Portland, ME - HDTV - Page 109

Follow the money. It has little to do with helping the consumer and is mostly about bandwidth and who gets it. Think presidential advisers. Hurts Verizon and helps sprint/nextel.

I don't think he was saying all of the analog channels would go digital, but that some/a bunch of the non-local analog channels would be moved to the digital tier.

That's just a guess, though.

I think Fox 23 will extend analog.

Response to my question of Fox 23's intention on transition date:
What is the plan for February - will it be digital or analog til June?

Thanks

Thank you for the email. We will will not be making a decision until the bill is drafted and we know what our options are.

Regards,

Torrey Ham
WPFO FOX23

Time Warner has said that they are leaving basic/analog cable as-is for the meantime. In other words, the idea that the OTA digital conversion will allow cable companies to dump analog and go to digital only service opening up bandwidth for more HD content is likely not going to come to fruition any time soon. It may be true that cable companies will not be required to provide analog service after the conversion takes place, but it seems they have no plans to change. Some operators (Verizon) are going all digital. As far as I nunderstand it, Comcast & Time Warner have no plans in that direction.

Joe

Actually, the Ports seemed to be switched on this unit as many have reported that the bottom port works and the top one doesn't.

I'm having D* coming Tuesday to upgrade to HD. When my dish was first installed there was an issue with the 119 satellite, so the installer mounted the dish on my barn roof. I had an install for the middle of January, but the guy said he couldn't get to the dish(too much snow???). That's why the Tuesday install. I've cleared the snow(it wasn't that bad), but I'm worried I'll get the same response.
Do I need the 119 satellite? I read on other forums that it is not needed anymore. Can anyone help out with this? I really don't want to change providers.

BTW, I live in Cornish.

I believe there are a few MPEG2 HD channels on 119, but the MPEG4 versions of them (which look better and take up less DVR space) are located on one of the two new satellites.

Does anyone think I can talk the installer into putting the new dish on the side of the barn, where it's more accessible? Are the local HD channels on this bird?

That will all depend on the line of site to the satellites. In Maine you usually have to get the dish mounted up high, in order to get a good shot to the south to see all the satellites.

In Florida my dish is low on the side of my house, with a row of trees behind the house, and still see the satellite, because I am way south. In Maine I have no trees or hills around my house and the only way it can see the satellites is from my roof.

But if your barn faces south and it is on a hill with a good southern exposure they may be able to put it on the side of the barn. Also another thing to look at, if the barn is away from your house, you need to take into consideration the lines from the dish to the receiver(s), in the house. It is winter and the ground is frozen.

The Portland/Auburn locals are on DirecTV 11 at 99.2 degrees.

Right. The House vote apparently will be Tuesday. The last time it required a two-thirds vote to pass. This time under regular rules, a majority vote will be sufficient.


Dana

I am new to Maine (2 months now) and was kind of disapointed that the Fox affiliate was not broadcasting digital. Now that the transition is not being extended I guess I don't have to worry about that much longer. I also wondering why WCSH only broadcasts with 2.0 audio. I really missed the 5.1.

Welcome to the Great State of Maine and this friendly Mainah's AVS Forum thread!

A vote in the US Congress tomorrow will determine whether the digital transition is postponed or not.

It's a long story about FOX23. Previous owners dropped the ball. There's more here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WPFO


As to why WCSH Channel 6 hasn't seen fit to upgrade to DD 5.1, I suspect it's $$$$. Previous contacts with the station manager indicate that the station may do so when the digital transition takes place.

Dana

I actually got a response to an email I sent them shortly after I posted this morning. Here is what they said,

"WCSH 6 does not have the 5.1 audio equipment necessary to pass this through from NBC to viewers with TV sets that can pick it up...BUT we are in the process of changing over our Master Control Room. when it is finished we will be able to air 5.1 audio from NBC. By mid-year we should be equipped for 5.1 audio. All the best, mike marshall, programming manager"

Sounds like it has been put off longer than the transition. I wonder why thy chose to buy a DD 2.0 encoder in the first place rather than a DD 5.1 encoder.

Master Control Room!! Might be a sign that they are also working toward setting it up for HD for local news. Just a thought, or maybe wishful thinking.

Every time I read a response from Mike on this topic, I get the impression that he thinks DD 5.1 is some sort of weird audio effect. He's looking for 5.1 sound on TV sets? I wonder if he's aware that audio video receivers have been invented and some of us in Maine might actually have them. And speakers that are separate from those on the TV set. Golly gee.

Probably not.

Dana

I would seriously doubt it if they do not even have their master control room together. In a TV station Master control takes care of all network programming, commercials and the broadcast of the local programming. There is a separate control room for production of news shows. Aptly called News Control. I would seriously doubt that they have spent the money on an HD switcher for News Control. Who even knows if they have HD capable cameras on their news set.

On another note, did anyone actually pick up WPFO's digital broadcast yesterday? Their website said they had turned of the analog in favor of the digital until 7:30 pm last night. I scanned for it on one of my ATSC tuners last night after work and couldn't pick it up. I wonder how low power they are broadcasting at, cause the transmitter is pretty far away.

