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The Official LG xxPK550 Owner's Discussion Thread [no price talk] - Page 15

post #421 of 5201
3/31/10 at 12:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orta View Post

Surprisingly, it seems they actually do. Panasonic NA makes no mention of it in any of their published materials, but frame interpolation is clearly present in the Standard and Vivid picture modes (Custom, Game, and THX/Cinema do no feature it). Only the effect can be seen, the setting itself is controlled and hidden by the software. It seems they simply moved it into the general user menu's as "Blur Reduction" on the '10's. It's possible reviews did motion tests on the Standard mode as a lot of them do "Out of Box" measurements (which is what the panel defaults to ootb).

I'm not quite sure I stand corrected ... How would frame interpolation work on a 60Hz TV such as the Pannys under discussion? You send it a 1080p60 signal, the circuitry analyzes it and detects that the content is (say) actually 30fps video, it discards redundant alternate frames and interpolates new ones for a 30fps to 60fps effect?

Well if that's right, how does it work to improve motion resolution on 60fps video such as the output of a video game? It seems it cannot ...

Are talking about the same models here??
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post #422 of 5201
3/31/10 at 12:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by walt73 View Post

I'm not quite sure I stand corrected ... How would frame interpolation work on a 60Hz TV such as the Pannys under discussion? You send it a 1080p60 signal, the circuitry analyzes it and detects that the content is (say) actually 30fps video, it discards redundant alternate frames and interpolates new ones for a 30fps to 60fps effect?

Well if that's right, how does it work to improve motion resolution on 60fps video such as the output of a video game? It seems it cannot ...

Are talking about the same models here??

I am speaking on the North American G10 specifically. I don't pretend to know what the feature is doing, only that it seems to be the "Intelligent Frame Creation" feature seen in Panasonic European PDP models, and presumably what has been named "Blur Reduction" in most of the North American 2010's. You would have to direct your questions at what those features are doing. The effect is somewhat similar to a 120Hz LCD with FI on low. The only point I was making is that in the NA 2009's, the feature is apparently embedded in the low level software (invisible and uncontrollable by the user) and only active in the Standard and Vivid profiles. The obvious implication being if reviews are only noting Full 1080 with "Blur Reduction" on in the 2010's, it is possible they were making their motion measurements under Standard or Vivid in their 2009 reviews.
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post #423 of 5201
3/31/10 at 3:16pm
I received my 60PK550 this morning. First impressions were wow that is alot of TV. I am going from a 32' crt. I have this placed temporarily in a room with alot of natural light. With the shades pulled the glare was not to bad. And my shades do not stop alot of light. I am just watching SD on Directv so I can't speak to much on pq.
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post #424 of 5201
3/31/10 at 5:39pm
Well I won't be able to do any further input lag tests for a while. Sears told me they were bringing me a replacement set today and instead of doing so they just came and took my old one. I called them after the new one didn't show up and they told me it was cancelled because they were out of stock. What I have a problem with is why the hell did they let me order a replacement if they didn't have any to replace it with.
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post #425 of 5201
3/31/10 at 6:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by gihad View Post

Do you think you could take a picture of what is hapenning?
I would try to reproduce it on mine.

Here are the couple of images taken with Canon XT ( 4sec exposure/ 200 ISO)
You can ignore some IR in the upper left corner, and just pay attention
to the bandings. Can't really miss them.

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/5600/img0813n.jpg

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/84/img0812b.jpg
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post #426 of 5201
3/31/10 at 7:04pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaddix View Post

What I have a problem with is why the hell did they let me order a replacement if they didn't have any to replace it with.

Why not let you use the old one until they have something to replace it with. Your right that makes no sence and now you have no tv.
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post #427 of 5201
3/31/10 at 7:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by walt73 View Post

I'm not quite sure I stand corrected ... How would frame interpolation work on a 60Hz TV such as the Pannys under discussion? You send it a 1080p60 signal, the circuitry analyzes it and detects that the content is (say) actually 30fps video, it discards redundant alternate frames and interpolates new ones for a 30fps to 60fps effect?

Well if that's right, how does it work to improve motion resolution on 60fps video such as the output of a video game? It seems it cannot ...

Are talking about the same models here??

