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FAQ for the 3D HTPC - Page 41

post #1201 of 1331
11/15/12 at 9:21pm
PowerDVD sucks. I know many people use it, but I feel I have to say it because my trial did nothing but close on itself and tell me to buy it even though I had x days left of trial. TMT5 isn't perfect either but I've had must less trouble with it. I wish I could give you some pointers for 3D but I can't. As soon as I get a 6000 or 7000 Radeon, I will post my settings and experience. I'm just waiting to see if Newegg will have a sale on any for Black Friday/November. The $10 rebate is all right, but if something goes on sale for more than that without MIB then I'll jump on it. :-)
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post #1202 of 1331
11/15/12 at 10:19pm
There are several reasons why a software piece sucks. In the case of PowerDVD, clean installing Windows, then driver, then PowerDVD often fixes many problems. Yup, clean install Windows is a pain.
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post #1203 of 1331
11/16/12 at 3:58am
OK I finally got around to BootCamp-ing my MacMini to run Windows 7 Ultimate. I was planning to use the 32 bit since my 2x8GB RAM hadn't arrived but for some reason, the drivers Apple provided needed 64 bit mode so another reinstall with 64 bit Ultimate.

This installed fine with Intel drivers for graphics and audio.

HDMI on Mini went to AVR for audio
HDMI via DisplayPort adaptor went to Optoma HD33 HDMI 1.4 display

Next TMT5. I am still using an older version:
5.0.1.80_5.0.1.87
because I am worried about Cinevia.

I set Graphics Settings to Output To -> Cloned -> Digital Display 2 + Digital Display 1

This meant the Optoma became the primary display. Otherwise when I play a movie, I get a black box where TMT5 is on the Optoma (but TMT5 plays on the second display via the AVR)

But in this mode, I could not get Audio to be sent out via the primary HDMI port on the Mini to the AVR.

*sigh*

Even with this mode, I could not get it to output 1080p24 Frame Packed.

I set the 3D settings to - Intel S3D Display

Still no joy.
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post #1204 of 1331
11/16/12 at 11:36am
OK, followup on my problem posted earlier: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1240499/faq-for-the-3d-htpc/1150_50#post_22593175

Am I embarrassed! It finally occurred to me that the stuttering problem could be because I was trying to play the ISO's from a server on my network! Duh! I ripped a new ISO of Ice Age 3 to the HTPC, and voila! It plays smooth as silk.

TMT 5: plays the 3D movie fine, but insists on going into a smaller display when it switches to 24 fps. I don't have TMT set to switch automatically, btw... In fact, I've always had that problem when trying to set the HTPC to 1080p-24. It always reduces size so that about 1.5" black borders appear on all 4 sides, even on the desktop. And no, these aren't letterbox movies. They're full 16 x 9 films. Can anybody tell me where in Catalyst 12.11 to correct that?

PowerDVD 12 (trial): Message still comes up that trial only plays 3D films with hardware accelleration on the PC. Ugh.

Corel WinDVD Pro 11 (trial): When I select to play the 3D version of Ice Age 3, a message comes up that my bluray player isn't detecting a connected 3D display. So it won't play the 3D movie. Ugh. Ripping Hugo to an ISO at the moment...

ETA: Same thing happens with Hugo. From the style of the 'no 3D capable display detected' messages, they're coming from the 3D ISO's, not from the player.
Edited by Pagali - 11/16/12 at 1:15pm
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post #1205 of 1331
11/16/12 at 5:45pm
reneth i have news...good and bad!

ok i turn the steroscopic 3d on,and the epson wake up to 3d mode.change the resolution from 720p to 1080p 24hz.

i play with power dvd 3d,but i feel something litle wrong with the 3d image. the depth size option in power dvd is not off,and i choose the depth field.if close the depth field is better.

this option says:if you watching 2d media in 3d mode anb feel uncomfortable try adjusting the 3d scene

why?i play 3d stuff not 2d.change in 3d options to auto or hdmi 1.4 1080p 24 in 3d option and still tha same.

play with core win dvd 11.i think is beter for my eyes and the depth option is locked.of course this is normal because the frame packing is a locked depth.

another problem is if conect epson and onkyo,with any conection hdmi or dvi,the onkyo in nvidia resolution tell me that the onkyo native resolution is 1080i and max 30 hz.if connect only the onkyo to the gtx 660,the native is 1080p-60hz.

