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The Official AVS TiVo "Series4" Premiere topic - Page 94

post #2791 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by jreink01 View Post

. . . . I just ignore it. I am still getting upcoming programming, probably because its only been a day since canceling the service, I am wondering if this also could be the reason why the clock is still correct also?? If anyone can shed some light on this, it would be greatly appreciated.

I predict it will stop functioning as a recording device soon after your return period has expired.
post #2792 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by jreink01 View Post

..... I figured paying 15.00 monthly was just too much . . .

I am in total agreement with you. Fifteen dollars a month from now to eternity is just way to much. Just go ahead and get lifetime and be done with it!
post #2793 of 3301
Tivo and the cable and satellite companies have us trained well to pay DVR service fees.

In other countries, there are no such fees or they're minimal at best.
post #2794 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by WS65711 View Post

I am in total agreement with you. Fifteen dollars a month from now to eternity is just way to much. Just go ahead and get lifetime and be done with it!

The break even point (monthly fees vs. lifetime) is just shy of 3 years, IIR my pre-purchase cypherin' correctly. Of course that didn't include the initial 3 "free" months. So if you're planning on keeping it longer than 3 years, lifetime is the way to go, otherwise go monthly and endure the 1 yr commit.
post #2795 of 3301
Except that you need to remember that newer TiVo's with Lifetime have a high resale value. Those without Lifetime, not so much....
post #2796 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

The break even point (monthly fees vs. lifetime) is just shy of 3 years, IIR my pre-purchase cypherin' correctly. Of course that didn't include the initial 3 "free" months. So if you're planning on keeping it longer than 3 years, lifetime is the way to go, otherwise go monthly and endure the 1 yr commit.

The break even point for a lifetime TiVo is actually much less if you factor in the amount if money you get when selling the TiVo to upgrade to the next generation of TiVos.
post #2797 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by jreink01 View Post

Why pay 15.00 a month just to be able to record a show/movie. I do not/need all the extras that some might like. I only want the dvr feature that allows it to record, just like what a vcr does, thats it, and I don't feel that I should have to pay a service for that.The reason I might keep it is if I can continue to record manually or not. This morning, I did unplug the tivo for about 4 hours and when I plugged it back in, the time was correct, I'm just wondering if this will keep for the upcoming months or if it is still going off of the last connection to tivo central, too early to tell. And about Charles comment about it complaining, it does say at the top that there is a problem with the connection, please check, I just ignore it. I am still getting upcoming programming, probably because its only been a day since canceling the service, I am wondering if this also could be the reason why the clock is still correct also?? If anyone can shed some light on this, it would be greatly appreciated.

Yeah I'll shed some light - return the box while you still can. You pay for a subscription to record stuff because Tivo doesn't make money on the hardware, they make it on hardware + subscription (think cellphone business model). The only way you can use an unsubbed Premiere is as a Cablecard or OTA STB for live TV only, it will not work over the long term as a DVR.

You picked the wrong box, so get rid of it and find some crappy DVD recorder instead, or buy that equally crappy Channel Master OTA/QAM DVR. There is no cheap HD DVR option in the Cablecard or OTA world now.
post #2798 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post


The break even point for a lifetime TiVo is actually much less if you factor in the amount if money you get when selling the TiVo to upgrade to the next generation of TiVos.

 

This is very true. In my case (a dozen or so units over the years) if you upgrade the hard drive you can often recoup most if not all of your money (including the cost of the new drive).

post #2799 of 3301
The fact that a used TiVo with lifetime commands such a premium speaks to the fact that they are solidly built and last a long time.
post #2800 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

Yeah I'll shed some light - return the box while you still can. You pay for a subscription to record stuff because Tivo doesn't make money on the hardware, they make it on hardware + subscription (think cellphone business model). The only way you can use an unsubbed Premiere is as a Cablecard or OTA STB for live TV only, it will not work over the long term as a DVR.

