act and fast forward is not very fast.
With a wired Ethernet or MoCA connection the (MRS) Multi-Room Streaming between Premieres is almost identical to the performance you would experience on the originating TiVo Premiere. A wireless connection can be a bit jerky with FF, and may not even work especially with 2.4GHz N, 5GHz N works much better, but not as good as wired.
post #2117 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

Thanks, that's what I was looking for. As long as the fast forward and skip work well, it will suit my needs. I just don't want a fast forward that is like one gets on VOD- slow to act and fast forward is not very fast.

When using MRS (streaming) between Premiere's, trick play functionality is not as smooth as playing it from the local box but it isn't bad. It certainly isn't delayed. The only issue I've noticed is the video isn't as smooth when fast forwarding/rewinding as local content. But that is to be expected.
post #2118 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

With a wired Ethernet or MoCA connection the (MRS) Multi-Room Streaming between Premieres is almost identical to the performance you would experience on the originating TiVo Premiere. A wireless connection can be a bit jerky with FF, and may not even work especially with 2.4GHz N, 5GHz N works much better, but not as good as wired.

Thanks guys. I have MOCA so it sounds like it will work well. Now I just have to run down a used Elite/XL4.
post #2119 of 3305
TiVo Premiere 4/XL4 & Stream Bundles

Refurbished Premiere XL4 & Stream Bundle - $399.99
New Premiere 4 & Stream Bundle - $299.99

http://www.woot.com/offers/tivo-premiere-dvr-stream-bundle
post #2120 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Which would you be more ticked off at -- missing the first couple minutes or missing the last minute where you find out who the killer is or whether or not they hopped into bed together? I can figure out what happened in the first 2 min by the first commercial; I would be way more ticked off if I watched for an hour and missed the punchline. IMHO TiVo got it right.

For me either. I don't clip anything. If I miss the first couple of minutes or the last couple of minutes I don't want to watch the program. I will end up getting it from Amazon or VUDU. I've always had my TiVos set to not record the lower priority. And I make lower priority shows the ones that are repeated throughout the week, like cable shows. While I have shows that only have one showing, like the broadcast networks, set at a higher priority. This has worked very well for me with my TiVos since 2001.
post #2121 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

TiVo Premiere 4/XL4 & Stream Bundles

Refurbished Premiere XL4 & Stream Bundle - $399.99
New Premiere 4 & Stream Bundle - $299.99

http://www.woot.com/offers/tivo-premiere-dvr-stream-bundle

Is the stream still Apple only or is it finally working with Android devices?
post #2122 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Using a wired network.
The Premiers' transfer speed to PC is 40Mbps -- that is >2X the bitrate of any recording. Premier to Premier is faster because between TiVo's they transfer the transport stream as it is stored on the disk and don't have to mux the output into an MPEG-2 file like they do for PC transfer. The TiVo HD transfer speed to PC is much slower -- 10-14 Mbps -- which will bottleneck a Premier <--> TiVo HD transfer to the lower speed. You cannot watch a TiVo HD based transfer as soon as you start the transfer (except ABC), you have to give it some initial transfer time.

You do not need TiVo Desktop software running on a PC to transfer between TiVo's -- the two functions are unrelated. You do not even need TiVo Desktop software to transfer from TiVo to PC if you elect to use kmttg instead; there is also a direct FTP method. TiVo Desktop has value in that the Desktop server runs in the background and will automatically transfer series recordings to PC if you are collecting. It will also "publish" PC folders to your TiVo so they are available to you in the TiVo playlist. A Tivo could be set to record a series; Tivo Desktop could be set to automatically transfer each recording of the series as soon as it is recorded to your serving PC; TiVo Desktop can publish those recordings so they can be accesses by any other TiVo in your household.

More options:
Tivo is not limited to playing .tivo files. It will play .VOB files (from DVD) and .mpg files (HD/5.1). You can rip movies or TV episodes from your DVD's as single .VOB files; store them on your TiVo Desktop server and have them available to all your TiVo's for transfer and playback from your TiVo playlist. You can transfer TiVo HD/5.1 recordings to your PC then edit out commercials with Video ReDo and save them as .mpg files; then store them on network storage where they can be published by TiVo Desktop to be accessed by your TiVo's or shared by Windows so they can be accessed by any media players on TV's without a TiVo -- whole-house media. If you don't need two TiVo's but occasionally need more than two tuners, you can buy an inexpensive PC tuner (I have the dual-tuner HD Homerun) to record the overflow, then edit commercials and save to .mpg and publish for transfer/playback on your TiVo.