3d image cant play and the audio cant lock to the receiver...

so i decide to play simple dts-dd from optical out,of my motherboard..
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post #1206 of 1331
11/24/12 at 8:19am
Does anyone know if the newer Nvidia drivers are functioning correctly with the nvidia 6xx series cards?

My gt 430 is dying (fan is failing - keeps overheating) and I would like to replace it with a gtx 650.

Last I checked (301.x), HDMI audio and proper detection of my TV was unstable with the newer WHQL drivers (anything over 285.x) and 3dtvplay installed (for nvidia version of stereoscopic player). I am guessing that I can not use the 270-280 drivers for the gtx 650.

Here is my previously posted issue:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmelan View Post

Well this may just be a very specific problem, but none of th Nvidia WHQL drivers released since 280.26 are functioning correctly in my HTPC setup ever since the infamous 285.62 drivers broke 7MC (really good QC there). It seems unlikely that this is a coincidence, likely resulting from whatever fix was put in place after 285.62.

Problem:
HDMI audio only works after a computer restart. When i turn off the TV and turn the TV back on, HDMI audio is not detected and I am unable to watch recorded TV or anything else.

Setup:
Sony XBR 52 HX909 - via either HDMI or DVI-->HDMI (multiple monoprice old and high speed HDMI cables)
EVGA nvidia gt 430
nvidia 3dtv play
any nvidia drivers from 285.62 and on

This problem is not present when I unplug the 3d transmitter from the TV, at least on the most recent WHQL drivers.
This seems like an obvious bug in the Nvidia drivers.

I attempted to clone the EDID data from when the TV is connected just after restart and install as in Tulli's EDID override thread without any change in behavior.
I would be happy to hear any suggestions for a solution.

thanks!

Edited by jmelan - 11/24/12 at 11:13am
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post #1207 of 1331
11/24/12 at 3:50pm
I haven't seen any problem with GTX 650 + 306.97.

BTW check also GTX 650 Ti.

- GTX 650: 384 stream processors
- GTX 650 Ti: 768 stream processors

Ti will give a great improvement in madVR and gaming. Or just stay with another GT 430/440=630. (Vanilla 650 is not powerful enough for madVR Jinc at 60fps.)
Edited by renethx - 11/24/12 at 5:33pm
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post #1208 of 1331
11/24/12 at 5:02pm
Ren. I currently have a 5450 and have a new 1155 mobo in the mail. I am debating between going the cheap route and using a G530 along with the 5450 for 3d playback but am worried 3d playback wont be worth it with that setup and should just return the 5450 and use the G530 alone. Will the 5450 even add anything to the G530?
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post #1209 of 1331
11/24/12 at 7:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hemogoblin View Post

Ren. I currently have a 5450 and have a new 1155 mobo in the mail. I am debating between going the cheap route and using a G530 along with the 5450 for 3d playback but am worried 3d playback wont be worth it with that setup and should just return the 5450 and use the G530 alone. Will the 5450 even add anything to the G530?

First of all, GPU integrated in G530 does not support Frame packing HDMI 1.4a 3D video format. So you will have to use another GPU (HD 5xxx/6xxx/7xxx, any GeForce, GPU in Core i3 or higher). Here is CPU usage at BR 3D playback with Celeron G530 + Radeon HD 5450 + PowerDVD. HD 5450 supports Frame packing, but does not support MVC decode (exactly the opposite to G530). Hence MVC decode relies entirely on CPU. The question is, Is G530 powerful enough to decode MVC?



So playback is almost smooth, but you may see occasional stuttering. G530 is not powerful enough for MVC decode.