You picked the wrong box, so get rid of it and find some crappy DVD recorder instead, or buy that equally crappy Channel Master OTA/QAM DVR. There is no cheap HD DVR option in the Cablecard or OTA world now.

jreink: This is solid feedback IMHO--as a TiVo newbie, you'd be well advised to follow slowbiscuit's guidance on this issue.
post #2801 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

Yeah I'll shed some light - return the box while you still can. You pay for a subscription to record stuff because Tivo doesn't make money on the hardware, they make it on hardware + subscription (think cellphone business model). The only way you can use an unsubbed Premiere is as a Cablecard or OTA STB for live TV only, it will not work over the long term as a DVR.

You picked the wrong box, so get rid of it and find some crappy DVD recorder instead, or buy that equally crappy Channel Master OTA/QAM DVR. There is no cheap HD DVR option in the Cablecard or OTA world now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chi_guy50 View Post

jreink: This is solid feedback IMHO--as a TiVo newbie, you'd be well advised to follow slowbiscuit's guidance on this issue.

Three Thumbs Up...smile.gif
post #2802 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

You picked the wrong box, so get rid of it and find some crappy DVD recorder instead . . .
@jreink01
Here's a link to one of those: http://www.avsforum.com/t/940657/magnavox-537-535-533-515-513-2160a-2160-2080-philips-3576-3575/0_100#post_12244086
Relatively cheap and functional as a digital VCR -- no frills, just basic recording and playback.
post #2803 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

Tivo and the cable and satellite companies have us trained well to pay DVR service fees.

In other countries, there are no such fees or they're minimal at best.
The price of a new Tivo with lifetime is around the same price as most of those DVR's. Tivo gives you the option (which is a poor decision in the long-run) to pay by the month instead. Like Kelson and Slowbiscuit mentioned, you can always go the dvd-recorder route. The Magnavox units sold at Walmart are probably the best non-Tivo or Media Center recording devices currently available in the USA.
post #2804 of 3301
The signal strength meter is still messed up on the TiVo Premiere. I cannot check the signal strength on the antenna input or the cable connection, including clear qam. And it is also bricked in the DVR diagnostics menu. It stays on the same number for all channels. They supposedly have been notified about this bug created from a previous firmware update, but no correction as of yet. Over a month and very frustrating.
post #2805 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

The signal strength meter is still messed up on the TiVo Premiere. I cannot check the signal strength on the antenna input or the cable connection, including clear qam. And it is also bricked in the DVR diagnostics menu. It stays on the same number for all channels. They supposedly have been notified about this bug created from a previous firmware update, but no correction as of yet. Over a month and very frustrating.

The Signals shown in the DVR Diagnostic menu should be correct as long as you have not used the signal meter since a reboot.
post #2806 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

The signal strength meter is still messed up on the TiVo Premiere. I cannot check the signal strength on the antenna input or the cable connection, including clear qam. And it is also bricked in the DVR diagnostics menu. It stays on the same number for all channels. They supposedly have been notified about this bug created from a previous firmware update, but no correction as of yet. Over a month and very frustrating.

Not that I am excusing the bug, and i would lime it to work also, but why do you constantly need to check signal strength? Do you have reception issues? If you don't and everything works, why the constant checking?
post #2807 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aero 1 View Post


Not that I am excusing the bug, and i would lime it to work also, but why do you constantly need to check signal strength? Do you have reception issues? If you don't and everything works, why the constant checking?

I agree that the bug should never have happened and reflects on the lack of testing by TiVo. Its function is a diagnostic tool. I hope to never need it. I have two cable drops into my house, one for the TiVo and cable modem, and one for everything else. The TiVo, TV, two other DVRs and the cable modem all agree that I have a SNR about 36-37db. No PQ problems, but I do know if something is wrong I can probably trust the readouts. I also have a fixed FM antenna that measures a 50db SNR. When a storm blows through it might drop and I can hear the change. The meter only confirms what I hear, and the TiVo diags would only confirm what I would see. That said, the post was made by someone with a rotor and stations that are in different directions. It would seem the rotor control doesn't display the direction or it can't be seen. No matter, if I lost a tool I would be upset also. But my eyes and ears are still my best tools.

 

I could give examples of where diagnostics have helped identify a problem and where they were useless. But you get the idea.

post #2808 of 3301
Signal Strength Meter Bug

Use the DVR Diagnostic Page in lieu of Signal Strength Meter because of the current software bug that locks it up.

