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Vinyl Record Sales Rising

post #1 of 44
Thread Starter 
I thought this was cool.

Click link below to read more.

"Vinyl records and cassette tapes have enjoyed a resurgence in popularity, as more music fans ignore CDs and digital downloads, official sale figures suggest."]"Vinyl records and cassette tapes have enjoyed a resurgence in popularity, as more music fans ignore CDs and digital downloads, official sale figures suggest."
post #2 of 44
Hmmmm. I don't know if I trust that any currently heightened interest in it by the teenage or college crowd is necessarily going to result in any real long-lasting uptick in the industry in general, though. More likely to just be a "fad" for those types.

Once their parents and other family member's old, free and cheap turntables and cassette decks all break down, it'll probably be over for the most part. New turntables which are decent enough to give them an improved sound over mp3 aren't cheap.

You might get a certain number of those who's interest in vinyl carries over because they prefer the sound, but probably not a huge amount - especially once they go on and start getting wrapped up in more adult responsibilities. Certainly not more than the old aficionados who are dying off.

Now, if it were more mature adults fueling the so-called boom, I might be inclined to take it a little more seriously (and Eastern Asia doesn't count. Serious collectors over there have been hogging all this stuff up for awhile now like crazy).
post #3 of 44
The real road block to any vinyl comeback is software. Content content content! Are any major labels with large pop catalogs publishing any of that treasure trove on vinyl these days? Are a significant number of new releases being pressed on vinyl? Classical and Jazz labels will not sustain a resurgence in vinyl.

Sadly, the planet has voted and the masses would rather have their music convenient and easy to access rather than stunningly real. 128K bit rate music files are fine. TV speakers are fine. Earbuds are fine. HTIB is great! They don't care about SACD or DVDA. They don't know or care about Bluray or lossless audio codecs. Why would they care about vinyl? They wouldn't. This is either a fashion statement that will be over in 6 months or a really really small market of new fans. Either way, it's not sustainable for equipment makers, studios, or artists. You need a minimum critical mass (money) to keep it going.
post #4 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnefied View Post

Classical and Jazz labels will not sustain a resurgence in vinyl.

There is no new classical vinyl. Hasn't been any for years.
post #5 of 44
When the total sales are small to begin with, a large percentage sales increase sounds big but really is not.

I have about 80 albums....wanna buy 'em?
post #6 of 44
Thread Starter 
What's interesting are the limited edition new releases that are available which will often include exclusive tracks, booklets, and artwork exclusive to that pressing. A must-have for a collector or particular fan.



http://www.amazon.com/Heligoland-Bon...180944&sr=8-13
post #7 of 44
there is a surprising amount of pop/rock stuff on lp--norah jones, guns n roses, metallica, many many indie bands, u2, pearl jam-just to name a few. not so sure about the newest one hit wonders but the bands that care about sound and have some longevity seem to be pressing some vinyl. even my local best buys are carrying some vinyl titles and I live in the middle of nowhere.
post #8 of 44
The thing is, if you grew up with vinyl like me, I was always hoping for something better to come along. Alas, CD.

Now since it is somewhat of a niche product, this generation thinks it is cool and sounds better....bah humbug. MHO of course.

I just can't go back to the hiss, snap, crackle and pop of vinyl. Nor do I care for the highly compressed crap that most folks seem to listen to on their ipods and such.
post #9 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

There is no new classical vinyl. Hasn't been for years.

Didn't say there was. What I said was that Jazz & Classical music wouldn't sustain a market for vinyl. If Acoustic Sounds can be assumed to be a proxy for all the vinyl that's getting sold (they have a convenient search tool), then three categories of music make up roughly 3/4ths of the available titles. Classical and Jazz are a big part of that. I was actually amazed at the catalog of rock / pop titles but upon reflection, I guess I shouldn't be. Those categories have probably outsold all other categories combined by a 10 to 1 margin over the last 50 years.

Acoustics Sounds Search For Classical Music Yields.....
Vinyl - 2,488 titles
CD - 422
SACD - 1,939
DVDA - 128

Acoustics Sounds Search For Jazz Music Yields.....
Vinyl - 3,288 titles
CD - 575
SACD - 519
DVDA - 75

Acoustics Sounds Search For Pop / Rock Music Yields.....
Vinyl - 7,773 titles
CD - 227
SACD - 154
DVDA - 132

The other two categories in the top 5 are Soundtracks & Broadway. Oh joy.
post #10 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnefied View Post

Didn't say there was. What I said was that Jazz & Classical music wouldn't sustain a market for vinyl.