Walt,
I can't see how the panasonic NA versions can have better performances, without using the same "features" of the E.U. versions. Panels and video-processor are the same on both.
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post #428 of 5201
3/31/10 at 7:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumon View Post

Here are the couple of images taken with Canon XT ( 4sec exposure/ 200 ISO)
You can ignore some IR in the upper left corner, and just pay attention
to the bandings. Can't really miss them.

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/5600/img0813n.jpg

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/84/img0812b.jpg

thats pretty bad, what are you going to do? The second pic looks like what my Samsung 42" DLP RP has, but to be honest I don't even see it anymore. I'm sure if I tried hard enough I could find it.
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post #429 of 5201
3/31/10 at 7:12pm
You can find the vesa on here : (under cabinet/accessories) tab

http://www.lg.com/us/tv-audio-video/...tv-50PK550.jsp
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post #430 of 5201
3/31/10 at 8:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by halokilla77 View Post

thats pretty bad, what are you going to do? The second pic looks like what my Samsung 42" DLP RP has, but to be honest I don't even see it anymore. I'm sure if I tried hard enough I could find it.

I am seriously thinking on returning it. To many little things that bug me now:
- mediocre black level
- highly reflective (any light in the room washes out the picture easily)
- line bleeds
- IR
- horizontal banding

Not sure if it is just my set though (at least bandings).

On the positive side:
- PQ is very good (except dark scenes)
- very smooth 24P blu-ray playback
- no noticeable input lag (for my needs)
- nice style
- great value
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post #431 of 5201
3/31/10 at 8:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumon View Post

I am seriously thinking on returning it. To many little things that bug me now:
- mediocre black level
- highly reflective (any light in the room washes out the picture easily)
- line bleeds
- IR
- horizontal banding

Not sure if it is just my set though (at least bandings).

On the positive side:
- PQ is very good (except dark scenes)
- very smooth 24P blu-ray playback
- no noticeable input lag (for my needs)
- nice style
- great value

I just checked my TV and couldn't see the banding thing like you have in the pic.

However to be honest, most of the things that you listed as problems are in all sets and not just in yours and some more problems that you didn't list, this TV is not as good as most owners in this thread want/report it to be. It has its fair share of "small" problems.
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post #432 of 5201
3/31/10 at 8:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by gihad View Post

I just checked my TV and couldn't see the banding thing like you have in the pic.

However to be honest, most of the things that you listed as problems are in all sets and not just in yours and some more problems that you didn't list, this TV is not as good as most owners in this thread want/report it to be. It has its fair share of "small" problems.

Yes. I've noted that the banding thing may be just specific for my set.
Never thought that it could be the case with plasmas. So the tipping
points for me are black level and bandings.
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post #433 of 5201
3/31/10 at 9:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaddix View Post

I believe I will stick with the PK550. I don't really want to give money to panasonic when they're not willing to make things right with their users. If they actually did something to fix that black level problem, they would be the gold standard overnight. Until then, no money from meeeee!!!!!
L G
L G
L G
L G
*chants*

I think what I'll do, is make 3 fictitious emails a day and email LG about the input lag, and hopefully, over like 6 months. 600 people will have complained about the input lag XD

I thought LG was THE low input lag brand. I've heard samsung was notorious for input lag.
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post #434 of 5201
3/31/10 at 9:31pm
Hey guys. Finally got eh 550 up and running. Amazing PQ. Watched some planet earth and it did not dissapoint. Really good panning movement and no phosphor trailing. One thing I did notice while watching Quantum of Solice blu-ray though. In the opening scene with the car chase, it seems like things are laggy.... or a bit behind almost. I'm wondering if there is a way to fix this or if this is how 2:4:1 content is displayed at 1080p..... any thoughts?
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post #435 of 5201
3/31/10 at 9:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumon View Post

I am seriously thinking on returning it. To many little things that bug me now:
- mediocre black level
- highly reflective (any light in the room washes out the picture easily)
- line bleeds
- IR
- horizontal banding

Not sure if it is just my set though (at least bandings).

On the positive side:
- PQ is very good (except dark scenes)
- very smooth 24P blu-ray playback
- no noticeable input lag (for my needs)
- nice style
- great value

I noticed in your pics you still have some of the tags on the tv. How long have you had it?