If the Signal Meter is Locked Up, then do the “unplug reboot” and do not use the Signal Strength Meter again or it will just Lock Up again. Use only the DVR Diagnostic Page until the Bug is Fixed.

If you have OTA Signal Issues then the DVR Diagnostic Page is the “only” way to fly because it provides 4 levels of critical signal data for BOTH tuners at the same time. The Signal Strength Meter cannot do that anyway.
post #2809 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonPerson View Post

Signal Strength Meter Bug

Use the DVR Diagnostic Page in lieu of Signal Strength Meter because of the current software bug that locks it up.

If the Signal Meter is Locked Up, then do the “unplug reboot” and do not use the Signal Strength Meter again or it will just Lock Up again. Use only the DVR Diagnostic Page until the Bug is Fixed.

If you have OTA Signal Issues then the DVR Diagnostic Page is the “only” way to fly because it provides 4 levels of critical signal data for BOTH tuners at the same time. The Signal Strength Meter cannot do that anyway.
But the problem is, when the signal meter locks up, so do the readings on the DVR Diagnostics page. But, perhaps if I reboot, and go to the Diagnostic page first, it will provide a correct signal reading without locking up. But they still need to get this fixed.
post #2810 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aero 1 View Post

Not that I am excusing the bug, and i would lime it to work also, but why do you constantly need to check signal strength? Do you have reception issues? If you don't and everything works, why the constant checking?
I have problematic reception issues with one distant channel that used to come in good, but now drops out. So I periodically switch antennas and preamps in the attic. And one local clear qam cable channel constantly pixelates and drops out, despite a dist amp that Charter installed. So I would like to have a working signal meter before I pay for a cable tech to come out. All the other clear qam locals work fine, so I think they need to boost the power on that channel from the street.
post #2811 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

The Signals shown in the DVR Diagnostic menu should be correct as long as you have not used the signal meter since a reboot.
Well, if this is indeed correct, it is a solution to the problem. Will unplug and reboot, and use Diagnostics menu only. Hopefully no more lock ups this way. Plus more detailed information. But, one thing for sure, the Premiere does not handle error correction or multipath as well as other tuners. Will not receive signals from the back or side of antenna like my Samsung, ePVision, or DTVPal tuners.
post #2812 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post


I have problematic reception issues with one distant channel that used to come in good, but now drops out. So I periodically switch antennas and preamps in the attic. And one local clear qam cable channel constantly pixelates and drops out, despite a dist amp that Charter installed. So I would like to have a working signal meter before I pay for a cable tech to come out. All the other clear qam locals work fine, so I think they need to boost the power on that channel from the street.

You are making the conclusion that the problem channels are due to a problem on your end. If you can record the problem, and document the low signal level, it should be enough to get this issue resolved. My "local" broadcast HD channels for NBC and CBS suffered from really bad "streaking" and some audio dropouts. I first recorded the problem and then watched the signal strength which showed NO variations. I confirmed with another nearby user that they experienced the same issue. The signal problems were on my clear QAM and analog mirror channels also. We contacted the headend and reported our problem. In a few days they found a bad fiber optic "box" used to receive those channels. Since the problem was very sporatic it was hard to track down and the diags in my equipment were of no use. But it was repeatable and recordable. Since I am cable only and my headend is fiber or satellite only, I can't help with the OTA issue. It's a shame you don't have a second opinion from another device. For cable, the RS corrected and RS uncorrected are probably the most important numbers for a digital signal. They should be zero.

 

I don't know a whole bunch about cable hardware, but I doubt there is any control over an individual channel at your cable drop. There might be interference. My headend sends fiber to a junction over a mile from my place where it changes to actual cable.

post #2813 of 3301
The signal strength on the local clear qam cable channel is apparently to low on the NBC affiliate, as the other clear qam locals are fine. As far as the OTA problem, it is a weak distant signal from a low power translator. I used to get it reliably at a very low signal strength, just barely above the digital cliff. But some sort of local interference has started blocking the signal. I think it may be when a local nearby strong signal recently increased power and is now drowning out the weak signal in the preamp.
post #2814 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