No argument. I was only adding a reason why.
post #11 of 44
Quote:


There is no new classical vinyl. Hasn't been for years.

Quote:


Acoustics Sounds Search For Classical Music Yields.....
Vinyl - 2,488 titles

So what are they selling—remainders?
post #12 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

So what are they sellingremainders?

Reissues.
post #13 of 44
I still have my old vinyl collection. Much of it is not in the best shape, a result of years of dorm misuse and abuse, although some of it was purchased post college and is probably in decent shape. I recently ran across my old turntable in the attic. I toyed with the idea of getting it down and plugging it up, decided no I won't. My wife wanted to put the albums on the curb and get rid of them!! She may still.

When I bought my Oppo BDP83 I started collecting a few SACDs (classical) and knew I had some HDCDs just by default. I bought a few more HDCDs from best buy, being mixed in with the normal ones. Seems mostly limited to acoustical types like Joni Mitchell, Neil Young, Stephen Stills.

It is sad that the standard today is redbook CD. I'm afraid anything better will be just be a fancy of a few. I'm still hoping for mass adoption of BD 3.0. Neil Young has most of his early works on BD. But I'd settle for HDCD, just something better.
post #14 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

New turntables which are decent enough to give them an improved sound over mp3 aren't cheap.


It does not matter how much you spend on a turntable, you will NEVER get sound as good as good MP3
post #15 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by NIN74 View Post

It does not matter how much you spend on a turntable, you will NEVER get sound as good as good MP3

Funniest thing I've read all day!
post #16 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by shane55 View Post

Funniest thing I've read all day!

What is funny is that vinyl lovers just will not admit that its not really an accurate medium whatsoever.

Its cool to like something but if SQ = Accuracy then Vinyl has LOW SQ.
post #17 of 44
Another major issue for neophyte or returning vinyl shoppers is that the remaining vinyl pressing plants are using machinery decades old, sometimes cobbled together to keep 'em up and running and the resulting lack of quality consistency is abundant.

Seems like half of the people I read about who are purchasing new vinyl are complaining that their album purchases are substandard in some way; warped, not centered correctly, noisy, etc. And the vinyls retailers either won't take vinyl back or they're only willing to allow a very limited number of return allowances as the record companies are not giving them any allowances or credits for bad vinyl.

A person who gets back into the new vinyl market must be prepared to endure a steady stream of frustration.
post #18 of 44
They made it sound in the article like these "new fans" are buying newer releases, but in the picture, it looks like they're rifling through used albums, so I'm not sure I know what to make of the article.

I have to laugh when I try to picture our youth of today attempting to deal with turntables and LP's at a drinking party. After a couple of parties, I can see them saying "Oh, **** it - just give me *** **** mp3 player".
post #19 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

What is funny is that vinyl lovers just will not admit that its not really an accurate medium whatsoever.

Its cool to like something but if SQ = Accuracy then Vinyl has LOW SQ.

I participated in most of the vinyl threads over the last year, year and a half. Funny, but I don't remember many of us who love vinyl professing that vinyl was more accurate than, CD, for example. But people, like you I guess, continue to bring it up, but that doesn't make it true. "most" of us simply stated that we like it for a variety of reasons. Nostalgia, we perferred the sound to what is coming out on CD these days, and to many of us vinyl was simply another option. It was in "addition" to CD, downloads, etc. Not a replacement for that media. So your posting that we just won't admit anything doesn't make what you say true. You participated in most of those threads as well and stated the same crap that you post now. It's not any more true now than it was then. We argued that CD was only as good as the master it was created from and that many of the vinyl albums seemed to be cut from superior masters and hence sounded better than their CD counterparts. Nobody, to my knowledge, ever argued that CD was not potentially a superior media, but that the industry these days didn't seem to be taking advantage of that superiority. Instead they compressed the shictk out of the music, going for pure loudness as we all know that loudness sells.

