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21" Maelstrom Curved Box Build - Page 3

post #61 of 732
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gmichael2 View Post

Why does this build look so familiar to me?

Hi Michael, good to see you over here as well.

Since the rest of my HT is black, my wife is reluctant to have a wood subwoofer. I don't think she appreciates how nice it will look having all the plys showing. She saw Bent's Dual 15's with the wood finish and black front and liked that. What do you think this would look like. I can get a plate of 1/4" steel laser cut. If I finish it gloss black, flush mount it on the front leaving 1/4" of the wood all the way around. Bring it right to the edge of the surround and attach it with rare earth magnets so the front is clean. Then I have a natural wood enclosure with a piano black face.
post #62 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by corock View Post

Hi Michael, good to see you over here as well.

Since the rest of my HT is black, my wife is reluctant to have a wood subwoofer. I don't think she appreciates how nice it will look having all the plys showing. She saw Bent's Dual 15's with the wood finish and black front and liked that. What do you think this would look like. I can get a plate of 1/4" steel laser cut. If I finish it gloss black, flush mount it on the front leaving 1/4" of the wood all the way around. Bring it right to the edge of the surround and attach it with rare earth magnets so the front is clean. Then I have a natural wood enclosure with a piano black face.

I like that idea better than the whole thing being black. Seems like such a wast of good wood grain. If you were going to go all black then you may as well have used MDF.
How about black trim on the sides too? I do like the look of most things with a tasteful black trim.
post #63 of 732
Thread Starter 
I was thinking the same thing, but I haven't been able to visualize any side trim that doesn't look like some cheesey pin striping.
post #64 of 732
Nice work so far.
I will give you some hints as I have do a few cabinets this similar way as you are doing.

Most important to clamp pieces 100% even with pressure.
These cabinets as they arrived to me as shown in the first picture, were in need of a TON of work.
Next let the wood acclimatize evenly to let the wood spring back after you clamp the pieces. You will more than likely get some cracking.

The person who stated these cabinets used threaded rods and clamped them also.But the area were the driver was going could not get any rods and could not compress evenly. And the cabinets had severe cracks in them.



After a lot of work here they are
ready for 18" drivers.

Weight was 325lbs each once finished



All the best in the final cabinets.
post #65 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by corock View Post

I was thinking the same thing, but I haven't been able to visualize any side trim that doesn't look like some cheesey pin striping.

How about a triangle of black on top. Starting accross the front, (but not all the way accross. Maybe 1/4 to 1/3) that taperes to a point in the center on the top/back.
The sides are harder to imagine. Maybe a similare triangle that covers the rounded portion going back to a piont where it becomes flat? If so, maybe the top triangle should end in that same distance (or not)?
Just a few ideas that might get your gears turning.
post #66 of 732
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAWAC View Post

Nice work so far.
I will give you some hints as I have do a few cabinets this similar way as you are doing.

Most important to clamp pieces 100% even with pressure.
These cabinets as they arrived to me as shown in the first picture, were in need of a TON of work.
Next let the wood acclimatize evenly to let the wood spring back after you clamp the pieces. You will more than likely get some cracking.

The person who stated these cabinets used threaded rods and clamped them also.But the area were the driver was going could not get any rods and could not compress evenly. And the cabinets had severe cracks in them.



After a lot of work here they are
ready for 18" drivers.

Weight was 325lbs each once finished



All the best in the final cabinets.


Very nice enclosures. Thanks for the tips.
How come you went with layers to create a cube? Was it for the extra thick walls?
post #67 of 732
Are you getting enough compression of the layers between the clamps?

I use 2x3's on edge with a compliant layer (dense foam or weatherstripping) to distribute the force.

Quote:
Originally Posted by corock View Post

Do you think natural is the way to go? I thought it was kinda pale and might need to be darkened a bit, kinda like the clamp handles.

There's a clamp party at my place...byoc.

post #68 of 732
Thread Starter 
from what I've read I should be ok. Each clamp is applying 1000 psi. The boards themselves will redistribute the weight. I need to be at 100-250 psi so that pressure should be acheived throughout. Here's crossing my fingers.
post #69 of 732
If the glue lines are even you're good.
post #70 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by corock View Post

I can get a plate of 1/4" steel laser cut. If I finish it gloss black, flush mount it on the front leaving 1/4" of the wood all the way around. Bring it right to the edge of the surround and attach it with rare earth magnets so the front is clean. Then I have a natural wood enclosure with a piano black face.

If you have the time (and the inclination) you might want to try out an alternative: black stain directly on the wood. Make a small laminated piece (6 inches square should be enough) and sand it smooth. Then apply a couple of coats of black stain to the front topped with a couple of coats of polyurethane. If you like the results you could use that on the front of the cabinet instead of the steel plate. You'll have a black front to match the room but the lamination should still show through to some extent.
post #71 of 732
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

If the glue lines are even you're good.