I see Channel 13 has gotten FCC approval and is scheduled to shut off their analog signal on the 17th.

A local maine thread?!

Interesting.

Way too many pages too look through.

WPFO ran their DT test on UHF 23 from 6 AM until 730 PM. I live near exit 47 on the Westbrook-Portland line and WPFO came in quite well with no drop outs. The WPFO tower is located next to the WCBB-DT tower in Litchfield
and put the relatively feeble WCBB signal to shame. I hope the FCC approves the application from WCBB-DT to boost their signal strength soon.

Wish I saw that.

How much of an area does the WCBB-DT signal reach on channel 10 now? What about WMEA-DT in your area?

If you go to the FCC website, www.fcc.gov, and click on "search" along the top banner, then choose "TV Station Query" you can get detailed info including service contour map. Type the call letters in the "call sign" window, then scroll down and higlight "TV Query (Detailed Output + CDBS Links)" and click on "submit data"

The service contours are there.

56 dBu for the analog signal (no longer live): http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-serv...=TV612560.html

41 dBu for the present digital signal: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-serv...=DT428496.html

36 dBu for the proposed increased digital signal: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-serv...DT1290118.html

I believe that the higher number dBu is the weaker signal, on a log (factor of 10) scale. I alos understand that analog signals are still receivable (with static) at lower power levels, whereas the digital signal is "perfect" until it isn't receivable. So the 56 dBu analog signal will reach more sets than the digital signals do.

You can get the same maps for WMEA.

Joe

You do have to remember that WPFO is trying to cover both Portland & Augusta -- southwest to Saco/Biddeford and northeast past Centerville -- with one transmitter, but that WCBB is part of MPBN which uses multiple smaller transmitters to cover the same area. It isn't fair to compaere the two signals power levels directly.

MPBN uses four transmitters to cover the entire Atlantic coast of Maine. In the region of WPFO's coverage, there are three MPBN towers -- WMEB Orono, WCBB Augusta, and WMEA Biddeford.

MPBN's coverage maps are here: http://www.mpbn.net/About/CoverageMa.../Default.aspx;
you can also see what is in the FCC database following the instructions above.

Joe

Question for lurking station engineers!

I'm curious about the service contour plots available at the FCC database. How are the signal strengths the maps are plotting chosen, and how do they relate to reception? What are the differences in this relationship for digital & analog signals?

The only info I have found on reception contours relates to "Grade A & B contours" which are used to determine availibility of distant locals for satellite television. These apparently are not hard signal levels, but depend on the channel/frequency the broadcast signal is on.


Do the contour plots in the FCC data base relate to Grade A or B contours? Or something else? Are Grade A & B copntours "different" for digital broadcasting (where you get the signal or you don't, unlike analog which fades away to static)?

Thanks,

Joe

I don't know how many engineers lurk in this thread, so I'll chime in. I'm not an engineer, but I want to be one, I'm in school studying to be one (not too far along yet), and I understand FCC matters pretty well.

The FCC's coverage contour is basically a loose prediction of what kind of power level you can expect. While it's designed to measure coverage, it's based on some flawed data and thus is a poor estimate.

The contour plots on the FCC site should be Grade B contours on the analog side, and on the digital side are just what the FCC considers to be the minimum signal level for reliable reception (on UHF, this is the 41dBu contour). Both of these contours generally fall short of a station's actual coverage area, which is why the FCC's strict reliance on them concerns me.

The biggest shortcoming is that they don't take terrain into account, only the "height above average terrain" which means that if the HAAT is artificially low for some reason (I have first-hand experience with this) the coverage predictions will fall short.

That may not have answered any of your questions, but I tried. If you want me to attempt to clarify or restate something, let me know and I will do my best.

If you want good coverage maps, use the ones on TVFool.com instead of the FCC contours.

- Trip

Thanks for chipping in -- there are a few of the local station engineers who keep track of this thread -- particularly Craig Clark of WGME. But that's what I was after.

take care,

Joe

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?hpid=topnews

Dana

One important point, both WMEA-DT and WCBB-DT are relatively weak signals in the largest TV market in the state. Trying to receive a reliable ota signal on either is damn near impossible in much of Portland without an attic or outdoor antenna. When WLED-DT lights up from Mount Washington with NH PBS, they will deliver a much stronger signal to the Portland area. MPBN will find themselves at a competitive disadvantage. As a generous contributor to MPBN, I'm hoping the pending power increase on WCBB-DT will substantially improve the signal in Greater Portland. Time will tell.

WGME is officially confirming on their website that they will shut off analog on Feb. 17. According to WCSH's 11PM newscast Gannett hasn't made a firm decision on WCSH/WLBZ. WMTW is going to maintain analog through June 12. I didn't watch WPFO's 10PM newscast that carefully tonight so I don't know if anything has been decided for FOX 23.

Just to get an out-of-market perspective, I was watching KGO-TV's 6PM newscast tonight on the web (my best friend lives in the Bay Area) and it was matter-of-factly mentioned that everyone now has 128 days to get ready for digital. Sigh...