FAQ for the 3D HTPC - Page 43

Answer below...

So you're saying the GT 430 is too slow (DDR3-1400) compared to the GT 630 (DDR3-1600)? What benefit does the faster card provide? I'm having problems with occational studdering with TotalMedia 5, PowerDVD 12 and MPC-HC. I know the nVidia cards allow for custom refresh rates to help in this regard (one of the reasons I'm leaning twords nVidia). Looking to add one of the Yamaha Adventage receivers (2020/3020) eventually. One step at a time... Thanks again for your help/advice...

GT 630 = GT 430 hardware-wise. GT 430 is being discontinued. The only difference is:

- Core clock: 810MHz (GT 630) vs 700MHz (GT 430)

Memory varies with the model. I recommend 1GB 1600MHz (or higher) effective speed.

Custom refresh rate is tricky. If you create "23Hz", then it will be 23Hz for stereoscopic 3D if "Stereoscopic 3D" is enabled. So you have to constantly enable / disable "Stereoscopic 3D" depending on if the content is 3D / 2D.
Edited by renethx - 2/20/13 at 3:11am

Guys i have GF 650 on my desctop and i can watch perfectly FULL HD 3D frame packeted . I have the 1920x1080@24/23 resolutions in the nvidia control panel .
I also have Lenovo with Intel i7 2670 QM with build in video chipset and aditional GF555 M which i can not use as a 3D frame packing device because it uses the 555M only as an accelerator for 3D games . You can only change resolutions from the Intel Graphics card panel . How can i add FULL HD 3D resolution stereoscopic 1920x1080p 24/23 because for my desctop , setting up 3dTV play added them

Gotcha. Then how 'bout the GT 640? A little faster and has 384 CUDA cores vs 96 on the GT 630. Any picture quality benefit to the addl cores for HTPC use or does that just benefit gaming? What about 1GB memory vs 2GB? Thanks again for your help/suggestions...

For BR 3D with PowerDVD / TMT, GT 630 / 1GB is enough. GT 650 Ti or higher is good for DVD upscaling under madVR, but it has nothing to do with BR 2D / 3D playback.

OK, got it. Thanks for your help!

What do you think about these two? The EVGA w/GDDR5 is supposed to increase performance significantly. I'm concerned about the small fan though being to noisy. Both are the same price after rebates.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Productcompare.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007709%20600007321%20600335271&IsNodeId=1&bop=And&CompareItemList=48%7C14%2D125%2D426%5E14%2D125%2D426%2DTS%2C14%2D130%2D808%5E14%2D130%2D808%2DTS
Edited by Yawny - 2/22/13 at 7:33pm

Hi,

My AVR is hdmi 1.3 so I'm looking to add a GPU card to my AMD Trinity APU HTPC for separately sending HD audio to my AVR (a method as suggested by renethx in an ealier post here). Specifically, I'm looking at buying a 6670 card that would also be compatible for Crossfire mode with the A10 integrated graphics processor in my system.

However, I have also gathered from other forums that AMD's Dual Graphics system will automatically disable the integrated graphics ports when a discrete GPU card is added, regardless of whether Crossfire is in use. So I hope to get some confirmation from any fellow AMD Trinity APU HTPC owners here who have added a separate AMD graphics card to their build, whether this is the case, or not.

Thanks.
Edited by AVGadgetBoy - 3/3/13 at 11:28am

Any discrete card (AMD or NVIDIA) works independent of iGPU in extended desktop mode. IGPU can be enabled or disabled in BIOS. (This is also true for Intel iGPU.)

CrossFire means that Radeon cores of both GPUs are used simultaneously for better gaming performance, but you can get video/audio from only one of the GPUs. So you have to turn off CrossFire to watch BR 3D (as you will need to get video from one of the GPUs and audio from the other).
Edited by renethx - 3/3/13 at 4:57pm

The thing is, I have an old Nvidia card (GTS250) and when I insert it to the PCIe slot to power into bios, all options for integrated graphics become automatically disabled without any way to select which graphics device to use as the primary one. Also, powering up with the monitor connected to the integrated graphics ports instead doesn't change anything (no signal to display at all). So I am forced to use only the discrete GPU's ports.

After booting into Windows 7, Device Manager shows Nvidia's graphics card as the only display adapter, and plugging another display to the integrated graphics port in an attempt to detect it doesn't make a difference. I suspect that AMD's integrated graphics has been shut down due to it being incompatible with a non-AMD discrete GPU, but this does not align with what you have just explained. Could it be a restriction specific to my mobo (MSI's FM2-A85XA-G65)? But I haven't been able to find any info about this in the mobo manual or on their product support site.

Although I have some confidence this should not happen if I were to use a AMD GPU card, I would like some confirmation from other Trinity APU+discrete GPU users before spending on a 6670.