I really think you may have a bad set as i can't get anything close to the issues your tv has. How exactly are you getting your set to be that gray? I also have what i think is an awesome black level. Ive played dark video games (Dead Space and Gears of War 2) and the blacks seem very dark and not gray or washed out like my LCD. In fact i was very amazed at how well the game Dead Space looked since it is such a dark atmospheric game I did have bad IR at first but after breaking the tv in some with normal use and the "color wash" setting it hardy ever shows up anymore and when it does it takes only a few seconds of a different channel/image to remove it. Im wondering if there isn't some bad sets out there. Chad gave it a great review and he is about an hour or so from me so maybe certain regions could of gotten different tv's? I dunno how that kind of shipping works but maybe it could explain it


Edit: Also wouldn't that banding disappear with and actual image being portrayed on the screen and not show up when its lighted?
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post #436 of 5201
3/31/10 at 9:54pm
Also can somebody explain the "Soap Opera Effect"? Ive seen it on a few tv's and it looks odd. I think thats what the two guys above are discussing but they have gotten two technical for me lol. Also why isn't that a plasma does not get this effect?
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post #437 of 5201
3/31/10 at 10:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by terfong View Post

I'm looking to buy this TV but all I have is std cable..does anyone know if the pic quality is any good and clear or is it grainy? Also how is the IR on this TV...I noticed that the Samsungs are very good with IR.

IR hasn't been an issue with me and from what I have read from others on this forum doesn't seem to be a problem.

On the topic of Stand Def, that for me was a huge prob. Stand Def looks like crap on this TV. To fix this issue I upgraded to HD cable (1080i actully). Here is my theory. Why in the heck would I buy a TV that cost over a thousand dollars and then watch Stand Def on it in the first place? And that theory should hold true for you, as well, no matter what you decide to buy. The fact that Stand Def on this TV looks like crap IS NOT the TV's fault. The TV is not built for Stand Def. BTW, before going to better cable I did notice that from a viewing distance of 10' the Stand Def looked a lot better, almost tolrable. Still, HD programming looks freaking awesome on this TV, that's what the TV is built for, and I am NEVER going back to Stand Def. Hope this helps.
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post #438 of 5201
3/31/10 at 10:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smith5361 View Post

Also can somebody explain the "Soap Opera Effect"? Ive seen it on a few tv's and it looks odd. I think thats what the two guys above are discussing but they have gotten two technical for me lol. Also why isn't that a plasma does not get this effect?

Hi,

The "soap opera effect" is a phrase used to describe the effects of frame interpolation -- basically, it's an algorithm that averages the difference between the pixels of the current frame and the next frame of video or film-based content, then inserts newly created frame(s) in between. It essentially removes the "look" of 24 frames-per-second film and smooths it out to look like something shot on video tape (30 fps), such as the typical soap opera would be -- although it actually looks more extreme than that, IMO. Some plasmas do have this, erm, "feature", but it seems much more prevalent on LCD sets.
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post #439 of 5201
3/31/10 at 11:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by halokilla77 View Post

What a great review man, glad you love it and enjoy it. Do you play FPS games as well? I got the cash to pick up a 60PK550 I just can't decide if I should wait for the 750 or 950. Either way I'm sure I will be happy. Btw what is your thoughts on the glare?

I do play fps. But ive not in a while. If i did, i would just follow the same process. Glare, well..right now, my tv has a window in front of it. Not my choice, long story. But at night, with no lights, there's no glare. The glare is something im getting used to. Like in the crt days. What can ya do. So the glare is there, just make sure your tv doesnt have a window directly in front of it (directly behind your head).

Btw, ive come to the conclusion, not all blu rays look the same. For instance, i just watch kingdom of heaven blu ray, looks great! Rambo 3 looks great, kickboxer looks great, While other movies, like predator blu ray look poor. Too much film grain and not a very good transfer. So movies that are well transfered look amazing. Of course all the movies have great motion. So that's a positive. It also doesnt help, that im sitting 5-6 feet from my set. When i stand about 10 feet away, the image quality doubles. You see less/to no grain at all. When i did that, it made me smile.

I HATE FILM GRAIN!!! lol
Anyway, once i move out to my new place, the tv will be at a proper distance. This tv really shines at 10-12 feet away!
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post #440 of 5201
3/31/10 at 11:42pm
So I checked out quantum of solace blu Ray again and I'm definately getting the soap opera effect. I don't have anything turned on in expert features and the "film" mode is grayed out. Film mode only came on for planet earth. How can I stop the soap opera effect? It's doing it with 4 other blu rays I tried, but not with any of my .avi movies from a hard drive....