You picked the wrong box, so get rid of it and find some crappy DVD recorder instead . . .
@jreink01
Here's a link to one of those: http://www.avsforum.com/t/940657/magnavox-537-535-533-515-513-2160a-2160-2080-philips-3576-3575/0_100#post_12244086
Relatively cheap and functional as a digital VCR -- no frills, just basic recording and playback.
.
You need some SLEEP Old Buddy! biggrin.gif

On 7/30/13 at 11:18am, you pointed him back to the thread where this all began on 7/26/13 at 12:06am:
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jreink01 View Post

Hello all. I am new to this forum so please bear with me. I just purchased the tivo premier which I like but I hate that I have to pay a monthly subscription. I am thinking about returning it (I have 30 days). I was looking at the magnavox 533 dvr dvd recorder. I have a couple questions which I'm hoping you guys could answer for me. Right now I just have over the air channels. My cable provider in my area is charter and they told me that they are in the process of scrambling all the cable channels so if I do decide to get cable I would have to get a cable box, which is not a problem because when I had cable in the past, I've always had a box. My question is, will this 533 box be able to record cable channels (if I decide to get cable in the future) with these channels scrambled?? I would think that it would work if I were to hook up this box after my cable box, right, or is there another way of hooking this up to where I could record cable tv? Thanks for any and all feedback.
post #2815 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

You are making the conclusion that the problem channels are due to a problem on your end. If you can record the problem, and document the low signal level, it should be enough to get this issue resolved. My "local" broadcast HD channels for NBC and CBS suffered from really bad "streaking" and some audio dropouts. I first recorded the problem and then watched the signal strength which showed NO variations. I confirmed with another nearby user that they experienced the same issue. The signal problems were on my clear QAM and analog mirror channels also. We contacted the headend and reported our problem. In a few days they found a bad fiber optic "box" used to receive those channels. Since the problem was very sporatic it was hard to track down and the diags in my equipment were of no use. But it was repeatable and recordable. Since I am cable only and my headend is fiber or satellite only, I can't help with the OTA issue. It's a shame you don't have a second opinion from another device. For cable, the RS corrected and RS uncorrected are probably the most important numbers for a digital signal. They should be zero.

I don't know a whole bunch about cable hardware, but I doubt there is any control over an individual channel at your cable drop. There might be interference. My headend sends fiber to a junction over a mile from my place where it changes to actual cable.

Yes, a Reed-Solomon error count of zero would be the ideal, but it is by no means the standard in my experience. As long as the RS numbers are relatively small (e.g., under 1K) and do not increase over time (i.e., while the tuner remains on a given frequency), they do not indicate cause for concern.
post #2816 of 3301
I thought it would be worth while to mention if anybody is interested in a new TiVo Premiere 4 or XL4, Amazon has them at a $100 or more dollars off retail. I wish I would have waited as I bought two for $189 each.
Premiere 4
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006L8TX94/ref=pe_211990_31565050_email_1p_1_ti
Premiere XL4
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005TI1ILS/ref=pe_211990_31565050_email_1p_0_ti
post #2817 of 3301
Clearing inventory ahead of the Roamio launch probably.
post #2818 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jed1 View Post

I thought it would be worth while to mention if anybody is interested in a new TiVo Premiere 4 or XL4, Amazon has them at a $100 or more dollars off retail. I wish I would have waited as I bought two for $189 each.
Premiere 4
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006L8TX94/ref=pe_211990_31565050_email_1p_1_ti
Premiere XL4
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005TI1ILS/ref=pe_211990_31565050_email_1p_0_ti

Best Buy also has the tivo premier 4 for 100.
post #2819 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

Clearing inventory ahead of the Roamio launch probably.
I agree. That is what they did with the TiVo HD just ahead of the Premier. If one of the new unts has 4 OTA tuners, I will finally be tempted to upgrade my TiVo HD.
post #2820 of 3301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

Clearing inventory ahead of the Roamio launch probably.
I agree. That is what they did with the TiVo HD just ahead of the Premier. If one of the new unts has 4 OTA tuners, I will finally be tempted to upgrade my TiVo HD.

 

Start being tempted... shows here the basic Roamio will be for cable and OTA, others cable only.

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