With all due respect, don't paint us vinyl lovers with the broad and inaccurate brush that you seem to be using. It's insulting and untrue.
post #20 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lhasa-lover View Post

I participated in most of the vinyl threads over the last year, year and a half. Funny, but I don't remember many of us who love vinyl professing that vinyl was more accurate than, CD, for example. But people, like you I guess, continue to bring it up, but that doesn't make it true. "most" of us simply stated that we like it for a variety of reasons. Nostalgia, we perferred the sound to what is coming out on CD these days, and to many of us vinyl was simply another option. It was in "addition" to CD, downloads, etc. Not a replacement for that media. So your posting that we just won't admit anything doesn't make what you say true. You participated in most of those threads as well and stated the same crap that you post now. It's not any more true now than it was then. We argued that CD was only as good as the master it was created from and that many of the vinyl albums seemed to be cut from superior masters and hence sounded better than their CD counterparts. Nobody, to my knowledge, ever argued that CD was not potentially a superior media, but that the industry these days didn't seem to be taking advantage of that superiority. Instead they compressed the shictk out of the music, going for pure loudness as we all know that loudness sells.

With all due respect, don't paint us vinyl lovers with the broad and inaccurate brush that you seem to be using. It's insulting and untrue.

I didnt make the silly comment , Im just replying with facts...that other guy that posted laughing is laughing for the wrong reasons. The fact is people post they liked the SQ of vinyl....SQ isnt subjective for me.

"sounded better" sounds like an subjective opinion to me. If its not as accurate it will not sound better in my opinion. Im happy you realize it has its flaws, Im also not saying anything about what you should enjoy either but again if someone is going to post online that "Product A is better then PRoduct B" they should be talking about the data and not their own subjective wants.

We all like something, I find no reason to post about that type of stuff online actually. These discussions go the same way everytime. I just want facts and science. Not concerned about subjective banter.



btw, I agree with your opinion on compression.
post #21 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

I didnt make the silly comment , Im just replying with facts...that other guy that posted laughing is laughing for the wrong reasons.

"sounded better" sounds like an subjective opinion to me. If its not as accurate it will not sound better in my opinion. Im happy you realize it has its flaws, Im also not saying anything about what you should enjoy either but again if someone is going to post online that "Product A is better then PRoduct B" they should be talking about the data and not their own subjective wants.

We all like something, I find no reason to post about that type of stuff online actually. These discussions go the same way everytime. I just want facts and science. Not concerned about subjective banter.



btw, I agree with your opinion on compression.

My disagreement with you isn't that vinyl does or does not sound better, regardless of whatever argument anybody presents. It's with your broad statement that "vinyl lovers" won't admit that it's an basically in inaccurate medium. We don't argue with that. At least "most" of us don't. Your brush is MUCH too broad. Many of us just like it better due to the compression/loudness issue. Well mastered CD's are very hard to find these days. So we "added" vinyl back into our choices. Not replaced.

On a personal level, I am a vinyl lover. And I freely admit that it is an inaccurate medium.

BTW apologies in advance if I have mistaken you for somebody else but if my memory serves me, aren't you the person who has often posted that music, to you, is really only background noise. You don't really listen, critically, to music much and MP3 and/or your ipod serves you just fine? If so then your statement: SQ isnt subjective for me. is rather silly. But maybe I've mixed you up with somebody else.
post #22 of 44
"better" can refer to either a subjective or objective assessment. To each his/her own...
funny how a "vinyl record sales rising" thread devolved into a which medium is better/mine is bigger than yours thread rehash within a few posts.

Obviously vinyl has its ups and downs--if you don't like it I can understand that but its sound is unique. Certaibnly flawed but for those used to (having grown up with) digital audio only the alternate type of sound and nostalgia factor are reasonable factors to account for the resurgance in sales and reissues.
post #23 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lhasa-lover View Post

My disagreement with you isn't that vinyl does or does not sound better, regardless of whatever argument anybody presents. It's with your broad statement that "vinyl lovers" won't admit that it's an basically in inaccurate medium. We don't argue with that. At least "most" of us don't. Your brush is MUCH too broad. Many of us just like it better due to the compression/loudness issue. Well mastered CD's are very hard to find these days. So we "added" vinyl back into our choices. Not replaced.

On a personal level, I am a vinyl lover. And I freely admit that it is an inaccurate medium.

BTW apologies in advance if I have mistaken you for somebody else but if my memory serves me, aren't you the person who has often posted that music, to you, is really only background noise. You don't really listen, critically, to music much and MP3 and/or your ipod serves you just fine? If so then your statement: SQ isnt subjective for me. is rather silly. But maybe I've mixed you up with somebody else.