Again, no noise reduction or anything is turned on.... This could be a deal breaker if I can't watch blu Ray movies at 24 fps instead of the 30fps soapy style. Please help!
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post #441 of 5201
3/31/10 at 11:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumon View Post

I am seriously thinking on returning it. To many little things that bug me now:
- mediocre black level
- highly reflective (any light in the room washes out the picture easily)
- line bleeds
- IR
- horizontal banding

Not sure if it is just my set though (at least bandings).

dumon,
what you have written above is referred to when you use it connected to the pc, or always?

Looking at your pics there is, of course, something wrong on that TV.

Where you connected in PC mode? What are that strong lights at the bottom?

I would suggest you to do another test, if you can: arrange a 0 IRE pattern (or/and a 5 IRE pattern) and load it/them to the display. Try it by using the USB port, and a DVD/BD player. If I remeber well, on flatpanelsHD.com there should be available for free a test software they use to check many things on HDTV, have a look at it.

In the meantime, could you please tell me the complete settings (OSD - Picture menu) you were using when you have done those 2 pics?
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post #442 of 5201
4/1/10 at 12:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capn-Daft View Post

So I checked out quantum of solace blu Ray again and I'm definately getting the soap opera effect. I don't have anything turned on in expert features and the "film" mode is grayed out. Film mode only came on for planet earth. How can I stop the soap opera effect? It's doing it with 4 other blu rays I tried, but not with any of my .avi movies from a hard drive....

Again, no noise reduction or anything is turned on.... This could be a deal breaker if I can't watch blu Ray movies at 24 fps instead of the 30fps soapy style. Please help!

Hey.. we were speaking about that soap opera effect on the panasonic, when their IFC is turned ON. LG has not that "features".

There is something strange on what you have written, about the Film mode option. At first, I suggest you to read the PDF user manual (as usual), to learn what the options do.

What BD Player are you using? Did you set it right? What you have called "soap opera effect", if it is really present because of the TV (one option), you see it always, not only sometimes. Instead, some BD could have beeing encoded in a wrong way, and some other are not "film" but "video", and in the second case you get that soap effect, but that is not a TV problem, it is normal on some BD, or it is because of the BD player or because that BD source. There are some thread around, speaking about those things, and also some web sites. Have a look also to the BD reviews. Not all BDs are the same, and not all are good or without some native problems, unfortunately
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post #443 of 5201
4/1/10 at 5:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumon View Post

Here are the couple of images taken with Canon XT ( 4sec exposure/ 200 ISO)
You can ignore some IR in the upper left corner, and just pay attention
to the bandings. Can't really miss them.

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/5600/img0813n.jpg

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/84/img0812b.jpg

Sup hoss, I spent plenty of time looking at dark solid color screens(lol) when I had it, and it did not look like that. I wonder if that evens out over time. I mean there's no backlight.

as far as this tvs problems,(not speaking directly at you anymore dumon) they are outweighed by the price. You won't get better blacks from panny lol, but you will get higher prices lol. I guess you could go samsung if you like buzzzzzzzzzzzz. Really what are the other options here? A 58"+ panny V series? That's about it. You could get a G20, no IR, less glare, but enjoy your flickering BD for 400 dollars extra.
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post #444 of 5201
4/1/10 at 6:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mauri View Post

dumon,
what you have written above is referred to when you use it connected to the pc, or always?

Looking at your pics there is, of course, something wrong on that TV.

Where you connected in PC mode? What are that strong lights at the bottom?

I would suggest you to do another test, if you can: arrange a 0 IRE pattern (or/and a 5 IRE pattern) and load it/them to the display. Try it by using the USB port, and a DVD/BD player. If I remeber well, on flatpanelsHD.com there should be available for free a test software they use to check many things on HDTV, have a look at it.

In the meantime, could you please tell me the complete settings (OSD - Picture menu) you were using when you have done those 2 pics?

Mauri,

The bandings are visible on any input. The picture shows my PC desktop with black wallpaper.
The bright lights is windows task bar. I had to overexpose the picture a little to make the
banding more visible for the computer monitors.
I could actually see the bandings on any solid background (maybe except totally white).
I could definitely see them on most of the "break in" images that I was running from the
USB stick.
The picture settings were on Cinema mode (brightness: 35 contrast: 55)
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post #445 of 5201
4/1/10 at 6:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smith5361 View Post

I noticed in your pics you still have some of the tags on the tv. How long have you had it?