When you went from the DHG to a TiVo you acquired a very sophisticated piece of kit with far more capability than the DHG ever had, beyond DVR functionality, due to TiVo's network capability. Right now people are into nit-picking minor capability differences and ways of doing things. Once they get over this and get into the network features, they will find a whole new world of capabilities the DHG could never provide. The first post of this thread has a lot of information that is still relevant and answers a lot of these things.

Your speeds should be faster. My speeds to my TiVo Desktop machine are between 70Mb/s and 75Mb/s. I can be transferring concurrently from my two Elites and my two Tuner Premiere and the transfer rate into my TiVo desktop machine will be around 225Mb/s.
post #2123 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

Is the stream still Apple only or is it finally working with Android devices?
Apple iOS only still frown.gif
post #2124 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Which would you be more ticked off at -- missing the first couple minutes or missing the last minute where you find out who the killer is or whether or not they hopped into bed together? I can figure out what happened in the first 2 min by the first commercial; I would be way more ticked off if I watched for an hour and missed the punchline. IMHO TiVo got it right.

I would be somewhat ticked off if I missed anything. I watch a lot of PBS, where there is usually much padding at the end of the time slot and no last-minute nonsense. I'm used to things like the NewsHour or Charlie Rose being clipped as necessary at the end. Recently I've noticed the Premiere wanting to clip some shows at the beginning. Is it because I've switched (maybe temporarily) to the HDUI, or is it because they changed something in the latest software update? Maybe each season pass needs to have an option for clipping at the beginning or at the end (when needed).

I've also noticed the problem of missing episode numbers, recently mentioned in some TiVo Community Forum threads. Is that just missing guide data or is it a bug in the HDUI? I first assumed it was just the guide data, but now I'm not so sure.
post #2125 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by L David Matheny View Post


I've also noticed the problem of missing episode numbers, recently mentioned in some TiVo Community Forum threads. Is that just missing guide data or is it a bug in the HDUI? I first assumed it was just the guide data, but now I'm not so sure.

It started with a 2x4 being smaller. Then the foot-long subway is only 11". So losing information in the guide is just another cut-back. I do miss the episode numbers. Maybe that was the price for Tribune Media to get out of bankruptcy?
post #2126 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

It started with a 2x4 being smaller. Then the foot-long subway is only 11". So losing information in the guide is just another cut-back. I do miss the episode numbers. Maybe that was the price for Tribune Media to get out of bankruptcy?

From time to time episode numbers are crucial. I've recording some series out of order that have the same (limited) program information. So, it's really necessary to have the episode numbers to figure out the order to watch them. I hope this isn't permanent.
post #2127 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

From time to time episode numbers are crucial. I've recording some series out of order that have the same (limited) program information. So, it's really necessary to have the episode numbers to figure out the order to watch them. I hope this isn't permanent.

Yes, episode numbers are important. TiVo has traditionally erred on the side of caution by recording season pass shows with missing episode numbers, since the unit couldn't be sure that they were duplicates of shows already recorded. If episode numbers are frequently missing, this will result in many duplicate recordings. Worse yet, if TiVo ever stops being that cautious, the result could be many missed recordings.
post #2128 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

From time to time episode numbers are crucial. I've recording some series out of order that have the same (limited) program information. So, it's really necessary to have the episode numbers to figure out the order to watch them. I hope this isn't permanent.
Since Zap2It uses TMI also and they have Season and Episode number, I hope it's a temporary TiVo problem.
post #2129 of 3305
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

From time to time episode numbers are crucial. I've recording some series out of order that have the same (limited) program information. So, it's really necessary to have the episode numbers to figure out the order to watch them. I hope this isn't permanent.
In the information screen you can find the original air date. Alternatively, go to TV.com and look up the series -- in the episode guide you can match up the episode title with the episode number.
post #2130 of 3305
Whats odd is why Tivo sometimes show the episode number(actually probably the majority of the time) but other times like with Castle they don't confused.gif
I also frequently look at the OAD(original air date) which isn't always shown but the vast majority of the time it is although if they are showing episodes out of order(like Castle and Body of Proof like to) then OAD is really of no help.
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