Everything looks even and solid. If something was wrong and I was going to get cracking would that show up right away?
post #72 of 732
Actually I didn't understand that comment about cracking.

If the gluelines are even you should be fine, and the plies inherently reduce tensency to crack.
post #73 of 732
Personally I hate seeing wood grain through paint.

An alternative would the high build resin used on bartops, pigmented black.

Or black acrylic, or black real glass.

I'd do the latter before steel, which by the time it's cut and finished would probably cost more anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerParty View Post

If you have the time (and the inclination) you might want to try out an alternative: black stain directly on the wood. Make a small laminated piece (6 inches square should be enough) and sand it smooth. Then apply a couple of coats of black stain to the front topped with a couple of coats of polyurethane. If you like the results you could use that on the front of the cabinet instead of the steel plate. You'll have a black front to match the room but the lamination should still show through to some extent.
post #74 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by corock View Post

Everything looks even and solid. If something was wrong and I was going to get cracking would that show up right away?

OK here goes.
With all the clamps even the ones shown in the photo you have a high chance for cracking.

If you look at the photo

Look at the top corner the area coming down to the c clamps.

You can see more compression here.

Also every spot you clamp and press does not have the same pressure as 1" to 3 " away from the clamp.

I know, I got all of these brought to me (below) in unfinished form and I spent hundreds of hrs correction them.

What I learned
tack the layers with a few brads and layer them as fast as you can.
Then use one weight mass to press down evenly on the cabinets.

Tell you what these sub cabinets were cracked so bad and all out of alignment it took 2 gallons of bondo to fill in the cracks and voids.
Then I made them as square as I could and then re clad them in another layer of 1/4" MDF. for a total thickness of 3.75" thick

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=62548.0

Sorry for the link off cite but as I am no longer in the business and my forum is closed I thought it would be ok.
post #75 of 732
in situations like this the best clamping system you can use and the most affordable is this >>
post #76 of 732
I believe that upper right area (appearing compressed) is actually the curve in of that corner and not compression of the wood,, you can see the same on the left corner,, some times photographs offer appearances that are not actual,, the eye can be tricked very easy,,

Derry
post #77 of 732
Thread Starter 
Good eye Derry. You are correct.
post #78 of 732
with the jorgenson clamps, i'm a bit worried about the rubber find any oily orange marks on your wood yet?
post #79 of 732
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ufokillerz View Post

with the jorgenson clamps, i'm a bit worried about the rubber find any oily orange marks on your wood yet?

Nothing that has stood out to me. Is your concern the glue won't hold where the clamps are?
post #80 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by corock View Post

Nothing that has stood out to me. Is your concern the glue won't hold where the clamps are?

i am somewhat afraid that the oily residue might have adverse affects of the glue holding at the certain areas. i know i found some orange oily residue on the stuff i clamped down on with the same orange clamps you have.
post #81 of 732
Thread Starter 
I hope not, but there's not much I can do about it now, just about done.

post #82 of 732
Looking good..... put a few coats of epoxy to the inside.... that will harden it up and close up anything that wants to come apart..you would be good to go...no matter what..
post #83 of 732
I have to agree with the earlier poster, brad nailing the layers together and then applying one mass weight on top of them all would be by far the most efficient and effective way to do a build like this.
post #84 of 732
On a side note, you have the cleanest shop/garage I have ever seen.
post #85 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danielson99 View Post

I have to agree with the earlier poster, brad nailing the layers together and then applying one mass weight on top of them all would be by far the most efficient and effective way to do a build like this.

I forgot to comment on this earlier.

100 psi is the minimum clamping pressure suggested by Titebond.

If the laminations are 20" on each side by 1" wide, for 80 sq.", that would take 8000 lb of weight.
post #86 of 732
Thread Starter 
I agree with Noah. I'm about 96 linear inches with fourteen 1000 lb clamps so I should be right in the 100-150 psi across the board. Aside from parking two pickup trucks on top of it, I'm not sure what single mass weight would give me 14,000 lbs of pressure.
post #87 of 732
However I agree with the comment that you're not likely getting that between the clamps.

BTW what kind of glue are you using?
post #88 of 732
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

However I agree with the comment that you're not likely getting that between the clamps.

BTW what kind of glue are you using?

Yes, looking back I should have used wood on top of the pieces I'm clamping, as you mentioned earlier. the pressure spreads out as it gets further away from the contact point.

I'm using Lepage's carpenter's glue.
post #89 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by corock View Post

Yes, looking back I should have used wood on top of the pieces I'm clamping, as you mentioned earlier. the pressure spreads out as it gets further away from the contact point.

I'm using Lepage's carpenter's glue.

You are fine, don't let the second guessing get you down. Looks great!
post #90 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by t6902wf View Post

you are fine, don't let the second guessing get you down. Looks great!

+1
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