I really think you may have a bad set as i can't get anything close to the issues your tv has. How exactly are you getting your set to be that gray? I also have what i think is an awesome black level. Ive played dark video games (Dead Space and Gears of War 2) and the blacks seem very dark and not gray or washed out like my LCD. In fact i was very amazed at how well the game Dead Space looked since it is such a dark atmospheric game I did have bad IR at first but after breaking the tv in some with normal use and the "color wash" setting it hardy ever shows up anymore and when it does it takes only a few seconds of a different channel/image to remove it. Im wondering if there isn't some bad sets out there. Chad gave it a great review and he is about an hour or so from me so maybe certain regions could of gotten different tv's? I dunno how that kind of shipping works but maybe it could explain it


Edit: Also wouldn't that banding disappear with and actual image being portrayed on the screen and not show up when its lighted?

I have the set for about 10 days. The actual black level is not that gray - I had to overexpose the shot to make it more visible
for the PC displays. You can definitely see it glowing with no input or in the dark scenes.
Banding are really obvious on solid backgrounds only.
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post #446 of 5201
4/1/10 at 6:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by shane0049 View Post

Point 1 has some validity to it and your right. I made a comment based on emotion rather than fact. But the flip side to that is by you passing judgement on a TV by what you see in a store and not what you see at home helps nobody make an informed decision. Point 2 makes no sense at all. Lit in anyway? So your saying from personal experience that because this TV has no filter it has to be in a completely dark room for there to be no glare on it? That's funny because my TV sits in a room with medium lighting during the day and there are no glare issues when the TV is on. I assume what you meant is direct lighting vs. indirect lighting?

Yes, I meant direct sunlight and/or lamps reflecting off the screen directly or via pictureframe glass/mirrors. I should have specified that any light behind the set or above would likely not cause any problems. And youre right, because I dont own the set,I shouldnt just assume its reflective. I was basing this partially off the showroom, but also off my previous experience with glare on a panny and 3 samsungs(all with filters, all reflective to a degree).

If you have no glare issues, I think I can assume that what is behind your viewing area is probably a wall with no windows, mirrors, or anything else reflective.

I gotta say though, this set would be in my den right now if there was a filter. shame really.
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post #447 of 5201
4/1/10 at 7:53am
Shaddix, i believe its was you who asked me what scenes in planet earth i was experiencing the flickering in. Well the first very noticeable one is on the first disc (blu ray). Start watching at 1:30 with the large group of birds. I notice it the most in the bottom right corner before the screen fades out at about 1:50ish. If it is on your set you won't miss it. There are many other spots of flickering throughout the series I have noticed as well.
Sorry for the incredibly late reply.
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post #448 of 5201
4/1/10 at 8:16am
Anyone else notice the soap opera effect with some blu-ray movies? I have put in The Hangover, Spiderman 3, and Quantum of Solace.... I get the effect on all 3 movies. I don't get this on planet earth....looks normal like it should. I have everything turned off and am just in cinema mode. I looked at the user manual and can't figure out how to fix this problem. Any help would be appreciated!
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post #449 of 5201
4/1/10 at 8:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capn-Daft View Post

So I checked out quantum of solace blu Ray again and I'm definately getting the soap opera effect. I don't have anything turned on in expert features and the "film" mode is grayed out. Film mode only came on for planet earth. How can I stop the soap opera effect? It's doing it with 4 other blu rays I tried, but not with any of my .avi movies from a hard drive....

Again, no noise reduction or anything is turned on.... This could be a deal breaker if I can't watch blu Ray movies at 24 fps instead of the 30fps soapy style. Please help!


I wonder if this would help. First to back up a little, some movies (mostly concerts) are shot on video (30fps) with most movies (the ones in theater) are shot at 24fps. I wonder if some of the Blu-rays are shot on video, not film. If so, then maybe when you see the "soap-opera-effect", try changing the output of your player to 30/60Hz and set the TV to 60Hz as well and see if it goes away. I would think that if it was shot on video (30fps/60Hz) and the TV is trying to match to 24fps/72Hz then you may get the "soap-opera-effect". It may be worth to experiment.
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post #450 of 5201
4/1/10 at 9:11am
Woot!!! I can officially say I belong to the PK550 Owner's Thread.

I got it thru Sears & they will be able to deliver it on Monday... I don't think I'll be able to sleep until then. So dying to have a TV again.
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