Thanks.
Edited by AVGadgetBoy - 3/3/13 at 7:06pm

Remove GTS 250. In BIOS > Settings > Advanced > Integrated Graphics Configuration > Initiate Graphic Adapter: set to [IGD]. Then insert GTS 250. See if both iGPU and dGPU work. Of course you should see POST screen only in iGPU.

Anyway GTS 250 is not a good choice because you can choose either:

Video: iGPU -> 3D display
Audio: GTS 250 does not support HD audio, it supports S/PDIF from onboard audio codec. But this is pointless, why not use an optical cable to connect to AVR to send DD/DTS/2ch PCM?

or

Video: GTS 250 -> 3D display; Frame packing is supported, but hardware decoding is not supported (well, A10 is fast enough, though).
Audio: iGPU -> AVR: good.

Radeon HD 5450 (~$20 AR) is enough to send HD audio bitstreaming to AVR.

Video: iGPU -> 3D display
Audio: HD 5450 -> AVR.
Edited by renethx - 3/3/13 at 10:10pm

I did ensure that bios was set to [IGD] before powering down to insert the Nvidia card. But as soon as I power up with the card in the mobo, the display connected to the card's port would be the one to receive the screen signal while the display connected to the IGD port doesn't detect any signal at all. Entering the bios menu would then show "Initiate Graphic Adapter" as [PEG] rather than [IGD], and it would be in a grayed-out state (i.e. not possible to change value anymore). Also, what used to be available in the bios menu for setting the IGD options (a choice of "Auto", "Disable", or "Dual Graphics") has all but disappeared.

I have no intention of using the GTS 250 due to its high power consumption (needs two 6-pin power plugs), but I'm testing it only because it's what I have at hand, taken from a defunct setup. From what I'm seeing so far, I am inclined to think that either the mobo or the Trinity architecture does not allow the IGD to function alongside any external GPU that's not compatible with Dual Graphics mode, which would sadly also include the HD 5450.

Even with a Dual Graphics compatible card (eg. 6670), I am still concerned that I might still be faced with the problem of getting only either IGD or PEG ports active, but not both (something that was suggested to me in another forum). So I'm looking for confirmation from anyone who has dealt with the same setup as mine.
Edited by AVGadgetBoy - 3/4/13 at 4:35am

It's the MSI mb that's the problem (is BIOS up to date?). I have tested ASRock, ASUS, GIGABYTE FM2 mb and none of them has such a problem.

Yes, it's the latest bios (V1.6). I upgraded it from the original V1.1 which also had the same issue.
Thanks for sharing about the other boards you've tested.
I guess i'll have to contact MSI directly to get help.

Sadly for me, below is the reply from MSI -

Hmm, it's pretty surprising that there is a mb not supporting simultaneous, independent use of iGPU and dGPU.

Apparently, that's not the case after all.
I took the plunge and bought myself a used HD6670 card despite the earlier official reply from the MSI tech.
To my pleasant surprise, everything worked as I had hoped for!
I do have to disable Dual Graphics (Crossfire) for it, but that's a simple matter of toggling a seletion in the AMD Vision Center. So I leave Dual Graphics enabled until whenever I want to watch 3D movies.
This workaround not only saves me a needless (and expensive) upgrade to a 3D AVR, but also gives an added boost to my HTPC's graphics performances through the Dual Graphics feature.
A 2-in-1 solution at minimal cost! I can't ask for more.

Still this episode does confirm my suspicion that the MSI mobo will not allow a non-AMD Dual Graphics compatible card to work this way (since I already tried a Nvidia card with no success).
It also confirms what I feel about the MSI tech support - that they don't really bother with the answers they give (I got this feeling when I probed them further with questions about the bios and received very lazy answers).
I'm glad I trusted my own reasoning using information from various online sources such as this.

So thanks for creating this forum and for all the helpful replies, renethx.
Cheers!
Edited by AVGadgetBoy - 3/9/13 at 1:47am

Wow, this is a great thread.

1 Question:
I see you keep suggesting a 7750 for HTPC usage, If I have 0 interest in games, and simply want to use my HTPC for XBMC and 3D Blu-Ray is a Radeon 6450 enough? or am I going to need something like the 7750?

Specs: Intel Pentium G620 (2.6ghz dual core), 8GB RAM.


Thanks.

HD 6450 is enough. If you use Stereoscopic Player, then even G620 is enough (just output Side-by-Side (Half)). You can rip BR 3D with MVC video untouched by MakeMKV.
Edited by renethx - 3/18/13 at 1:43pm

Thanks for the reply, I originally picked up a GT610, but I think I will switch to the 6450.