Far enough, I will correct my statement in saying Im wrong about all vinyl lovers!

Im not sure why it matters how I choose to listen to my music. Its never background noise for sure though but I choose to not sit and do nothing when Im listening. I have headphones on right now, sometimes I have to mute for conference calls but other times music is just playing. I also listen to it when Im having fun tweaking or building speakers. I also enjoy a great live music locally but with kids, 6 pm and after is no fun any more I have never posted once saying anything about SQ and how I listen so Im not sure why you think its silly when I talk about SQ. You are aware that I have a long list of equipment to choose from if I choose to listen in a high SQ environment. Heck my HT room is a damn good room for that if I again choose too...$50K room or $100 Ipod in the garage while building something....give me the garage

You do not have to listen to music a specific way to have incredible passion towards music, You dont have to use a specific medium to have incredible passion towards music. Im fully aware of the compromises in my choices. That does not mean I have not experienced the other side. I have many times, My critical listening experiences with 5 guys sitting around saying nothing, with their eyes closed is like watching paint dry...you might as well put fire ants on my skin because its that painful to experience. I want action, I want thought, I want the "other" things involved with a music experience too.

For me music brings back incredible memories of life experiences. Sometimes its overwhelming because they events were incredible!

Both sides will brush broad strokes sometimes but a little cage rattling is okay isnt it
post #24 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denophile View Post

"better" can refer to either a subjective or objective assessment. To each his/her own....

I agree. Hadn't thought about it but I like the process of looking through the albums, picking the one I want, cleaning off the dust, spinning it up on my tt, and sitting back with the cover in my hands as I listen. One reason why I like it better that has nothing to do with SQ at all. Of course I also still like foreplay even after 33 years of marriage.
post #25 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

Far enough, I will correct my statement in saying Im wrong about all vinyl lovers!

Im not sure why it matters how I choose to listen to my music. Its never background noise for sure though but I choose to not sit and do nothing when Im listening. I have headphones on right now, sometimes I have to mute for conference calls but other times music is just playing. I also listen to it when Im having fun tweaking or building speakers. I also enjoy a great live music locally but with kids, 6 pm and after is no fun any more I have never posted once saying anything about SQ and how I listen so Im not sure why you think its silly when I talk about SQ.

You do not have to listen to music a specific way to have incredible passion towards music, You dont have to use a specific medium to have incredible passion towards music. Im fully aware of the compromises in my choices. That does not mean I have not experienced the other side. I have many times, My critical listening experiences with 5 guys sitting around saying nothing, with their eyes closed is like watching paint dry...you might as well put fire ants on my skin because its that painful to experience. I want action, I want thought, I want the "other" things involved with a music experience too.

For me music brings back incredible memories of life experiences. Sometimes its overwhelming because they events were incredible!

Both sides will brush broad strokes sometimes but a little cage rattling is okay isnt it

Too funny. You just gave me a list of "subjective" reasons why you listen to music the way you do and why you subjectivly like it.

BTW, as usual, I agree with most of your opinions. While I still do listen to music with my eyes closed sometimes, it's not with a bunch of guys these days. It's every now and then when the mood for nostalgia hits me. Most music I listen to is through my ipod while riding my bike. For some of us "ready to die guys" vinyl is just cool. I am under no illusions about the facts of the medium.
post #26 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lhasa-lover View Post

Too funny. You just gave me a list of "subjective" reasons why you listen to music the way you do and why you subjectivly like it.

BTW, as usual, I agree with most of your opinions. While I still do listen to music with my eyes closed sometimes, it's not with a bunch of guys these days. It's every now and then when the mood for nostalgia hits me. Most music I listen to is through my ipod while riding my bike. For some of us "ready to die guys" vinyl is just cool. I am under no illusions about the facts of the medium.

Yes, how I listen is completely a subjective choice and I know it isnt the highest quality. I have tried it other ways, Im not a guy that sits still for too long unless Im on sensory overload (ie. Gaming, action movies, drinking at a bar listening to great music).
post #27 of 44
My reaction was not about vinyl vs. CD.

His statement was "...you will never get sound as good as MP3."

Among other things, this is a completely subjective statement. 'Good'? In what way, 'good'?
I find a lot of vinyl to be far more 'listenable' than any MP3 I've ever heard... even 320k. That is MY 'good'.