I recommend adding Radeon HD 6570 like this card to G530. CPU usage at BR 3D playback with Celeron G530 + Radeon HD 6570 + PowerDVD:



Note that recently there have been released lots of HD 6570 with low effective memory speeds such as 1000MHz and 1300MHz. Avoid them. I recommend 1600MHz or higher.

On Core i3-3225: Overall, you will get better video playback performance with G530+HD 6570 than Core i3+integrated GPU (Intel HD Graphics 4000). Roughly HD 6570 is twice more powerful than Intel HD Graphics 4000. For example, Intel HD Graphics 4000 struggles with upscaling SD to HD @60fps with madVR Lanczos 4 + AR, while this is a piece of cake for HD 6570. CPU plays little role in DXVA + EVR/madVR video playback.
Edited by renethx - 11/25/12 at 2:13pm
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post #1210 of 1331
11/25/12 at 9:58am
Ren. Thank you for the excellent response, you have answered every question I had and helped me make a decision.

I think I will go ahead and buy the G530 and keep my 5450 and use them together for now. If I am ever unhappy with the 5450, I can always easily upgrade to the 6570 later. I dont think I will be doing that much 3d and thanks to your G530+6570 being better than an i3 ivy bridge, I should go ahead and buy a G530.
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post #1211 of 1331
11/27/12 at 3:39pm
Interested in building a thin 3d bluray capable htpc with an intel cpu with hd 4000 and DH61AG mobo. However, it seems people have had better luck playing 3d bluray isos with larger htpcs with standalone video cards. It makes me nervous building a new thin system since there is not going to be an option to add a video card if the onboard graphics prove problematic. I have had issues in the past on intel onboard graphics that were easily solved by just using a low profile radeon card.

Impressions for playing 3d isos in intel hd400 based htpcs seem hard to come by, but the ones I've read say stuttering is a common issue even when playing from a local drive in Power DVD, TMT etc. Has anyone else tried to build a system with the DH61AG and had success with 3d playback?
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post #1212 of 1331
11/29/12 at 1:46am
"b) If it is a discrete AMD GPU and your CPU does not have integrated GPU, then add another cheap GPU such as HD 5450 (~$20) for audio. The second graphics card works even with a PCI Express x1 slot! (Just cut the closed end to make it an open end.)"
Many thanks for this hint, my ati 7750's heat sink has blocked one of my free PCIe x1 ports, and the other one was surronded by the mainbord battery and capacitors, so I've actually trimmed my old 5450, cut the unused connectors from the card to fit. I can confirm it is still is still working and I'm streaming audio via that port.
I was hoping use use my ASUS P5E-VM HDMI (G35) mainbord's HDMI for audio, which is supposed to support PAP, but the IGP gets disabled with the ATI inserted.
I know I could have got an NVidia, but I already had the 5450 - now 2 passive ATI cards are sitting in my system
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post #1213 of 1331
11/29/12 at 5:32pm
My HD 7750 arrived today and it's running pretty well. Boy, I love having HDMI audio out with Win7 because my audio level is normal, instead of that muted junk with onboard Realtek drivers. Anyway, I have my CCC settings set to YCC 4:4:4 and Video playback as 0-255 and Sotti's recommended settings in the calibration forums. Is anyone familiar with 5.1 or greater audio out with AMD Radeon cards? Is Windows the default control panel for it or is there an AMD audio control panel? I tested the speakers with Windows and I think I'm just getting 3.1. Windows sends the rear channel to the corresponding front speaker (rear left to front left). Shouldn't windows be sending it to the rear? Perhaps my ALC1200 control panel needs to be exited.
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post #1214 of 1331
12/1/12 at 1:50pm
Click on the speaker icon in the taskbar with the right mouse button and select playback devices, set your speaker setup there
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post #1215 of 1331
12/1/12 at 3:29pm
Thanks Uzi. I didn't have that option with the older software. Boy, I love the current video card, things just work better with it. On a slightly unrelated note (non 3D), is there a non silverlight way to stream netflix with an HTPC? I can't stand the tearing/judder of the picture. I'm considering just using my TV's Netflix app. I tried setting 7MC display type to 1080 @ 60p, but it just changes the screen resolution to "59 Hz" so the tear lines are nothing but obvious.
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post #1216 of 1331
12/1/12 at 7:51pm
I couldn't get my Mac Mini with Intel HD 4000 to output both
a. 1080p24FP 3D to projector and
b. HD audio (bitstream or otherwise) to my HDMI 1.3 AVR

I think it's still best to use a dedicated graphics card for that.