Hey guys quick question. I was going out to buy a video card to today and ended up walking out as i wasn't 100% sure which one to get.. Basically i have an expensive HDMI 1.3 preamp and am getting a 3d projector. I want to bitstream the HD audio out of one HDMI port, and send the Framepacked (sp) 3d video directly to the Projector out of the other HDMI/DVI port. My motherboard doesn't support bitstreaming so i was hoping to use a single Nvidia card to send the audio/video out two cables. Using Renethx's table, since i want to use only one card, it looked like it had to be GT(X) 430-460/520-560/all 6xx. I went to look at a bunch of those cards but couldn't find any that were HDMI 1.4a. Wouldn't it have to be 1.4a to get the FramePacked 3d off a Bluray disc?

Any info would be much appreciated, want to go down again tomorrow and get the right card.

Craig

HDMI 1.4a is a set of features and HDMI.org asks users:

- HDMI specification versions have added new features available for devices.
- These features are optional.
- For example: a device claiming to be “HDMI 1.4” may or may not support 3D.
- Look at the device and cable specifications for supported features, instead of version numbers.

GeForce cards support "Frame packing" since GT(X/S) 2xx whatever HDMI version it is (this is a fact).

thanks for the quick reply Renethx, appreciate it.. so you're saying that i can get the highest quality 3d from my new Hobbit Bluray without HDMI 1.4. I could have just bought the GT 640 and ran one cable to my PJ and the other to my Preamp and get everything i want? Adding another card isn't an option as i only have one PCI express slot.

thanks again, can't wait to get another card tomorrow.

Craig

Ok guys, just a follow up..

I was able to do what I wanted.. I ended up buying a Geforce GT 650 and ran two cables, one to my 3D Tv and the other to my HDMI 1.3 Preamp. I plugged the one HDMI output from the card and ran it directly to the 3d TV and at the same time, i used a standard DVI->HDMI adapter and ran an HDMI cable into my Preamp. I can confirm that i was able to simultaneously get 3D and lossless bitstreamed HD audio with that card..
Edited by Craig Woodhall - 3/25/13 at 10:17am

I am planing to update my 5 years old pc to play bluray 3D with my Benq W1070 DLP projector. It is a C2D 2.66 with 8600GS running Vista for the time of 2D bluray. If I swap the video card to HD6450 will my system be good enough for 3D bluray playback?

I also have a Toshiba laptop with i5 and HD5650 running Win 7. I have hdmi connect direct to my DLP projector but I can't get it to trigger 3D mode with any 3D software player playing 3D bluray. With standalone bluray player 3D playback is simple. Projector will switch to 3D frame pack mode at 1080p 24Hz and works with my DLP link 3D glasses straight away. I wish my pc will do the same. After some searching I guess it is my driver as Toshiba needs its own driver but there is no update from Toshiba since day one. And AMD driver are said to be not compatible with Toshiba laptop so I think I am stuck. SInce what version of catalyst driver does ATI HD5xxx series card start to support 3D bluray? Or I need HD6xxx series for the purpose?

HD 6450 works.

Thanks. Got a HD6670 and it works perfectly with Powerdvd 12. I pick auto select for source and display and it trigger my projector (Benq W1070) into 24Hz frame pack mode with 3D bluray right away.It even works with all SBS mkv I care to play. Very impressive. Too bad my recently upgraded TMT6 does not work for me at all. There is no auto selection and all options I pick failed. Even the playback of mkv clashes it many times. I guess I will have to stick with Powerdvd from now.
Edited by peterho3 - 4/5/13 at 4:33pm

Got a problem with 3D bluray. I can get 3D working with hdmi direct to my projector but not DVI+hdmi adapter on my Gigabyte HD6670. Is DVI port on my card not meant to work with 3D bluray at all or I need some special kind of adapter for my DVI to work the same as hdmi? I see the pins are DVI-D on both DVI port and adapter. Also read that DVI can also carry audio so my question is that can my DVI port bitstream HD audio just like the hdmi port? If so what kind of adapter do I need? Or it is just not possible? My pj only accept 1080p@24Hz for 3D frame pack just like any standalone 3D player.

The reason for all this is that I am still using a 1.3 Receiver and want to bitstream HD audio with hdmi port and use DVI for video to my 3D projector. Too bad DVI works fine with 2D bluray but not 3D bluray. Hdmi by the way works for all format without issue. So I wish I can find a way to use DVI for video and keep getting HD audio bitstream via hdmi if there is a way to make them work.
Edited by peterho3 - 4/12/13 at 4:33am

...double post.
Edited by peterho3 - 4/12/13 at 4:32am

I think you need a nvidia card to bitstream audio from dvi port while using hdmi for 3d pics.

Or add another discrete graphics card as a HDMI sound card, e.g. Radeon HD 5450. A PCI Express x1 slot is enough for this purpose in case your mb does not have another PCI Express x16 slot, although you have to make the closed end of the PCI Express x1 slot open.