What was laughable was 'never' and 'good' combined, and not about CD's, but in praise of a very lossy compression process.

I laugh at his absolutes.

Maybe HE will never get sound from an LP as good as his MP3's but what are their sources, what ratio, what kind of music, what kind of EQ or processing have they been through all to HIS ears. There is no absolute in you' for what he prefers.
post #28 of 44
immediately before you go on to laugh at the absolutes, you say this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by shane55 View Post

....but in praise of a very lossy compression process.



I, in turn, must laugh at your absolutes.


iow, "very lossy" is an over-generalization which doesn't really apply to all compression processes. Modern codec, higher bit rate mp3's are often* indistinguishable from source, particularly when listened to without pre-knowledge as to which is which.


*Note the use of the non-absolute word "often".
post #29 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by CruelInventions View Post

immediately before you go on to laugh at the absolutes, you say this...



I, in turn, must laugh at your absolutes.


iow, "very lossy" is an over-generalization which doesn't really apply to all compression processes. Modern codec, higher bit rate mp3's are often* indistinguishable from source, particularly when listened to without pre-knowledge as to which is which.


*Note the use of the non-absolute word "often".


'Very' good.

The word 'very' was just an exageration of my opinion of MP3. You are 'very' correct that many codec's are 'very' good, but that's not really what I was saying. I was only talking about MP3 since that was what was mentioned by the OP in comparison to vinyl. I also never denegraded the codec.

Also, other than my statement about MP3's and how lossy they are, I said that I have not heard an MP3 that I prefered to listen to over many of my vinyl's. Just my opinion based on my experience. Again, I'm not slamming MP3's.

I didn't say that I could distinguish an MP3 from a CD or anything of the sort.

Yes, all MP3 is lossy. That is why there are designations for lossless codec's... which MP3 is not. To parse my words and attack 'very' is missing the point I was making.

Here's an absolute: MP3 is a lossy codec. You may love it, I may not be able to distinguish it from CD. So what? It's a lossy codec.
post #30 of 44
Quote:


Originally Posted by Lhasa-lover
I participated in most of the vinyl threads over the last year, year and a half. Funny, but I don't remember many of us who love vinyl professing that vinyl was more accurate than, CD, for example. But people, like you I guess, continue to bring it up, but that doesn't make it true. "most" of us simply stated that we like it for a variety of reasons. Nostalgia, we perferred the sound to what is coming out on CD these days, and to many of us vinyl was simply another option. It was in "addition" to CD, downloads, etc. Not a replacement for that media. So your posting that we just won't admit anything doesn't make what you say true. You participated in most of those threads as well and stated the same crap that you post now. It's not any more true now than it was then. We argued that CD was only as good as the master it was created from and that many of the vinyl albums seemed to be cut from superior masters and hence sounded better than their CD counterparts. Nobody, to my knowledge, ever argued that CD was not potentially a superior media, but that the industry these days didn't seem to be taking advantage of that superiority. Instead they compressed the shictk out of the music, going for pure loudness as we all know that loudness sells.

With all due respect, don't paint us vinyl lovers with the broad and inaccurate brush that you seem to be using. It's insulting and untrue.

Lhasa,
I agree with so much of what you say!!! I'm new here and have missed most of these vinyl discussions.For me the nastalgia is a big part of it.There is something that is very reassuring,peaceful,and relaxing in putting an album on the turntable,installing the weight/clamp on the spindle,cleaning it with the CF brush,and lowering the stylus to the record.The great sound(most of the time) is just a bonus!You can also look at the pics and read the lyrics(w/o glasses) while you're listening. I keep two vintage Dual CS 5000 tables spinning. I could not afford them when they were new(but lusted for them in my heart).I also have a newer Acoustic Signature rig. About 20 years ago I sold most of my vinyl.I've spent the last 10 years buying it back(and more).

Like Lhasa,vinyl is only part of my listening.I also enjoy CD and SACD.Recently I have been using a Sony MP-3 player when I travel.I also stream Pandora radio into my HT system via a Samsung 3600 Blu-ray player

Yesterday I played a cut from a David Sanborn LP for my 25 yr. old nephew.He cold not believe that he was listening to vinyl.He,like far too many others had only heard vinyl on inferior systems with scratched/dirty records.
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