Also HD4000 seems to have a bug playing 1080p24 properly (it does it at 24fps and not the correct 23.976? needed to maintain sync) according to Anandtech.
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post #1217 of 1331
12/2/12 at 12:34am
Intel HD Graphics 4000 itself is capable of sending Frame packing 3D video to a display over HDMI and HD audio bitstreaming to a HDMI 1.3 AVR over another HDMI.

Basically there is no such bug. There may be still motherboards suffering from not being able to output @23Hz, however (and it's not a problem of Intel HD Graphics 4000 itself).
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post #1218 of 1331
12/2/12 at 1:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Intel HD Graphics 4000 itself is capable of sending Frame packing 3D video to a display over HDMI and HD audio bitstreaming to a HDMI 1.3 AVR over another HDMI.

I used the official Intel HD4000 chipset drivers from Intel
http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=22081&lang=eng

http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=22152&ProdId=3442&lang=eng

Mac Mini
HDMI to Denon AVR4810
Thunderbolt -> HDMI adaptor -> Optoma HD33

Windows 7 x32 with latest updates

Arcsoft TotalMedia Theatre Platinum v5.0.1.87

Is there a version after this that supports dual HDMI audio and video while not enabling Cinevia?
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Basically there is no such bug. There may be still motherboards suffering from not being able to output @23Hz, however (and it's not a problem of Intel HD Graphics 4000 itself).

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5773/intels-ivy-bridge-an-htpc-perspective/5

Looks like it's been fixed with newer firmware. Not sure if the Mini has fixed it tho.
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post #1219 of 1331
12/4/12 at 1:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by petes457 View Post

@renethx @roknrol
SO.......
Thanks very much guys for your help and suggestions on this problem. I was about to try your suggestions and see if PDVD would do any better, but I had pretty much wasted two days and the GT 440 card had to go back to work in it's original computer. When I did that, I noticed a strange anomaly in the nVidia Control Panel. All of a sudden the "Enable 3D Stereoscopic" session was back. When I had installed it for testing in my HTPC, the section wasn't there (the other 3D settings section was there - I just thought it had been removed from the 306.97 driver). I'm thinking what happened is that the nVidia 306.97 drivers were originally installed when I just had the onboard 9300 graphics and didn't completely install all the components (e.g. 3D Stereoscopic) - and when I installed the GT 440, I didn't re-install the driver. Ugghhh.... Anyway, I went back and re-installed the GT 440 card in my HTPC, re-installed the 306.97 drivers - and lo and behold, there was 3D Stereoscopic section to enable. At that point, everything went smoothly and I'm happy to report that TMT5 played my Bluray 3D disk superbly, my Samsung TV automatically did the 3D switching and back to 2D when I stopped the disk. (The TV did NOT recognize my 3D MKVs and do automatic switching when I played them natively through WMC, but I'm guessing if I played them through TMT5, it would.) Not happy I wasted several hours on a problem like this, but such is the way with testing new technologies you're not familiar with.
Anyway, I am now convinced the GT 440 will play Bluray 3D content in my current setup without upgrading to a new i3/mobo combination. However, now the final test is for gaming. As I indicated before, I'm not a gamer, but I'm entralled with 3D graphics and I want to test it and see. I know gaming typically takes a lot more juice and this setup is probably borderline usable, but I want to test and see. So my question is, I now have a new Galaxy 2GB GDDR3 GT 620 card and I have the same Galaxy 512 MB GDDR5 GT 440 card I've been testing with previously. I can't find much info on the GT 620, but I do know enough about nVidia's numbering systen that I just shouldn't conclude that the 620 is more powerful than the 440 for gaming. I'm sure that both cards would meet my basic HTPC needs (including Bluray 3D playback), but which of these cards would be the best for gaming - and gaming in 3D if possible? I'll be testing with Black Ops, Dirt 3, Batman Arkham. Are there any "decent" gaming cards for under $100 (or maybe $150)? I admit I'm a bit biased towards nVidia although I'd like to be open-minded if that's wrong-headed these days.
Thanks for your help. I'm getting there, albeit slowly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

A good gaming card is also good for madVR. It depends entirely on the level of madVR algorithm / gaming performance which card to choose. 7850 (dual fan is recommended) is a good choice. 7770 is also a good option if you want to save money. GTX 650 Ti comes between them.
If you are not interested in gaming nor madVR (Jinc algorithm), then just add Radeon HD 6570 or GT 430/GT 630.
Your system is not bad. PCI Express 3.0 is supported only by the latest IVB processor, but it is hardly important in video playback and gaming. 4GB system RAM is enough.
Another point of consideration is AVR: if it is HDMI 1.4a, there is no problem; if it is HDMI 1.3, then you won't get HD audio bitstreaming with Radeon unless you add a "HDMI sound card" (= a cheap Radeon card such as HD 5450).

@renethx

Thanks for your help. So my quest I think has come to an end. After a couple of missteps, I ended up evaluating a GTX 660 card from the big box retailer. (I couldn't find a GTX 650ti card or a 7850 card there but I just wanted to see 3D gaming and see if it was worth spending money on.) I can't say I'm very impressed - but maybe I was not doing things right. I installed Batman Arkham City (which is suppose to be a native 3D Vision game) and played it - but I didn't think the 3D was impressive at all. I expected bats to be flying out of the TV, around my head, etc. Maybe 3D gaming is all about providing depth in the scene, and I could tell a difference in that. (I had 3D Vision enabled in the Settings.) But, I'm a noob and just don't know what to expect. I do know it was NOTHING like a 3D Bluray movie.

Anyway, after doing some more research, I'm taking the GTX 660 back and buying a eVGA SSC 650ti 1GB. (It's at $129 including the $20 rebate.) My reasoning is that it's small and fits my SFF case, it's very power efficient (I have a 450W Corsair power supply and I don't want to buy another one), and yet seems to be seen as a pretty good mid-priced overclocked gaming card that can play games at 1920x1080. So here are my final questions:

1. My main concern is that the eVGA card only has mini-HDMI. Remember that 95% of the use of the computer is as the household HTPC (connected to Xbox entenders). There will be no degradation of performance, pass bitstreaming audio to my new Denon 2113ci (1.4a compliant), i.e., it will perform the exact same as regular HDMI, right? (Still I'm not happy buying another $7 cable.)

2. As for my expectations on 3D gaming, should I expect things to "pop" out of the screen, as well as just seeing more "depth"?

3. I'm buying the 1GB card because I'll never play games at resolutions greater than 1920x1080 on a 65" screen. From my research, it seemed 2GB cards only helped at greater resolutions (e.g., 2560x1600). Agree?

Thanks to all for your help.
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post #1220 of 1331
12/4/12 at 3:58pm
1. Mini-HDMI is the same as the normal HDMI with an adapter.
2. Well, this should be able to be configured in the driver to some extent. Also check GameGrade3D database (and the entire site of MTBS3D).
3. 1GB is usually enough. 2GB vs 1GB
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post #1221 of 1331
12/4/12 at 7:14pm
Thanks renethx for all your help. Just put in the order for the eVGA SSC 650ti 1GB ($123 after rebate with free game - not bad). I will check on the 3D resources you suggested. I had read a lot of the benchmarks and it's apparent that you get little benefit from 2GB vs 1GB today. But that article really suggested future-proofing and buying a 2GB today - especially for larger screens at higher resolutions. Oh well.....as I said I'm not a gamer anyway, just intrigued.
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post #1222 of 1331
12/8/12 at 3:57pm

I am trying to decide between these 2 Radeon video cards.

 

This would be for plain HTPC usage 2/3D BluRay and DVD playback, no gaming. I have been a big fan of the IceQ concept of venting the 'exhaust' out of the case. On the other hand, my setup/case can probably easily bear the extra heat from the fan-less card. Therefore, I can base my decision on performance.

 

How would a GT450 fair against these cards?

 

TIA!

____

Axel


Edited by Axel - 12/8/12 at 4:45pm
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post #1223 of 1331
12/8/12 at 4:34pm
I would vote for the 6670, but for a little more I would strongly recommend the 7750. I just added one to replace 2x HD3850 and I love it. I chose it because it runs 55W under max load and doesn't need additional power. I use 7MC and TMT5 for playback and they both run great. For the extra power, between the two you listed, the 6670 will be great. But if you want a "power saving" and low profile, and I just mean 6" long card as opposed to 8", you can't go wrong with the 7750.

Edit: Also go for a GDDR5 card, you'll like it more than GDDR3.
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post #1224 of 1331
12/8/12 at 4:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by anikun07 View Post

I would vote for the 6670, but for a little more I would strongly recommend the 7750. I just added one to replace 2x HD3850 and I love it. I chose it because it runs 55W under max load and doesn't need additional power. I use 7MC and TMT5 for playback and they both run great. For the extra power, between the two you listed, the 6670 will be great. But if you want a "power saving" and low profile, and I just mean 6" long card as opposed to 8", you can't go wrong with the 7750.

Edit: Also go for a GDDR5 card, you'll like it more than GDDR3.

 



Thanks for your reply. Noise level is also a great concern for me. So in the '7750 league', I found a HIS iSilence. Here the comparison. Wouldn't a 7750 be overkill? Again, no gaming for me.

 

Also any thoughts how these fair against a GT450?

_____

Axel

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post #1225 of 1331
1/2/13 at 7:17pm
Hi guys

Im new to htpc and set up my first one last month
Was wondering if theres any gurus here that could help me out

The HTPC is a HP N40L with a Asus GT620 for video and its connected to hdmi to a pioneer vsx-s300 reciever, and then finally outputted to a passive 3d TV, LG 65LW6500
The issue being is at seemingly random times ill get no output errors on the tv, at which ill remote into the htpc and reset the res which will fix it, and ill get output on the tv again.

Im using powerdvd 12, and also cant get the 3d to work properly - i can get 3d windows desktop to work, but then when i enable 3d in powerdvd, ill get the controls of powerdvd in 3d but no depth at all in the movie - its just a 2d image viewed in 3d.
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post #1226 of 1331
1/2/13 at 8:15pm
I assume you mean no output to the TV? Your PC should see the TV through the HDMI cable. Have you tried updating your video drivers?

Edit: For PDVD make sure you have the proper type of 3D selected in your 3D TV format. I forgot whether you need 3D content playing or what to change the settings, but you should make sure it has the right stereoscopic frames shown.
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post #1227 of 1331
1/3/13 at 12:04pm
I've checked nvidia control panel and the detected display shows my pioneer receiver, not the TV.

Ill give tmt5 a try tonight
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post #1228 of 1331
1/3/13 at 12:10pm
That shouldn't be too much of an issue. Sometimes it just depends on how the devices communicate over HDMI.
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post #1229 of 1331
1/3/13 at 2:18pm
Oh and yes ive already updated drivers to the latest drivers.
PowerDVD - i havent seen any 3d options for display type, only just a few general 3d options like depth control and L/R eye image switching.

Ive had a bit of issue with how my pioneer communicates with my tv. Ive had hdmi passthrough and control enabled on it and its caused problems. Ive disabled both functions and they play nice together after that.
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post #1230 of 1331
1/3/13 at 2:33pm
Somewhere, either in video settings or 3D settings, there should be an option for 3D type because when I ran the trial it was defaulting to anaglyph and I had to change a setting to 1080p HDTV or something like that.
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